In a matter of generations is the English dialect changing significantly?

[arkitect]

Remember my focus is on the service industry. Think if it this way, after looking over the menu you order veal sauté mascot, artichoke, and mushroom, with a bottle of Chenin Blanc... would you rather hear My pleasure or No problem?

How about, Thank you

No problem
Unless I made a special request such as a substitution or the like, probably not what I'd expect to hear.

My pleasure
No.

But then again that's just my British perspective.
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"My pleasure" feels overly fawning to me.

Definitely.

 

[Huntn]

"My pleasure" feels overly fawning to me.

Depends on how it's said. How do you feel about no problem as a reply? To tell a customer, you enjoy serving them is a positive statement, although it could be just one of the nice things said. VS a no problem which is a neutral- slightly negative as if you are being inconvienenced, but can shake it off. Ok, I admit I've beat this horse to death and that many replies (from service people saying no problem) are just an acknowledgment without any thought put into it.

 

[mobilehaathi]

Depends on how it's said. How do you feel about no problem as a reply? To tell a customer, you enjoy serving them is a positive statement, although it could be just one of the nice things said. VS a no problem which is a neutral- slightly negative as if you are being inconvienenced, but can shake it off. Ok, I admit I've beat this horse to death and that many replies are just an acknowledgment without any thought put into it.

"No problem" doesn't bother me, and to be honest neither phase is something I would care much about. But if we're going to over-analyze these two phrases in a generalized service industry context, then, "my pleasure" definitely feels overly fawning. In reality, I very rarely take notice how servers choose to phrase their acknowledgement of my orders!

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Remember my focus is on the service industry. Think if it this way, after looking over the menu you order veal sauté mascot, artichoke, and mushroom, with a bottle of Chenin Blanc... would you rather hear My pleasure or No problem?

As it happens, while walking over to have my back & shoulder massage later this afternoon, a neighbour's car stalled while reversing out of her drive; it blocked the footpath, and I paused, uncertain whether to proceed (the driveway was on a slope), and unsure of when and whether the car would restart - a few attempts were unsuccessful - and equally unclear as to whether I should simply step out onto the road - which I eventually did, briefly - to bypass the car, hoping that neither that car - reversed and stalled on a slope, nor another car - chasing along the road - would put an end to my fleeting existence.

Anyway, apologies, profuse and embarrassed were extended, and my reply - uttered twice before I realised it was out of my mouth and this thread called to mind - was a heartfelt 'no problem'.

"My pleasure" feels overly fawning to me.

I'm inclined to agree with you.

Not many people can pull that sentence off and sound plausible rather than fawning while doing so.
[doublepost=1466621824][/doublepost]

Depends on how it's said. How do you feel about no problem as a reply? To tell a customer, you enjoy serving them is a positive statement, although it could be just one of the nice things said. VS a no problem which is a neutral- slightly negative as if you are being inconvienenced, but can shake it off. Ok, I admit I've beat this horse to death and that many replies are just an acknowledgment without any thought put into it.

I am beginning to suspect that it is a cultural difference between Old and New World English.

To be honest, while I don't work on the service industry (and the service industry in the US can be rather different), I have worked in a lot of international environments, and, either domestically or internationally 'no problem' is quite simply that, a statement that what is being discussed - or requested - or, has arisen - is 'no problem'.

It is not used in a sarcastic or negative sense in Europe.

 

[Macky-Mac]

It is not used in a sarcastic or negative sense in Europe.

no problem is no problem in most places in the US

 

[AlliFlowers]

Absolutely, sir. I'll have your order in shortly.

 

[Huntn]

Absolutely, sir. I'll have your order in shortly.

Superior to no problem.

 

[A.Goldberg]

@Huntn wheb you asked it it was "frowned upon" to hang on the lane line, was that a legitimate question or a hint to tell the lifeguard to get the kids off the lane line? I find my father, in his early 60's, has this tendency to rather than ask "can you clean the pool" will say "the pool is looking pretty dirty" (as a cue for me to agree to clean it).

And yes it's bad to hang on the lane line. They can stretch out and/or break... And they're surrisingly expensive to replace- generally $500-600+ per line.

I wouldn't be surprised if English is evolving. If you listen back to broadcasts from pre-1970's I guess broadcasters have that... Broadcaster Voice.

