HomePod Firmware Suggests iPhone 8 Split Status Bar, Tap to Wake and No Touch ID Under Display

[RedWing512]

It's less I fail to consider their achievement, and more that I've lost faith in them. You're right, I'm not an engineer and don't know exactly how it works, but they sure as **** haven't been instilling confidence in the last few releases.

That's the difference between Steve's Apple and Timmy's Apple.

Steve's Apple was capable of truly amazing, world-changing things. Timmy's Apple, not so much.
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Perhaps integrating it under the display caused more problems than solutions: without a ring, maybe aligning fingers without explicitly looking at the screen was a hassle. Maybe, since it was under the display, fingerprints became an even larger problem. The what-ifs can extend in both directions so asking them without credible answers is pointless. It seems as though Apple found a solution that they are willing to be big on.

You say you expected a full redesign for 8 and that is what you are getting. Something that is redrawn and outside the box. You can't ask for those things then throw a tantrum when the small preview you get doesn't match what existed before.

Problem is that Apple is so slow coming to market with anything that it leaves them in a very uncomfortable position design-wise. They couldn't do the whole "thin-to-no-bezel" thing on the front of this phone without looking like an LG G6 or Galaxy S8. They had to do something different to make the phone stand out...hence the weird and extremely odd-looking cutout at the top.

 

[Syk]

My main concern is anyone being able to point my phone at my face and unlock it from there. Mind you, the concern isn't astronomically high, but I can see privacy issues arise from this. Plus, how easy would it be for a police officer to just point your phone at your face and get whatever they want off your phone in the spot? Again, not a huge concern of mine, but curious how it is addressed.

At the end of the day we were having similar discussions before Touch ID. Thatworked out fine. So I'm absolutely willing to let Apple show me what I don't know. Itnwill suck to have to dunk touchid though. If true of course.

I won't get into the legal side of it but why would the officer have possession of your phone and what's to stop a police officer from putting your finger on the TouchID ring. I'm going to guess that majority of people have their thumbs or index finger scanned in for TouchID. If an police officer is going to go through your phone when he shouldn't by holding it to your face then it's not beyond reason to think that he wouldn't cuff you and force your finger to the TouchID. If you're worried about a police officer doing that then you should be using a passcode instead

 

[DNichter]

That's the difference between Steve's Apple and Timmy's Apple.

Steve's Apple was capable of truly amazing, world-changing things. Timmy's Apple, not so much.
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Problem is that Apple is so slow coming to market with anything that it leaves them in a very uncomfortable position design-wise. They couldn't do the whole "thin-to-no-bezel" thing on the front of this phone without looking like an LG G6 or Galaxy S8. They had to do something different to make the phone stand out...hence the weird and extremely odd-looking cutout at the top.

I am sure that's it. They waited until the S8 and G6 to come out and then they started working on their phone design.

 

[JPack]

I was thinking the same thing... you're in a crowded place, sitting at a table or bar, attention is elsewhere or in a conversation, someone could angle your phone at you without you noticing at lot easier than they could grab your hand...

That assumes the iPhone checks faces once and never again after it's unlocked.

A proper implementation continuously checks the user's face, particularly when the user is accessing data or if significant motion is detected.

This is the beauty of facial recognition. It can continuously verify identity without prompting the user to place a thumb on a sensor.

 

[lordofthereef]

I won't get into the legal side of it but why would the officer have possession of your phone and what's to stop a police officer from putting your finger on the TouchID ring. I'm going to guess that majority of people have their thumbs or index finger scanned in for TouchID. If an police officer is going to go through your phone when he shouldn't by holding it to your face then it's not beyond reason to think that he wouldn't cuff you and force your finger to the TouchID.

It's a little more difficult to force (and of course cut off) a finger. This wouldn't force anything. They point it at you and they're done. Again, unless it doesn't work that way.

Nothings to stop them from holding you down and usingyour finger. Assuming they know which finger. And they place it correctly in three tries or fewer.
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Isn't Apple's whole remit "solutions for the 90%"? (at least it was under Jobs). There are always going to be scenarios where it "fails" in a given situation. The simple truth is if these concerns are paramount to you then it's simply not the phone for you.

