HP to Reenter Tablet Market with Windows 8

[seek3r]

You have answered that question yourself - they should stick to making stuff we DON'T see, since pretty much every other consumer-aimed device HP produces sucks big time...apart from printers, of course.

In terms of consumer equipment.. Their tablet laptops are solid, and the probably the most common around (hell, the only other 2 x86 tablets I've even seen in quantity in a loong time are thinkpad X tablets and motion's slates).

Their workstations are best-in-breed, they make some nice screens, a nice netbook.

Honestly their basic consumer stuff isnt bad for what it is. Not everyone can afford a mac you know.

Lastly, while a lot of their instrument business was spun off into Agilent (which does make excellent stuff btw), HP still makes some of the best calculators around ( http://welcome.hp.com/country/us/en/prodserv/calculator.html )

 

[adelinalee]

thanks

nice.. share thanks.. probably i'm new in here

thanks for this thread

 

[SkyBell]

Screw you HP, you took webOS and effectively killed it. It needed more than a few bugs worked out when Palm had it, and we thought you'd be able to give it the life it deserved that Palm couldn't. You do nothing to help it, basically slap it on the same old phones and less then exciting tablet, and you even cancel that whole thing before it even got a chance. Now you want to try and do basically the same thing with Windows 8? We'll see how long this lasts before you toss it in the trash too.

 

[Renzatic]

Besides, I couldn't care less about HP and its purportedly "innovative" tablets (or "slates", as Ballmer and some of his followers here would prefer). They have brought virtually nothing of value to the tech world in the last 20 years.

I think that's the biggest problem with some of you here. You've set all these other companies up in a Catch-22 situation, which is basically...

We all blather on about how we'd love to see these companies innovate more, but when a company does, in fact, innovate, we heap derision and scorn upon it outright because if it were truly innovative, Apple would've already innovated it.

No innovations are innovations until our favorite company comes out with their innovation upon a previously applied innovation. Then we say innovation over and over again until innovations are innovative in an innovastaculation.

 

[nokuchikushi]

Except it is not a grid of icons. You can have as many, or as few, tiles as you like - and (depending on the app) it can be much more than a straight link to open the app, e.g. I have an iheartradio station pinned to the menu (instead of the app tile), so when I tap that tile, that station starts playing.

I can have tiles that take me to my Twitter messages or replies, rather than just opening the app. My calender tile shows my next appointment.

I can go on and on, but the tiles are far from just a grid of icons which open an app. If you don't like a tile, remove it. Try removing an icon from iOS.

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I disagree. I have not used Metro on a phone yet but I have Windows 8 installed on my computer. What a mess. At first it seems pretty and functional but that soon wears off and then it does feel like it's made for children or people with limited intelligence. It seems geared for it. There are some apps released for the iPad with a Metro design to them, and it's the same thing. They sure do look pretty and seem fun to use, but then the limitations of the interface become apparent. It seems Metro is only concerned with looking good, and everything else is secondary.

On a computer running Windows 8 it's even worse. Eventually and probably immediately, you have to leave the Metro interface because it's really just the desktop screen with icons. Think about it, how often are you looking at your desktop screen? Once you start opening programs it's gone. So basically, it's a useless pile of crap that you'll seldom use overlaid on top of regular Windows to make it look trendy and new. A little bit of use and it's clear it's a marketing trick. It may indeed work. They may sell gazillions of these devices. I'm just saying that right now it's crap.

Metro does make iOS look dated, that's for sure, but I think that's because we've been living with iOS and Android for a few years now and ready for something new. Metro seems like it but, really, the novelty wears off fast. And I doubt Apple is sitting on their hands and will be releasing something new soon. And whether or not like Apple or Windows think about this: if it wasn't for Apple's design innovations, Windows 7 would probably still look (and act) like Windows ME. After they carved out their initial monopoly decades ago, MS doesn't usually do anything unless they feel threatened or want to take something from someone else (like PlayStation and XBox). They usually don't create product categories. Their goal is always to expand Windows and Office and rarely anything else.

