I can't take it anymore, I'm jumping ship.

[Sanpete]

Thinner and lighter at any cost!

Apple is no longer innovating (unless you count thinner and lighter in that term) whereas MS appears to be going all in.. Apple is now the old MS and MS is now the old Apple as far as innovation goes.

Blah blah blah. Things people say when they relate to Apple via emotion more than fact. Obviously the MBP isn't thinner and lighter at any cost--they could make it thinner and lighter in many ways, but they balance that with other needs. And yes, people do value thinner and lighter, or we'd all get 10-pound "laptops."

Some innovations are more useful than others. I'll take an improved MBP, especially the 15", over a novel removable touch screen. (I guess that's the innovation you have in mind.) What I like about the Surface isn't what would amount to a useless gimmick for me, but what it shares with Apple, attention to quality in execution.

 

[0989383]

Well guys, I'd really appreciate your opinions on the last part of my last reply (about the thread topic)!

 

[Sanpete]

Not sure what to do about the charger. It's on its last legs, but given that it copes with 240 volts directly, I'd be weary of buying a non Apple one. Though that'd be £80, it would outlast this Mac anyway. And if I get another Mac in the future, it will be incompatible due to USB C or the thinner MagSafe..

I agree, if you replace it, buy the Apple one. You'll be able to resell it on eBay if you want.

 

[Finchly]

The Surface Pro is an excellent device. I haven't used the new MBP yet so I can't comment on that but msft did a great job on the Pro. Take a look at the XPS 13 as already mentioned or the HP Spectre X360 if you like the Surface's design. 30% off that would be a steal.

 

[raqball]

Blah blah blah. Things people say when they relate to Apple via emotion more than fact. Obviously the MBP isn't thinner and lighter at any cost--they could make it thinner and lighter in many ways, but they balance that with other needs. And yes, people do value thinner and lighter, or we'd all get 10-pound "laptops."

Some innovations are more useful than others. I'll take an improved MBP, especially the 15", over a novel removable touch screen. (I guess that's the innovation you have in mind.) What I like about the Surface isn't what would amount to a useless gimmick for me, but what it shares with Apple, attention to quality in execution.

The same can be said for your post no?

Blah, blah, blah. The things people say when they are defending Apple at all costs instead of facts..

Can you show me posts from before the MacBook's were announced where the users were asking for a thinner and lighter MacBook Pro?

I'll wait, no rush....

 

[bytecurious]

Well guys, my MacBook Pro is officially getting in the way of the tasks I need to get done.

macOS is brilliant, and I'm very much working well within the iPhone/Mac ecosystem, same with iCloud. The Mac is quick enough, and the screen / hardware - if it worked correctly - is still also excellent..

The Problem
Starting with the D key, the keys are rapidly getting weaker and falling off. I can type pretty damn fast and the keys are starting to suffer as a result. I replaced the keyboard with a 'genuine' and 'new' eBay part, which, in fact turned out to be not genuine and not new at all.. stopped working 2 minutes after installation intermittently. NO genuine or NEW Apple branded keyboards for the MBP are on eBay. I know this, because I sent a PM to every seller of one in the UK eBay listings and not one replied to confirm that they were - this was two weeks ago. So I will NOT find a good quality, replacement keyboard. I don't think a used one from a donor Mac will last much longer. More keys are starting to fall off, and whilst so far they'll go back on for a few days, its not going to fix itself. The charger is also on its way out, bit annoyed it's now £80 and not £60.. not like there was any new R&D costs needed in a product which has remained the same since 2006 (MagSafe 1 in my case). I love the charger on the Mac, and MagSafe, quite disappointed that the new MacBooks aren't going in this direction. The battery is also now well over 1000 charges and needs replaced. It won't even last for a 2 hour lecture running only Microsoft Word on the lowest brightness. Only Apple can really provide solutions to all of this, and at a high cost. They may also refuse, I am told, as I've upgraded to a 1TB SSHD and 8GB of RAM.. ridiculous IMO.

The Solution?
This is why I'm posting here. Not simply a rant. I'm getting rid of this Mac. It's 3 years old this month and whilst I'd happily use it for 5 it's going to cost a fair bit to keep running 'well' enough for prime, everyday use. It's also struggling to do things like Minecraft due to the 2012 hardware so there may be more reasons to move on. I can't afford a new MBP, I'll probably be graduated by the time I can now since Apple have priced the new models ridiculously high with no real reason.. I can't afford any new Mac really.

This Mac, at best, will fetch £500 on eBay due to the SSHD and RAM. So, after fees, £450. Add the £100 I'd have spent on a charger and stuff there's £550.

I can just about stretch to a Surface Pro due to its high end build quality, but only the Core M3 model which not many people deem fit for purpose. I know as a Mac user, paper spec lists don't mean much in the real world, but going for a non-Surface means I'm back to the 2008 and before build quality and workmanship of Windows laptops. Not a great place to be. Even at £1,000+ their Mac competitors are a joke in at least one way or another.

