Has Apple's quality control standards gone down the toilet? I think so.....

[jaredtomas]

wow, you judge me by the way I've dealt with one manager at an Apple store and how unlucky I was to receive multiple laptops with material blemishes. and for that you know me to be a jerk? tell you what. I will share another quick story with you. a few months ago I took delivery of my 2009 BMW 135i. they had to order the car from another dealership because they didn't have the one I wanted in stock.

so about a week later it comes in and they prep the vehicle to their standards. I then showed up to pick up my new car and I noticed one of the A/C control panels had a small nick in it. it looked like someone had hit it with something because it was enough to put a noticeable nick in the plastic itself. the sales manager was surprised that I caught that and she didn't. she then had no problem in having their parts department order a replacement part and they did the work three weeks later once the part arrived from Germany.

so let me guess? I was also being a jerk because I made them fix something on my $40K car that shouldn't have been broken in the first place, right?

go figure...

I don't see a problem with that. There's nothing wrong with being a perfectionist.

 

[nanofrog]

No, but if there is 15 miles already on it, and the seat is adjusted funky that's no reason to take it back.

How would that compare to cosmetic or even functional damage?

 

[Chaos123x]

How would that compare to cosmetic or even functional damage?

It doesn't

Just means there is a point where nitpicking is just nitpicking.

If mine was dented or scratched I would be on my way to the Apple Store in a heartbeat, praying they don't try to blame me for the damage.

But complaining just to complain is different.

it's not like they forgot to put the firewire port on the side or anything.... oh wait they did.

 

[chaos86]

I sympathize with the OP. A new product should be perfect.

I also sympathize with the Manager. Apple has to protect their bottom line. Ideally they should do this by making the products perfect so they get no returns, but lets think about the alternative:
The machine that the OP returned for a tiny nick in the aluminum has to be shipped again ($ for shipping) to the refurbishment facility, has to be completely taken apart if the blemish is on the screen case part or the unibody ($ for labor). If it's on the bottom or the battery cover they just need to replace that. Let's assume it's the unibody. They have to reassemble ($ for labor) the machine in a new unibody ($ for parts), test it ($ for labor), repack it ($ for labor and materials), ship it again ($ for shipping), and sell it at a discount because it's technically refurbished ($ from profits). The decreased sale price alone looses the Apple about $500, then add all the rest.

I think Apple should take responsibility for the quality of these machines, but I also understand why they train their customer service people to try to avoid replacing things, whether by making policies to exclude certain problems or simply by talking the customer out of it. What if the OP actually caused the damage to all three machines because he was wearing a ring that damaged the aluminum? That manager was in a tough position. As a shareholder I'm glad they do it.

 

[wheezy]

If the OP finds a problem with the laptop, he has every right to take it back. Three is pretty extreme, but in this case it happens. The 10% restocking fee charge is just garbage however, and the manager needs to pick up some customer service skills as he's shunning away a (seems to be very faithful) Apple Customer. He's purchased 3 laptops in the last year, to me he should be treated as a valuable customer who should get valuable service. However... don't flaunt your money. That's just fuel for the fire for some posters.

 

[nanofrog]

I sympathize with the OP. A new product should be perfect.

I also sympathize with the Manager. Apple has to protect their bottom line. Ideally they should do this by making the products perfect so they get no returns, but lets think about the alternative:
The machine that the OP returned for a tiny nick in the aluminum has to be shipped again ($ for shipping) to the refurbishment facility, has to be completely taken apart if the blemish is on the screen case part or the unibody ($ for labor). If it's on the bottom or the battery cover they just need to replace that. Let's assume it's the unibody. They have to reassemble ($ for labor) the machine in a new unibody ($ for parts), test it ($ for labor), repack it ($ for labor and materials), ship it again ($ for shipping), and sell it at a discount because it's technically refurbished ($ from profits). The decreased sale price alone looses the Apple about $500, then add all the rest.

I'd agree, that Apple should prevent this from ever happening by taking necessary steps in production.

They didn't, and should be held accountable. This is how they learn, and prevent such occurrences in the future. If not, they will go bankrupt in the end.