Maybe it's just my limited exposure, but I've noticed a lot teens these days aren't great with computers. Now that everything has moved to mobile devices, that's where kids are spending much of their time. The digital world when I was a young revolved around an infantile consumer Internet only just beginning to connect people with AOL/AIM, color printers, scanners, digital cameras with floppy disks, CD burners, Napster. Now people are more connected digitally with social media and such. New words and phrases and cultural things like memes and viral videos pop up and spread like wildfire- something that would have taken much longer not long ago.

And maybe some euphemisms are lost with time.

 

[0388631]

I'll admit to using "no problem" and "my bad" without thinking at times. The problem is that I've always catered my spoken and or written English to my audience. If I'm ordering something from the American south, I'm going to turn down the eloquence. Otherwise known as dumbing it down. I've found that if you can sound like the person you're talking to and keep up with them, they feel more connected to you and thus are happier to help you out. I may or may not take on a false accent as well to aid my situation as I see fit.

Though the problem is that English is my third language and I learned English at a British-American run school overseas as a child many, many, many years ago. And the English I learned in the US was different, not because of the decade in time but also because British English isn't spoken like American English. Having a fondness for British programming, one does pick up odd sentence structure over the years.

"What have you in mind?/What do you have in mind?" is one such example. It throws people off. Besides, few people speak in grammatically correct English.

Everything is a ****ing cliche. No problem, circle back, core competency, move the needle, lots of moving parts, scalable, get your ducks in a row, drill down, take it offline, synergy, reach out, low hanging fruit, peel the onion.

These all sound like sexual euphemisms.

"Groovy", "rad" and "tubular" should be brought back!

I recall using "groovy" and "rad" in my youth. I drunkenly said these words once near my wife many years ago and it caused her to laugh. Not at me, but because she didn't think people used those words anymore.

 

[curmudgeonette]

I'm noticing a change in the usage of the past tense of irregular verbs.

For years, the weatherman at one TV station would use the -ed form of a certain word. I can't remember what the word is, but it was used in almost every weather forecast. My preference is to use the shorter form of this word. Hearing the longer form is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I eventually decided this must be a regional thing - I grew up far from where I now live.

Recently, I saw a video segment about the election: The woman, obviously selected for her looks, also used a longer -ed form of a word. Arghh! I wonder if she was eschewing or hadn't been taught the irregular form?

Another TV news usage: The reporters like to say "the defendant pleaded guilty." I'd say "pled guilty." (Wow - the spell checker is rejecting pled!)

 

[0388631]

Speaking of, I'm not sure what's happened with certain British dialects, but what's with the er suffix? Honda has become Honder, Toyota has become Toyoter, carriage has become carriageah (sounds like er). I've only noticed it in new live television in the last 3-4 years.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I'm noticing a change in the usage of the past tense of irregular verbs.

For years, the weatherman at one TV station would use the -ed form of a certain word. I can't remember what the word is, but it was used in almost every weather forecast. My preference is to use the shorter form of this word. Hearing the longer form is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I eventually decided this must be a regional thing - I grew up far from where I now live.

Recently, I saw a video segment about the election: The woman, obviously selected for her looks, also used a longer -ed form of a word. Arghh! I wonder if she was eschewing or hadn't been taught the irregular form?

Another TV news usage: The reporters like to say "the defendant pleaded guilty." I'd say "pled guilty." (Wow - the spell checker is rejecting pled!)

But standard British English uses the 'ed' for most verbs in the past tense. As someone from the UK, the US habit of shortening - or truncating - verbs (removing the 'ed' in the past tense) sets my teeth on edge and - in my teaching days - might have run the risk of unleashing my inner grammar Nazi.

In the UK, it is 'pleaded' not guilty.

Mind you, I once knew a diplomat from our part of the world, who had been accredited to the US, and who subsequently derived a truly sadistic pleasure from penning everything he wrote in US spelling. He claimed it was 'more logical' but his son, whom I knew at university, confessed that he really enjoyed getting up the noses of those whom he saw as stuffy colleagues.

 

[Huntn]

@Huntn wheb you asked it it was "frowned upon" to hang on the lane line, was that a legitimate question or a hint to tell the lifeguard to get the kids off the lane line? I find my father, in his early 60's, has this tendency to rather than ask "can you clean the pool" will say "the pool is looking pretty dirty" (as a cue for me to agree to clean it).

