HP iPod Photo

[david_r_p]

HP iPod very good indeed...

I think the Apple/HP iPod and iPod Photo is a great thing, and I'd like to see more of it. I think making the iPod as ubiquitous as possible should be the goal, and let's face it, HP has much more marketing and distribution muscle than Apple. In fact, Apple should create private-label iPod players for any "pee cee" maker who wants to buy it.

If the iPod is perceived as a closed, proprietary system (much like the Apple OS already is) the iPod will eventually become a niche player (much like the Mac computer). By forming startegic partnerships, Apple is getting as many people as possible to adopt the iPod, and hopefully a few switchers along the way.

I'm shocked that anyone is against Apple selling as many iPods as possible.

 

[MontyZ]

If Apple wants all of their products to appeal to PC users or general consumers, I think they would be better off shifting their own marketing as needed rather than "outsourcing" this task to other companies, like HP, if that's what this deal is all about. Remember what happened when Apple decided years ago to allow other companies to make Mac clones? Apple would do better to instead find more stores to sell the iPod under their own name.

 

[nagromme]

There were a bunch of posters on the Apple Discussions griping that iPhoto should have been bundled with the iPod Photo since it's required. That just not true. It's almost as bad as the many people who think Apple iPods won't work on PCs. And not only are they misinformed, they pass on that misinformation to others and don't educate themselves with the facts.

Even more amazing is that even though they don't OWN the product (or they wouldn't even think it was an issue), they still get themselves worked up enough to bother posting on Apple support boards... but not enough to bother, say, looking at the iPod Photo page on Apple's site, full of handy info

Why doesn't HP just sell ****ing iPods? You don't need to call it an HP iPod especially when it's exactly the same product.

Because the deal is of great benefit to Apple, BUT like most deals, it ALSO benefits the other party. HP wanted to get into the business and grow their image in consumer electronics--they chose the route of selling iPods customized with HP branding, and Apple found it worth agreeing to. Both parties gain income AND mindshare. And consumers who fear Apple but trust HP now have something they can buy without tossing and turning in a cold sweat all night

If Apple wants all of their products to appeal to PC users or general consumers, I think they would be better off shifting their own marketing as needed rather than "outsourcing" this task to other companies, like HP, if that's what this deal is all about. Remember what happened when Apple decided years ago to allow other companies to make Mac clones? Apple would do better to instead find more stores to sell the iPod under their own name.

HP iPods are NOT clones and NOT outsourced. They are made BY Apple for HP. And because of the volume HP can sell for Apple, it was worth Apple's while to agree to customize them with an HP logo. This is nothing like cloning.

As for Apple finding stores on its own--that's neither free nor easy! The HP deal, in one fell swoop, put iPods in THOUSANDS of places they would never otherwise have been sold. Apple could have tried (and sometimes failed) to get into those stores directly, but it would have taken forever, and lots of money/effort. It's much easier to leverage an existing distribution relationship than to try to create a new one.

Plus, many PC users actually LIKE the HP "stamp of approval." Then they find themselves exploring Apple quality when they might never have done so before.

And of course, HP has paid for a TON of iPod advertising as part of the deal. Far better those TV and magazine ads show iPods (and the Apple logo next to HP), than show whatever Microsoft WMA player HP would be selling if Apple hadn't partnered with them!

This is nothing but good for the iPod, for Apple, for consumers, and ultimately for the Mac itself. (And it's been going on for a while now, selling TONS of iPods for Apple. What downside has reared its head? So a few people think the Apple-brand iPod is Mac-only... so what? They ALREADY thought that regardless of HP, and now they can buy the same iPod despite their ignorance.)

 

[carlos700]

I guess it makes PC people more comfortable with the HP logo on it. I think that the iPod + HP is not compatible with Macs. HP lists nothing about Mac compatibility on their website.

 

[AidenShaw]

of course not...

HP lists nothing about Mac compatibility on their website.

Of course not, they want the "iPod+hp" "halo effect" to sell more Pentiums !!!

Remember that 98.2% of the market is for Wintel PCs, it isn't worth the price of the ad copy for HP to say that their digital music player works with Macs.

 

[Xtremehkr]

I've been underwhelmed by the whole iPod/iPhoto concept. Though it is useful for those who can connect their iPhotoPod to a large enough screen (most Big Screens I am assuming) to share it with others. At the same time, it does open a new and larger market since HP does have a larger market share. But the idea of subjecting others to slide shows of your vacation/slide show (/fill in the blank) seems to be an old idea given new life. It won't be a cliche until it hits sitcoms though I guess.