BTW you can remove icons from iOS (it also removes the app) as well as sending certain elements of web pages to the home screen as an app. As for iheartradio, I cannot test it as I am not in the US but it sounds like choosing a default station or pinning a particular station is a function of the app, not of the OS.

 

[Renzatic]

On a computer running Windows 8 it's even worse. Eventually and probably immediately, you have to leave the Metro interface because it's really just the desktop screen with icons. Think about it, how often are you looking at your desktop screen? Once you start opening programs it's gone. So basically, it's a useless pile of crap that you'll seldom use overlaid on top of regular Windows to make it look trendy and new.

Bad argument, man. Not very well thought out at all.

The desktop should basically be the space for your windows to play in. The new start screen, much like the old start menu, is there for you to do searches and launch applications. I use mine as a way to tuck apps I find useful, but don't use so often I feel the need to pin them to the taskbar. The only difference between it and the old start menu is that it's now full screen, and you can slap a few metro tiles into it if you want.

It's not completely useless. It's not "basically the desktop". It's the way you get to your stuff without having to minimize or reorganize your open windows.

 

[r.j.s]

I disagree. I have not used Metro on a phone yet

It shows in the rest of your argument.

but I have Windows 8 installed on my computer. What a mess. At first it seems pretty and functional but that soon wears off and then it does feel like it's made for children or people with limited intelligence.

The new start menu is just that - not a replacement desktop. A quick way to launch apps, check for notifications/calendar events/mail/etc. You shouldn't interface with Win8 through the start menu only.

 

[50548]

You people do realize the word "fail" is a verb, right? Using it repeatedly as a noun doesn't make it a noun, any more than it makes the point you're trying to make any more believable. If anything, when someone starts throwing around the word FAIL I immediately stop listening or reading because I figure whatever they're saying is ignorant tripe anyway. And I believe I'm 100% right about that.

FAIL (noun): A grade that is not high enough to pass an examination or test.

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I think that's the biggest problem with some of you here. You've set all these other companies up in a Catch-22 situation, which is basically...

We all blather on about how we'd love to see these companies innovate more, but when a company does, in fact, innovate, we heap derision and scorn upon it outright because if it were truly innovative, Apple would've already innovated it.

No innovations are innovations until our favorite company comes out with their innovation upon a previously applied innovation. Then we say innovation over and over again until innovations are innovative in an innovastaculation.

Nope, you misunderstood me. HP DID innovate with the WebOS and I gladly admit it (not to the level of iOS or iPhone, but close enough); however, the company itself decided to kill such a development.

So why aren't we supposed to mock them?

 

[manu chao]

(...) the HP Slate. Sure it wasn't that great of a device, but HP did show interest in this market back before the original iPad was announced.

Being able to show interest and to produce something remotely competitive is not exactly the same thing.

 

[Renzatic]

FAIL (noun): A grade that is not high enough to pass an examination or test.

This post is full of Win.

Nope, you misunderstood me. HP DID innovate with the WebOS and I gladly admit it (not to the level of iOS or iPhone, but close enough); however, the company itself decided to kill such a development.

So why aren't we supposed to mock them?

Actually, HP didn't innovate at all with WebOS. Palm did. HP just bought the company. And yes, they do deserve to be ridiculed and mocked for their decision to kill it off after just THREE FREAKING MONTHS. Hell, the iPhone didn't even hit its strong sales stride until the 3G came out nearly a year later. HP needs to be smacked about the face for that idiot move.

I think my biggest problem with the whole "who's innovative" argument is that it's very much an overused word, and quite a few people here seem to confuse good, solid design with true innovation, and fail to see true innovation whenever another computer company does it. The constant criticism for the sake of criticizing any company not Apple is obnoxious and stupid, and it always makes me wonder why people do this.

