Inside Apple's Retail Store Operation

[something3153]

Yeah, that *must* be it.

They're all brainwashed. There's cheaper options out there, but they've chosen the Apple way, and they keep doing it for some mysterious, inexplicable reason. They've just got to be crazy.

It isn't because Apple's nailed the principles and practice of effective retail. No, that can't be it. It's because they're being controlled.

LOL that's ****in gold, man. Just gold.

All you're doing is supporting my point, you know.

 

[un.titled]

The only thing I hate when I go to the store, come on Apple you do so many things well, this part makes no sense. Maybe they will change this policy.

It's the typical "If customers do not purchase such item, then they didn't receive enough information on it".

It's an archaic kool-aid stand that still exists in most retail stores.

 

[kiljoy616]

Who cares if they "hate" you. Go in, buy, and leave.

The gods favor the bold.
- Ovid

The bold die you and horrible deaths.
- Me

 

[ikir]

I'm aware what you were talking about. My point is, Apple is also perfectly happy to sell machines at new prices with year-old (or more) processors and graphics cards. Pointing out Windows machines with old specs isn't really a selling point for a Mac. C2D for sale in 2011, anyone?

rarely cpu are 100% used. I'm not referring to a specific Mac, it could be last MBP model for example. You probably think they were C2D in 2011!! OMG! But with unibody, firewire, compact enclosure, led, wifi N, great OS, great software included, multitouch, SDHC, optical audio, magsafe, MiniDiplay port over fullHD res... so the fault was/is your considering a machine only for CPU and Ram.

Also most Macs at refresh use latest cpu, sometimes before PC market.

If you ask me, white MacBook are expensive and outdated, but for a normal users are incredible machines, with good specs with a fast and secure OS, better than trash notebooks you pay less and you have thousands problems. I would not buy one now, but it doesn't mean their value aren't right. IT JUST WORKS, don't care too much for specs neither if they are new or old, consumer experience is the choice.

 

[WhySoSerious]

Ok, so if you are an Apple salesman and sell their hardware (computers, ipads, iphones) and you are graded on your attachment rate, but do NOT work on commision.....then say your attachement rate is really low and the manager moves you to a new area to sell only headphones and cases....who cares? You weren't working on commission anyway, right? So what's the incentive to be a hardware salesman vs a headphone/case salesman vs software salesman? If no one gets commission, and you're all paid the same hourly, then I sure as hell would rather just sell headphones than deal with the issues of selling computers.

 

[aristotle]

Unfortunately in Canada the little paper slip always seems to arrive in the mid-afternoon. And I can't deliver personal packages to my workplace. Definitely tried, definitely was reprimanded for it.

Wow, really? I get packages delivered to work all the time and so do my colleagues. Sometimes it is something I ordered from an online store and sometimes it is something from our rewards program catalogue. We also get some free trade magazines delivered as well.

Of course, for personal packages, everyone keeps it within reason to a size than anyone can carry. When the package arrives, I get an email from reception and go pick it up.

 

[aristobrat]

Having a brainwashed customer base that is willing to spend ludicrous amounts of money without considering other options helps a lot.

Over 50% of Mac purchases in the Apple Stores are made by current PC-owners, buying their first Mac.

Ok, so if you are an Apple salesman and sell their hardware (computers, ipads, iphones) and you are graded on your attachment rate, but do NOT work on commision.....then say your attachement rate is really low and the manager moves you to a new area to sell only headphones and cases....who cares? You weren't working on commission anyway, right? So what's the incentive to be a hardware salesman vs a headphone/case salesman vs software salesman? If no one gets commission, and you're all paid the same hourly, then I sure as hell would rather just sell headphones than deal with the issues of selling computers.

My experience from working there is that they don't move you to another area of the store, they move you off of the schedule. ie. the best/most hours go to the highest performers There was no "headphone" or "software" sales person. You're in sales (everything), or you're off the floor.

Having said that, where I worked, metrics weren't everything. We had several folks with less than stellar metrics that were "saved" by consistently being rated 9 or 10s by customers that filled out those web-based "how was your trip to the Apple Store" emails.

