From my experiences living in China and learning Chinese; nah, it takes much less. Of course, it depends on how much time you throw at it. I'd say 2-3 years.
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If you could choose anywhere in the world to live
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From my experiences living in China and learning Chinese; nah, it takes much less. Of course, it depends on how much time you throw at it. I'd say 2-3 years.
chinese characters only have one reading in chinese, no?
each one has at least two readings and as many as seven in japanese, they use all the chinese characters plus two native japanese scripts on top of it mixed in. no spaces between words either (guessing chinese is the same on that last part).
itll take far more than 2-3 years to learn how to write 2000 everyday kanji.......
theres just no way johnny foreigner is going to come in and master it all in 2-3 years when it takes native speakers who were born there and grew up there 2 decades (you may have missed my second post). then again ive noticed americans always have a funny definition of "fluent"
anyway not going to discuss it anymore, if everyone thinks they can speak read and write japanese truly fluently at the native level in 2-3 years, so be it. decent conversational speaking and maybe very limited reading might be achievable in 2-3 years, but not much more for most people. ive lived there for a few years, studied it, and seen people spend years and years trying to learn the language. most people dont shoot for level 2 proficiency (2-kyuu) until theyve been there around 4-5 years, and the jump to 1-kyuu after that (hardest level) is massive and takes a ton more study. you can maybe get a non english teaching job with 2-kyuu, but someone else will be applying with 1-kyuu and even then they arent close to native level.
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It's funny, of all the places I've been - Okinawa would be last on my list of places to return. I did not find it friendly or welcoming.
Ok. You people are going to have to do better than this (lack of pics)or I'll start my own photo thread. Cudos to @ameriMacka for making an attempt.
For me ideally it would be 2 places, beach (I love mountainous islands, flatish islands are generally boring) and a location in the North woods next to a mountain lake. Locations from a scenic aspect that have enchanted me- most of the U.S East Coast Appalachians (because I prefer my mountains with trees on them- oldest mountains in the U.S.), West Virginia, Virginia, upstate New York, Montana, Northern Minnesota, Washington State, coastal California, England, Ireland, France, Germany, central-northern Italy, Sicily, and Switzerland. If I had carte Blanche, it would not be an easy choice, not to mention culture shock aspects.
For me it would be:
Mountain water
Or Mountainous Ocean water (St. Lucia). Give me both.
And there are exceptions to this policy, such as Tuscany.
And Southern Virginia
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Definately Scandinavia (Sweden, Denmark & Norway). Not the best place to be during winter if you live in the southern parts (the usually snow-free and very rainy/dull places). Otherwise great tax-system that literally "just works", free school + hospitals + high standard of living in general. You seldom stress, convenient and working buss/train system.. It is lovely
Japanese culture is really interesting. My time in Japan is one of my most cherished travel memories of this life.
When we were young and carefree (kinda) with a 3 year old son in tow, besides working there for a month at a time, we took a 30 day vacation on Honshu. Took the Bullet train from Tokyo to Iwikuni and worked our way back. People were very friendly and helpful. If I have a complaint it would be too many people on the Kanto plain. If I can dig up some decent photos, I'll post.
One stop: Himeji (not my photo)
Another stop: Nara (not my pic)
On board the Bullet Train circa 1983
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Spain or Canada, nowhere near cities though. I currently live in Canada, but eventually we'll move out of the city, too populated.
Your interpretation of the two languages' relative complexity is overly simple.
You forget to mention that Japanese has a much higher prevalence of furigana, and that kana is very easily readable, and therefore also used for animals, fruits and vegetables, loanwords, etc, whereas Chinese is overflowing with unique characters for everything and a strong tradition for localizing everything imaginable into something unpredictable (bet you didn't know Doraemon's Chinese name is 哆啦A梦). Grammar looks simple at first, but then you stumble across examples where 合适 is an adjective but 适合 is a verb, of the same meaning. Then there's also the issue with tones, and the fact that the country is so big that Mandarin pronunciation in major cities can vary widely from one person to the next, which sometimes even throws natives off.