It's like some of you want to look like you have a refined sense of taste and high standards, and you show this off by exclusively praising the one company best known for going out of their way to market themselves as having a sense of taste and high standards. It's dumb.

 

[scottsjack]

I disagree. I have not used Metro on a phone yet but I have Windows 8 installed on my computer. What a mess. At first it seems pretty and functional but that soon wears off and then it does feel like it's made for children or people with limited intelligence.

Totally correct. Metro looks pretty cool when you play the videos available on the Building Windows 8 site. As soon as I have to deal with it on a 24in display Metro turns sour really fast. Even on a 15in MBP Metro looks horrible and is beyond clunky to use.

Unfortunately Metro takes the shine off some real improvements in the real Windows 8.

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It's not completely useless. It's not "basically the desktop". It's the way you get to your stuff without having to minimize or reorganize your open windows.

Disagree. The Windows 7 Start menu is really easy to use, doesn't get in the way and is seamlessly part of Windows 7.

On the other hand the Metro start is not a menu, it's an entire screen. Got a 30in display? That's how big the Metro start screen is. Going back and forth between Windows 8 Aero and that giant collection of huge, brightly colored rectangles is a pain to say the least.

For awhile it looked like Windows was going to win me back for much of my work. I like Windows 7 a lot. But with the direction that Windows 8 is going versus the positive direction that Mountain Lion appears to be heading I don't think it's much of a contest any more.

 

[cjmillsnun]

When talking about consumer products UI = OS, and sorry, but no. The grid of icons is the ancient UI - it has been 5 years for iOS, but before that, there was Blackberry OS, and Palm way before that (both essentially a grid of icons).

Again, have you even used a WP device?

Yep I've used WP7. I have as my second phone a Nokia Lumia 800. It's not bad, certainly powerful and easy to use however I prefer iOS. Were iOS not around I would pick WP7 for my primary phone.

Having said that Win 8 is a disaster. The unhappy mish mash of desktop and Metro Style needs sorting. Go one way or the other. Both doesn't work.

 

[ThunderSkunk]

How do you figure ? Windows has been running your existing software on iPad-like hardware for close to a decade and has nowhere been a contender yet.

There was no existing booming market at that time though, and hardware was barely capable of running the OS, much less any sizable applications. The options were a barely-portable convertible, or, for something actually usable like a tablet, you had to go with a severely underpowered slate like a Motion. ...which, we loved anyway, once maxed out with RAM (at 2GB & a light centrino chip), an extra battery for 2.5 hours of charge time. ...and once configured properly, since Tablet XP's stock configuration from windows was to present the user with a nearly unusable pen & input panel behavior... but MS has famously been ridiculed enough for making a disastrous mess out of Tablet PCs.

Now thanks predominately to iPhone & iPad, people don't mind an on-screen keyboard, so long as they don't have to tap each letter with a stylus or have it recog characters one at a time and drag you through the tedious validation process... I mean, that was absurdly bad. ...but again, MS has famously been ridi...

Now, there's a booming market full of tablets, and the only two that are selling are the two that do two very distinct things well. The iPad, which does everything one way, a way people are familiar with thx to the iPhone, and to a lesser extent, the Kindles, the reader/poor mans iPad. So you've got a high end leader and a low end leader. Android stumbled out of the gate without anything to set them apart or specialize at, or any amazing hardware. Just a phone OS adapted for a bigger screen, but without any real claim to fame or decent app selection to give people a reason to buy in.

With a market full of iPad customers, many of whom are irritated by the closed nature of iOS file system & sandboxing hurdles among other annoyances, there are plenty of people that'd love the usability of modern iPad-like hardware, but with the ability to simply and seamlessly extend their work environment to a mobile device and go, no matter what program, without syncing files or keeping your work hosted online somewhere in some other file structure, or wondering if there's a compatible application out yet for the new windows mobile version, and if you have to buy it twice or blah blah blah. Just do it seamlessly. But they can't.