And yes it's bad to hang on the lane line. They can stretch out and/or break... And they're surrisingly expensive to replace- generally $500-600+ per line.

I wouldn't be surprised if English is evolving. If you listen back to broadcasts from pre-1970's I guess broadcasters have that... Broadcaster Voice.

Maybe it's just my limited exposure, but I've noticed a lot teens these days aren't great with computers. Now that everything has moved to mobile devices, that's where kids are spending much of their time. The digital world when I was a young revolved around an infantile consumer Internet only just beginning to connect people with AOL/AIM, color printers, scanners, digital cameras with floppy disks, CD burners, Napster. Now people are more connected digitally with social media and such. New words and phrases and cultural things like memes and viral videos pop up and spread like wildfire- something that would have taken much longer not long ago.

And maybe some euphemisms are lost with time.

To answer your question, the kids who were sitting on the lane dividers had left, so it was asked as a pool policy question. Both times I've seen kids playing in the lap lanes, on the deeper end of the pool, a couple of them end up sitting on the dividers cause I imagine having conversations and not swimming, it's easier than treading water. And both times the guards seemed oblivious to it. The one I asked, told me "the other day one got pulled out of the wall", which I imagine is a pain to repair.

As far as being great with computers, with the goal of the toaster computer, one that takes minimal system knowledge to use such as a tablet or phone, I'd expect overall computer knowledge to be sliding along with the use of what is considered proper English as short-cut phrases seems to be the trend. Of note, both my Aunt and Father (in their 80s) although they both use computers, seem resistant to moving beyond barely able to use it. I'm often fielding questions which seem basic and I'm no programmer.

A couple of decades ago, I was surprised when I heard the question (in Minnesota) Can I go with (you)? where the 'you' was inferred but silent.

 

[A.Goldberg]

To answer your question, the kids who were sitting on the lane dividers had left, so it was asked as a pool policy question. Both times I've seen kids playing in the lap lanes, on the deeper end of the pool, a couple of them end up sitting on the dividers cause I imagine having conversations and not swimming, it's easier than treading water. And both times the guards seemed oblivious to it. The one I asked, told me "the other day one got pulled out of the wall", which I imagine is a pain to repair.

As far as being great with computers, with the goal of the toaster computer, one that takes minimal system knowledge to use such as a tablet or phone, I'd expect overall computer knowledge to be sliding along with the use of what is considered proper English as short-cut phrases seems to be the trend. Of note, both my Aunt and Father (in their 80s) although they both use computers, seem resistant to moving beyond barely able to use it. I'm often fielding questions which seem basic and I'm no programmer.

A couple of decades ago, I was surprised when I heard the question (in Minnesota) Can I go with (you)? where the 'you' was inferred but silent.

As a former lifeguard in my childhood and an avid swimmer of 2-3 decades, I thought that was common kneowledge. Having the anchor tear out of the wall is something you don't want to have to deal with. Clearly, underwater repairs are a big and expensive problem. It sounds to me like the lifeguard isn't doing his job too well- but that's not very surprising. I've had lifeguard leave me in the pool anattended (with and without notification either), talk on their cell phones, and not proficiently scan the pool (particularly infront of their chair which is a blind spot). I can clearly swim proficiently, but in an adult-only lap pool the most common risk is seizure, passing out or shallow water back out. In the few years I lifeguarded 2/3 "saves" I made were adults having seizures.

It's always amazed me how most older folk never caught onto computer... Though I suppose not entirely surprising. Even my parents, both of whom have used personal computers since the early 90's, are pretty bad with tasks outside of their daily routine tasks (email, MS Word banking software-dad and medical records/reference-mom). When I was in 4th grade they started teaching us how to do formulas in Excel. I'm not sure they do that anymore. It's all about the watered down mobile tech. I know there's been a big push to teach programming from a young age, but I'm not sure how well that's taken off in the states.

 

[lightstream1975]

If you want to see what millenial speech looks like, watch the new Voltron series on Netflix. It really captures the modern millennial slang, and I found it both jarring and fascinating.

 

[A.Goldberg]

Depends on how it's said. How do you feel about no problem as a reply? To tell a customer, you enjoy serving them is a positive statement, although it could be just one of the nice things said. VS a no problem which is a neutral- slightly negative as if you are being inconvienenced, but can shake it off. Ok, I admit I've beat this horse to death and that many replies are just an acknowledgment without any thought put into it.