I can get 30% off at HP, and 10% off at Dell for a new laptop since I'm a student. So if those brands can offerr something good for £550, let me know!

Some things about Windows I'm not looking forward to are a fragmented ecosystem between Apple (for my iPhone) and Windows for the laptop. Then there's the washed out screen with poor colour depth. The sh*tty charger that isn't magnetic.. (though a new MBP has that these days too). Clunky, plastic casing with spontaneously placed ports - I SAW ONE WITH A VGA PORT WTF .. anyway, there will be compromises. THE MOUSE PAD MOSTLY WOULD BE HELL.

I was even contemplating going to the real dirt cheap likes of the Inspiron 15 and HP 250 etc, and saving some money for the future. Or using it to fit an SSD and tonnes of RAM to make those basic machines perform well. Not sure what this would mean in reality. Or perhaps a 'midrange' Windows laptop, offering an i5 or i7, 8/16 for RAM and a mediocre 15'6" screen and few other bad touches...

What do you recommend?
- Surface Pro with the M3
- Dirt cheap Windows PC, with SSD and RAM and pocket the rest
- Mid range, best I can afford Windows PC

and do you know of a £550 Windows laptop with a non crappy touch pad and decent battery?

Dell Chromebook 13 with a 256 GB SSD and you'll still be under budget.
Decent screen, fantastic keyboard, glass trackpack, insane battery life.

GalliumOS is absolutely trivial to install and gives you access to the entire Ubuntu catalog.

 

[Sanpete]

The same can be said for your post no?

Blah, blah, blah. The things people say when they are defending Apple at all costs instead of facts..

Can you show me posts from before the MacBook's were announced where the users were asking for a thinner and lighter MacBook Pro?

I'll wait, no rush....

No, the same can't be said of my post, since it's factual. Obviously size and weight matter. I didn't say anything about what you ask, nor does it matter to what I did say. Do you disagree with anything I actually said?

 

[xxray]

You're comparing bespoke high-end personal machines with mass-corporate tat.

The build quality of the high-end Microsoft, Dell, HP, Razer etc computers in 2017 isn't wildly different than Apple. The 2015 MBP trackpad is still my favourite, but it's splitting hairs at this point, the MS Precision pads are so similar.

If Apple had a line of $300 corporate stations, at the same level of internals as the Windows machines, you can bet they'd be tat too. Probably moreso, given Apple would not work with the razorthin profit margins others are willing too: that cost cutting comes from somewhere.

I have to disagree. I've tried out the Dell XPS, Surface Book, Surface Pro, all praised for their build quality. While I'll agree they're good, I still think Apple is on another level with the 2016 MBP.

 

[raqball]

No, the same can't be said of my post, since it's factual. Obviously size and weight matter. I didn't say anything about what you ask, nor does it matter to what I did say. Do you disagree with anything I actually said?

Yeah that's what I thought... No factual response to back up the rhetoric fueled love fest.. It's cool though and thanks for playing.. :thumbsup:

 

[Sanpete]

Yeah that's what I thought... No factual response to back up the rhetoric fueled love fest.. It's cool though and thanks for playing.. :thumbsup:

Wow. Do you even read what you reply to?

 

[wittyphrase]

Can you show me posts from before the MacBook's were announced where the users were asking for a thinner and lighter MacBook Pro?

I don't have anything to say about the rest of your back and forth, but on this particular piece - whether he could or couldn't dig up such posts it wouldn't matter. Companies don't make decisions like that based on forum posts.

 

[Hieveryone]

Well guys, my MacBook Pro is officially getting in the way of the tasks I need to get done.

macOS is brilliant, and I'm very much working well within the iPhone/Mac ecosystem, same with iCloud. The Mac is quick enough, and the screen / hardware - if it worked correctly - is still also excellent..

The Problem
Starting with the D key, the keys are rapidly getting weaker and falling off. I can type pretty damn fast and the keys are starting to suffer as a result. I replaced the keyboard with a 'genuine' and 'new' eBay part, which, in fact turned out to be not genuine and not new at all.. stopped working 2 minutes after installation intermittently. NO genuine or NEW Apple branded keyboards for the MBP are on eBay. I know this, because I sent a PM to every seller of one in the UK eBay listings and not one replied to confirm that they were - this was two weeks ago. So I will NOT find a good quality, replacement keyboard. I don't think a used one from a donor Mac will last much longer. More keys are starting to fall off, and whilst so far they'll go back on for a few days, its not going to fix itself. The charger is also on its way out, bit annoyed it's now £80 and not £60.. not like there was any new R&D costs needed in a product which has remained the same since 2006 (MagSafe 1 in my case). I love the charger on the Mac, and MagSafe, quite disappointed that the new MacBooks aren't going in this direction. The battery is also now well over 1000 charges and needs replaced. It won't even last for a 2 hour lecture running only Microsoft Word on the lowest brightness. Only Apple can really provide solutions to all of this, and at a high cost. They may also refuse, I am told, as I've upgraded to a 1TB SSHD and 8GB of RAM.. ridiculous IMO.

