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id Shows Off 'Rage' Running on iPhone 4 at 60 Frames Per Second

Hopefully this will set a benchmark for the 3D Realistic games available, and those yet to be released, of what the iPhone 4/3GS is capable of.

Of course the quirky 2D games will still remain popular on this platform, but sometimes its nice to see what the device is capable of.
 
To heck with all the debate on frame rate... the demo video looks pretty darn good to me. I can't imagine anyone complaining about it.

It will be cool to see how they take advantage of multiplayer and maybe the new iTV to make your iPhone or iPod Touch interact as a controller with the action on your big screen.

Either way.... it's cool. This has got to make game platform makers (Microsoft, Sony, Nitendo) nervous as the technology migrates out to other devices.
 
Now that is a cool idea. Get some plugs for your iphone, hook it into a widescreen TV, the phone becomes the control pad and the game is shot onto a plasma TV.

Gaming anywhere!
 
Krauser said:
3D power wise, the Droid X is probably the quickest. I can't say compared to the iPhone 4 but it is no slouch. It is without a doubt the fastest GPU in an Android phone to date, making it the quickest graphically (the 1GHz CPU helps as well) but I do not have knowledge of the GPU capabilities of the iPhone 4. From what's been shown, my educated guess is that the Droid X's GPU is more powerful than the iPhone 4's but I can't be certain so don't take my word. But don't worry, it's not substantially slower than the iPhone 4 by any margin so, with the proper coding, this demo could be pulled off on the Android platform. Then again, anyone who optimizes this well could do it eventually. Still, don't worry about the X. It's plenty fast in the GPU and CPU department. As of now, on Android 2.1, it is faster than the Evo 4G in the benchmarks and the Nexus One (running 2.1) so when Froyo hits it later this month, with the Delvin coding that guarantees 2 to 5 times greater performance, it will be the flagship for speed in the smartphone market. Don't worry, it's plenty adequate ;)
Click to expand...

with android you have to go through the OS and a VM to get to the hardware. with iOS you only have the OS. this is the reason why Android phones have more powerful hardware but don't perform as well in games and some other areas

2 to 5 times performance increase is in some tasks. not all around
 
Everyone's wrong.. the human eye can easily detect 100 fps. I have two, and so can detect 200. Me FTW! Actually the ideal frame rate is around 3 fps. I like to look around and take everything in, before the next frame comes along changing everything and confusing me. Plus, if I see an enemy coming, I have 20 seconds to pull out a gun, reload, work out a strategy (i.e. I google 'game walkthrough').

On a more serious note.. looks great! If that's a steady average rate, then there hopefully is enough room to add more on-screen characters, particles and light-sources (such as energy weapons), and AI & physics/collision detection; still with a reasonable frame rate.

I wonder how it would look if output to a mid-sized HDTV. After looking at the Chopper 2 videos (using an iPhone as a controller for an iPad game, outputting to a HDTV), I'm hopeful!
 
Pbrad08 said:
Such an ugly and crude comparison: comparing FPS with the human eye.

The human eye doesn't see in "frames", 'nuff said about that.
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haha true story.

And any video game fan can easily see the difference from 30-60 fps
 
Imperil said:
I keep seeing people mention this so they must only be reading this article and not all of the QuakeCon news. Today iD stated that iDTech5 will be kept proprietary in-house and they will no longer be licensing technology.
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I saw this and sincerely hope that they change their minds or at least Bethesda expands their mobile division with some new franchises. While Carmack is probably the single most skilled person at developing real time rendering engines, I have never felt that the rest of Id was at his level. I view Id's in-house games as glorified tech demos for Carmack's work. Hopefully this changes with Rage.
 
Is Carmack watching Jersey Shore??

CAUSE THERE SURE IS ALOTTA FIST PUMPING GOING ON!!
 
Screen Size

Its much simpler to produce 60 frame per second (fps) when you're "only" doing so for a small screen such as the iPhone or iPod Touch.

However, when you are drawing polygons for large television or computer monitors, there are several times more polygons to be drawn.

Therefore, Apple's A4 processor is not more advanced that the specially designed PowerPC processor that powers the XBox.

Layman's Terms:
Here's an experiment to try in your head...

1. Take a sheet of paper and write "APPLE" in as large letters as you can to take as much room as possible on the sheet of paper. How long does this take? Perhaps 10-30 seconds.

2. Now, perform the same task on an outdoor billboard. Which one takes longer?
 
globalhemp said:
Its much simpler to produce 60 frame per second (fps) when you're "only" doing so for a small screen such as the iPhone or iPod Touch.

However, when you are drawing polygons for large television or computer monitors, there are several times more polygons to be drawn.

Therefore, Apple's A4 processor is not more advanced that the specially designed PowerPC processor that powers the XBox.

Layman's Terms:
Here's an experiment to try in your head...

1. Take a sheet of paper and write "APPLE" in as large letters as you can to take as much room as possible on the sheet of paper. How long does this take? Perhaps 10-30 seconds.

2. Now, perform the same task on an outdoor billboard. Which one takes longer?
Click to expand...

I don't think that's quite accurate, the poly count shouldn't be affected by the screen size/resolution; but the fill rate would be. Since the iOS devices' screens are relatively low-res, that should help them avoid being fillrate limited.

Now if the game scene is very complex (complex objects & lots of particles -> lots of polygons) iOS devices will struggle. But that's due to the scene complexity, not the screen size. Obviously, there are other factors like the complexity of the lighting model and LOD reduction.

I think it's pretty impressive what they've done so far, though obviously they have a long way to go to make a game of it.
 
globalhemp said:
Its much simpler to produce 60 frame per second (fps) when you're "only" doing so for a small screen such as the iPhone or iPod Touch.