The updated and yet cliched situation; a bunch of relatives being subjected to slide shows of the Hawaii Vacation via an iPod and not a projector using film negatives. Yawn, American Pie as it is.

 

[blybug]

i was in radio shack the other day and i overheard a woman asking a salesman about the HP ipod... "whats the difference between this one and the one made by apple?" the guy quickly replied "well the apple ipod only works with an apple computer while the HP works with both." she said "oh its a good thing i asked, i have a pc at home"

i had to bite my tongue to not walk over to the counter and tell him he was full of sh*t.

I overheard and attempted to intervene on a similar conversation at CompUSA before Christmas while I was looking at iPod accessories...

Customer: "I'm looking for an iPod for my daughter."
(This caught my attention and I immediately thought "This guy has no idea what an iPod is except that his daughter will kill him if he doesn't get her one.")

CompUSAGuy: "Do you want the HP iPod or the Apple?"

Customer: "What's the main difference?"

CompUSAGuy: "Well, is your computer a PC or a Mac?"

Customer: "We have an eMachine, which is that?"
(I'm ready to rumble...clenching fists...)

CompUSAGuy: "That's a Windows PC, you'll want the HP then."​

Assuming his daughter may be hip enough to notice the difference, I decide it's time for me to step in and provide some enlightenment in order to perform my constitutional duty as a Mac zealot as well as save this guy from forever being labelled a dork by his daughter after Christmas morning...

Me: "Actually they'll both work with your PC, the HP is simply a rebranded Apple unit. You should just get the Apple iPod."

CompUSAGuy: "Are you sure about that? I thought the HP came out for PC compatibility."

Me: "Take a look at the box...Apple makes them, HP rebrands and sells them. They're exactly the same."

Customer: "Well if they're exactly the same I'll just get the HP since he's sure that will work with our computer."

CompUSAGuy: "Great, I'll ring that up for you. And would you like to protect your daughter's iPod by purchasing our protection plan...."
​

At that point, having been unprepared for this sudden skirmish, I realized that I didn't really have any further arguments, other than that the Apple iPod was "cooler." What else was there to say?

This run-in with the Average Joe consumer and the stereotypically imbecilic CompUSAGuy mad me realize that these encounters must happen every day, without any knowledgeable person on either end of the conversation. But in the end, an iPod is sold one way or another. I suspect that Apple teamed with HP because they knew that despite the incessant "Mac + PC" iPod ads, that Average Joe and CompUSAGuy could never get it through their thick heads that something from Apple would actually work for them.

Go Apple + HP!

 

[MontyZ]

HP iPods are NOT clones and NOT outsourced. They are made BY Apple for HP. And because of the volume HP can sell for Apple, it was worth Apple's while to agree to customize them with an HP logo. This is nothing like cloning.

Yes, you and I may know this, but, the general consumer may just think HP came out with an iPod clone. As you mentioned, they (the consumers) are dumb enough not to know that the iPod works on both PCs and Macs even though this is clearly indicated in all advertising for the iPod, so, how will they figure out that HP is not cloning the iPod?

I looked at the way HP advertises it in their online store: "Apple iPod from HP" and "(Apple icon) iPod + hp" -- In the marketing world, that's called Brand Confusion. What is this thing called exactly? The HP iPod? The iPod+hp? The Apple HP iPod? The HP+Apple iPod? And does it only work on Windows? Only on HP computers? Does it only play iTunes music? Will it work on the Mac? I think this marketing deal -- that was supposed to clear up any questions by consumers -- only creates more questions and more confusion, IMO.

I also think that this will make it much easier for companies like Microsoft or Sony to come out with their own iPod-like players in the future to further confuse consumers. And if they're sold for $100 cheaper with 3-year warranties, it'll end up hurting the iPod, not helping it. Because in the end, if the consumer thinks they can get basically the same thing for less money, that's where they'll go. Apple then loses the cache and waters down the incredible branding they've built for the iPod, which has taken the world by storm.

Now, I could be totally wrong and Apple could have a larger strategy in mind, such as selling more digital music from the iTunes Store. They probably make a ton more money from the iTunes Store than they do iPods. So, if the goal is really just to make the iTunes Store THE de-facto standard in digital music, then maybe this is a good idea for Apple and iTunes. But, I don't think it's a good idea for iPod.