 

[NAG]

Fine, go into your local Apple store and tell them you have $400 to buy a laptop. See what they tell you. You're confused what my opinion was.

This refutes my opinion that most people have insane expectations how? But I guess you're right. People really love those cheap netbooks. I mean it isn't like netbook share is tanking...oh wait...it is.

Okay, lets go ahead and play your game that price point is the most important thing about a computer and that what they're actually doing with it is irrelevant. Are you arguing that the $400 Windows laptop from Best Buy or whatnot is somehow significantly different than buying a used, $400 Mac laptop? Are you living in a world where the specs of this $400 laptop are somehow current? Please. I'd like to think you're smarter than this. Come up with some new points or at least some data to back up your claims. Your boring.

[...]MAC[...]

Pst, when you're trolling you might want to lose those tells. It subtracts from the overall experience.

I'm aware what you were talking about. My point is, Apple is also perfectly happy to sell machines at new prices with year-old (or more) processors and graphics cards. Pointing out Windows machines with old specs isn't really a selling point for a Mac. C2D for sale in 2011, anyone?

I beg to differ. Part of the argument they were using against the mac was that she wanted top of the line specs, i.e. not out of date. She then flips around and buys out of date hardware that doesn't match her ultraportable needs. In other words, how does this not support my case that most people have zero clue about what specs they actually need? Turning it around and saying Macbook Airs still use Core 2 Duos somehow makes her logic to go and get a laptop that clearly did not fit the list she was shopping for when she claimed to look at Macs doesn't work because it only further illustrates how there are two standards here.

 

[Digital Skunk]

At the Genius bar the first 3 years at Apple I saw mostly computer users and switchers. My last 2 years at Apple I saw mostly iPod and iPhone users. The computer users couldn't get appointments so management usually would just fast track the machine. Not good service since fast track meant that the client wouldn't get the basic troubleshooting done.

Not to mention they won't know when their repair would be done of if it would cost them to get it fixed.

I think you need to go back and read the beginning of the conversation. I don't understand how these are advantages to a dell over a mac? The premise of my point was, aside from price, I personally wouldn't recommend a Dell if I was an Apple employee. I don't know what tangent you're going off on.

No, I think we all need to stay on topic. I never said you were wrong about that, I actually said you were doing fine up to that point. The point where you mentioned:

"I didn't say that, but aside from price (which is what I mentioned), why would you buy a Dell instead? I enjoy the flexibility of running two OS's."

Is were you made a small mistake. Price isn't the only thing that a Dell is good for. Take or leave the quality issues Dell's have, and personal feeling for Windows and Mac OSX. That statement is just wrong. As was the statement that no one needing Mac OSX would ever be in an Apple store.

You are 100% correct about much everything else, and I agree, that $400 isn't going to get you much of a computer, Mac or Windows PC.

 

[MacMan86]

Ok, so if you are an Apple salesman and sell their hardware (computers, ipads, iphones) and you are graded on your attachment rate, but do NOT work on commision.....then say your attachement rate is really low and the manager moves you to a new area to sell only headphones and cases....who cares? You weren't working on commission anyway, right? So what's the incentive to be a hardware salesman vs a headphone/case salesman vs software salesman? If no one gets commission, and you're all paid the same hourly, then I sure as hell would rather just sell headphones than deal with the issues of selling computers.

Asides from the fact that working in accessories is generally dull (a lot of your time is spent on replenishment and putting products back in their packaging because customers tend to rip everything open just to have a look...) if you want to get promoted to the Expert position (salaried, benefits etc.) you need to have good attachment rates (they're not as high as you might think).

If you have no interest in progressing (earning more money) or getting a raise (earning more money) then you are correct, there is no incentive.

 

[un.titled]

This refutes my opinion that most people have insane expectations how? But I guess you're right. People really love those cheap netbooks. I mean it isn't like netbook share is tanking...oh wait...it is.

