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HP Claims Innovation Over Apple With 'World's Thinnest Laptop'

lowkey said:
Technically it can. But in practice it's becoming a real drag lugging it around every day. The 15"rMBP is still pretty heavy.

I'd love a smaller lighter Mac laptop with an i7.
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My guess is you'll get one this year.

Blaze4G said:
So why is the macbook not one of its real competitors?

That's like you saying the galaxy s7 is not competing against the 6s. Really?
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So far it seems like the Mac is the only thing this is being compared to as if the XPS and Surface Book didn't exist. Since all of those run Windows 10 might be a better comparison, no? Of course we haven't seen any reviews yet, just the tech media regurgitating HPs marketing. Even this story is just quoting from HPs press release and using their press photos.

\-V-/ said:
Wow ... what's Apple's excuse for having 1 port?
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Excuse for what? I'm sure if Apple could build a device with no ports they would. If you want a laptop with more ports that's what the MBP is for.
 
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Rogifan said:
My guess is you'll get one this year.



So far it seems like the Mac is the only thing this is being compared to as if the XPS and Surface Book didn't exist. Since all of those run Windows 10 might be a better comparison, no? Of course we haven't seen any reviews yet, just the tech media regurgitating HPs marketing. Even this story is just quoting from HPs press release and using their press photos.



Excuse for what? I'm sure if Apple could build a device with no ports they would. If you want a laptop with more ports that's what the MBP is for.
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HP clearly aimed this at the macbook. So obviously the media is going to compare it to the macbook. HP says it's the world thinnest laptop. Who previously held that record? The macbook. So isn't it obvious that is what people would compare it to?

Again, when Samsung release their phones, what is the first device media and reviewers compare it to? The iPhone. Then after it gets compared to g5, Nexus, etc. So why should this be any different?

Lol @ excuse for macbook one port design. If Apple was aiming the macbook at people who only used one port (which is NO ONE) then they would not have adapters.
 
MagnusVonMagnum said:
You are mistaken, sir. My original post was a comment about this HP laptop versus the Macbook that uses similar connections (as in if HP can manage, why can't Apple?). My comments were a comparison. It is your response that made excuses for Apple's design choices that lead me to comment further on the Macbook. Please don't pretend I'm hung up on it. I'm simply mystified by Apple's designs as of late. They push USB-C early on the Macbook, but then they do not offer it on later Macbook Pro models or iMacs, even. They could have put it on the iPhone as well since it is the new worldwide STANDARD, but they chose to continue the Lightning port, even on the new iPad Pro where it doesn't have enough bandwidth to remotely begin to replace Macbooks as some reviews (from say Macworld) have suggested it is starting to do.

If Apple is going to embrace the standard that is USB-C, particularly now that is part of Thunderbolt III, they should do so wholeheartedly and begin putting it on everything so we only need ONE type of cable for everything (save hubs which would facilitate the transition at home and perhaps a USB-3 port or two for a few years on larger model notebooks and iMacs). But instead, Apple has frustratingly split their product lines into using different connectors while offering overall less connectors than in the past even for 15" models (e.g. my 2008 Macbook Pro had every connector a person could possibly want; now they can't even give you an extra USB3 port when they've removed Ethernet, Firewire, Express Card and larger video ports like the full size DVI the 2008 model had).

I'm ready to buy a new Macbook Pro and even possibly a new desktop replacement, but I'm not going to buy some outdated POS. I want Thunderbolt III with USB-C and a hub that can take an external graphics card for the Macbook Pro (so I can use it as a desktop) or an Mac desktop of some kind that has a REAL GPU capable of handling things like virtual reality, even if I have to dual-boot Windows to use it. We've been told THE reason Apple is not getting the Oculus Rift is that they don't offer a single model Mac that has a GPU that can make use of it properly and that includes the Mac Pro. I've been saying for years Apple needs better GPUs, but that company said it better in a nut shell how under-powered Macs are for graphics these days.

I don't like Microsoft's invasion of privacy and forced updates that is Windows 10, but I'm tired of being four years behind and a $1000 short on everything but the CPU due to Apple's inept hardware design choices.
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Well I'll say Magnus, that is a much more coherent explanation then I was reading before, thanks for that. My suspicion is June is when the MBP is likely receiving a major overhaul.

I still stand by the idea that the MacBook isn't a "why can't they" but instead a "they chose not to", but it sounds to me like you're in the market for a Pro, so let's see what happens two months from now.
 