My mother has been one to always go crazy about the semantics of this... Wonder why someone would say "no problem" when it's the responsibility of the person to do the task.

 

[Huntn]

My mother has been one to always go crazy about the semantics of this... Wonder why someone would say "no problem" when it's the responsibility of the person to do the task.

Exactly. Just a little logic applied indicates that if your job is to sell cars, and someone asks can you sell me a car? There are much better, positive answers than the obvious no problem. If someone tells me they'd love to sell me a car this is not fawning or pandering because I sincerely believe they'd love to make a commission.

 

[senseless]

I've noticed "so" starting off responses to questions, in the last few years. Most people don't realize they're doing it.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I've noticed "so" starting off responses to questions, in the last few years. Most people don't realize they're doing it.

Whatever about when it is done orally, - in what is often an unconscious verbal tic on the part of the speaker, when it appears in writing - such as in the sort of lugubrious post on these fora which begins a sorry saga: "So, I spilled a glass of water/wine/beer on my rMB...." then, yes, it can become somewhat irksome.

 

[chown33]

Whatever about when it is done orally, - in what is often an unconscious verbal tic on the part of the speaker, when it appears in writing - such as in the sort of lugubrious post on these fora which begins a sorry saga: "So, I spilled a glass of water/wine/beer on my rMB...." then, yes, it can become somewhat irksome.

Sew, to make clothing.

Sow, to reap later.

So, to be somewhat irksome.

 

[samiwas]

The ones that get to me are using "like" fourteen times in every sentence and ending every sentence with "you know!"

My wife has a friend, probably 30-35 years old, who I referred to as "like girl" before I could remember her name. In all seriousness, she talked like this: "Like, so like, yeah...we were, like, about to head here, and like, Billy got his, like, ball stuck in, like, a tree, and I had to, like, you know, like, get a, like, ladder and, like, climb up and get the, like, ball, before we could, like, leave." My wife was pissed that I told her that, because she had never noticed it before, and now can only hear "like like like like like". It drives me, like, nuts.

What I really can't stand is people saying "hey...language changes all the time" when they are just plain wrong, as if they are somehow blazing new trails in linguistics. if you write "There going to you're house," or "Your going to be their," or "It's to hot" or using an apostrophe in plural words, you are not just furthering language...you are wrong.

 

[chown33]

My wife has a friend, probably 30-35 years old, who I referred to as "like girl" before I could remember her name. In all seriousness, she talked like this: "Like, so like, yeah...we were, like, about to head here, and like, Billy got his, like, ball stuck in, like, a tree, and I had to, like, you know, like, get a, like, ladder and, like, climb up and get the, like, ball, before we could, like, leave." My wife was pissed that I told her that, because she had never noticed it before, and now can only hear "like like like like like". It drives me, like, nuts.

What I really can't stand is people saying "hey...language changes all the time" when they are just plain wrong, as if they are somehow blazing new trails in linguistics. if you write "There going to you're house," or "Your going to be their," or "It's to hot" or using an apostrophe in plural words, you are not just furthering language...you are wrong.

So, I so like this.

 

[satcomer]

To interject some nostalgic conjunctions!

 

[rdowns]

To interject some nostalgic conjunctions!

Conjunction Junction was my jam.

 

[Eldiablojoe]

Whenever someone says, "So...." I can't help but interject before they end the pause with, "A needle pulling thread...!" (A nod to the do-re-mi-fa-so-la-ti song from The Sound Of Music).

I wholeheartedly agree with the pled and pleaded. The word, as I knew it growing up, was "Pled." Pleaded sounds like someone who does not know the past tense of the verb plea (As opposed to the noun).

The other one that I hear often that makes me cringe is "Often." I was taught and raised to pronounce the word with a silent "T." When I hear the "T" pronounced, I immediately judge the utterer ignorant. To me it is the same thing when people actually pronounce the last letter in the proper noun, "Illinois."

I do not know if it is generational or regional, the pronunciation difference between "Rout" and "Root" for the word "Route." Paper route, Route 66, et cetera. I was taught the "Rout" pronunciation.

You know who says the phrase, "My pleasure." ad nauseum? Every employee of Chick-fil-A.