I'm sure you have a love affair with Japanese and that "my language is harder than your language", but objectively speaking one is as hard as the other, but in different ways.
Finally, I'm European.
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Do you not have an EHIC card?
[doublepost=1456241749][/doublepost]I'd live in Iceland
That looks like my ideal. I remember visiting St. Marten, and thinking it was a fabulous place to retire (if you could avoid the tourist areas).
I've tried but not succeeded, not that it is too difficult, but with the realization if you don't use it you lose it, and I've never been in a situation where I really needed it, although living in Texas, I would benefit from knowing Spanish on occasion.
As long as it's pretty, there are not many things that would want to eat me, and I don't have to live under a dome or use a breathing device when outside. I'll plan on the next lifetime.
Something like:
I would pick Greece as I have family on one of the islands.
Second choice would be Hawaii. This choice would be for the weather primarily as I like in the not-so-great Northeast (NY) and I am tired of winter.
Second choice would be Hawaii. This choice would be for the weather primarily as I like in the not-so-great Northeast (NY) and I am tired of winter.
Ok. You people are going to have to do better than this (lack of pics)or I'll start my own photo thread. Cudos to @ameriMacka for making an attempt.
For me ideally it would be 2 places, beach (I love mountainous islands, flatish islands are generally boring) and a location in the North woods next to a mountain lake. Locations from a scenic aspect that have enchanted me- most of the U.S East Coast Appalachians (because I prefer my mountains with trees on them- oldest mountains in the U.S.), West Virginia, Virginia, upstate New York, Montana, Northern Minnesota, Washington State, coastal California, England, Ireland, France, Germany, central-northern Italy, Sicily, and Switzerland. If I had carte Blanche, it would not be an easy choice, not to mention culture shock aspects.
For me it would be:
Mountain water
Or Mountainous Ocean water (St. Lucia). Give me both.
And there are exceptions to this policy, such as Tuscany.
And Southern Virginia
What? No Misty Mountains?
Me: stable economy, affordability, no political / social strife, little humidity, tons of veggie food, varied climate (Spring and Winter) and public transport / walking distance to everything.
I have no idea where the heck that would be.
What? No Misty Mountains?
Me: stable economy, affordability, no political / social strife, little humidity, tons of veggie food, varied climate (Spring and Winter) and public transport / walking distance to everything.
I have no idea where the heck that would be.
The foothills are quite nice when we are not dealing with incursions of goblins, nasty worgs, and reports of large spiders, so lately have been taking holiday at Beorn's. They seem to leave him and his farm alone...
only elementary kids use furigana, adults do not. its primarily for kids to learn kanji and it isnt all that prevalent in society when out and about.
of course japanese uses hiragana and katakana, those are the native scripts. used in addition to and often with kanji in the same word. are hiragana and katakana easy to learn and read? sure. majority of the language is kanji anyway though so its fairly moot. virtually nothing is written in all hiragana or katakana, unless its for little kids.
heres an everyday japanese 101 kanji (日) with more than a few readings, and you have to deal with this for all 2000 kanji, have to learn by word compounds rather than individual kanji:
日本 - nihon
本日 - honjitsu
毎日 - mainichi
日柄 - higara
月日 - gappi
明日 - ashita
昨日 - kinou
一日 - tsuitachi
and for fun , 日日 - hi-nichi
lots of dialects in japan too, which can be surprisingly different for such a small country.
anyway my only point is that if someone really wants to master the language - speaking, reading, and writing it - its basically a lifelong affair. like i said, native japanese learn it all the way through high school - thats nearly 20 years right there for native speakers. dont really understand why anyone would argue this. simply put, anyone thinking they are going to go over there and be truly self sufficient - this means dealing with landlords, municipal forms, japanese resumes, utility companies, the dmv, post office, atms (certainly no furigana on these guys), banks, copy machines, city hall, etc - is pretty much going to be in for a rude awakening if they think they are going to be able to do any and all of that on their own without help after just a couple years. decent convo skills and barely passable reading of parts of a text? sure. able to read a whole book? highly doubt it. fill out forms by hand at city hall or fill out a standard japanese resume form? probably not. certainly dont want to be using just hiragana on a resume. not to mention all you ever learn in school is kanto dialect, i dont even know of anywhere overseas that teaches kansai dialect, which is the whole of osaka/kobe/kyoto/himeji so that requires special study in addition to the default kanto dialect that is taught.
anyway i never said chinese was easier than japanese, just that people arent mastering japanese in 2-3 years. i think thats a fair statement.
