Intel Begins Shipping First Kaby Lake Processors, but Most Macs Won't Get Them Until 2017

[OldSchoolMacGuy]

You guys at macrumours assume that Apple is going to release any new macs until next year...
[doublepost=1469124662][/doublepost]

Because nothing says 'happy camper' quite like a completely outdated set of computers with the exception of the retina macbook

https://buyersguide.macrumors.com//#Mac

And yet, they're selling just fine.

People here need to realize that MacRumors members are the MINORITY. The average Apple user isn't on rumor sites or discussing the specs and releases of the newest Macs. The average user simply buys a computer to do basic stuff and as long as it does that they don't care about the rest.

That's why Apple has no issue selling what they do. 99% of their buyers don't care about the things people care about here. Having the latest process or one 2 generations old doesn't matter to them as long as they can get online, do some email and word processing and that's about it.

 

[melendezest]

Apple never had a real Pro line, just a Pro line name to make consumers feel "Pro". At core components they were always behind, except for few small consumer interfaces. Real Pros do not use Apple. You won't see any engineers building the next Boing Airplane or BMW Car or next Space Station or an Sky Skaper on Apple devices. Not even the milling machines they use are controlled by Apple devices, they are controlled by Windows boxes.

Apple is pure consumer oriented. Spec wise their pro "line" is a joke.

There are plenty of pros that use Macs, so there's no way you can make that assessment factually.

It's known that the creative art industries (film, music at least) use Macs extensively. In my (global telecom) industry, there are plenty of Macs and PCs workin' together.

Thus, I believe Apple's "pro" designation is used in that particular context.

Macs are also, despite their lag in updates, recognized for being very fast at running Windows too, so a Mac IS a PC.

Win/win.

So, in business, cost is the biggest and overriding factor: why pay for a Mac when a (cheaper) PC will do? In my company, when given the choice (and given the option to cover the difference), our employees choose Macs.

I am FAR more productive on a Mac, regardless of what I'm doing (work or play), because of 2 things:

The OS, particularly multiple desktops and multi-touch implementations, and those absolutely-freakin-wonderful-smooth-as-hell-can't-get-enough-of-them trackpads.

 

[CmdrLaForge]

FTFY.

Thanks so much.
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Apple never had a real Pro line, just a Pro line name to make consumers feel "Pro". At core components they were always behind, except for few small consumer interfaces. Real Pros do not use Apple. You won't see any engineers building the next Boing Airplane or BMW Car or next Space Station or an Sky Skaper on Apple devices. Not even the milling machines they use are controlled by Apple devices, they are controlled by Windows boxes.

Apple is pure consumer oriented. Spec wise their pro "line" is a joke.

Actually I consider myself a professional. Funny enough at work I run on my MacBook Pro only office. All I need to get my job done. At home I use fcpx motion and whatnot

 

[Michael Scrip]

Why is everyone always so pissed at Apple for having “old” hardware, when it’s Intel that’s been causing the delays?

Intel delivered Skylake chips 8 months ago. OEMs have been using them since then.

Except Apple.

So... who's delay was it?

Some Macs got Broadwell last year... but no Macs are using Intel's current-gen processor, Skylake.

And then there's the Mac Pro which still starts at $3,000... while using 2013 Ivy Bridge-EP.

So again... who's delaying who?

 

[patseguin]

Am I the only one who wants a new mac mini?

 

[Orange Computer]

Today the A9 is in a similar league to what Apple ships in a Macbook and the lower end Macbook Airs. To replace in their high end systems they need to make a quad core processor with each core running at least 1.5 times the speed of the existing A9 (this would pretty much exactly match an i7-6700 at 3.4 Ghz). There are two questions: Can they do it? And would it be profitable? I think we're getting close to the point where the answer to both questions is "yes"

 

[cambookpro]

When was that? Other than the one time Apple got some low power Intel chips before others for the original Macbook Air, I seem to recall that nearly every other Apple computer was a little bit behind the times when it came to specs. Seriously, this made me laugh.

With exceptions few and far in between, Apple has always been about a generation or more behind with CPU architecture, and has charged a large premium for having OS X, quality materials and build quality, and good support.

