I wanted to like the X, but...

[dexterie]

I don't think that holds water, if they had low confidence the project should have been killed long before they unveiled it yesterday. The inclusion of the 8 is a simple fact that they need to have one model at a given price point.

The X is a luxury item in a sense, and so Apple is probably not expecting huge over the top sales figures, the 8 will be the bread and butter model, but the X is higher tier, lower sales volume, higher priced model.

My point again: the X offers what the competions does. But Apple decided to make it a higher standard. And their normal standard is now below standard.

 

[maflynn]

My point again: the X offers what the competions does. But Apple decided to make it a higher standard. And their normal standard is now below standard.

No argument, Samsung has had all of these features well before the X, and in fact I will say I like how they handled the lack of a home button better then that silly swiping up that you need to do.

The past few years I've seen a degradation in the simplicity that Apple used to embrace

 

[TechnicallyTee]

For a phone that is supposed to be a celebration and an achievement, it's quite underwhelming. Specially because we're talking about Apple. They could have done something better.

Well put. I really expected a little more. I feel it's a rushed prototype phone. And this is coming from so meoje who loves iPhones. The better buy for me right now is for sure the 8 Plus. I hope people enjoy the X but its not the end of all phone. It's ok a best.

 

[cableguy84]

I don't think that holds water, if they had low confidence the project should have been killed long before they unveiled it yesterday. The inclusion of the 8 is a simple fact that they need to have one model at a given price point.

The X is a luxury item in a sense, and so Apple is probably not expecting huge over the top sales figures, the 8 will be the bread and butter model, but the X is higher tier, lower sales volume, higher priced model.

That's fair enough, but i think fragmentation is becoming an issue.
Apple should have put all efforts into the "X".
The X just seems a bit half baked

 

[maflynn]

but i think fragmentation is becoming an issue.

Agreed, and this is where I think we miss Steve's guidance. We've lost a lot of simplicty in designs and the product mixture is confusing and/or overlapping. It doesn't matter if we're talking phones, tablets or laptops.

I will say Apple improved the overlap greatly in the tablets by moving the iPad Pro to 10.5", having 2 tablets at 9.7 and pricing them differently was just a bad idea.

 

[melb00m]

Remember, the $1000 variant is for the low-tier model also. As the mid-tier variant is gone and I never go for the low-tier, I'd have to spend a whopping 1319€ here in Germany for an iPhone that is not a four-year old design with huge bezels.

I don't like they did away with Touch ID for another method that looks clearly inferior. And I'm still baffled the main benefit they could show off for all this fancy front-camera tech was animated poo.

After being with the iPhone for 10 years, the time has come for me to make the switch. I also did the same with my laptop, after the MacBook Pro line has been changed to an overpriced luxury-laptop "Pro" line.

Don't get me wrong, this all makes me really sad. I've been an enthusiast for Apple for many years, and convinced friends and family that the Apple tax is money well spent. I can no longer do that. Just look at the iPhone lineup now: SE, 6s, 6s Plus, 7, 7 Plus, 8, 8 Plus, X. Absolutely insane. All those bows towards Steve Jobs yesterday to me seemed like derision, as they clearly forgot his basic ideas and principles that brought Apple to such great success.

 

[willmtaylor]

Ok, you're right. They aren't the same phone. But they are very similar, aren't they? The evolution in those generations (6, 6S, 7, 8) is less evident than, say, between 4 and 5S.
It feels they are just improving, fine-tunning and not creating something new.

I still disagree.

There always seem to be folks who believe the aesthetic changes make a phone different. I’ve always thought Internals were far more important, and in that regard, they’re worlds apart.

 

[PaladinGuy]

Remember, the $1000 variant is for the low-tier model also. As the mid-tier variant is gone and I never go for the low-tier, I'd have to spend a whopping 1319€ here in Germany for an iPhone that is not a four-year old design with huge bezels.

I don't like they did away with Touch ID for another method that looks clearly inferior. And I'm still baffled the main benefit they could show off for all this fancy front-camera tech was animated poo.

After being with the iPhone for 10 years, the time has come for me to make the switch. I also did the same with my laptop, after the MacBook Pro line has been changed to an overpriced luxury-laptop "Pro" line.

Don't get me wrong, this all makes me really sad. I've been an enthusiast for Apple for many years, and convinced friends and family that the Apple tax is money well spent. I can no longer do that. Just look at the iPhone lineup now: SE, 6s, 6s Plus, 7, 7 Plus, 8, 8 Plus, X. Absolutely insane. All those bows towards Steve Jobs yesterday to me seemed like derision, as they clearly forgot his basic ideas and principles that brought Apple to such great success.

Exactly. The iPhone X should start off with at least 128GB for the price. I was a bit shocked to see that they kept the iPhone 6S in the lineup. I think iOS is going to become much more glitchy with Apple trying to optimize the software for 5 different phones, all of which have different capabilities.

Right now, I think I’ll stick with my iPhone 7 for another year. Next time I upgrade, I’ll seriously consider other options than the iPhone, depending on what they do next year.

