How likely would you say the next MBA will be retina.

[Beau10]

This. Apple has already shown that it's willing to move in the direct of Retina for MacBooks, but will only do so if it can retain profit margins. I don't think it's a matter of if, but more like when and that will be when the tech is at a price Apple finds acceptable.

Apparently they didn't have too much trouble doing it for iPads earlier this year, and the yield cost is certainly going to be closer to that than a 15" screen currently by the time next year rolls around.

The biggest issue is power consumption and integrated GPU speed. Haswell will do much to fix that. I say 90% chance next year. There will likely be a 13" rMBP later this year, then 9+ months later we'll see the retina MBAs. I also believe the next updates for the retina MBPs will spell the phasing out of the classic MBPs with the costs coming back down to those price points.

 

[KohPhiPhi]

If they go retina on any 13", it's going to be rMBP 13" at 2560x1600 (doubling up on the current 1280x800).

Quite frankly, I still prefer current 1400x900 over 2560x1600, because it's more screen real state. I dont need ultra-high font crispiness, I would rather prefer larger screen real state.

 

[jfriedman8]

I think in the 13's you'll see something closer to 1920x1200 if they keep the same aspect ratio. Those screens are still expensive and Apple will have to keep up/ stay ahead with these Ultrabooks all soon to boast full HD screens.

For heat and build reasons alone, I think we're further off on a "retina" MBA display.

 

[LeGacY X]

Agreed, I believe that it will Lilkley be two or three generations before we see a Retina Air, if at all. By that time the tablets may have caught up....

 

[KittyKatta]

2010 - You can't fit a backlit keyboard into a computer so thin
2011 - You can't fit a 720p camera into a computer so thin
2012 - You can't fit a retina screen into a computer so thin

I bought a 2012 but im not sure if I "need" Retina enough to buy again so quickly but my guess is they'll get it in there and people will move on to wanting something new in the 2014 model.

 

[Vulcan]

Honestly, it's hard to say. The MacBook Pro needed a significantly larger battery to accommodate the new display. They largely accomplished this by removing the optical drive. The Air has nothing to remove and already is thin as can be. Unless Apple develops a new battery or does a completely new design, I don't see how it would be possible.

So with that being said, my guess would be early-2014.

 

[halledise]

Really?

In what planet?

The 2011 13" Ultimate MBAs are selling for $1000 ($1700 MSRP). I wouldn't call that "great". Good, maybe, not great.

I just got $1100 (less PP and ebay fees of course) for my 2011 MBA with 128gb SSD and 4gb memory.
paid $1400 for it a year ago from memory

 

[intervenient]

Messing around with my 11 today, I definitely think it's about time to get the 13.

Would have been nice to get on the good update cycle, but, YOLO and shizz, mirite?

 

[nuckinfutz]

2010 - You can't fit a backlit keyboard into a computer so thin
2011 - You can't fit a 720p camera into a computer so thin
2012 - You can't fit a retina screen into a computer so thin

I bought a 2012 but im not sure if I "need" Retina enough to buy again so quickly but my guess is they'll get it in there and people will move on to wanting something new in the 2014 model.

Some people get a thrill being proven wrong

Honestly, it's hard to say. The MacBook Pro needed a significantly larger battery to accommodate the new display. They largely accomplished this by removing the optical drive. The Air has nothing to remove and already is thin as can be. Unless Apple develops a new battery or does a completely new design, I don't see how it would be possible.

So with that being said, my guess would be early-2014.

A bit too pessimistic. The standard MBP 15 has a 77.4 Watt hour battery. The new Retina MBP has a 95 Watt hour battery (roughly 23% difference)

With that in mind presuming the same display technology is used Apple should only have to increase watt hours of the respective models by the same 23%

2012 11" MBA 35 Watt hour to 43
2012 13" MBA 50 Watt hour to 62(which is the size of the current 13)

Battery really isn't the issue. It's manufacturing yield. While LG is currently the sole supplier of the 15" screens I'd be willing to be that there will be multiple suppliers for the 13 size.

Agreed, I believe that it will Lilkley be two or three generations before we see a Retina Air, if at all. By that time the tablets may have caught up....

Not even in the ballpark.

 

[Booji]

I don't think the high resolutions will come to the Air line until the need for it becomes more mainstream.

If they are keeping the Air, the Pro needs to have a clear functionality distinction. The Air should be all around keeping it light as possible with the highest battery life and maximizing "on the go" type of use cases. Someone would upgrade to the Pro for better screens and more functionality at the cost of weight and potentially battery life.

 

[bit density]

Yes for Ultimate...