Okay, lets go ahead and play your game that price point is the most important thing about a computer and that what they're actually doing with it is irrelevant. Are you arguing that the $400 Windows laptop from Best Buy or whatnot is somehow significantly different than buying a used, $400 Mac laptop? Are you living in a world where the specs of this $400 laptop are somehow current? Please. I'd like to think you're smarter than this. Come up with some new points or at least some data to back up your claims. Your boring.

I figured you wouldn't have any substance, considering you've confused my opinion every chance you were given.

Pst, when you're trolling you might want to lose those tells. It subtracts from the overall experience.

MAC instead of Mac, I must be an 3vil PC user!

 

[kiljoy616]

When you can install Windows on a Mac, there is no reason to buy a Dell other than price. The only way I would recommend a Dell, if I was an Apple employee, would be if the customer walked in with $400 in their pocket expecting to pick up a computer.

Ah lets get out the story of Dell, my favorite one of IT war stories.

Got a batch of Dell's about 200 where I use to work. Medical Lab company and we where having problems with failures. These where new Dells but they where on Lease rather than bought out rite. So we had a meeting of the minds at our department because something was up. The decision was made to open all Dells before going out, what we found was that about 1/3 of them had refurbish equipment inside of them. I like to believe that is old story for Dell but when you push sales to the lowers common denominator something has to give.

We moved away from dell a few months later and started using HP, better no but at least those had no refurbished equipment inside a new shiny box.

Mostly it was Memory and HD that where refurbished. To bad we could not go with Apple products but back then Apple was just not taken serious in the IT world. Kind of strange since I have always considered MS Windows to be a toy OS, more for Gamers.

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

Not to mention they won't know when their repair would be done of if it would cost them to get it fixed.

Totally. I know you know all about this stuff! Quick drop to me was one of the biggest shams and disservices to a customer ever. It basically told the customer they weren't as important as the iPhone people and we would get to it whenever we could. Most quick drops turned into NTF's which later led to angry customers which later turned into a CRU which basically means we lost money in order to appease iPhone users.

 

[Sodner]

My experiences both browsing and purchasing at all 3 of my local Apple stores have been, mostly positive. They do greet you every time I go in but the typical "I'm just looking" comment sends them away.

When a bought my iMac a few weeks ago I did want Apple Care so there was no need to pressure me for that but like someone else said, even though I knew and stated exactly the model and options I wanted on my iMac, the "specialist" seemed to want to go through the typical sales pitch to determine my true needs. I had to cut him off a few times before he gave in and went and got my giant white box.

My biggest problem is normally getting someone to ring me up when I'm picking up something small like ear buds, or a case. Mostly the folks in blue are busy selling or in a crowd talking to each other.

 

[lilo777]

Unfortu... Sorry. As it turns out, some members of this forum were indoctrinated by Apple and now are trying to do the same to others here. Remember, indoctrination of employees is not the only kind of indoctrination employed by Apple. They saturate airwaves with "think different" and "feel good" commercials to achieve the same effect on regular folks.

 

[Aduntu]

oh my god, are you actually serious? you're saying that it's MY fault that i say "no" in the wrong way/tone?

that sounds familiar....to rape victims. "hey darlin', i know you said NO to the attacker, but, you know...you really said it in the wrong tone and it's your fault. please re-evaluate how you communicate next time you're attacked".

Aduntu.....no, means no. period.

I'm not going to pay attention to that absurd analogy.

The fact is, if you cannot convey to a salesman that you aren't interested when you say no to an offer, and they continue to offer, you're doing one of two things wrong. You're either not effectively communicating your position or you're doing yourself a disservice by allowing him to continue ignoring your responses. Your two solutions are to make yourself clear, or walk away.

 

[un.titled]

Price isn't the only thing that a Dell is good for.

I agree. I might have been a little short-sighted.

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

Unfortu... Sorry. As it turns out, some members of this forum were indoctrinated by Apple and now are trying to do the same to others here. Remember, indoctrination of employees is not the only kind of indoctrination employed by Apple. They saturate airwaves with "think different" and "feel good" commercials to achieve the same effect on regular folks.