 

[rhpenguin]

I overheard and attempted to intervene on a similar conversation at CompUSA before Christmas while I was looking at iPod accessories...

Customer: "I'm looking for an iPod for my daughter."
(This caught my attention and I immediately thought "This guy has no idea what an iPod is except that his daughter will kill him if he doesn't get her one.")

CompUSAGuy: "Do you want the HP iPod or the Apple?"

Customer: "What's the main difference?"

CompUSAGuy: "Well, is your computer a PC or a Mac?"

Customer: "We have an eMachine, which is that?"
(I'm ready to rumble...clenching fists...)

CompUSAGuy: "That's a Windows PC, you'll want the HP then."​

Assuming his daughter may be hip enough to notice the difference, I decide it's time for me to step in and provide some enlightenment in order to perform my constitutional duty as a Mac zealot as well as save this guy from forever being labelled a dork by his daughter after Christmas morning...

Me: "Actually they'll both work with your PC, the HP is simply a rebranded Apple unit. You should just get the Apple iPod."

CompUSAGuy: "Are you sure about that? I thought the HP came out for PC compatibility."

Me: "Take a look at the box...Apple makes them, HP rebrands and sells them. They're exactly the same."

Customer: "Well if they're exactly the same I'll just get the HP since he's sure that will work with our computer."

CompUSAGuy: "Great, I'll ring that up for you. And would you like to protect your daughter's iPod by purchasing our protection plan...."
​

At that point, having been unprepared for this sudden skirmish, I realized that I didn't really have any further arguments, other than that the Apple iPod was "cooler." What else was there to say?

This run-in with the Average Joe consumer and the stereotypically imbecilic CompUSAGuy mad me realize that these encounters must happen every day, without any knowledgeable person on either end of the conversation. But in the end, an iPod is sold one way or another. I suspect that Apple teamed with HP because they knew that despite the incessant "Mac + PC" iPod ads, that Average Joe and CompUSAGuy could never get it through their thick heads that something from Apple would actually work for them.

Go Apple + HP!

Why incourage people to buy the iPod from Apple when HP actually offers a better warranty on the product than Apple does?

 

[BenRoethig]

If Apple wants all of their products to appeal to PC users or general consumers, I think they would be better off shifting their own marketing as needed rather than "outsourcing" this task to other companies, like HP, if that's what this deal is all about. Remember what happened when Apple decided years ago to allow other companies to make Mac clones? Apple would do better to instead find more stores to sell the iPod under their own name.

1. HP has a distribution network that Apple wish it had. HP sells stuff basically everywhere. Apple has competent people only at its Apple stores.

2. Would you rather HP either 1) build their own non-itunes compatible music player or 2) team up with either Creative or Dell.

3. It is not a clone. Apple builds them.

4. The clones didn't work for a number of reasons. The two major reasons where 1) the clone makers were all computer industry novices. Power Computing, Umax, Daystar, and Motorolla had never sold personal computers before. As a result they did not have the name or marketing dollars to expand outside the Mac community. Apple offering computers that were inferior to the clones didn't help either. 2) There wasn't a big difference between Macs and PCs in those days. No iTunes, iLife, Ipod, iMac. spyware, even viruses were rare in those days. People weren't fed up with windows the way they were in the broadband internet age.

 

[BenRoethig]

you sir just made a light go off in my head. IF there are more people like this thinking that the iPod only works on macs and they see a bunch of iPods out there, it must make them think, a lot of people actually have macs, which may lead them to checking one out. In short, the iPods may make the stupid look at macs b/c they are none the wiser. The halo effect working another way.

Close. What if HP were to strike a similar deal with the new $499 computer? If Apple were to release an ad for this, honestly there are many who wouldn't pay attention because of Apple's reputation. More still probably wouldn't drive three hours (or every other block if you're in Los Angeles) to their nearest Apple Store. If HP was to release an ad for a computer with no spyware and very few viruses that can be had at the nearest Walmart, radioshack, staples, Best Buy, etc. people would probably check it out.