The existing screen and a retina screen will likely both be available. I think that they will have a tough time keeping the price point on the entry level machine with a retina screen. The ultimate in store, and BTO will be the only way to get them.

This is IF there is an improvement in screen yields. But there probably will be.

It will be the upgrade after that I would expect to see it in the entry level machine. I think this times out pretty well. By that time the overall engineering to get it consumer friendly will be done. Right now I think your going to see a bit of dinking around while developers see what they can do, and consumers express what they want.

----------

I don't think the high resolutions will come to the Air line until the need for it becomes more mainstream.

I think the distinction will be in how the machines are used. There is definitely a consideration for a tasty air that has a beautiful scree for document consumption. Pros, people who get paid to use their computer, as opposed to students and mom, will likely find that the screen clarity to be amazing along with the weight savings. But it will be expensive, and so only BTO or Ultimate would be my guess. And mainstream will continue with the same screen.

But only for one upgrade cycle.

 

[Booji]

The existing screen and a retina screen will likely both be available. I think that they will have a tough time keeping the price point on the entry level machine with a retina screen. The ultimate in store, and BTO will be the only way to get them.

This is IF there is an improvement in screen yields. But there probably will be.

It will be the upgrade after that I would expect to see it in the entry level machine. I think this times out pretty well. By that time the overall engineering to get it consumer friendly will be done. Right now I think your going to see a bit of dinking around while developers see what they can do, and consumers express what they want.

----------



I think the distinction will be in how the machines are used. There is definitely a consideration for a tasty air that has a beautiful scree for document consumption. Pros, people who get paid to use their computer, as opposed to students and mom, will likely find that the screen clarity to be amazing along with the weight savings. But it will be expensive, and so only BTO or Ultimate would be my guess. And mainstream will continue with the same screen.

But only for one upgrade cycle.

I think Apple needs to keep clear product differentiation between the Pro line and the Air line. The Airs will focus on light weight, mid-level performance and battery life. The Pro line will have the top end performance and graphics at the expense of weight and power consumption. Therefore, it makes sense to keep the Air line at standard resolutions.

 

[ixodes]

The other thing of course is that they need to keep something at the $999 price point, if the 13" MBP become retina, and presumably moves up in price, what is going to fill the cheap seats?

I agree, yet a single model (think white MacBook of the past) will fill that slot.

It's almost a given that Apple will introduce retina equipped MBA's at the next refresh. They're far too profitable not too.

Apples on a roll with "Retina Madness" and will strike while the demand is at fever pitch. Apple is nothing if not genius at separating customers from their money.

 

[mattopotamus]

I agree, yet a single model (think white MacBook of the past) will fill that slot.

It's almost a given that Apple will introduce retina equipped MBA's at the next refresh. They're far too profitable not too.

Apples on a roll with "Retina Madness" and will strike while the demand is at fever pitch. Apple is nothing if not genius at separating customers from their money.

IMO, that is not even close to being accurate. They really need a dedicated GPU to handle the retina, and the airs won't be getting that.

 

[ixodes]

They really need a dedicated GPU to handle the retina, and the airs won't be getting that.

You're absolutely right, they do need a dedicated GPU, and they'll have it.

Remember, Apple did not create this massively profitable company by sitting back & waiting. When money is no object for a company like Apple withs it's highly brilliant engineers, they'll pull it off post haste.

Nothing motivates Apple like huge profits, make no mistake, they'll push the retina displays out to consumers as though it's an absolute must have item.

 

[PeterJP]

I've been looking at the 13 inch MBA, and while it looks like a suburb laptop...

It's not *that* big, is it ?

If it was, it could easily accomodate a screen with retina-like resolution. It would still be around 1ppi, but very high resolution anyway.


Peter.

 

[mattopotamus]

You're absolutely right, they do need a dedicated GPU, and they'll have it.

Remember, Apple did not create this massively profitable company by sitting back & waiting. When money is no object for a company like Apple withs it's highly brilliant engineers, they'll pull it off post haste.

Nothing motivates Apple like huge profits, make no mistake, they'll push the retina displays out to consumers as though it's an absolute must have item.

I just don't know how they can keep it an "air" with all of those features. I could see all of the pro models getting it in the next refresh, but the airs will fry with all of that heat in such a small build. I think they will update the panels, but retina is maybe 2-3 years out on the airs. If they did it, that would be amazing. Another concern is the price point. Adding retina to all models would cause a pretty hefty price increase and cut into sales. Would the mark-up make up for it...dunno

 

[clyde2801]

My friend got $1150 for his, I'd say that's pretty great. And $1000 is pretty damn good too, you'd never see that kind of resale value on a Windows laptop.