Instead, they're going to try to out-android android being the new guy on the block with his hand out.
Ridiculous.

Many people will buy win8 tablets, I don't doubt. It'll be fun to ask them a year later what they use them for.

 

[KnightWRX]

Now, there's a booming market full of tablets

I really don't think so. I think there's a booming market for iPads. The rest need not apply.

I don't think people are quite enamoured with tablets themselves. They buy iPads despite it being a tablet. What they want, is the computing experience of iOS. It just happens to only be available in tablet form.

Forget Windows on a tablet, it hasn't work and it'll probably never work as the non-walled garden version does on laptops and desktops.

 

[Renzatic]

Disagree. The Windows 7 Start menu is really easy to use, doesn't get in the way and is seamlessly part of Windows 7.

On the other hand the Metro start is not a menu, it's an entire screen. Got a 30in display? That's how big the Metro start screen is. Going back and forth between Windows 8 Aero and that giant collection of huge, brightly colored rectangles is a pain to say the least.

For awhile it looked like Windows was going to win me back for much of my work. I like Windows 7 a lot. But with the direction that Windows 8 is going versus the positive direction that Mountain Lion appears to be heading I don't think it's much of a contest any more.

And I somewhat disagree with your disagree.

See, I never used the old start menu for anything besides doing a searches and shutting down the PC. I always thought it was too cramped to comfortably launch applications from, and having to navigate the mess that was All Programs was a huge pain in the ass. The start menu had depreciated.

The start screen is, to me at least, an improvement upon the original design. I can put more programs into it, navigate through them more comfortably, and organize them much better than I could the old start menu. It going completely full screen only bothered me for a few seconds. As an application launcher and file search system, it does its job fairly decently.

That's not to say the whole new setup is perfect. There are tons of goofy little problems with the Win8 UI that can sometimes be a pain to work through. And the new start menu, while having a solid foundation, could be improved upon. While things aren't anywhere NEAR as terrible as some people make them out to be (OMG THEY RUINED DEEESSSKKTTTOOOPP MS FAIILL 4-EVA), it could use quite a bit of polish before I'd say it's as solid as Win7 was.

And admittedly, as far as the Tabletification of the desktop goes, I do kinda like the direction Mountain Lion is going a little better. It does blend in with the traditional desktop a little better than Win8 does.

 

[rockarollr]

It really is all about the operating system. It can make it apple or break it (RIM).

 

[firewood]

long time to play out

Microsoft lost with the Zune. It never caught up with the iPod because Apple stayed ahead of the curve.

But in 1996 Palm introduced their tablet computer. Multi-millions sold. It quickly gained a bigger market share than even the iPad and iPod Touch have now. Fortune 500 execs and soccer moms where carrying Palm Vs then, like they carry iPads now. In 1999, MS introduced a palm-sized competitor. People laughed. For 5 years, Palm trounced MS in the market. Then Palm failed to keep innovating, failed to keep developers happy, and the grandkids of Windows CE slowly started to gain traction. Another 7 years later and Palm was dead (eaten by HP and digested).

The question is whether for the next 10 years after Steve, will Apple continue to innovate as they have during the past decade? Will it be the Zune story? Or will it be the Palm story?

 

[Dmunjal]

We live in a new world where bureaucracy will kill your company. Depending on someone else's technology to run your business will bury you. HP doesn't get it. Microsoft doesn't get it. Apple succeeds because they have control of everything.

That works in the early cycle of technology. Like when PCs came out or right now as we move to a new post PC era. But as the market grows, it becomes more important than any one company and a distributed approach works better. That is why the PC beat the Mac. Time will tell if Android can repeat history.

 

[npro1464]

They should just put WebOS on it. It was actually an excellent tablet OS, much better than any Windows tiles crap.