However, when you are drawing polygons for large television or computer monitors, there are several times more polygons to be drawn.

Therefore, Apple's A4 processor is not more advanced that the specially designed PowerPC processor that powers the XBox.

Layman's Terms:
Here's an experiment to try in your head...

1. Take a sheet of paper and write "APPLE" in as large letters as you can to take as much room as possible on the sheet of paper. How long does this take? Perhaps 10-30 seconds.

2. Now, perform the same task on an outdoor billboard. Which one takes longer?
Click to expand...

I think you are confusing polygons with pixels. More polygons = smoother curves, but has relatively little to do with screen size. Larger screens have tended to have more pixels in the past, but that's not the case any longer. Let's take Halo 3 running on an xBox 360 as an example. It is rendering at 1138×640 (728320 pixels). If Rage is using the full iPhone 4 display resolution of 960x640 (614400 pixels), then it is only 15% fewer pixels. Running on an iPad at 1024x768 (786432 pixels) is actually higher resolution then Halo 3. Considering that Rage is said to be running at 60 frames per second vs 30 for Halo 3, Carmack is actually pushing about twice the pixels of a current gen console.

BTW - I agree that the current consoles are pushing more polygons, but Carmack is pushing more pixels on the iPhone/iPad then most console games.
 
err404 said:
I think you are confusing polygons with pixels. More polygons = smoother curves, but has relatively little to do with screen size. Larger screens have tended to have more pixels in the past, but that's not the case any longer. Let's take Halo 3 running on an xBox 360 as an example. It is rendering at 1138×640 (728320 pixels). If Rage is using the full iPhone 4 display resolution of 960x640 (614400 pixels), then it is only 15% fewer pixels. Running on an iPad at 1024x768 (786432 pixels) is actually higher resolution then Halo 3. Considering that Rage is said to be running at 60 frames per second vs 30 for Halo 3, Carmack is actually pushing about twice the pixels of a current gen console.

BTW - I agree that the current consoles are pushing more polygons, but Carmack is pushing more pixels on the iPhone/iPad then most console games.
Click to expand...

Saved me time thanks ^^
 
err404 said:
BTW - I agree that the current consoles are pushing more polygons, but Carmack is pushing more pixels on the iPhone/iPad then most console games.
Click to expand...

Which means nothing. I mean if we're going to look at pushing pixels as some kind of metric, Super Stardust HD 3D runs at 720p 60fps (effective 120fps) and 1080p 60fps w/ 4x aa.
 
alent1234 said:
with android you have to go through the OS and a VM to get to the hardware. with iOS you only have the OS. this is the reason why Android phones have more powerful hardware but don't perform as well in games and some other areas

2 to 5 times performance increase is in some tasks. not all around
Click to expand...

That, and the mishmash of hardware in various Android phones make it unappealing for developers like Carmack to bother developing cutting-edge games. Standardization goes a long way in the game world.
 
wreckshop said:
Which means nothing. I mean if we're going to look at pushing pixels as some kind of metric, Super Stardust HD 3D runs at 720p 60fps (effective 120fps) and 1080p 60fps w/ 4x aa.
Click to expand...

My post was in response to a globalhemp suggesting that the screen size was responsible for Carmack being able to reach 60FPS when consoles typically target 30FPS. I stand by my claim that Rage is pushing more pixels on the iPhone/iPad then most console games as the vast majority of console games are 720p or less running at ~30FPS.

720p30 - Typical for majority of current gen console games
27648000 pixels per sec

Rage iOS - iPad
47185920 pixels per sec

Again, small screen size is not contributing to iOS Rage running at 60FPS

This does not mean that the iPhone/iPad are in the same league as the consoles. Rage on iOS will push far fewer polygons and contain a fraction of the post processing effects and AA.
 
I forgot how much of a geek Carmack is. Good to see him again.

Edit: Yikes, quite a ramble of a keynote. I guess it's tricky when there is no feedback from the crowd or breaks to show off slides.
 
look great

this is really cool, makes me wish I had an iphone 4 instead of the 3g. Makes me wonder why 27 people marked this as "Negative" on the front page. There was a study released recently that suggests that when given the option, some people will vote "No" or "Negative" simply cause it's one of the options given to them regardless of what they are voting on. I believe this to be true.
 
err404 said:
My post was in response to a globalhemp suggesting that the screen size was responsible for Carmack being able to reach 60FPS when consoles typically target 30FPS. I stand by my claim that Rage is pushing more pixels on the iPhone/iPad then most console games as the vast majority of console games are 720p or less running at ~30FPS.
Click to expand...

Let's get this straight. your term "pushing pixels" is something you made up to describe framebuffer output, and as such is worthless. In no way does rage on iphone process more pixels than halo 3.
 
fack id software, seriously. fack them! they can get a stupid game run on the damn iphone at 60fps, but they can't get the stream for the quakelive tournament run with more than 5fps. amazing how ****** and retarded this company has become over the last ten years.
 
wreckshop said:
Let's get this straight. your term "pushing pixels" is something you made up to describe framebuffer output, and as such is worthless. In no way does rage on iphone process more pixels than halo 3.
Click to expand...
True, but more people understand what a pixel is then a framebuffer. Also I don't know the framebuffer color mode to accurately compare raw size and throughput. I didn't want to confuse the issue with multi pass rendering and post processing, since it was not relevant to the specific question of rendering to the iPhone/iPad screen resolution. I recommend that your read globalhemp post to understand what I was responding to.

FYI - However, I have concluded each post clarifying that the phone is not at the same level for rendering quality.
 
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