Exactly. I have the intel X25-M (80 GB) in one of the early C2D macbooks and I can tell you that it will outperform (boot time, application launch time, most normal work) any of those new MBPros (certainly those with normal disks, and I would not be surprised if also those with the Apple-supplied SSDs). The Intel SSDs are probably the fastest on the market. You can get a 160 GB Intel X25-M for something like 330 EUR in Europe (without VAT which you guys in US are not paying). If you need even faster drive (faster write speed and more write cycles), get the Intel X25-E.
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Inside Apple's New MacBook Pro
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Exactly. I have the intel X25-M (80 GB) in one of the early C2D macbooks and I can tell you that it will outperform (boot time, application launch time, most normal work) any of those new MBPros (certainly those with normal disks, and I would not be surprised if also those with the Apple-supplied SSDs). The Intel SSDs are probably the fastest on the market. You can get a 160 GB Intel X25-M for something like 330 EUR in Europe (without VAT which you guys in US are not paying). If you need even faster drive (faster write speed and more write cycles), get the Intel X25-E.
I agree with Zadillo. Part of being a Mac user is getting to use only the hardware and software that has been given their blessing from The Jobs.
If I was looking to buy one of these I'd be less annoyed by the specs than the price increase. Lots of people were saying prior to the update that the MBPs were outdated and couldn't justify the price, yet the update still hasn't made them what I'd call cutting edge and they have actually increased the price! I'd say the prices only seem reasonable if you are able to get HE discount.
I'm definitely skipping this update seeing as they will probably update them again in October/November. Like some people have said, they really need Blu-ray and some SSD options as standard.
I'm definitely skipping this update seeing as they will probably update them again in October/November. Like some people have said, they really need Blu-ray and some SSD options as standard.
Sony's comparable Vaio, the Z, is around the same general price as these MBP's. For whatever reason Sony doesn't actually seem to make a comparable 15" laptop though, so the Z is lighter and has a 13" screen. But I would disagree with your notion that the competition has similar systems for much lower prices.
Sony's comparable larger machines like the F11 series are nice from a spec perspective, but also very large, thick and heavy - and the screen quality is average, generally, from the ones I've seen (including my brother's).
The most obviously direct comparison is the HP Envy, and I will admit that you can get it a bit cheaper (and it has a wider variety of configuration options, of course). But it also has its share of issues and problems and has been a pretty poor seller. The biggest issue I'd have with the HP Envy 15 is the terrible trackpad and the terrible ~2 hour battery life. Supposedly it also has some terrible heat issues.
I'd disagree with your point about the MacBook Air - what would you propose upgrading it with right now? Intel doesn't have a newer CULV CPU that it could be upgraded with. Maybe Apple could have updated the integrated graphics to be the same GT320M part, but that's all I can think of.
WHat are you talking about here.
So in the end you demonstrate a little rational thought, so why did you put all of us through this BS? The 13" got a significant update it really isn't that bad of a machine and like most Apple products is well built. Many people including myself speculated weeks ago that Apple might have to stay with Core 2 on many of it's machines, it doesn't take rocket science to see where Intel is at the moment. Besides on the 13" machine the processor just isn't that important.
Dave
Obviously you are not.
The problem is you don't have a clue. For one thing you are assuming Intel can ship processors in the volume Apple needs. On top of that the 13" MBP has always been a machine designed for users outside the power user realm. Think about it it is a 13" machine sold to people (students are big here) who need long battery life more than anything else.
Yes for many that makes the 13" MBP a much better value as they are getting a significant performance boost while at the same time getting extended battery life.
Actually I was hoping for a more radical update myself. However I did not expect "I" series processors on all the machines as you can't ship what isn't available. Your attitude is a strong reflection upon your understanding of industry, Apple can't hope that Intels production issues will go away. Rather it needs RELIABLE mass production quanities. Apples recent issues with the iMac are prime examples of pushing a little to hard and ending up with production problems and un happy customers.
I think you need to run a business for awhile yourself. Frankly you don't know what you are talking about.