 

[dsharits]

Close. What if HP were to strike a similar deal with the new $499 computer? If Apple were to release an ad for this, honestly there are many who wouldn't pay attention because of Apple's reputation. More still probably wouldn't drive three hours (or every other block if you're in Los Angeles) to their nearest Apple Store. If HP was to release an ad for a computer with no spyware and very few viruses that can be had at the nearest Walmart, radioshack, staples, Best Buy, etc. people would probably check it out.

But HP would never do it, because at that point, it is no longer a re-marketing of a product that can complement an HP system, but it turns into a competing system being sold alongside HP's label. Apple would be putting out a $499 computer to compete with low-end buys from Dell, Gateway, HP and the like. HP would never sell a competitor's system, only the products that can complement their own system.

Daniel

 

[AidenShaw]

But HP would never do it, because at that point, it is no longer a re-marketing of a product that can complement an HP system, but it turns into a competing system being sold alongside HP's label.

This also applies if the $499 CheapMac turns out to be a home media centre rather than a Mac.

See the HP televisions, media centres, satellite radios, pocket media centres, and other items at http://www.hp.com/country/us/en/prodserv/entertainment.html .

 

[zelmo]

Why incourage people to buy the iPod from Apple when HP actually offers a better warranty on the product than Apple does?

HP has a better warranty for phone support (1 yr of support vs. Apple's 90 days), but they only offer support for PC users. Yes, the hardware is identical, apart from an extra logo on the back. Bottom line, if you have a Mac you are still better off buying the "official" Apple iPod, and if you have a PC, you are better off with the HP branded iPod.

 

[k2k koos]

HP iPods

I might have overlooked them, but has anyone allready spotted the HP branded iPod in the average DIXON or Comet retail store here in the UK, I haven't yet. Not that I want one, I'm just curious, if any I will take de Apple one, just because I would feel the need to show everyone who wants to know that an APPLE branded product actually works WELL with their WINTEL machine....

 

[mrunderhill]

Why HP?

Why get involved with HP over this? I mean why can't Apple just leave things as they are. Will the HP iPod be cheaper than the Apple iPod, if it is then it will just confuse everybody and make a mockery of the whole thing. I always think of Apple as the BMW of computer companies and BMW don't let other people make cars for them. As a Mac guy I wouldn't dream of buying an HP iPod as I'd feel like I had a fake Rolex on my wrist.

 

[k2k koos]

HP iPods

Why get involved with HP over this? I mean why can't Apple just leave things as they are. Will the HP iPod be cheaper than the Apple iPod, if it is then it will just confuse everybody and make a mockery of the whole thing. I always think of Apple as the BMW of computer companies and BMW don't let other people make cars for them. As a Mac guy I wouldn't dream of buying an HP iPod as I'd feel like I had a fake Rolex on my wrist.

I can see what you are saying in regards to branding, but even BMW , which is possibly one of the last totally independent german car mfg out there, considering their relative small company size, cannot survive without the help of others. their Mini for example, has a Mercedes (okay daimler Crysler) engine, their biggest rival...
It is not totally a fake Rolex though, it would be a Rolex made, different branded watch...

Still the added value, not just monetary, of owning a true Apple iPod, is something a lot of people are sensitive too, myself included, and was for a while one of the very few remaining factors that Apple survived the early '90's.....

I doubt though that Apple will let HP sell cheaper iPods, unless it is a model that is allready replaced by Apple themselves for an updated iPod, why wait 9 months otherwise.... HP selling the current model, Apple the next...

 

[dsharits]

This also applies if the $499 CheapMac turns out to be a home media centre rather than a Mac.

See the HP televisions, media centres, satellite radios, pocket media centres, and other items at http://www.hp.com/country/us/en/pro...ertainment.html .

Exactly. We have to realize that HP is not selling iPods to just help Apple distribute them. They are looking for more publicity for their products, because they don't have a digital music player to put on the market against Dell, which is probably their main hardware competitor. This way, Apple sells more units, and HP gets the publicity and a cutting-edge DMP to put up against the Dell DJ. HP already makes the consumer-priced low-end PC's, so it would only put them at a huge disadvantage if they sold Apple's consumer-level products that was designed to go up against similar HP products. Also, if Apple can get enough advertisement for the new $499 computer, they won't need HP's help to sell it. Once people catch wind of a $499 Mac, it will sell almost as well as a $499 Dell or HP.

Daniel

 

[hcuar]

Why incourage people to buy the iPod from Apple when HP actually offers a better warranty on the product than Apple does?