It's ashame that people have been trained to accept lower standards, and be happy about it. We should demand better.

Please don't accept this as nitpicking, as I don't agree with complaining just to complain. But Apple has set their target at the upper end, and even cosmetic damage isn't acceptable. To me, this is where the new car analogy has merit. Ask your SO if she'd accept a damaged finish on a new Gucci purse that wasn't part of a 2nds sale.

 

[ozziegn]

as he's shunning away a (seems to be very faithful) Apple Customer. He's purchased 3 laptops in the last year, to me he should be treated as a valuable customer who should get valuable service.

go ahead and add two 24" iMacs to that list as well. we home school two younger kids and they use the iMacs. so that's five Apple computers I've purchased from them in less than one year.

and to think it all started from my first iPhone purchase. I was stunned by how nice the iPhone was and it was enough to convince me to try their computers. the rest is obviously history.

However... don't flaunt your money. That's just fuel for the fire for some posters.

I wasn't flaunting anything. I just used my recent car purchase as an example of how I expect my purchases to be in perfect condition. there was no flaunting intended.

 

[samrulestothema]

I'd agree, that Apple should prevent this from ever happening by taking necessary steps in production.

They didn't, and should be held accountable. This is how they learn, and prevent such occurrences in the future. If not, they will go bankrupt in the end.

It's ashame that people have been trained to accept lower standards, and be happy about it. We should demand better.

Please don't accept this as nitpicking, as I don't agree with complaining just to complain. But Apple has set their target at the upper end, and even cosmetic damage isn't acceptable. To me, this is where the new car analogy has merit. Ask your SO if she'd accept a damaged finish on a new Gucci purse that wasn't part of a 2nds sale.

Yeah so i was bored and read every post in this thread. Fully glad this guy talked about Gucci.
A scratch on a macbook, is the same as a 3mm thread hanging from a Louis Vuitton handbag. It's not a lot, but for what they charge, and what the company stands for it is unacceptable. If apple wishes to compete in the high quality, high price industry then they must also adhere to the quality that comes in the high ends of any industry.

To the person talking about the 30miles on a car---erm no thats completely different. He isn't bitching about the battery being used before or for testing. A better example is a scratch on the hood. Not huge but enough to make any buyer slightly disappointed with their purchase.

There is a difference between not wanting to restock an item and deliberately being obtuse. Sounds like the manager's standards would have accepted scratches, and was knowingly ignoring them. (how did he manage to be a representative of apple? let alone a manager for an apple store)

Anyway theres my 2 cents worth.

Hope you get it all sorted.

P.S calling some guy a jerk, then going on about to prove a point says a lot about you too....

 

[NT1440]

P.S calling some guy a jerk, then going on about to prove a point says a lot about you too....

All I said he behaves like a jerk when he laughs in the face of people working at stores. They dont "need to put up with that crap" (or however he put it).

Its rude.

 

[drew0020]

All I said he behaves like a jerk when he laughs in the face of people working at stores. They dont "need to put up with that crap" (or however he put it).

Its rude.

I agree about not being rude, but I also agree with the OP. Apple needs to improve. I just noticed 2 dead/stuck pixels on my 4th laptop. What is the problem Apple??

I never had any of these issues with my 3 original Macbooks and multiple Airs.

 

[StayAlive]

IT is entirely likely that he got three faulty computers as the same happend to me. I don't think, in my case, asking for a working optical drive and a computer that does NOT make clunking noises when picked up is too much to ask. The bent lid thing on my just put it over the top. The books in my store are crap plain and simple. Maybe you got lucky and got a flawless one but just b/c you got lucky doesn't mean every one else with a problem is being too picky or is a bad customer. It just means you got lucky.

He is jerk because of the way he treated the manager. Insulting him, laughing in his face -- the very definition of a tool.

 

[SkylerXR]

go ahead and add two 24" iMacs to that list as well. we home school two younger kids and they use the iMacs. so that's five Apple computers I've purchased from them in less than one year.

and to think it all started from my first iPhone purchase. I was stunned by how nice the iPhone was and it was enough to convince me to try their computers. the rest is obviously history.



