iFixit Highlights Apple's Uncertain Right to Repair Stance Through Emails Shared With Judiciary Committee

[ouimetnick]

Who will be responsible for a badly repaired phone or when something stops working after home repair? What if the device has been sold to a buyer that didn't know it was repaired by the owner?
I like to have the right to repair, but what should incapable people have the right to do?

But this applies to everything. What about a car? What about a kitchen appliance? I can purchase genuine parts for my vehicles from the dealership’s part department. The mom and pop store where I bought my dishwasher, fridge, and stove will gladly sell me repair parts if I give them the part number (or they can look it up for me)

The responsibility falls on the person who made the repair. Consumer electronics should be no different.

 

[CJ Dorschel]

Competition has always been good, monopoly not so much
Once we were able to open a computer and upgrade ram (some iMac lets you still do it), change internal HD etc
Great times!

Exactly my point and exactly this. If Apple didn’t solder everything to their systems for “thin” designs and lockout users from upgrading simple parts while allowing the Mac Pro to be user upgradable with third-party parts this would be less of an issue.

 

[Expos of 1969]

Often the buyer may not know that the device was "home repaired", but guess who gets the blame of bad quality!

Same as with a used car. You buy used, you take your chances. If you buy a used Ford from John Smith and it gives you problems you can bad mouth Ford all you want but so what. If you buy a used iPhone from Tom Smith and it gives you problems, you can bad mouth Apple but so what. Why does Apple think its reputation will be ruined and other companies making other products do not?

 

[macfacts]

Who will be responsible for a badly repaired phone or when something stops working after home repair? What if the device has been sold to a buyer that didn't know it was repaired by the owner?
I like to have the right to repair, but what should incapable people have the right to do?

Those aren't new questions. Same kind of problems with car repair.

 

[Agit21]

Never knew how greedy Apple really was. Glad all this dirt is made public now.

 

[Count Blah]

Congress should ask iFixit how they make their money. Of course they're advocating for "Right to Repair"; with it, they could do a lot more business.

So you don’t want people to be able to make their own repairs?

 

[Rocko99991]

Apple was trying to pass a bill in California trying to make it illegal to fix your phone yourself. What are you talking about. Dude, Apple is hella shaddy for that. They are not on the customer side.
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Eh wrong. People buy second hand cars all the time. Check craiglist. Those cars have been worked on by regular people.

Illegal? What is the fine/penalty for fixing a product you own? 6 months in jail?

 

[apple_unreal]

iFixit should ask Samsung why they don't even put those pull tabs on their battery and instead gluing them directly, making it a ton more difficult (and more dangerous) in replacing a Samsung phone's battery vs iPhone.

Probably because we are talking about Apple products that do have their battery glued as well...

 

[macmyworld]

This is a huge issue with Apple. Cracked my iMac screen in March when Apple stores were closed. Easy repair so I called Apple wanting to order a new one.

Learned that Apple will not sell parts direct. Beats me why, my money is good.

Apple said I had to use an independent place which there was one open in Minneapolis. Emailed that shop with a picture of the cracked screen and asked them to order it.

No dice. They said I had to bring the machine in so they could run a diagnostic that Apple requires before they could order the screen. I said that was nuts, they said it is Apple policy.

So that would have been two trips at 20 miles during a pandemic. One to order and one to get the part which was over $900.

i gave up and hit the black market. Had the part in three days and it worked perfectly.

Apple needs to be way better than this. I can order anything for my car.

 

[TeamMojo]

Implicit in iFixit's ridiculous stance is that Apple go out of their way to make their devices easier for iFixit to open. Thus easier for iFixit to make money off of parts and videos. It's not the noble Right to Repair cause they pretend.

And the idea itself is ridiculous. We don't live in a country with a long list of enumerated rights for a reason. You don't have a Right To Repair and never will. You can try taking apart your device at your own risk, and if you succeed, great, but if not, it's not Apple's fault that they used more glue, or a special seal to make their devices waterproof, etc.