I'm always rather incredulous when people call Apple's engineers "inept". You've got to just laugh from your belly at such nonsense. They're as "inept" as Mondrian was with painting intersecting lines in cleverly calculated spacings and filling the intersections with bold colours to appeal to the senses, as "inept" as Tchaikovsky was at composing music, or as "inept" as Dieter Rams is at designing record players.

Jony Ive is well known as being of the thinking that design should be "inevitable" and get out of the way, not stand up and shout "LOOK AT ME! LOOK - LOOK HOW CLEVER THIS DESIGN ELEMENT IS, AND HOW ELEGANT AND SMART IT IS THAT THIS GOLD HINGE ARCS OUTWARD, AND THEN GLIDES BACK INTO THE BODY WHEN THE LID'S BEING CLOSED.... LOOK!!!! LOOK HOW CLEVER WE WERE TO DESIGN SOMETHING SO OBVIOUS, BUT LOOK!!!!!!!"

The design language of this laptop is shouting "I'm insecure" to those who can read design language properly. Go and watch "Objectified" movie - a very good place to begin.

These people must have no sense for good design, or, in some cases, just not much sense at ALL.
 
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uid15 said:
I'm always rather incredulous when people call Apple's engineers "inept". You've got to just laugh from your belly at such nonsense. They're as "inept" as Mondrian was with painting intersecting lines in cleverly calculated spacings and filling the intersections with bold colours to appeal to the senses, as "inept" as Tchaikovsky was at composing music, or as "inept" as Dieter Rams is at designing record players.

These people must have no sense for good design, or, in some cases, just not much sense at ALL.
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Isn't "good" design somewhat subjective?
 
Blaze4G said:
HP clearly aimed this at the macbook. So obviously the media is going to compare it to the macbook. HP says it's the world thinnest laptop. Who previously held that record? The macbook. So isn't it obvious that is what people would compare it to?

Again, when Samsung release their phones, what is the first device media and reviewers compare it to? The iPhone. Then after it gets compared to g5, Nexus, etc. So why should this be any different?

Lol @ excuse for macbook one port design. If Apple was aiming the macbook at people who only used one port (which is NO ONE) then they would not have adapters.
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I'm not making an excuse for anything. I'm saying Apple is intentionally trying to get away with as few ports as possible, not that their engineers aren't smart or innovative enough to add more. And yeah, they'll sell an adapter because they know some people will buy it and accessories are profitable. But I'll bet most people that own the MacBook are using just the one port (like tens of millions do with an iPad).

Anyway I find it quite amusing that Apple routinely gets knocked for being obsessed with thinness yet this device is being fawned over, mostly sight unseen (outside of HP press photos), for being thinner than the MacBook (even though it's actually heavier, has an inferior screen and has fans). And if laptops like the XPS and Surface Book are supposedly more innovative than any Mac, according to the tech media, why are they focused on comparing it to the Mac? We all know why; clicks, clicks, clicks.

uid15 said:
I'm always rather incredulous when people call Apple's engineers "inept". You've got to just laugh from your belly at such nonsense. They're as "inept" as Mondrian was with painting intersecting lines in cleverly calculated spacings and filling the intersections with bold colours to appeal to the senses, as "inept" as Tchaikovsky was at composing music, or as "inept" as Dieter Rams is at designing record players.

Jony Ive is well known as being of the thinking that design should be "inevitable" and get out of the way, not stand up and shout "LOOK AT ME! LOOK - LOOK HOW CLEVER THIS DESIGN ELEMENT IS, AND HOW ELEGANT AND SMART IT IS THAT THIS GOLD HINGE ARCS OUTWARD, AND THEN GLIDES BACK INTO THE BODY WHEN THE LID'S BEING CLOSED.... LOOK!!!! LOOK HOW CLEVER WE WERE TO DESIGN SOMETHING SO OBVIOUS, BUT LOOK!!!!!!!"

The design language of this laptop is shouting "I'm insecure" to those who can read design language properly. Go and watch "Objectified" movie - a very good place to begin.

These people must have no sense for good design, or, in some cases, just not much sense at ALL.
Click to expand...

What constitutes "good design" is clearly subjective but the idea that the MacBook only has one port because Apple didn't know how to do anything else is nonsense. I'm sure if Apple wanted to they could have stuck a Retina display in a MBA and called it a day but they chose not too. In my opinion that's because then the Air and Pro would be too similar with little product differentiation and a redesign of the Pro was/is probably on the roadmap. Eventually the Air will be gone and the Pro will become the MBA with Retina display that everyone wanted.
 