So in the end you demonstrate a little rational thought, so why did you put all of us through this BS? The 13" got a significant update it really isn't that bad of a machine and like most Apple products is well built. Many people including myself speculated weeks ago that Apple might have to stay with Core 2 on many of it's machines, it doesn't take rocket science to see where Intel is at the moment. Besides on the 13" machine the processor just isn't that important.
Dave
Great, now i gotta save up even more money. The only thing i'm kinda pissed about is the 5400rpm HDD across the line. 15 and 17" should come stock with 7200rpm drives at the least. Ohh well, i'm still happy. MBP 15 here i come!
The only model to get a price increase is the base model 15", and that is because the base model now gets a dedicated GPU to go along with the integrated graphics. I guess it would have been nice if they could have done this and still kept the price the same, but if I were in the market for the base model, I would be glad to know I was getting the benefits of a dedicated graphics option without having to buy the higher end 15" MBP just to get them.
Finally getting my first MBP
Well people
I am happy with this. I for one shall be buying a new MBP 13" one. This is my current machine: mac mini late 2006 model, 1.83Ghz intel core duo and 1GB mem, and 80GIG HD. So I am pretty sure this will be a nice upgrade for me. lol anyone agree?
Well people
I am happy with this. I for one shall be buying a new MBP 13" one. This is my current machine: mac mini late 2006 model, 1.83Ghz intel core duo and 1GB mem, and 80GIG HD. So I am pretty sure this will be a nice upgrade for me. lol anyone agree?
C2D vs i3
Interesting, could you please explain? I remember reading somewhere that they were even considering rebranding some of the penryn based chips to i3.
Interesting, could you please explain? I remember reading somewhere that they were even considering rebranding some of the penryn based chips to i3.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834114803
Less than the MacBook price wise but more powerful than the top end MacBook Pro.
Less than the MacBook price wise but more powerful than the top end MacBook Pro.
Obviously you are not.
wow you are witty
The problem is you don't have a clue. For one thing you are assuming Intel can ship processors in the volume Apple needs. On top of that the 13" MBP has always been a machine designed for users outside the power user realm. Think about it it is a 13" machine sold to people (students are big here) who need long battery life more than anything else.
i have provided a link that says an asus laptop with i3 and DISCRETE 310GT is running 8.5hr battery life on the maximum IN REAL WORLD TESTING. Again, Asus still uses cylindrical batteries so if it's the same case in an apple laptop, i have no doubt in my mind it can be extended to 9 or 10. don't throw battery life when obviously you haven't done your research. And i'm sorry, these were delayed for a good three-four months because of supply issues. seeing how none of the other apple laptops use the i3, it's hard for me to fathom that supply is the real question here unless you're an insider at intel.
Yes for many that makes the 13" MBP a much better value as they are getting a significant performance boost while at the same time getting extended battery life.
Again, significant performance boost... in graphics. but the geforce 310 discrete carries almost similar performance, apple just needed to redesign the logic board
Actually I was hoping for a more radical update myself. However I did not expect "I" series processors on all the machines as you can't ship what isn't available. Your attitude is a strong reflection upon your understanding of industry, Apple can't hope that Intels production issues will go away. Rather it needs RELIABLE mass production quanities. Apples recent issues with the iMac are prime examples of pushing a little to hard and ending up with production problems and un happy customers.
Again, I addressed supply issues and AGAIN it was delayed for supply issues and AGAIN apple's 13" would be the only laptop in APPLE'S LINEUP that uses an i3.
I think you need to run a business for awhile yourself. Frankly you don't know what you are talking about.
I don't think you know what you're talking about, but yet these aren't arguments. the only real argument you put out is supply, which I'm 90% sure isn't the case. The case ist he logic board, us more logical people got it down pat.
