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HOWTO: 2880x1800 Without Scaling in OS X

darwinian said:
I can't wait to play around with getting a GNU/Linux system up and running on this thing.
Click to expand...

Me too. My biggest concern at this point is the thunderbolt ethernet support. I am almost 95% sure that I will be primarily running linux on my macbook pro retina.
 
An update on my experiences on 2880x1880.

For mobile productivity, its game changing.

I've made some changes to the ergonomics of my workstation for comfort and to prevent the tendency of leaning in towards the screen on smaller objects, and its working out well.

I am slightly nearsighted (.75 correction) and am able to clearly distinguish any element on the screen at 22-24" from my eyes. I can still operate sitting roughly 36" from the laptop screen, however I personally lose focus without my glasses ever so slightly at that distance, and I'd imagine the scale of text exacerbates my distance vision.

TL;DR: My visions not perfect and I have adjusted perfectly to 2880x1800 native. I haven't experienced such general satisfaction with a laptop since the Thinkpad T40 series.

While it may be obvious, rendering at the native 2880x1800 removes any and all scaling defects (fuzzy fonts, blown out icons, etc) and is very smooth in GPU accelerated, desktop applications. The 650M is buttery smooth for business productivity on this display and an external 2560x1600.
 
@plazmic: Do you know if this app is actually able to overcome the scaling issue described in this thread?

That means, if you create a 1440x900px profile in SwitchResX, does it display old "not-yet-retinafied" apps normal as it would on an old MBP? Or are they also pixelated and blurry? If it actually would display them normal than the app would really be a game changer.

Would be great if somebody with a Retina MBP could try that for me!


Thanks!

MD
 
MDomino said:
@plazmic: Do you know if this app is actually able to overcome the scaling issue described in this thread?

That means, if you create a 1440x900px profile in SwitchResX, does it display old "not-yet-retinafied" apps normal as it would on an old MBP? Or are they also pixelated and blurry? If it actually would display them normal than the app would really be a game changer.

Would be great if somebody with a Retina MBP could try that for me!


Thanks!

MD
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I'm looking for! At the moment, I need current apps and things to look great, not wait for everything to be updated to retina. Any news/updates would be greatly appreciated. Kinda scared to buy the RMBP until this is clear. Can't look at blurry stuff until it's updated!!
 
To be clear here (I'm not quite sure how it works), is the physical resolution 2880x1800, but it shows a 1440x900 image (e.g. 1 pixel becomes 4), and what you're doing is forcing it to show a 2880x1800 image?
Edit: so it's basically real-estate vs clarity?
 
Last edited:
JosephDuffy said:
To be clear here (I'm not quite sure how it works), is the physical resolution 2880x1800, but it shows a 1440x900 image (e.g. 1 pixel becomes 4), and what you're doing is forcing it to show a 2880x1800 image?
Edit: so it's basically real-estate vs clarity?
Click to expand...

Correct.

I dunno guys, I don't have perfect vision but I'm trying the 1920x1200 scaled mode and even with it the text is a bit too small for my liking. Maybe I will adjust. Don't know how you can stand going full-native though.
 
plazmic said:
An update on my experiences on 2880x1880.

For mobile productivity, its game changing.

I've made some changes to the ergonomics of my workstation for comfort and to prevent the tendency of leaning in towards the screen on smaller objects, and its working out well.

I am slightly nearsighted (.75 correction) and am able to clearly distinguish any element on the screen at 22-24" from my eyes. I can still operate sitting roughly 36" from the laptop screen, however I personally lose focus without my glasses ever so slightly at that distance, and I'd imagine the scale of text exacerbates my distance vision.

TL;DR: My visions not perfect and I have adjusted perfectly to 2880x1800 native. I haven't experienced such general satisfaction with a laptop since the Thinkpad T40 series.

While it may be obvious, rendering at the native 2880x1800 removes any and all scaling defects (fuzzy fonts, blown out icons, etc) and is very smooth in GPU accelerated, desktop applications. The 650M is buttery smooth for business productivity on this display and an external 2560x1600.
Click to expand...

Dude, you just conviced me to buy this laptop. I have very good eyesight, so for me to hear u adjusted made me so happy

already wrote about this some days ago
https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15039604

and im so happy that this fix is already out. I cant understand why apple didnt include the option. Didnt cost them nothing to do it. And people have more choices. Please share more info on how its going 😀

thanks again!