I wasn't flaunting anything. I just used my recent car purchase as an example of how I expect my purchases to be in perfect condition. there was no flaunting intended.

As reasonable as your actual complaint and the entire ordeal sound, you definitely are at least slightly delusional if you truly believe that you are not one bit of the image you are portraying, here and only here, in this thread, that others have pointed out. Take a step back and look at the audience you're writing to, and it's not too hard to deduce the reason behind some of the replies you're receiving.

With that said, I hope you'll be able to sort this out as painlessly as possible as soon as possible, either returning it or not. I'd also agree that the quality control of these new MacBooks is indeed quite poor. Although to be fair I have to say that there were certainly older generation MacBooks that were just as poorly built. Whether it was as often an occurrence or not I can't say due to the absence of any statistical data, but I'd be surprised if it turned out to be a significantly lower number.

In any case, I wish you the best of luck.

 

[chaos86]

It should be "Have Apple's quality control standards gone..." not "Has...
The word standards is plural.

This is an example of being a Jerk.

 

[chrisiw]

We are not talking about a few dollar item here. Any computer, I don't care who makes it, it should be flawless I have always bought Dell computers for work and all I have bought have been perfect no dents scratches etc, and these computers are the cheapest crap around 400-500 bucks. I since have switched over to mac , and I expect no less then perfect for the money we spend. I would raise hell also, Just my 2 cents..

Agree! I purchased a MSI Wind Netbook, at 25% the cost of a new MacBook, I know its allot smaller, but the product is of a very high standard. I thought that Apple products were good but the posts on here are very concerning, at the prices of these MacBooks they have got to be perfect.

 

[drew0020]

Agree! I purchased a MSI Wind Netbook, at 25% the cost of a new MacBook, I know its allot smaller, but the product is of a very high standard. I thought that Apple products were good but the posts on here are very concerning, at the prices of these MacBooks they have got to be perfect.

I have been one of the complainers, but I do love the computer!! Just hate problems Overall, the design, the body, the style are the best ever. Just some minor quality control that im sure will be ironed out over time.

 

[skubish]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5F136 Safari/525.20)

pics or it didn't happen

 

[themoonisdown09]

All I said he behaves like a jerk when he laughs in the face of people working at stores. They dont "need to put up with that crap" (or however he put it).

Its rude.

I believe I would laugh in the face of the store manager too if he was telling me that the 2nd scratched up computer in front of me was okay.

 

[JDSPGA]

After reading all of this...

1. The manager needed a laughing at, sounds to me like he needed to be put in his place. The OP didn't just laugh right off the bat, but probably after the 2nd macbook came back with scratches, and was told he had to pay a restocking fee....that's ridiculous!

2. I am a college student getting ready to buy my first macbook, first laptop at that. I have saved 1800 bucks for this thing and when I get it I want it to be perfect. 1800 isn't a lot to some of you but to me it's a whole freaking lot of money.

3. Some of you guys have the worst logic I have ever seen. Don't ever join a debate team.

 

[eye.surgeon]

People talk like these are the most expensive computers in the world so they must be perfect . They're $1299 people...barely entry level for serious users. Now if you just laid out $5k for a Sony TT or a VooDoo I could see where you would cry if some little detail were not perfect.

 

[bassline]

At first I was pretty sympathetic, being that I just bought a new Macbook 2 days ago for myself. But if, at the third laptop, it still has the same defects, I think you need to accept that as a normal product defect with what you're buying and either accept it or buy something else. They're not going to let you open every box in the store just to find one without defects or stand on the assembly line watching for one. THat's to say, it's definitely not universal, mine is in perfect condition.. try a different store at a last resort maybe?

 

[desenso]

[T]he camera probably wouldn't pick up the scratches. the scratches are pretty faint....

There are valid complaints, there are invalid complaints, and then there are people like you who have such a sense of entitlement that their complaints are, literally, laughable.

Your exploitation of Apple's generous return policy for this non-issue (scratches so faint that a camera can't pick them up on a machined metal product) harms all of us, because every time Apple has to sell the laptops you've opened as refurbs and take a hit, their willingness to accept returns goes down.