So in the end you demonstrate a little rational thought, so why did you put all of us through this BS? The 13" got a significant update it really isn't that bad of a machine and like most Apple products is well built. Many people including myself speculated weeks ago that Apple might have to stay with Core 2 on many of it's machines, it doesn't take rocket science to see where Intel is at the moment. Besides on the 13" machine the processor just isn't that important.
i think you're a joke, but i don't want to be rude. In your case you think a unibody laptop can build enough of a case that it can offset a chipset that's two years old. the only different isn't speed, there's also power efficiencies in those two years. The processor is always important. And where is intel at this moment? Care to tell us? The only argument you've made is "Oh supply issues dumbass" please care to link me to these sources that says i3 is severely undersupplied when compared to the i5 and the i7
wow you are witty
The problem is you don't have a clue. For one thing you are assuming Intel can ship processors in the volume Apple needs. On top of that the 13" MBP has always been a machine designed for users outside the power user realm. Think about it it is a 13" machine sold to people (students are big here) who need long battery life more than anything else.
i have provided a link that says an asus laptop with i3 and DISCRETE 310GT is running 8.5hr battery life on the maximum IN REAL WORLD TESTING. Again, Asus still uses cylindrical batteries so if it's the same case in an apple laptop, i have no doubt in my mind it can be extended to 9 or 10. don't throw battery life when obviously you haven't done your research. And i'm sorry, these were delayed for a good three-four months because of supply issues. seeing how none of the other apple laptops use the i3, it's hard for me to fathom that supply is the real question here unless you're an insider at intel.
Yes for many that makes the 13" MBP a much better value as they are getting a significant performance boost while at the same time getting extended battery life.
Again, significant performance boost... in graphics. but the geforce 310 discrete carries almost similar performance, apple just needed to redesign the logic board
Actually I was hoping for a more radical update myself. However I did not expect "I" series processors on all the machines as you can't ship what isn't available. Your attitude is a strong reflection upon your understanding of industry, Apple can't hope that Intels production issues will go away. Rather it needs RELIABLE mass production quanities. Apples recent issues with the iMac are prime examples of pushing a little to hard and ending up with production problems and un happy customers.
Again, I addressed supply issues and AGAIN it was delayed for supply issues and AGAIN apple's 13" would be the only laptop in APPLE'S LINEUP that uses an i3.
I think you need to run a business for awhile yourself. Frankly you don't know what you are talking about.
I don't think you know what you're talking about, but yet these aren't arguments. the only real argument you put out is supply, which I'm 90% sure isn't the case. The case ist he logic board, us more logical people got it down pat.
So in the end you demonstrate a little rational thought, so why did you put all of us through this BS? The 13" got a significant update it really isn't that bad of a machine and like most Apple products is well built. Many people including myself speculated weeks ago that Apple might have to stay with Core 2 on many of it's machines, it doesn't take rocket science to see where Intel is at the moment. Besides on the 13" machine the processor just isn't that important.
i think you're a joke, but i don't want to be rude. In your case you think a unibody laptop can build enough of a case that it can offset a chipset that's two years old. the only different isn't speed, there's also power efficiencies in those two years. The processor is always important. And where is intel at this moment? Care to tell us? The only argument you've made is "Oh supply issues dumbass" please care to link me to these sources that says i3 is severely undersupplied when compared to the i5 and the i7
It's also a typical piece of Toshiba plastic garbage, weights almost 7 pounds, is over 1.5" thick, has about a third of the battery life, at best.
Seriously, is this some revelation to you? If you do not care about a lot of these things, you can get some great low prices on machines with very high specs.
Check out the HP Envy 15 if you want to see what happens when you make a thin 15" machine with a quad core i7 - you end up with a machine with pretty abysmal battery life and an enormous heat problem.
We could play this game all day, frankly. It's always been possible to pick out specs and say "But look at this laptop - it has the same or better specs, and costs half as much". But people do ignore build quality, screen quality, battery life, etc. when making these comparisons. There are almost always tradeoffs with laptops.
I'm not saying that the MBP is perfect, or that there aren't some really nice PC alternatives (but I would point to Asus and Sony as companies that make nice alternatives, not crap like Toshiba or the flawed HP Envy). But it's important to look at the whole picture.
Well people
I am happy with this. I for one shall be buying a new MBP 13" one. This is my current machine: mac mini late 2006 model, 1.83Ghz intel core duo and 1GB mem, and 80GIG HD. So I am pretty sure this will be a nice upgrade for me. lol anyone agree?
Absolutely, you're gonna feel a big difference already
The previous 15" matte also had a silver bezel - it's similar to the Macbook Air in appearance (though I think the MBA bezel is slightly wider relative to the screen than the MBP). Older MBPs also had a silver bezel. Why they didn't choose black, no idea.