----------
JosephDuffy said:
To be clear here (I'm not quite sure how it works), is the physical resolution 2880x1800, but it shows a 1440x900 image (e.g. 1 pixel becomes 4), and what you're doing is forcing it to show a 2880x1800 image?
Edit: so it's basically real-estate vs clarity?
Click to expand...
Why would u get worse clarity/picture quality at native 2880x1440. Its still the same amount of pixels pushed. everything is just smaller. But pictures etc will still look as good.
 
I tried this out, but when I tried going back to the factory defaults, it got messed up. Now none of the scaling options in System Preferences work. It looks like SwitchResX deleted this file:

Code: 
/System/Library/Displays/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-610/DisplayProductID-a00f

Can someone be kind enough to zip up this file and attach it here or send it to me? I don't want to go through the hassle of a restore just for 1 missing system file.

By the way, beware of this application! Don't let it happen to you.
 
Sir Al said:
I tried this out, but when I tried going back to the factory defaults, it got messed up. Now none of the scaling options in System Preferences work. It looks like SwitchResX deleted this file:

Code: 
/System/Library/Displays/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-610/DisplayProductID-a00f

Can someone be kind enough to zip up this file and attach it here or send it to me? I don't want to go through the hassle of a restore just for 1 missing system file.

By the way, beware of this application! Don't let it happen to you.
Click to expand...

sure

Code: 
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<!DOCTYPE plist PUBLIC "-//Apple//DTD PLIST 1.0//EN" "http://www.apple.com/DTDs/PropertyList-1.0.dtd">
<plist version="1.0">
<dict>
	<key>IOGFlags</key>
	<integer>4</integer>
	<key>scale-resolutions</key>
	<array>
	<!-- internal panel modes AND modes mirroring external panels (but not kDisplayModeValidForMirroringFlag)  " -->
	<!--  	This list includes sizes that overlap between and preferred sizes the internal panel and common matches for external displays" -->
	<!--  	If the internal panel does not need a sizes then set kDisplayModeValidForMirroringFlag and move them down to that list " -->
		<data>AAAPAAAACWAAAAAB</data>				<!-- 3840x2400 internal 16x10 1920x1200 -->
		<data>AAANIAAACDQAAAAB</data>				<!-- 3360x2100 internal 16x10 1680x1050 -->
		<data>AAAKAAAABkAAAAAB</data>				<!-- 2650x1600 internal mirror 16x10 to mirror to external 30" -->
		<data>AAAIAAAABQAAAAAB</data>				<!-- 2048x1280 internal 16x10 1680x1050 21" -->
		<data>AAAEAAAAAwAAAAAB</data>				<!-- 1024x768  internal mirror 4x3   compatibility -->
		<data>AAADIAAAAlgAAAAB</data>				<!--  800x600  internal mirror 4x3   compatibility -->
		<data>AAACgAAAAeAAAAAB</data>				<!--  640x480  internal mirror 4x3   compatibility -->

	<!-- internal panel to mirror to common external displays (best for external - kDisplayModeValidForMirroringFlag) " -->
		<!-- already present above -->				<!-- 2650x1600 internal mirror 16x10 to mirror to external 30" -->
		<data>AAAKAAAABaAAAAABACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 2650x1440 internal mirror 16x9  to mirror to external 27" -->
		<data>AAAHgAAABLAAAAABACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1920x1200 internal mirror 16x10 to mirror to external 21" -->
		<data>AAAHgAAABDgAAAABACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1920x1080 internal mirror 16x9  to mirror to external 1080p -->
		<data>AAAFAAAAAtAAAAABACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1280x720  internal mirror 16x9  to mirror to external  720p -->
		
	<!-- internal panel low-resolution modes (game compatibility) " -->
		<!-- already present above -->				<!-- 1920x1200 internal low-res 16x10 upscale mode -->
		<data>AAAGkAAABBoAAAAB</data>				<!-- 1650x1050 internal low-res 16x10 upscale mode -->
		<data>AAAFoAAAA4QAAAAB</data>				<!-- 1140x900  internal low-res 16x10 upscale mode -->
		<data>AAAFAAAAAyAAAAAB</data>				<!-- 1280x800  internal low-res 16x10 upscale mode -->