The Solution?
This is why I'm posting here. Not simply a rant. I'm getting rid of this Mac. It's 3 years old this month and whilst I'd happily use it for 5 it's going to cost a fair bit to keep running 'well' enough for prime, everyday use. It's also struggling to do things like Minecraft due to the 2012 hardware so there may be more reasons to move on. I can't afford a new MBP, I'll probably be graduated by the time I can now since Apple have priced the new models ridiculously high with no real reason.. I can't afford any new Mac really.

This Mac, at best, will fetch £500 on eBay due to the SSHD and RAM. So, after fees, £450. Add the £100 I'd have spent on a charger and stuff there's £550.

I can just about stretch to a Surface Pro due to its high end build quality, but only the Core M3 model which not many people deem fit for purpose. I know as a Mac user, paper spec lists don't mean much in the real world, but going for a non-Surface means I'm back to the 2008 and before build quality and workmanship of Windows laptops. Not a great place to be. Even at £1,000+ their Mac competitors are a joke in at least one way or another.

I can get 30% off at HP, and 10% off at Dell for a new laptop since I'm a student. So if those brands can offerr something good for £550, let me know!

Some things about Windows I'm not looking forward to are a fragmented ecosystem between Apple (for my iPhone) and Windows for the laptop. Then there's the washed out screen with poor colour depth. The sh*tty charger that isn't magnetic.. (though a new MBP has that these days too). Clunky, plastic casing with spontaneously placed ports - I SAW ONE WITH A VGA PORT WTF .. anyway, there will be compromises. THE MOUSE PAD MOSTLY WOULD BE HELL.

I was even contemplating going to the real dirt cheap likes of the Inspiron 15 and HP 250 etc, and saving some money for the future. Or using it to fit an SSD and tonnes of RAM to make those basic machines perform well. Not sure what this would mean in reality. Or perhaps a 'midrange' Windows laptop, offering an i5 or i7, 8/16 for RAM and a mediocre 15'6" screen and few other bad touches...

What do you recommend?
- Surface Pro with the M3
- Dirt cheap Windows PC, with SSD and RAM and pocket the rest
- Mid range, best I can afford Windows PC

and do you know of a £550 Windows laptop with a non crappy touch pad and decent battery?

I would go with a Dell if I had too. I've heard good things.

My 2nd choice would be a Microsoft built laptop.

IDK what it is, but I trust my computing needs most to the biggest names.

 

[Queen6]

I jumped ship yesterday... Picked up a Surface Book and sold my MacBook Pro nonTB to an acquaintance last night.

The largest issue I have with the switch is that I need to buy all my Mac programs again in Windows 10 form. Also I am sure I will miss continuity and handoff.. Next up my iPhone goes bye-bye tonight after my Google Pixel gets delivered..

Anyone know of a way to get semi handoff and continuity function between Windows and Android? I was told to check out PushBullet?

Already jumped, when Apple make something useful for my needs I may reconsider, equally maybe not, given the current direction. See you here

Q-6

 

[sapibobo]

pics or it didn't happen

Yeah, no pics = HOAX.

 

[Mobster1983]

You're comparing bespoke high-end personal machines with mass-corporate tat.

Normally you would be correct, but many of these laptops are over $2,000 new. By no means cheap machines.

 

[-aggie-]

I'm still using my MBP from 2009 and see no reason to move to another laptop. I have TotalFinder installed to give me some of the features I like in Windows and after being on Snow Leopard for years, I recently moved to El Capitan and couldn't be happier. Oh, and as far as the Windows haters go from some of the posts I saw on here, I find Windows 10 to be great for my desktop.

 

[getbretweir]

The same can be said for your post no?

Blah, blah, blah. The things people say when they are defending Apple at all costs instead of facts..

Can you show me posts from before the MacBook's were announced where the users were asking for a thinner and lighter MacBook Pro?

I'll wait, no rush....

I despise when people use the word "portability" when describing laptops these days. Like .5 lbs. is THAT big of a difference.

I value light and thin, but not if it means sacrificing the features I value most. Finding that right balance is the key.

More people care about using their laptop than carrying it around.

 

[Queen6]

I despise when people use the word "portability" when describing laptops these days. Like .5 lbs. is THAT big of a difference.

I value light and thin, but not if it means sacrificing the features I value most. Finding that right balance is the key.

More people care about using their laptop than carrying it around.