It's just a matter of security. I just feel it's potentially less secure.

Further, if it is a large enough concern I imagine one could simply turn off the feature. Hardly a reason to not get the phone.

Anyway. Just thinking out loud. As one does in a forum.

 

[RedWing512]

I am sure that's it. They waited until the S8 and G6 to come out and then they started working on their phone design.

Obviously, they started working on it before then. But remember, this is the same company that sued Samsung for making their phones a similar rectangular shape. I still think it's possible that they had to reverse course and come up with something "new" after all these other phones started coming out.

 

[i hate phones]

That assumes the iPhone checks faces once and never again after it's unlocked.

A proper implementation continuously checks the user's face, particularly when the user is accessing data or if significant motion is detected.

This is the beauty of facial recognition. It can continuously verify identity without prompting the user to place a thumb on a sensor.

So what if you're letting someone else use your phone?

 

[djlythium]

Here you go. What is weird about this design is that it starts to curve up but gets cut off. I followed the curve of the icon...

I was thinking like the Forbes render (notice the curves), but with the time replacing the signal indicators. Can you do that please?

I would put money on that most Apple users really don't care about wifi or cell signal indicators anymore because they're practically unnecessary to be always on the main display. If you want to check them, go into settings. Also, I feel the same way about the location indictor, and the 'thinking' circle, so I could totally see Apple removing those, and keeping only the most necessary info (i.e. the time and the battery level).

Thank you! Good work!

 

[saile]

In my opinion the Touch ID will be integrated under the screen, it can not be otherwise!
How would we do with  Pay? The iPhone 7 is proof that they are able to place a "fictive" button so why could not they put it under the screen in a pseudo touch bar.


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galaxy s10 samsung galaxy s8

 

[stevefeinstein]

The iPhone 8 is expected to have an edge-to-edge design with thin bezels at the top and the sides

Edge-to-edge, or thin bezels. Pick one. They're mutually exclusive.

 

[BlankSlate]

What about the code that revealed a screen size of 6.5' inches, is that plausible? That got me hoping there will be a plus version of the 8, same design as the 5.8' inch version, just bigger. Would be my dream phone right there. Well, it's fun to speculate anyway.

 

[Prince1369]

No Touch ID..? it's going be a bit strange at first, when you use Apple Pay in a store and you tell the
cashier, "hold on a sec, the phone can't recognize my face right now"...and now you have a line behind you.

 

[JPack]

So what if you're letting someone else use your phone?

Similar to rotation lock. Toggle enhanced security on and off.

 

[jedifaka]

I read this site for the drama and this thread doesn't disappoint. The emotional attachment some people express for one particular biometric is stunning. And kind of fun.
Apple is thought to be buying 3D sensing components from Largan Precision (previous MacRumors thread). "Vertical-cavity surface-emitting lasers (VCSEL)," Lasers, man!
Facial recognition hasn't been done like that on a cellphone before. "But what about when it's dark?!" Between IR and range-finding lasers, your phone will have no problem finding you.
I'm currently using a Galaxy S8 and it's my favorite phone ever. Samsung Pay, with its support for magnetic swipe cards (still ubiquitous in the US) means it works virtually everywhere. But it doesn't have lasers (lasers!) and I'll finally know what iPhone envy feels like when Apple releases this next phone with a completely unique and very useful feature.
Overnight, fingerprint sensors are going to be passé and in a way that wired headphones won't be.

 

[phenoplastic]

Oh well, I'll be sticking with my iPhone 6 for another year then. It still runs great!

 

[sd70mac]

no worries, as soon as the iPhone 8 pre order goes live, you have about 0,003 seconds to get your pre order in. Anytime after those 0,003 seconds you are looking at shipphing times/backorders somewhere in your 2018 release date

That sounds a lot like Tesla's Model 3.

 

[LoveToMacRumors]

That sounds a lot like Tesla's Model 3.

Maybe 1 day, but they're not there yet.

 

[mariusignorello]

Because iOS 11 is in beta, Apple is moving forward with the next versions' (iOS 11.0.x and 11.x) development already. HomePod is running one of those versions, which would have debuted after the public iOS 11 and iPhone 8 were released, therefore there was no reason to create a version of iOS 11.x.x that omitted those bits since the update shouldn't have dropped prior.