	<!-- EXTERNAL panels to mirror to internal displays (best for internal) " -->
		<data>AAAPAAAACWAAAAAJAKAAAA==</data>		<!-- 3840x2400 mirror external panels to internal (include 2x) -->
		<data>AAANIAAACDQAAAAJAKAAAA==</data>		<!-- 3360x2100 mirror external panels to internal (include 2x) -->
		<data>AAALQAAABwgAAAAJAKAAAA==</data>		<!-- 2880x1800 mirror external panels to internal (include 2x) -->
		<data>AAAKAAAABkAAAAAJAKAAAA==</data>		<!-- 2650x1600 mirror external panels to internal (include 2x) -->
		<data>AAAHgAAABLAAAAAJAKAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1920x1200 mirror external panels to internal (include 2x) -->

		<data>AAAHgAAABDgAAAAJACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1920x1080 mirror external panels to internal 1080p (no 2x) -->
		<data>AAAFAAAAAtAAAAAJACAAAA==</data>		<!-- 1280x720  mirror external panels to internal  720p (no 2x) -->
	</array>
</dict>
</plist>
 
houkouonchi said:
I work at a datacenter for a web-hosting company. Here is a picture taken just a few minutes ago. You can see the left monitor (my highest resolution 3840x2400 22 inch monitor) just has tons of terminals on it. It allows me to have lots of stuff running where I can see output all at once. I work for one of the largest shared hosting companies so its nice to be able to see everything at once especially when there are short burst outgoing DDoS servers that are hard to catch cause they run for very short time (you can have a ping running on tons of servers and see when one stops).

[url=http://box.houkouonchi.jp//workstations_triplemonitor-small.jpg]Image[/URL]



This totally depends on the person. Honestly I have no problem reading 75 DPI X (which is lower DPI than most other OS's) Basically the text on my terminal monitor is about the height of the width of a dime.

I think as long as someone has near 20/20 vision (or corrected) it is fine. I have glasses with a nearly 6 diopter (very heavily corrected) and have no issues.
Click to expand...

Just curious, why 3 smaller monitors instead of like 2 32 inch?
 
Sir Al said:
I tried this out, but when I tried going back to the factory defaults, it got messed up. Now none of the scaling options in System Preferences work. It looks like SwitchResX deleted this file:

Code: 
/System/Library/Displays/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-610/DisplayProductID-a00f

Can someone be kind enough to zip up this file and attach it here or send it to me? I don't want to go through the hassle of a restore just for 1 missing system file.

By the way, beware of this application! Don't let it happen to you.
Click to expand...

I've had similar issues during tinkering, but using switchresx to go back to scaled modes worked and after reboot so did the built in preference pane.

The original post does state there's issues with using switchresx, the most concerning is the login screen after a reboot.
 
MDomino said:
@plazmic: Do you know if this app is actually able to overcome the scaling issue described in this thread?

That means, if you create a 1440x900px profile in SwitchResX, does it display old "not-yet-retinafied" apps normal as it would on an old MBP? Or are they also pixelated and blurry? If it actually would display them normal than the app would really be a game changer.

Would be great if somebody with a Retina MBP could try that for me!


Thanks!

MD
Click to expand...

I answered another similar question already: 1440x900 (non-scaled) is being redirected and forced back into the scaled HiDPI mode (presumably by the nvidia kexts). In other words, I haven't been able to get OS X to actually display @ 1440x900.

But to answer your question directly, that mode would fix the blurriness introduced by applications that don't support HiDPI. Just as running in a true, nonscaled 2880x1800 does. However, you will give up the image clarity you see in "retina mode"... when we can get 1440x900 to work without HiDPI, it will look identical to the regular MBP's (not counting color/contrast/other panel differences).
 
Sean Dempsey said:
sure
Click to expand...
Thank you so much, you are a lifesaver!

Funny this is exactly the same file as DisplayProductID-a00e. Can someone confirm that DisplayProductID-a00f and DisplayProductID-a00e are identical?

Thanks again!

----------
plazmic said:
I've had similar issues during tinkering, but using switchresx to go back to scaled modes worked and after reboot so did the built in preference pane.

The original post does state there's issues with using switchresx, the most concerning is the login screen after a reboot.
Click to expand...
I was playing around with the custom resolutions on the last tab... so I don't recommend doing that.
 
plazmic said:
But to answer your question directly, that mode would fix the blurriness introduced by applications that don't support HiDPI. Just as running in a true, nonscaled 2880x1800 does. However, you will give up the image clarity you see in "retina mode"... when we can get 1440x900 to work without HiDPI, it will look identical to the regular MBP's (not counting color/contrast/other panel differences).
Click to expand...