Well, because HP's service sucks... Trust me.

 

[BornAgainMac]

This was a informative thread about the HP iPod. I didn't realize people out there wouldn't buy a Apple product because they feared it would not be compatible. It is strange that newbee users today even know what that means. In the 80's there were several platforms that didn't work with each other. Today it seems like every company including Apple sell Windows machines. What did Apple do to make them think it wouldn't work with their existing Windows software?

Perhaps HP should sell HP branded Macs too.

 

[hcuar]

This was a informative thread about the HP iPod. I didn't realize people out there wouldn't buy a Apple product because they feared it would not be compatible. It is strange that newbee users today even know what that means. In the 80's there were several platforms that didn't work with each other. Today it seems like every company including Apple sell Windows machines. What did Apple do to make them think it wouldn't work with their existing Windows software?

Perhaps HP should sell HP branded Macs too.

Simple... it's all FUD by the insecure PC world. All systems used to be less compatible (even different branded PCs). My parents were amazed when I burned the latest copy of AVG free addition with my PB this Christmas for them to take home and install on their Dell. They couldn't believe they could read the disk on their computer.

 

[rhpenguin]

HP has a better warranty for phone support (1 yr of support vs. Apple's 90 days), but they only offer support for PC users. Yes, the hardware is identical, apart from an extra logo on the back. Bottom line, if you have a Mac you are still better off buying the "official" Apple iPod, and if you have a PC, you are better off with the HP branded iPod.

LMFAO... I know they dont offer support for Macs because i work on the damn support line. Just gotta hope you get me on the line and i do help.

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

i was in radio shack the other day and i overheard a woman asking a salesman about the HP ipod... "whats the difference between this one and the one made by apple?" the guy quickly replied "well the apple ipod only works with an apple computer while the HP works with both." she said "oh its a good thing i asked, i have a pc at home"

i had to bite my tongue to not walk over to the counter and tell him he was full of sh*t.

Sad to hear. But given the price controls the stores have to give a reason to buy from them. I don't support lying, but I understand.

Apple using the distribution arm of HP is great. I wonder if it will be used for the iMac mini?

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

True... we do work off commision, and yea, an iPod is a really good sale. There are always a few salesman who will do anything, even lie to make a sale, but thats business. I like to think of myself as an honest salesman (as much as that sounds like an oxymoron). I've given up many a good sale when I realized that the customer didn't really know what they were buying, or was buying the wrong thing. It all works out in the end though, rest assured; if we get something returned, it counts off your commision for the next day. Its alot harder to get commision when you start off the day $400 in the hole. But give SOME of us RS people a break.

( Sorry, I just really like my job - its an awesome place to work. This thread just seemed a little on the negative side towards RS and I'm trying to clear up any misconceptions, I apologize if I seem a little defensive.)

We in sales are taken for granted at times. And there are also a few bad apples that spoil the barrel. It is matter sometimes who you work for. I work in a shop that pays us a decent wage by the hour. We get SPIFFS and extra compensation at times. In the end the SPIFFS and such don't help if you don't create an atmosphere that will want customers to come back to you on.

IMO too many look at the short term goal. And that is to make a sale. This goes for both the company and employee. We sell the iPod Photo and other Mac products on a special order basis. And we have an Apple store down the road. I tell my customers that we are there to help them when we can, even if it is making a call to the manufacture to get their problem resolved. In other words going to bat for them.And we do. I have seen fight for rebates. I have seen us fight to get the manufacturer to take something back even months after the sale, since the customer did not feel that it met their needs.

 

[ssnmx]

What about other countries?

We also have to think about all the countries where Apple is not popular and HP is. In Mexico Macs are just SO overpriced and most people don't even know what iPods are.

So here comes HP, an established PC company, offering you an iPod bundled with the new HP computer you're buying. Might not get many switchers at first, but these would be people who don't know Apple exists, and they might as well notice the friggin' Apple logo on the iPod... so for Apple is better that they buy an HP iPod than nothing at all. I'm assuming this would apply to most Latin America and some other parts of the world. It's a nice way to introduce people to Apple.

I don't know what the HP prices are, but they have the advantage of bundling it with a computer or whatever...

Seriously, though. Apple products in Mexico are SO overpriced:
iPod mini = $500 USD
20 GB iPod = $800 USD
Entry-level eMac = $1,600 USD
Entry-level iMac = $2,000 USD