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What? No Misty Mountains?
Me: stable economy, affordability, no political / social strife, little humidity, tons of veggie food, varied climate (Spring and Winter) and public transport / walking distance to everything.
I have no idea where the heck that would be.
When you figure that out, let me know cause I'll be ready to move!
here, not moving away...
- free healthcare
- free education from a kindergarden to an university
- enough and paid holidays from work (5weeks in a year)
- peaceful
- good social system (if you loose your job or become sick for example)
- fresh and clean environment
- thousends of lakes
- forests
if i had to choose another country (and not part of north europe)... then it would be... canada/japan?
- free healthcare
- free education from a kindergarden to an university
- enough and paid holidays from work (5weeks in a year)
- peaceful
- good social system (if you loose your job or become sick for example)
- fresh and clean environment
- thousends of lakes
- forests
if i had to choose another country (and not part of north europe)... then it would be... canada/japan?
Sounds just like Sweden! Where in Europe do you have it like that?
close enough... but im on the right, the neighbour of sweden...
edit. oj, du är svensk... så.. lite till höger därifrån men inte tills ryssland
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Surprising how few seem to mention the people. My London England ancestry apparently dates back to the time of the Crusades. BUT I suffered all my life in many places, for being naturally facetious in gloomy populations. Thankfully I moved to Liverpool, in the UK where I find an equal measure of friendliness, sincerity and facetiousness. Humour is where you find it and as Honorary Straight Man to 400,000 natural comedians, I cite just three examples: Man looking at some 'modern' apartment blocks being demolished "It used to take a hundred years to make a slum- now they send you a kit". 2. Man approached by a no win no fee crook lawyer canvasser "Have you had any accidents in the last three years' ' No, mate, I've always looked like this." 3. Man told by his Doctor to cut down on drinking "Well, l I'll, try, but you don't see many old Doctors and the streets are full of old drunks."
There is nowhere in the World where I have not been that I want to visit. Least of all my ancestral home, London. But then, I remember when it had real Londoners i it. Not now. Last time I was there only two friendly faces - one an Irishman building a wall, and a West Indian window cleaner.
There is nowhere in the World where I have not been that I want to visit. Least of all my ancestral home, London. But then, I remember when it had real Londoners i it. Not now. Last time I was there only two friendly faces - one an Irishman building a wall, and a West Indian window cleaner.
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One reason for that might be that the USA keep on occupying Okinawa ? Do you expect the japanese people to be happy with this?
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I'd pick somewhere in Europe. Maybe Italy (the italian attitude towards life is awesome). Or Switzerland (maybe a bit cold in winter but i'd deal with it).
Based on having been there.
If you're in Europe you can get to so many cool places just by driving for a day or less anyway, even if where you happen to live isn't perfect, or you get bored.
Sorry, but this is an extremely absurd statement.
If China or Russia occupied the US and had military bases on some of the most fertile land, which in Japan also happens to be very limited being a small chain of islands, would you just "make lemons"? Doubt it. You'd be madder than hell.
There are a lot of problems that come with the military bases on Okinawa, rapes and sexual assaults by US soldiers on the locals being a large one. A lot of the Japanese people are still pacifist and don't mind the US presence there and have learned to deal with the problems our bases bring, but a lot of them are starting to really show resentment, particularly the farmers who want their land back so they can make a living. It's been 70 years.
That said, I think you're the only person I've heard of to have had a negative experience in Okinawa. Okinawan culture is quite a bit different from mainland Japanese culture, and quite a bit slower. "Island time" and all that. I'm surprised you had a bad experience with people who are largely considered some of the most polite and non-confrontational in the world...unless you were extremely rude.