That or put Android on it. Anything with Windows is a POS

 

[darbus69]

Just. Make. Printers.

YOU MEAN YOU STILL print documents. Shame on your carbon footprint, Steve Jobs is rolling over in his grave. I RARELY print, much less use my Mac Mini, except for a media hub and with iCloud I don't even need that...

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HP is notorious for jumping on a bandwagon and then jumping off while the horse is still running.....

I wouldnt take this thing for free....ever since the days of the Jordana, they have lacked in their support and upgrades. I gave them way too many chances, and now will just stick with other companies that take pride in their products.

good point. APPLES software update system is absolutely the easiest and most carefree system ever. those of you "anti-lemmings" who scowl at the "closed ecosystem" are paranoid fools. The only downside is with Steve's death will Apple veer off course, what an amazingly eccentric man, but he did what few before him could even dream of.

 

[drblank]

HP products are usually pretty good (if cheaply made), so it'll be good to see what they come up with.

Are they going to use Windows 8 or Windows 8 RT? FWIH, both suck for different reasons, at least for the corporate buyer.

 

[blow45]

Screw you HP, you took webOS and effectively killed it. It needed more than a few bugs worked out when Palm had it, and we thought you'd be able to give it the life it deserved that Palm couldn't. You do nothing to help it, basically slap it on the same old phones and less then exciting tablet, and you even cancel that whole thing before it even got a chance. Now you want to try and do basically the same thing with Windows 8? We'll see how long this lasts before you toss it in the trash too.

Love your sig! Best in the forums.

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YOU MEAN YOU STILL print documents. Shame on your carbon footprint, Steve Jobs is rolling over in his grave. I RARELY print, much less use my Mac Mini, except for a media hub and with iCloud I don't even need that...

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good point. APPLES software update system is absolutely the easiest and most carefree system ever. those of you "anti-lemmings" who scowl at the "closed ecosystem" are paranoid fools. The only downside is with Steve's death will Apple veer off course, what an amazingly eccentric man, but he did what few before him could even dream of.

Last I heard apple didn't offer epaper...as for the carbon footprint you are oversimplifying things you don't know much about. Yeah people still print, and they will continue to do so, you might want to know that trees can be harvested to no detriment of the environment. You might want to check with your local bp or shell petrol station to get an idea of what real, irreversible and immense environmental destruction is.

 

[iSayuSay]

This news just a nice addition to the fact that many computer OEMs are OS biotch. They dont have some commitment nor consistency, they dont even have patience.

HP could have been successful with WebOS if only it could hold longer, be patient and continuously developing. Not even iOS had major success in the first year. Why plug it off so fast, HP?

Same with other OEMs, when Windows8 released, they're gonna ditch Android for good and left loyal Android user nothing but to buy another new smartphone, no updates, OS upgrades no nothin.

 

[Eidorian]

This news just a nice addition to the fact that many computer OEMs are OS biotch. They dont have some commitment nor consistency, they dont even have patience.

HP could have been successful with WebOS if only it could hold longer, be patient and continuously developing. Not even iOS had major success in the first year. Why plug it off so fast, HP?

Same with other OEMs, when Windows8 released, they're gonna ditch Android for good and left loyal Android user nothing but to buy another new smartphone, no updates, OS upgrades no nothin.

HP might have dropped WebOS like a stone in water just to be a larger partner for Windows. (Microsoft might have given them an earlier preview.) Then again it is impossible for HP to not already be a large if not the largest "partner" of Microsoft's software.

 

[Les Kern]

Meg's limited IQ is gonna lead HP to yet another disaster...as if Fiorina wasn't bad enough. Re-entry? Only if it's to crash and burn...

Probably. But you know what? I'd really like to see some competition in the market. I mean these tablets are EXPENSIVE. The iPad is great, the Asus Transformer is well built but Android positively sucks on it. Perhaps Windows 8 will work. we need lower prices, and competition is good for everyone.