 

[ian87w]

Probably because we are talking about Apple products that do have their battery glued as well...

With proper pull tabs so replacing them are easier.

Samsung doesn't put pull tabs on their battery, making it a lot harder and dangerous.

 

[baryon]

Remember when devices came with a repair manual, and warranties weren't automatically "voided" if you attempted to repair them? I know things have gotten more complicated since then but I do wish Apple at least made an attempt to make repairs easier, more accessible and not monopolized. Now they're actively fighting the ability of people to repair their stuff. It's crazy how you can't even replace the damned battery without voiding the warranty unless you go to Apple.

 

[d-klumpp]

Right to repair is an obvious step. For the "what happens when..." crowd, one need to look no further than cars. OEMs authorize franchises to repair their vehicles, but any other number of unauthorized shops can also do the repairs. The OEMs make the parts and knowledge available to everyone to facilitate the free market.

Would anyone like to revert to the model where only BMW authorized shops can touch a BMW?

The notion of repair varies greatly with the item, and generally bigger is better. So while a car can be repaired by many, and a bike can be repaired by most, a watch can only be repaired by a few who are skilled in the art. Same with a camera or a fishing reel. The only reason this silly issue is an issue at all is because so many more people carry a phone compared to those of us who use fishing reels, yet fishing reels are serviceable and not necessarily designed with compactness as a major asset. Instead, today's feature-rich phones are designed with compactness and water-resistance as key features, assets that are inherently at odds with convenient user serviceability.

Dave

 

[Craptastic]

Ah yes. This will be good. So when someone messes up they head straight to the Apple Store and expect free service/repair/replacement..or shocked Pikachu face when there’s a charge to fix the mistake they made.

 

[ouimetnick]

Often the buyer may not know that the device was "home repaired", but guess who gets the blame of bad quality!

How is that any different than a car or regular desktop computer then?

 

[hans1972]

Go to an Apple or AASP, just like now. Right to repair doesn't mean self repair as the only option. It means providing the guides, tools, and parts to do a home repair with OEM parts.

And this is what I disagree with. Apple should be forced to give those out.
Of course, it should be legal to repair it yourself, but Apple should be under no obligation to help you.
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But this applies to everything. What about a car? What about a kitchen appliance? I can purchase genuine parts for my vehicles from the dealership’s part department. The mom and pop store where I bought my dishwasher, fridge, and stove will gladly sell me repair parts if I give them the part number (or they can look it up for me)

The responsibility falls on the person who made the repair. Consumer electronics should be no different.

Can any person or company buy Tesla parts from Tesla and get manuals and tools for all kinds of repairs including exchanging the battery pack?

 

[StevieD100]

What is the difference between a car? Should we make it illegal to repair our own car at home because we want to protect our customers? That sounds insane.

I'm sure a good number of car makers plus white goods plus just about everything and everything would love to see that enacted in law. Only trained and accredited repain men will be allowed to change a light bulb in your home. Cost? $100 per bulb plus $500 call out.

 

[Art Mark]

One again we find ourselves in the Twilight Zone. Of course there will be divergent opinions within Apple on a topic. It's also a complicated issue. Do we really want all devices forever to have to be repaired by crazy uncle Charlie - just because? That's obviously not a good idea. There are a hundred different definitions of 'right to repair' and what it means. And given the complicated nature of the devices, when i buy a used iPhone that Cousin Buckly repaired with Elmers glue "It says it can glue anything!"and it ignites while on an airplane - how's that going to go? Divergent opinions within an organizations is a sign of a healthy organization. Sharing those ideas and opinions a sign of strengt. Otherwise you ned up with dictatorial style systems that squash important voices. Ultimately, yes, a decision has to be made, but I find it silly that everyone is reacting to the fact that different people in an organization can have and share different opinions. Man, it's almost like the world is complicated...