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Rogifan said:
I'm not making an excuse for anything. I'm saying Apple is intentionally trying to get away with as few ports as possible, not that their engineers aren't smart or innovative enough to add more. And yeah, they'll sell an adapter because they know some people will buy it and accessories are profitable. But I'll bet most people that own the MacBook are using just the one port (like tens of millions do with an iPad).

Anyway I find it quite amusing that Apple routinely gets knocked for being obsessed with thinness yet this device is being fawned over, mostly sight unseen (outside of HP press photos), for being thinner than the MacBook (even though it's actually heavier, has an inferior screen and has fans). And if laptops like the XPS and Surface Book are supposedly more innovative than any Mac, according to the tech media, why are they focused on comparing it to the Mac? We all know why; clicks, clicks, clicks.
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So what is the reasoning behind as few ports as possible on a laptop?

Lol at comparing people usage of ports with macbook and iPad. Do people usually charge their phone with an iPad? No. Do people usually connect flash drives to their iPad? No. Do people usually use external mouse with an iPad? No. Do people usually connect their iPad to a next iPad? No.

Is it common to see people using external mouse, flash drive, charging phone, connecting iPad to transfer music using their laptop? Yes. Have fun using 1 port doing all of that.

You know why it is being fawned over? Because it has a i7 processor in it vs a measly m processor. It has 3 ports vs 1. It has a mouse that actually clicks vs force touch or whatever it is called. The Apple apologist said their was no way you could put a more powerful processor and more ports in
a laptop as thin as macbook. Guess what? They were wrong.

.42 pounds heavier, oh my god how will I survive. No way I can lug around an additional .42 pounds.

When did fans become a negative? Because the macbook doesn't have fans? So does that mean I can say omg the macbook air and macbook pro has fans, such a terrible design.

You know when Apple Apologist are grasping at straws when fans in a laptop becomes a negative.
 
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uid15 said:
I'm always rather incredulous when people call Apple's engineers "inept". You've got to just laugh from your belly at such nonsense. They're as "inept" as Mondrian was with painting intersecting lines in cleverly calculated spacings and filling the intersections with bold colours to appeal to the senses, as "inept" as Tchaikovsky was at composing music, or as "inept" as Dieter Rams is at designing record players.

Jony Ive is well known as being of the thinking that design should be "inevitable" and get out of the way, not stand up and shout "LOOK AT ME! LOOK - LOOK HOW CLEVER THIS DESIGN ELEMENT IS, AND HOW ELEGANT AND SMART IT IS THAT THIS GOLD HINGE ARCS OUTWARD, AND THEN GLIDES BACK INTO THE BODY WHEN THE LID'S BEING CLOSED.... LOOK!!!! LOOK HOW CLEVER WE WERE TO DESIGN SOMETHING SO OBVIOUS, BUT LOOK!!!!!!!"

The design language of this laptop is shouting "I'm insecure" to those who can read design language properly. Go and watch "Objectified" movie - a very good place to begin.

These people must have no sense for good design, or, in some cases, just not much sense at ALL.
Click to expand...

"Design" applies to aesthetics as well as function. Appearance is more subjective. Although there are some styles that most observers would call hideous, I don't think that the HP falls into this category. It's not my cup of tea, but I can see where some might consider it attractive.

Many people here decry Apple's obsession with thinness as a design goal. Is it aesthetic or functional? I'd say some of both. Jony Ive feels that thinner devices are more "compelling." I agree that a thinner laptop can be more functional because it takes up less space in my carrying bag or because it's lighter. But at some point, other functional elements—battery life and ports, to name two—have to be sacrificed. That's where I have to decide which side of the line I'm on as far as the device's utility to me goes. I tend to prefer a slightly thicker laptop with more of both, but others may not.
 
Roller said:
"Design" applies to aesthetics as well as function. Appearance is more subjective. Although there are some styles that most observers would call hideous, I don't think that the HP falls into this category. It's not my cup of tea, but I can see where some might consider it attractive.

Many people here decry Apple's obsession with thinness as a design goal. Is it aesthetic or functional? I'd say some of both. Jony Ive feels that thinner devices are more "compelling." I agree that a thinner laptop can be more functional because it takes up less space in my carrying bag or because it's lighter. But at some point, other functional elements—battery life and ports, to name two—have to be sacrificed. That's where I have to decide which side of the line I'm on as far as the device's utility to me goes. I tend to prefer a slightly thicker laptop with more of both, but others may not.
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I think I covered both aesthetics and function. I am innately aware of what constitutes good design - and only good design matters.
 
uid15 said:
I think I covered both aesthetics and function. I am innately aware of what constitutes good design - and only good design matters.
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I don't disagree. I was simply amplifying the point that both are important, nor are they mutually exclusive. It's certainly possible to design products that incorporate both, which is something Apple has often done well. However, at some point they can conflict, as when thinness supersedes function.
 