Very much agree, sacrificing usability, by neutering the notebook for the sake of being thinner, is not for me. Portability is what I associate with my 12" Retina MacBook, MacBook Air. The MacBook Pro I expect performance & usability, net result no sale...

My 13" class notebooks is now a Microsoft Surface Book, 15" I am looking for a solution, possibly a Thinkpad P50/P70, ultimately I need my hardware to work for me not against me.

Q-6

 

[PhoneI]

The Surface Pro is an excellent device. I haven't used the new MBP yet so I can't comment on that but msft did a great job on the Pro. Take a look at the XPS 13 as already mentioned or the HP Spectre X360 if you like the Surface's design. 30% off that would be a steal.

The Surface Pro is an awful device. Not a day goes by that I don't want to throw mine against the wall. Im convinced the trackpad was made by the devil.

Bad laptop; awful tablet.

If you must go to Windows; get a Lenovo (and start drinking).

 

[5684697]

42

 

[Sanpete]

People continue to talk about their subjective preferences as though they have some special objective validity. A half-pound matters a lot to some people, more than 32 GB RAM. On the other hand, some people would gladly carry five more pounds for 128 GB. People have different needs and preferences. Apple can't possibly please everyone.

I despise when people use the word "portability" when describing laptops these days. ... More people care about using their laptop than carrying it around.

Portability is what I associate with my 12" Retina MacBook, MacBook Air. The MacBook Pro I expect performance & usability, net result no sale...

Such remarks are hard to make sense of. All laptops are designed for portability, that's the point of a laptop. You could get far, far more performance and features in a machine that weighed ten pounds, or twenty, or eighty. It would be far more pro. It could have 24-hour battery life, a 24" display, a nuclear GPU. Does that make smaller machines not usable, not pro?

 

[Queen6]

People continue to talk about their subjective preferences as though they have some special objective validity. A half-pound matters a lot to some people, more than 32 GB RAM. On the other hand, some people would gladly carry five more pounds for 128 GB. People have different needs and preferences. Apple can't possibly please everyone.

Such remarks are hard to make sense of. All laptops are designed for portability, that's the point of a laptop. You could get far, far more performance and features in a machine that weighed ten pounds, or twenty, or eighty. It would be far more pro. It could have 24-hour battery life, a 24" display, a nuclear GPU. Does that make smaller machines not usable, not pro?

Your use of subjective is getting old, people are unhappy with Apple's design choices as they are fully entitled to be. The new MacBook Pro simply works against my needs on multiple levels, as do many other notebooks, often the subjective impact of a device can be a determining factor, it's not always facts & figures as many would remind, given Apple's lack of ability to produce performance hardware.

Drop the drama & extremes, it doesn't work, loosing highly relevant ports, cutting battery capacity, introducing a keyboard that is far from optimal, for the sake of 1/8" as the man said "balance" Apple's focus is solely the aesthetic now, looking to see more sales in the midstream than the professional sector.

Time will tell if the 2016 is a success, equally rumor has it Apple is already working on a beefed up version. Anyway is pretty much academic given the small percentage of revenue the Mac now represents to Apple, so we can only expect more of the same.

Q-6

 

[raqball]

I despise when people use the word "portability" when describing laptops these days. Like .5 lbs. is THAT big of a difference.

I value light and thin, but not if it means sacrificing the features I value most. Finding that right balance is the key.

More people care about using their laptop than carrying it around.

Agree.. Apple is no longer innovating unless you count the already established and used by other PC makers USB C and / or you count thinner and lighter...

The only real innovation recently from Apple was with the AirPods..

 

[ZapNZs]

The Surface Pro is an awful device. Not a day goes by that I don't want to throw mine against the wall. Im convinced the trackpad was made by the devil.

Bad laptop; awful tablet.

If you must go to Windows; get a Lenovo (and start drinking).

Perhaps you have a lemon? Mine is great. But I didn't expect Mac quality or OS X robustness going in, and was pleasantly surprised by a reasonably good product for a reasonably good price. I chose it over the iPad Pro (although if the iPad Pro had OS X, I would have purchased it in a second.)

 

[PhoneI]

Perhaps you have a lemon? Mine is great. But I didn't expect Mac quality or OS X robustness going in, and was pleasantly surprised by a reasonably good product for a reasonably good price. I chose it over the iPad Pro (although if the iPad Pro had OS X, I would have purchased it in a second.)

I have owned every Surface model and they are all really bad laptops.

Come on, you have to admit the keyboard is bad and the touchpad is outright evil.

The screen is too small for a laptop, there are zero good tablet apps, cant be used in portrait position.

I would be hard pressed to really find one good reason where I would ever reach for my Surface Pro before my Macbook Pro to do anything.

If you want a good laptop, get a laptop. If you want a good tablet, get a tablet. The Surface Pro doesn't make for a good either.