Yes, that's exactly what I would need: to force it to use true 1440x900, so it doesn't use it's weird scaling behaviour that makes old apps look really terrible, but just look like it did on the regular MBPs.

Pity, that that's not possible. Let's hope there will be some software that can do this soon.
Thanks for trying it out, though!
 
plazmic said:
While it may be obvious, rendering at the native 2880x1800 removes any and all scaling defects (fuzzy fonts, blown out icons, etc) and is very smooth in GPU accelerated, desktop applications. The 650M is buttery smooth for business productivity on this display and an external 2560x1600.
Click to expand...

Good to hear. When I just got my 17" MBP, the text seems small, as I was transiting from my 24" 1920X1200 screen. However, soon after, I realised that I was more productive on the 17", than the 24". The eyes tire lesser.

I later read about the Bates Method, which teaches how the eyes are suppose to see. Basically our eyes are made to focus only on a small part (centralisation). You are only suppose to see one word at a time, not a bunch of words. In that sense, small text is better than large text.
http://www.seeing.org/intro/faq/faq03.htm
The Bates Method teaches that small and fine print is easier to read, relaxes the mind, eyes, improves central fixation and the clarity of eyesight at close and far distances.
Text is in a variety of colors. Color improves the function of the brain with the eyes.
Click to expand...
http://www.cleareyesight.info/
Don't get me wrong, large displays are good if you can be positioned further. If you have limited space, large displays/text simply tire your eyes quickly.

So native res on the RMBP maybe suitable for people who have near 20/20 eyesight.

Now I just have to wait for Windows compatability...
 
Last edited:
Dangerous Theory said:
Just curious, why 3 smaller monitors instead of like 2 32 inch?
Click to expand...

I cant REALLY answer for him, but most people forget screen size and number of pixels are totally unrelated. have you ever tried using a 1080p 42" tv as a comp monitor? sitting up close to it, the resolution in't that great, besides the fact its impossible to see the whole thing when you are 2 feet away. a more drastic example would be looking up close at any projector image, same idea

now if you have the same 1080p in say a 22" monitor, you can see the whole screen and its not pixelated.

a bigger screen doesn't always equal more screen real estate.
 
Is someone able to take a full screenshot while having this resolution?

for-science-detail.jpg
 
plazmic said:
An update on my experiences on 2880x1880.

For mobile productivity, its game changing.

I've made some changes to the ergonomics of my workstation for comfort and to prevent the tendency of leaning in towards the screen on smaller objects, and its working out well.

I am slightly nearsighted (.75 correction) and am able to clearly distinguish any element on the screen at 22-24" from my eyes. I can still operate sitting roughly 36" from the laptop screen, however I personally lose focus without my glasses ever so slightly at that distance, and I'd imagine the scale of text exacerbates my distance vision.

TL;DR: My visions not perfect and I have adjusted perfectly to 2880x1800 native. I haven't experienced such general satisfaction with a laptop since the Thinkpad T40 series.

While it may be obvious, rendering at the native 2880x1800 removes any and all scaling defects (fuzzy fonts, blown out icons, etc) and is very smooth in GPU accelerated, desktop applications. The 650M is buttery smooth for business productivity on this display and an external 2560x1600.
Click to expand...

Do you mind posting a video of the native resolution?? It seems interesting and I would like to try this on my RMBP too.
 
this is so unbelievably insane. I can hardly see anything and it's great!!!!!!! So much real estate!

Screenshot to follow.
 

Attachments

  • maxreso.jpg
    maxreso.jpg
    1 MB · Views: 4,028
Last edited:
Can some of you running the native resolution compare the battery life versus other resolutions like the "Best", and 1920X1200?
 
unixperience said:
I cant REALLY answer for him, but most people forget screen size and number of pixels are totally unrelated. have you ever tried using a 1080p 42" tv as a comp monitor? sitting up close to it, the resolution in't that great, besides the fact its impossible to see the whole thing when you are 2 feet away. a more drastic example would be looking up close at any projector image, same idea

now if you have the same 1080p in say a 22" monitor, you can see the whole screen and its not pixelated.

a bigger screen doesn't always equal more screen real estate.
Click to expand...

Yeah i know Tv's have terrible resolutions, was thinking of higher res computer monitors. You make a good point about visibility at close range though.
 
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