For all of our sake's, please stop buying Apple products and take your business elsewhere.

 

[drew0020]

There are valid complaints, there are invalid complaints, and then there are people like you who have such a sense of entitlement that their complaints are, literally, laughable.

Your exploitation of Apple's generous return policy for this non-issue (scratches so faint that a camera can't pick them up on a machined metal product) harms all of us, because every time Apple has to sell the laptops you've opened as refurbs and take a hit, their willingness to accept returns goes down.

For all of our sake's, please stop buying Apple products and take your business elsewhere.

I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, but if a scratch is .5" and bigger I think its valid whether or not a camera can pick it up. The funny thing is no MacBook, MacBook Air, or MacBook Pro I have purchased in the past has ever come with a scratch on the casing. I think this speaks volumes especially if the Air uses a similar process.

 

[allmIne]

go ahead and add two 24" iMacs to that list as well. we home school two younger kids and they use the iMacs. so that's five Apple computers I've purchased from them in less than one year.

and to think it all started from my first iPhone purchase. I was stunned by how nice the iPhone was and it was enough to convince me to try their computers. the rest is obviously history.



I wasn't flaunting anything. I just used my recent car purchase as an example of how I expect my purchases to be in perfect condition. there was no flaunting intended.

I think some people could take including the brand, model and price as flaunting. BMW ftw, though; their service is absolutely second to none, and it doesn't surprise me in the slightest they sorted it without a problem.

It's hard to say who's right here, as we can't see the damage. I don't agree with the hard time you're getting, though.

I'm also fairly sure 'laughing in the face of the manager' was used purely as an expression, to convey your incredulity. It's also pretty limp basing an entire argument on this one statement, as one poster has done. Actually, he's also quoted statements made by you in this thread, which is entirely unfair, because you're defending yourself, in the main from posts made by that poster and others to make you look like you're nitpicking and rude.

I'm guessing some of those attacking you have worked in retail in the past, or currently do so, and are pretty bitter. I have too, with high end clothes, and I've dealt with picky customers. If the goods aren't of sufficient quality, the customer will complain; that's life. I tend to find most are polite to begin with, as this poster was. They'll get irate if I stand there and tell them they're wrong, the product is perfect, when it's clearly not. Can't say i blame them.

Oh, and regarding not being able to take a picture of the scratch. That doesn't surprise me in the slightest. You only have to look on ebay to see the number of descriptions listing scratches that can't be picked up by a camera. Indeed, when I sold my powerbook 12in a few years ago, none of the cosmetic scratches showed up no matter what I tried.

 

[byke]

Ever since the intel switch over, which has helped boost sales.
We have seen a higher amount of pressure for apple to release more
products or updates or products in a shorter duration of time.

Unfortunately the trade off has been design perfection and build quality.
I myself have enjoyed using macs for a few years now, but with the
way the markets are changing and the pressure they are putting on apple
I am sure that we will really start to see a very noticeable change in products
and quality.

Unfortunately its these changes that will take away what has helped them
over the past few years.

 

[mcdj]

I posted in another thread about my 1st Alu MB. The keys were hitting the screen when I closed the lid, leaving oily marks on the glass, the constant seeing/cleaning/seeing again/recleaning of which, being a photo retoucher, drove me nuts.

I bought it in Soho NYC, but returned it to the 14th St. store. I initially met some resistance. Their position was that this was the nature of the design. But after a fairly lengthy, though entirely calm, friendly and civilized round of negotiation with the store manager (it had to be escalated from the Genius Bar, not because the Genius didn't empathize, but because the problem was considered too small and the Genius simply couldn't authorize a return by himself), I was given a new, and so far perfect, replacement.

IMO a calm friendly approach helped achieve the desired results, (you get more bees with honey!). I also strongly feel that getting the replacement from a different store bettered my chances of getting a replacement from a different batch than the original. I realize not everyone has the luxury of having multiple stores to choose from, but if at all possible, I highly recommend it. Evidence of batch specific problems can be seen in the OP's experience...multiple computers received in a row, all with scratches.