Apple did not provide this software to him via the developer program, they released it into the Internet for anyone, including myself, to download and decompile. I fail to see how it has anything to do with software provided to him under that agreement, which section 2 explicitly defines prerelease software provided directly through the developer portal.

This is Apple's screw up, not his lol. Just because they have some license doesn't mean it's applicable to everything they produce.

Wait, where was this posted? Not in the developer portal?

 

[apolloa]

That assumes the iPhone checks faces once and never again after it's unlocked.

A proper implementation continuously checks the user's face, particularly when the user is accessing data or if significant motion is detected.

This is the beauty of facial recognition. It can continuously verify identity without prompting the user to place a thumb on a sensor.

Which will kill the battery in no time... a 3D camera and IR lights constantly in use, won't be very efficient for battery life.

 

[Mascots]

Wait, where was this posted? Not in the developer portal?

No, it was posted on the server they use to deliver updates and several sites that monitor them for the direct links to those updates picked it up.

https://mobile.twitter.com/stroughtonsmith/status/890967683273035776

 

[SRLMJ23]

No Touch ID on the iPhone 8 is a nail in the coffin for me. I just cannot buy supposedly the "best iPhone yet" if it does not even come with Touch ID, and I mean Touch ID on the FRONT of the iPhone, not some crappy Samsung style back of the phone fingerprint scanner. Also, as many people have pointed out, I do not think banks and stores will allow facial recognition as a secure way to use Apple Pay and therefore Apple Pay will be dead on Apples FLAGSHIP 10th anniversary iPhone?!?! I have seen people post about being able to use your passcode to pay with Apple Pay, however, anytime I have put my phone up to a terminal I have the Wallet app open and I see no where to use my passcode, only my fingerprint. We have heard ZERO rumors of Apple renegotiating Apple Pay terms with banks and stores that support it, and that seems a little odd to me. We would have surely heard leaks from meetings between Apple and banks/stores about using facial recognition as a "secure" way to use Apple Pay. I do not see banks going for this, maybe in 2-3 years it will be a viable "secure" method but right now facial recognition is in its infancy in general in the mobile market, and facial recognition on the iPhone is about to be "born" with the iPhone 8/X/Edition...whatever it is going to be called. I still feel like Touch ID will be embedded under the display or the home button could be super slim and fit on the bottom bezel, I do not know but it just has to be on this iPhone or Apple Pay will lose many of the banks that support it as well as many of the stores and then we lose a major feature of iPhones and one that I use basically every day. I would rather see it delayed and Touch ID implemented correctly vs. getting it out in September and losing features. I mainly focused on Apple Pay in this post but think of all the other ways we use Touch ID on our iPhones everyday. Unlock the iPhone, unlock apps, close apps, switch through apps, and many many more uses. I will go with the iPhone 7s Plus if there is no front positioned Touch ID sensor, or hell, just keep my iPhone 7 Plus for another year and then buy the iPhone 8s/9 or whatever the naming scheme will be in 2018. Sorry for the long post everyone...just my two cents!!!

 

[jonnysods]

I will genuinely disappointed if there is no Touch ID. Not because I don't like change, but because it is genuinely useful.

 

[WatchFromAfar]

I have seen people post about being able to use your passcode to pay with Apple Pay, however, anytime I have put my phone up to a terminal I have the Wallet app open and I see no where to use my passcode, only my fingerprint.

Disable TouchID and you get the option to enter your passcode. If TouchID is enabled then you have to use your finger print (makes sense otherwise why would you have it enabled?).

 

[christo747]

How do you know what disadvantages there are without seeing Apple's implementation of facial recognition? Considering what we've seen with ARkit on existing hardware I'm sure a newer device with 3D and IR sensors they could have some crazy implementation ready.

Physics? Something like unlocking the phone in the pocket. I guess not possible with facial recognition. ;-)

 

[mscice]

Im sure you all know that, whoever will get iPhone8 is a official tester of the new product... then apple will create 8s or 9 with all issues fixed haha its been always like this.

Ill wait it out for 8s or 9