Yes, you're right on that one. Regardless of rumors, I'd definitely sell before they got released.

When I was recently fighting off 15" rMBP mojo, I was disconcerted to learn that I could MAYBE get $1100-1200 for my ultimate 2011 13", and that was with Applecare and a bunch of extra stuff thrown in. And by disconcerted, I mean :censored:.

Keep in mind a few oldtimers might have an outdated concept on mac resell value...it used to be Apple updated the powerbook from a 1.25 to a 1.33 ghz g4 chip, so you could get 90% of your value back after a year! Not so anymore, consider it the downside to Apple getting on the Intel upgrade bus.

Anandtech mentioned lagginess and scrolling issues in its review of the rMBP...abysmal under 10.7, improved with 10.8. And that's with an Nvidia 650 card! The culprit seems to be the integrated 4000 graphics powering the display in low power mode.

Since the MBA isn't going to get a discrete GPU due to size constraints, a retina won't happen with Ivy Bridge. Haswell and especially Broadwell are supposedly promising better integrated graphics. My guess is that it will be 2014 with the Broadwell chipset.

I just wish they'd put a better display in the Air, period. I don't need four times the amount of pixels, but I'd really, really like a display with better contrast (Blacks should be BLACK, dammit!) and a wider viewing angle.

If Apple forces the display manufacturers to dramatically up their game due to Retina madness, the overall net result will be a win for all consumers, even Windows folks (though I think they'd rather cough up blood than admit that).

 

[Blackened Apple]

After rethinking this. I really don't see them releasing an Air with Retina display, at least not next year. They'll probably just give the same treatment they gave to the 15" MBP to the 13" MBP, it most likely wouldn't be feasible to have it any thinner than that and still be able to power that amount of pixels. And then drop the old-style MBPs. So we'll be left with 11" and 13" Airs ultraportables, 13" and 15" rMBPs, slightly less portables, but pricier and more premium. That'd be quite a solid product lineup.

 

[nuckinfutz]

Therefore, it makes sense to keep the Air line at standard resolutions.

Nope. The separation is already there between the Pro lineup and the Air lineup. Pro have faster processors with higher TDP and Quad Core processing in the 15"

If you read the tea leaves Apple considers Retina to be a shift to be an important part of next generation computing.

IMO, that is not even close to being accurate. They really need a dedicated GPU to handle the retina, and the airs won't be getting that.

Not really, iGPU is fine so long as the design is powerful enough. Today it's not but next year Haswell based hardware will be able to run Retina resolutions with the onboard iGPU. Intel covered this at IDF 2012.

 

[mattopotamus]

Nope. The separation is already there between the Pro lineup and the Air lineup. Pro have faster processors with higher TDP and Quad Core processing in the 15"

If you read the tea leaves Apple considers Retina to be a shift to be an important part of next generation computing.



Not really, iGPU is fine so long as the design is powerful enough. Today it's not but next year Haswell based hardware will be able to run Retina resolutions with the onboard iGPU. Intel covered this at IDF 2012.

I still don't think they will be in the airs b.c then we are most likely looking at a base of $1500 which makes them lose a lot of business.

 

[nuckinfutz]

I still don't think they will be in the airs b.c then we are most likely looking at a base of $1500 which makes them lose a lot of business.

Intel is planning HiRez support for Desktops, Ultra Book, AIO and more.

https://www.macrumors.com/2012/04/12/intel-looking-toward-retina-display-pcs-by-2013/

I think the displays next year will come at only a slight premium and Haswell will have the oomph to push the resolution more than anything Intel has today.

 

[theSeb]

If they go retina on any 13", it's going to be rMBP 13" at 2560x1600 (doubling up on the current 1280x800).

Quite frankly, I still prefer current 1400x900 over 2560x1600, because it's more screen real state. I dont need ultra-high font crispiness, I would rather prefer larger screen real state.

The rMBP is doubled 1400x900 and not 2560x1600. I am not following your line of thought.

 

[johnmacward]

I think, yes they probably will but not yet. The Retina MBP is pushing the absolute limits of FPS so I can safely assume that an Air with much less room for power (due to space and power limitations) will start pumping 2400 X whatever pixels out through an Intel HD 4000.

 

[calvol]

Retina will NOT make it to the MBA until a screen technology comes along that draws less power and is cost effective, perhaps a version of OLED technology? The power consumption of Retina is just too high to make if feasible in the current genome of MBAs. Remember, these are Ultrabooks, and size and battery life trump display features.