 

[thejadedmonkey]

Often the buyer may not know that the device was "home repaired", but guess who gets the blame of bad quality!

And yet if a 5 year old device is home repaired and sold, guess who gets the praise for making a good product? It goes both ways, and a botched home repair is easy to spot.
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And this is what I disagree with. Apple should be forced to give those out.
Of course, it should be legal to repair it yourself, but Apple should be under no obligation to help you.
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Can any person or company buy Tesla parts from Tesla and get manuals and tools for all kinds of repairs including exchanging the battery pack?

I'm not sure how tesla operates because they were using 1sr party stores instead of dealers, but for a company like Ford they need to make replacement parts available for 7 years after they produce the car. So, yes?

 

[iBluetooth]

How is that any different than a car or regular desktop computer then?

The components in an iPhone are extremely small which takes tools and knowledge to do right. But, of course same applies to cars and computers, which is a risk there also. That's why

And yet if a 5 year old device is home repaired and sold, guess who gets the praise for making a good product? It goes both ways, and a botched home repair is easy to spot.

Yes, you don't really know the quality of the home repair until you drop it into water and find out it wasn't sealed properly etc. This fantasy of happy home repair is dependent on the bad apples within.

 

[jayducharme]

So you don’t want people to be able to make their own repairs?

I'm sure that would turn out really well....

Not everyone has the technical ability to fix that kind of tech. Swap out a battery, yes. But beyond that, I could imagine a customer bringing a dismantled iPhone to an Apple store, asking the geniuses to fix it after the customer botched the repair.

 

[FNH15]

Right to repair is an obvious step. For the "what happens when..." crowd, one need to look no further than cars. OEMs authorize franchises to repair their vehicles, but any other number of unauthorized shops can also do the repairs. The OEMs make the parts and knowledge available to everyone to facilitate the free market.

Would anyone like to revert to the model where only BMW authorized shops can touch a BMW?

This was never the case. It’s interesting you bring up BMW, as they are perhaps the best DIY platform out of pretty much any manyfacturer- you can easily download the same software the dealer uses to interface with the car.

And having owned multiple BMWs, all used, I would love it if only qualified shops, or people who know what they’re doing could work on them. It would cut down on the amount of poorly maintained examples on the road.

 

[Darmok N Jalad]

Right to repair is an obvious step. For the "what happens when..." crowd, one need to look no further than cars. OEMs authorize franchises to repair their vehicles, but any other number of unauthorized shops can also do the repairs. The OEMs make the parts and knowledge available to everyone to facilitate the free market.

Would anyone like to revert to the model where only BMW authorized shops can touch a BMW?

BMW might be a bad example, as many shops won’t work on them for any advanced repair. An oil change is one thing, but not every repair shop will touch every make and model of car for their own reasons. The last person I knew that had a mid-2000s BMW said it was hard to find places that would work on it and actually fix it. A mid-2000s Pontiac would be serviced practically everywhere.

What is the difference between a car? Should we make it illegal to repair our own car at home because we want to protect our customers? That sounds insane.

There are many aspects of modern automobiles that the owner can not repair. Many cars, you pop the hood and can’t even reach 75% of the components since they are buried under plastic and/or the windshield.

I’m not saying that right to repair is a bad thing, or that Apple is right to have the limits it does, but car analogies don’t always work. Still, there are some automotive problems that your local service station will eventually say “take it to the dealer.”

 

[farewelwilliams]

ifixit's right to exist stance

 

[Expos of 1969]

I'm sure that would turn out really well....

Not everyone has the technical ability to fix that kind of tech. Swap out a battery, yes. But beyond that, I could imagine a customer bringing a dismantled iPhone to an Apple store, asking the geniuses to fix it after the customer botched the repair.

And? The Apple store either says sure we will fix it at a cost of x$$ or the Apple store says we are unable or unwilling to fix it. No different from other products and other companies.