 

[dexterie]

Don't get me wrong, this all makes me really sad. I've been an enthusiast for Apple for many years, and convinced friends and family that the Apple tax is money well spent. I can no longer do that.

Exactly!
People around me ask me quite often which phone to get. I always say "iPhone". When they ask "Why is it so expensive though?" my usual reply is "Because it's better". I can't say this any longer. I would if the X was replacing the 7 and not elevated to jewel territory.
Other companies do the same, for less. And yes, you can tell me iOS is better and timely updates matter. But is this worth +500/600 EUR?

The only market in which I can still say, without a doubt and without feeling that I'm being biased, that Apple is better is in the tablet market. I recommend an iPad without thinking twice. I upgraded to my Pro 10.5 without thinking twice and I was thrilled to do so. This wouldn't happen with the X because I'd feel I was being ripped off.
I'll keep my 7 Plus. I'm very happy with it (even though, for the first time ever, I didn't buy it without thinking twice).
[doublepost=1505305659][/doublepost]

I still disagree.

There always seem to be folks who believe the aesthetic changes make a phone different. I’ve always thought Internals were far more important, and in that regard, they’re worlds apart.

I know that. An example are the 4 and the 4S.
The thing is that the design of the 8 is old. And didn't age well. It's a good phone, yes. But there's better around.

 

[melb00m]

I still disagree.

There always seem to be folks who believe the aesthetic changes make a phone different. I’ve always thought Internals were far more important, and in that regard, they’re worlds apart.

Of course, there are huge differences. And I've come to prefer the "s" line of iPhones (R.I.P.), because they've always focused much more on internal improvements and robustness.

However, it's hard to argue against the screen-to-body ratio of the iPhone 8 being completely outdated. That makes the phone look outdated as a whole, no matter how good the specs inside.

I would at least have expected an improvement on that front, similar to what they did with this years iPad Pro.

 

[dominiongamma]

That's my concern, I'd rather not be on the bleeding edge with my phone.
[doublepost=1505302040][/doublepost]
they need space for the front camera, so its either a notch, or a bezel - pick your poison.

Bezel would be better

 

[Brian Y]

I don't think that holds water, if they had low confidence the project should have been killed long before they unveiled it yesterday. The inclusion of the 8 is a simple fact that they need to have one model at a given price point.

The X is a luxury item in a sense, and so Apple is probably not expecting huge over the top sales figures, the 8 will be the bread and butter model, but the X is higher tier, lower sales volume, higher priced model.

I agree, although I think there's way too many models now.

Apple normally stick to a "good, better, best" way. E.g. iMac - you have 21, 21 4k, 27 5k. MacBook Air, MacBook, MacBook Pro.

So now they're selling the SE, 6S, 7, 8 and X. There's no need for that many models.

 

[melb00m]

The only market in which I can still say, without a doubt and without feeling that I'm being biased, that Apple is better is in the tablet market. I recommend an iPad without thinking twice. I upgraded to my Pro 10.5 without thinking twice and I was thrilled to do so. This wouldn't happen with the X because I'd feel I was being ripped off.

Same here. The iPad was always my "least liked" Apple product besides the iPhone and the Mac. Now the iPad Air 2 is my favorite Apple product.

 

[Mac'nCheese]

I wasn't blown away either. Face ID versus Touch ID, meh. It's neat but not that great. And I also don't like the bigger phones. Why only one size?

 

[maflynn]

Apple normally stick to a "good, better, best" way. E.g. iMac - you have 21, 21 4k, 27 5k. MacBook Air, MacBook, MacBook Pro.

I don't think their laptop line follows the good, better best mentality.
You have a 12" laptop, two 13" laptops, a 15" laptop. Seems fairly overlapping to me.

 

[4ppleg1rl]

That's the thing. I see Apple following and not leading.

The X is too expensive for a phone that has competition doing about the same for less. And then, the 8 is just a 6 with a new "facelift", keeping its aged design and sold as premium.

Unfortunately, Apple doesn't currently have a phone that is undeniably better than the competition. Years ago, buying Android was (to me, at least) an act of going for the lower end. Right now...I can picture myself changing sides (god forbid!). But it's the truth.

I felt like this a couple of years ago so I opted for the S7 BUT not even 2 years on, the S7 is laggy and just generally annoying now. iPhones genuinely don't do that. I had the 6 before and it was never laggy or had an issues. So while you can get more features for less on Android phones, they're generally not as long lasting. Which I guess is fine if you're the type to upgrade every year or 2 but if you want a phone that can take you through a few more years until you wanna upgrade then iPhones are more reliable.

But yeah I'm not even considering the X - it's ridiculously priced.

 

[dexterie]

I felt like this a couple of years ago so I opted for the S7 BUT not even 2 years on, the S7 is laggy and just generally annoying now. iPhones genuinely don't do that. I had the 6 before and it was never laggy or had an issues. So while you can get more features for less on Android phones, they're generally not as long lasting. Which I guess is fine if you're the type to upgrade every year or 2 but if you want a phone that can take you through a few more years until you wanna upgrade then iPhones are more reliable.

But yeah I'm not even considering the X - it's ridiculously priced.