As for colour and glare, the best is to visit an Apple Store if you have one nearby and look at them side-by-side. Photos can easily show the differences in reflectivity, but judging colour reproduction and sharpness that way will be trickier.
For reflections, a quick web search will turn up comparisons such as this one:
http://www.strongmocha.com/2009/07/07/apple-macbook-pro-glare-glossy-vs-non-glare-matte/
which I think is using a pair of 17" to illustrate the differences.
Whether it matters depends on how and where you use it - I often have windows or lights behind me, and glossy+glassy doesn't work for me, but I know plenty of people who are equally strong in preferring the gloss screen.
This will be my first mac!
I called an apple store about my configuration, but they lied over the phone saying it was available in store. I guess they do to not yet understand the concept of the "hi resolution glossy option". I was hoping for the 15" i7 with hi-res glossy display option.
Of course now I learned from a more knowledgeable apple store that the hi-res glossy option is only available online
I called an apple store about my configuration, but they lied over the phone saying it was available in store. I guess they do to not yet understand the concept of the "hi resolution glossy option". I was hoping for the 15" i7 with hi-res glossy display option.
Of course now I learned from a more knowledgeable apple store that the hi-res glossy option is only available online
Here are some guesses if you will.
I'm not privy to Apples internal decision making but can offer up the following possibilities:
Frankly this doesn't surprise mecat all. The new 13"MBP is a very good value.
Dave
I'm not privy to Apples internal decision making but can offer up the following possibilities:
- Core 2 is actually available in shipping quanities.
- I3 comes with horrible Intel integrated graphics! Since the 13" machine hasn't supported discrete graphics an I3 based machine would be an overall worst performer.
- Even worst is that Intels support of OpenCL sucks and the performance regressions would be worst than some could imagine.
- I3 and the I series in general benchmark well but for many user apps you willl never see the performance talked about. It all depends upon where your code executes in the processor, that is some sections of the new processor have improved more than others.
- Beyound OpenCL Apple uses the GPU heavily in Quartz and other parts of the system, an i86 processor simply can't accelerate graphics like a GPU can. In otherwords the included GPU is very important to the feel of a Mac and it's interface. While the Intel integrated graphics might do well for these 2D needs, going this route gives Apple at least 2X more in the way of GPU performance. 2X is very conservative here too.
- Finally it isn't like the processor isn't getting a speed boost as it is. So overall Apple is delivering far better performance than they could of with an all Intel solution
Frankly this doesn't surprise mecat all. The new 13"MBP is a very good value.
Dave
New ones look nice, wish I could have waited a year and gotten the new generation 17".
My HAL will stand up pretty nicely for a while, that's what you get with Apple, good quality products that last longer than industry "standards".
My HAL will stand up pretty nicely for a while, that's what you get with Apple, good quality products that last longer than industry "standards".
After lurking on here for close to six months I have finally decided to register.
Originally saving for the 17" MBP until the refresh rumours appeared and decided to wait and see what was going to be on offer.
Finally decided on, and placed my order for:
15" 2.66 Ghz i7
500gb 7200rpm
Hi-res anti-glare screen
I will look to upgrade to 8Gb of ram from another source. This is my first Apple and can't wait to get started with it, really looking forward to using OS X.
Next up the 27" iMac
Originally saving for the 17" MBP until the refresh rumours appeared and decided to wait and see what was going to be on offer.
Finally decided on, and placed my order for:
15" 2.66 Ghz i7
500gb 7200rpm
Hi-res anti-glare screen
I will look to upgrade to 8Gb of ram from another source. This is my first Apple and can't wait to get started with it, really looking forward to using OS X.
Next up the 27" iMac
Is this a new thing???
From Apple Store:
The antiglare display has a silver frame (border) around the display.
From Apple Store:
The antiglare display has a silver frame (border) around the display.
Absolutely, you're gonna feel a big difference already
hehe thanks. Now I am trying to sell my mac mini. Mac2sell suggesting a price of £150 so have put it up for sale.
No thats not new. And thats why I'll always like the antiglare better. Just looks so much more sleek.
Hmm, ok. Does anyone have a photo they can link me to to see what it looks like? It would be cool to have the silver border because I think it would make the MBP look more unique.