You're only saying that because you are a M$/Nokia employee paid to tarnish Apples name on message boards.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Totally. I know you know all about this stuff! Quick drop to me was one of the biggest shams and disservices to a customer ever. It basically told the customer they weren't as important as the iPhone people and we would get to it whenever we could. Most quick drops turned into NTF's which later led to angry customers which later turned into a CRU which basically means we lost money in order to appease iPhone users.

Hmm, Memories! CRUing a computer was just about the only way to appease a business customer that was out of a laptop for two weeks because of misc. junk repairs.

I remembering telling the bar that my top case was broken (trackpad) and that it'd be nice if I could just quick drop it and get it back in a few days.

NOPE!

I saw the guy NOT listen to me and not put in the concierge system that it was a trackpad issue. 10 days later they call me up and tell me what I already knew, not that they fixed it or anything. They called to verify that is was a top case issue.

6 days later I had to call them and chew them out about a two week long repair that should've only been 10 minutes.

Sadly I knew everyone in the bar and the genius admin that I chewed out.

I agree. I might have been a little short-sighted.

Not a problem, it happens on these forums.

It's hard to keep track of EVERYTHING that EVERYONE says. Especially when 6 or 7 people want to take a stab at someone.

I usually try to keep my head down.

 

[something3153]

rarely cpu are 100% used. I'm not referring to a specific Mac, it could be last MBP model for example. You probably think they were C2D in 2011!! OMG! But with unibody, firewire, compact enclosure, led, wifi N, great OS, great software included, multitouch, SDHC, optical audio, magsafe, MiniDiplay port over fullHD res... so the fault was/is your considering a machine only for CPU and Ram.

Also most Macs at refresh use latest cpu, sometimes before PC market.

If you ask me, white MacBook are expensive and outdated, but for a normal users are incredible machines, with good specs with a fast and secure OS, better than trash notebooks you pay less and you have thousands problems. I would not buy one now, but it doesn't mean their value aren't right. IT JUST WORKS, don't care too much for specs neither if they are new or old, consumer experience is the choice.

Hey, I wasn't the one who brought up old hardware. Lets go through your list:

Unibody - Eh. My 8440p is built like a slab of rock, and doesn't dent.
Firewire - Less than eh. Have it, have never used it once.
Compact Enclosure: Yup, got it. Thinner bezel than a Mac laptop, actually.
LED - would be nice, not necessary.
Wifi N - Yup.
Great OS - I love Ubuntu. Check.
Great software included - See above.
Multitouch - I'll give you here I'd like a bigger trackpad. This is the one real point you have.
SDHC - got it.
Optical audio - never used once
Magsafe - Cute, but I'm not so clumsy as to have ever needed it.
MDP - Yay, so I can plug into an Apple display. Or I can buy an adapter to plug it into just about anything else. HDMI + VGA means I don't need adapters for anything I plug into.

Your list of advantages winds up looking awfully thin. Also, by the way, I have never had a problem with this laptop, which is more than I can say for many people with their Macbooks. 9400m, anyone?

 

[Jayomat]

Unfortu... Sorry. As it turns out, some members of this forum were indoctrinated by Apple and now are trying to do the same to others here. Remember, indoctrination of employees is not the only kind of indoctrination employed by Apple. They saturate airwaves with "think different" and "feel good" commercials to achieve the same effect on regular folks.

as does every other company in the world? who sells products with "feel bad" commercials except the healthcare/donation business?

 

[WhySoSerious]

I'm not going to pay attention to that absurd analogy.

The fact is, if you cannot convey to a salesman that you aren't interested when you say no to an offer, and they continue to offer, you're doing one of two things wrong. You're either not effectively communicating your position or you're doing yourself a disservice by allowing him to continue ignoring your responses. Your two solutions are to make yourself clear, or walk away.

no means no bro....what don't you understand?

 

[Slurpy2k8]

Making large sums of money means you're good at making large sums of money, not that your customer service is great. Having a brainwashed customer base that is willing to spend ludicrous amounts of money without considering other options helps a lot. But wrap yourself up in that nice warm blanket of assuming Apple is the best at everything. I know you will.