The thing is that...right now,for the price of 1 iPhone , I could upgrade twice the soon-to-be laggy phone for a new one.

Don't get me wrong. I'm an Apple guy and I find all this upsetting. But it's becoming harder and harder to justify the "Apple tax" these days.

 

[Nozuka]

What was a big disappointment was the lack of pro-motion in a device that costs a freaking 1000$ dollars!!!

you mean the thing noone talked about until the iPad had it?
took a long time for truetone to arrive on the iphone too...

 

[willmtaylor]

Exactly!
People around me ask me quite often which phone to get. I always say "iPhone". When they ask "Why is it so expensive though?" my usual reply is "Because it's better". I can't say this any longer. I would if the X was replacing the 7 and not elevated to jewel territory.
Other companies do the same, for less. And yes, you can tell me iOS is better and timely updates matter. But is this worth +500/600 EUR?

The only market in which I can still say, without a doubt and without feeling that I'm being biased, that Apple is better is in the tablet market. I recommend an iPad without thinking twice. I upgraded to my Pro 10.5 without thinking twice and I was thrilled to do so. This wouldn't happen with the X because I'd feel I was being ripped off.
I'll keep my 7 Plus. I'm very happy with it (even though, for the first time ever, I didn't buy it without thinking twice).
[doublepost=1505305659][/doublepost]

I know that. An example are the 4 and the 4S.
The thing is that the design of the 8 is old. And didn't age well. It's a good phone, yes. But there's better around.

There’s change and there’s improvements. I’ve never been a proponent of change for change’s sake. And, of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[bmot]

The 6 and 8 are worlds apart, but I see the 8 as more of a "7S". If you have a 6/6S it's probably worth the upgrade, but if you have a 7 I'd say it wasn't.

As for the price issue, I would imagine that's down to the display. It's an odd display - I'd guess that yields are low and they're pretty damned hard to make.

I would not be surprised if there's a 2 month wait for an X.

Practically speaking, what are the real world usage advantages of an iPhone 8 over an iPhone 6?
I have the 6s and performance is noticeable better than on the 6, but beyond that the 7 and 8 don't noticeable perform better because the 6s already reached a performance that is optimal and the camera is already very good.
The only argument for me to upgrade would be to the X and for the only reason of having a small form factor versus a bigger screen. That is the first time since i bought the 6s that a new iPhone has an actual real world advantage over its predecessor. The iPhone 7 and 8 are just postponing, filling gap and milking the consumer cow devices.
Like it has been said before the X should have been the only iPhone this year for the price of previous years 7, maybe add the usual $50 increase but no more.

 

[bigjnyc]

Also, with the engineering resources at Apple's disposal, I'd have expected the bezels to be thinner. The Galaxy S8 and Note8 are aesthetically more appealing, and in my view, better looking than the iPhone X. The poor choices and compromises that inevitably led to Apple 'settling' on the iPhone X design is appalling, and simply do not justify the $999 price tag. Just my $0.02.

I agree with what you are saying, but I also think they are heading in the right direction finally, albeit really late to the party... But at least the huge top and bottom bezels appear to be going away so there's light at the end of the tunnel... I would say skip this year (unless you absolutely need/want a new phone) and lets hope that next year they refine it and figure out a way to mass produce OLED screens, or use a second source in addition to Samsung so they can drop the price, and still keep the ridiculous margins they've become accustomed to.

 

[rasputin1969]

Agreed, but I think there would have been a fairly large push back on a 1,000 phone. Apple is providing an upgrade path for the majority of people with the 8, and allows those that want to spend more to get the 1,000

Not for nothing but the Samsung S8 has nearly the same specs as the iPhone X (in fact many of the specs of the iPhone x have been in other android phones for years) and costs 840 dollars, closer to the iPhone 8 then the iPhone x but with iPhone x specs.

After many years with iPhone I bought a S8 this morning. Comes with Gear VR and a two year warranty from the Samsung UK web site. I bagged one for £533 by taking up the switch from iPhone option and used on old iPhone 4 I had lying around. I just don’t feel the 8 is remotely competitive at the moment.

 

[dexterie]

I wasn't blown away either. Face ID versus Touch ID, meh. It's neat but not that great. And I also don't like the bigger phones. Why only one size?

The phone isn't much bigger than the 6/6S/7/8. Removing the bezels allow it to have a bigger display in a small sized phone.

 

[Mac'nCheese]

The phone isn't much bigger than the 6/6S/7/8. Removing the bezels allow it to have a bigger display in a small sized phone.

Oh, I didn't realize that. I'll have to check it out when they have them in stores.

 

[willmtaylor]

After many years with iPhone I bought a S8 this morning. Comes with Gear VR and a two year warranty from the Samsung UK web site. I bagged one for £533 by taking up the switch from iPhone option and used on old iPhone 4 I had lying around. I just don’t feel the 8 is remotely competitive at the moment.

Yeah, having the fastest phone with the most accurate screen and an amazing camera from a company with the best customer service makes them not even remotely competitive since they don’t throw on the latest gimmicks ans fads.