Still quite horrifically buttugly!

And having the ports on the back seems so 1990s-2000s... It'll be a tad awkward managing all the devices, adapters, whilst having to lean over the computer, rotate it, or shut the lid.

Call me an Apple manic, but I'd take the MacBook any day ( though I'll stay with my 9.7" iPad Pro :D )!
 
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i wish apple made a macbook pro that dark with multiple thunderbolt 3/usb type c ports
 
LCPepper said:
Still quite horrifically buttugly!

And having the ports on the back seems so 1990s-2000s... It'll be a tad awkward managing all the devices, adapters, whilst having to lean over the computer, rotate it, or shut the lid.

Call me an Apple manic, but I'd take the MacBook any day ( though I'll stay with my 9.7" iPad Pro :D )!
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Well if you can't physically deal with ports on the back of a tiny laptop (all that god-awful "leaning"), I'd urge you to stay away from ALL of Apple's desktop computers or Thunderbolt display. They require a massive amount of leaning if you don't want to scratch up the aluminum when plugging something in.
 
Blaze4G said:
So what is the reasoning behind as few ports as possible on a laptop?

Lol at comparing people usage of ports with macbook and iPad. Do people usually charge their phone with an iPad? No. Do people usually connect flash drives to their iPad? No. Do people usually use external mouse with an iPad? No. Do people usually connect their iPad to a next iPad? No.

Is it common to see people using external mouse, flash drive, charging phone, connecting iPad to transfer music using their laptop? Yes. Have fun using 1 port doing all of that.

You know why it is being fawned over? Because it has a i7 processor in it vs a measly m processor. It has 3 ports vs 1. It has a mouse that actually clicks vs force touch or whatever it is called. The Apple apologist said their was no way you could put a more powerful processor and more ports in
a laptop as thin as macbook. Guess what? They were wrong.

.42 pounds heavier, oh my god how will I survive. No way I can lug around an additional .42 pounds.

When did fans become a negative? Because the macbook doesn't have fans? So does that mean I can say omg the macbook air and macbook pro has fans, such a terrible design.

You know when Apple Apologist are grasping at straws when fans in a laptop becomes a negative.
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sounds like you need a pro machine.

Rogifan said:
Excuse for what? I'm sure if Apple could build a device with no ports they would. If you want a laptop with more ports that's what the MBP is for.
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what to do with the cables that come with their other products and accessories?
 
I must be forgiven for thinking that it will still be Windows 10, and an HP. Miracles have been performed on my elderly iMac in the past six weeks., and you bet I am appreciative!
 
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numlock said:
sounds like you need a pro machine.



what to do with the cables that come with their other products and accessories?
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So are you saying non pros don't use flash drives, have a smartphone to connect to laptop, don't use external mouses?

Oh by the way, I think the Macbook looks better to me than the Spectre. Never been a fan of shiny metal on electronics. Nor am I a fan of copper / bronze color.
 
uid15 said:
I'm always rather incredulous when people call Apple's engineers "inept". You've got to just laugh from your belly at such nonsense. They're as "inept" as Mondrian was with painting intersecting lines in cleverly calculated spacings and filling the intersections with bold colours to appeal to the senses, as "inept" as Tchaikovsky was at composing music, or as "inept" as Dieter Rams is at designing record players.

Jony Ive is well known as being of the thinking that design should be "inevitable" and get out of the way, not stand up and shout "LOOK AT ME! LOOK - LOOK HOW CLEVER THIS DESIGN ELEMENT IS, AND HOW ELEGANT AND SMART IT IS THAT THIS GOLD HINGE ARCS OUTWARD, AND THEN GLIDES BACK INTO THE BODY WHEN THE LID'S BEING CLOSED.... LOOK!!!! LOOK HOW CLEVER WE WERE TO DESIGN SOMETHING SO OBVIOUS, BUT LOOK!!!!!!!"

The design language of this laptop is shouting "I'm insecure" to those who can read design language properly. Go and watch "Objectified" movie - a very good place to begin.

These people must have no sense for good design, or, in some cases, just not much sense at ALL.
Click to expand...
Do you think Jony Ive knows what USB port is?
 
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