Funny, out of the dozens of people I know who own macs not a single one didn't 'consider other options' before purchasing one. All of them owned a PC or previous PCs beforehand. Not a single one of these people I know are 'Apple fanatics'- they couldn't give 2 ***** about the welfare of the company itself, moreso than any other company from which they own products, yet they chose to buy an Apple product based on various factors. That makes them 'brainwashed'? Really? Does Apple engage in black magic and magically makes people from all walks of life suddenly irrational and hypnotized? Sure, why not. And somehow, they don't have buyers remorse after buying these products in a drugged/brainwashed state, and paying 'ludicrous' amounts of money for them, because these products then go on to have the highest customer satisfaction rates in the industry. Sure, Apple 'fanboys' do exist, but they make up a statistically insignificant percentage of the population. Just like fanboys of any other company.

Keep twisting your head in knots coming up with delusional and insane explanations on why people chose to purchase Apple products, instead of obvious and rational explanation. Also, 'ludicrously priced'? You're still using that ridiculous and debunked argument? Tell me, how do you determine if something is 'ludicrously' priced? Usually the market decides, and it seems most people don't agree with you, because something that is 'ludicrously priced' doesn't generate record-breaking sales. I'm sure more companies wished they had 'ludicrously priced' items they couldn't keep on shelves. Keep hating and trolling Apple on messageboards, meanwhile, they're raking in the dough and hundreds of millions of people are enjoying their products.

 

[frjonah]

Who cares if they "hate" you. Go in, buy, and leave.

On the other hand, we shouldn't "reward" bad customer service with a sale (or, at the very least, we should withhold repeat business) or we reinforce the faulty sales technique. It's like giving a horrible waiter/waitress a 30% tip... why should they change if things are working so well "as is"?

In this case, though, it's a conundrum in that if you have a problem with Apple's approach, there's no way to acquire their hardware without supporting them on some level... buying from a reseller, though, would reduce their margins somewhat. At the end of the logic, though, stands the sad fact that Apple is pretty much the only game in town when it comes to reliable, elegantly constructed, easy to use computers... maybe MS will change that with the new Windows (they def. improved somewhat with Win 7), but as of now, I don't consider there to be a serious alternative to Apple.

Concerning retail, I personally have had MUCH better experiences in Apple Stores than I have in reseller stores such as Be(a)st Buy, from which I will never purchase even so much as a piece of bubble gum. As cool as the atmosphere is at Apple Stores, though, I've never really been totally blown away... it's hard to get the attention of the staff, there always seems to be a line of totally relaxed people playing with the hardware I want to try out and the few times I have had an issue, they were not able to help in the least.

Solution (as others have said): shop online.

 

[*LTD*]

Unfortu... Sorry. As it turns out, some members of this forum were indoctrinated by Apple and now are trying to do the same to others here. Remember, indoctrination of employees is not the only kind of indoctrination employed by Apple. They saturate airwaves with "think different" and "feel good" commercials to achieve the same effect on regular folks.

Yes, the mass-brainwashing we keep hearing about. Zombie-cosumers that can't think for themselves (aren't these usually your average Windows users??) but have a lot of money, many of whom are probably in professions and/or probably have a decent education. They probably work hard in their careers, but are also brainwashed. Right.

Apple puts out commercials like anyone else. They have slogans just like everyone else.

The difference is, they have a suite of incredibly strong products, and they have a tradition of strong products that tend to shape industry direction and society's ideas about tech. They differentiate themselves from everyone else, when no one else can really manage that level of differentiation. The fact that their success contrasts so starkly with the rest of the industry isn't due to brainwashing or any other nonsense. It's because they are *intense* in everything they do. Their attention to detail is insane. Sometimes it gets them in to trouble, but most of the time - when combined with risk-taking - results in game-changing products.

It isn't mind-control writ large. It's actually giving a damn about what you put your name to as an organization. This will obviously pay off, and it is.