I can't quite find the exact model where Apple had the chips before general release, but I'm pretty sure it did happen to a couple of the early Intel Macs.
I disagree with your statement in bold, though. That has only tended to be true over the past few years. Take a look at the release dates for past MBPs and the release quarters for their corresponding Intel CPUs:

Intel chip: T8300 (Q1'08)
Mac release date: Feb 26, 2008

Intel chip: T9400 (Q3'08)
Mac release date: Oct 14, 2008

Intel chip: T9550 (Q4'08)
Mac release date: Jan 6, 2009

Intel chip: P8800 (Q2'09)
Mac release date: Jun 8, 2009

Intel chip: i7-620M (Q1'10)
Mac release date: Apr 13, 2010

Intel chip: i7-2720QM (Q1'11)
Mac release date: Feb 11, 2011

Intel chip: i7-2760QM (Q4'11)
Mac release date: Oct 24, 2011

To me, that doesn't look like it always being a generation behind. It's really only very recently the worrying trend of lagging far behind Intel's CPU schedules has appeared.

 

[dollystereo]

I remember some time ago, people where crazy about skylake and all the magic that would bring to apple. AND NOW, they are skipping it!!! Is hilarious.

 

[Wildkraut]

There are plenty of pros that use Macs, so there's no way you can make that assessment factually.

It's known that the creative art industries (film, music at least) use Macs extensively. In my (global telecom) industry, there are plenty of Macs and PCs workin' together.

Thus, I believe Apple's "pro" designation is used in that particular context.

Macs are also, despite their lag in updates, recognized for being very fast at running Windows too, so a Mac IS a PC.

Win/win.

So, in business, cost is the biggest and overriding factor: why pay for a Mac when a (cheaper) PC will do? In my company, when given the choice (and given the option to cover the difference), our employees choose Macs.

I am FAR more productive on a Mac, regardless of what I'm doing (work or play), because of 2 things:

The OS, particularly multiple desktops and multi-touch implementations, and those absolutely-freakin-wonderful-smooth-as-hell-can't-get-enough-of-them trackpads.

The film industry moved mainly over to linux or windows.

Look at:
http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/animation-and-visual-effects/behind-the-scenes/
You will have to look hard, to find somebody torturing himself by doing the real work on a mac.

Even the Music industry is more and more moving over to windows.
Apple is the next Nokia, just about iPhones now. Their computers mainly just exist to support the development of iDevices Applications. They don't care much for the rest anymore.

 

[keysofanxiety]

I remember some time ago, people where crazy about skylake and all the magic that would bring to apple. AND NOW, they are skipping it!!! Is hilarious.

Sorry if you're late to the party, but Skylake was an absolute disaster. Thank goodness Apple didn't use them.

 

[naeS1Sean]

Why is everyone always so pissed at Apple for having “old” hardware, when it’s Intel that’s been causing the delays? Besides, my Late 2013 15” rMBP still works darn well for my power user workflow.

Because the Mac Pro, for one. That's certainly not Intels fault.
[doublepost=1469133542][/doublepost]"And queue the people who are going to …." Jesus that's annoying.

 

[Celebion]

Sorry if you're late to the party, but Skylake was an absolute disaster. Thank goodness Apple didn't use them.

Care to elaborate?

 

[dollystereo]

Newer ≠ better.

I'd challenge you to find a mobile i7 shipping in a laptop that is more powerful than the i7-4980HQ which ships in the 2.8GHz BTO 15" rMBP. The only one I can think of is the i7-5950HQ, and even that is practically identical in performance.

That's part of the problem. People see newer gen quad-core i7s and wonder why Apple haven't implemented them yet. It's because they're often less powerful than the ones currently shipping. So yes, the chips are there. And Apple aren't using them for good reason.

Challenge accepted:
The Dell Precision Workstation, the Dell XPS15, the Dell Alienware, the Asus zenbook, and almost any high-end PC laptop.
This machine is so much better than the MBP:
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/p...1015us_4&model_id=precision-m5510-workstation

 

[Zellio]

Who decides they are outdated? I'm very happy with my 2015 15" Pro. Blazing fast compared to what it replaced (late 08 Pro) and while newer stuff might give me a few more minutes of battery and a few better specs I need a computer to edit 4K videos and this one does it and does it well. Specs are for PC users and always have been.

r u serious?? Your old 08 machine had a t9400 cpu. CORE 2 DUO. It had a passmark rating of 1761.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core2+Duo+T9400+@+2.53GHz&id=1009

Now look at this:

http://www.iphonebenchmark.net/passmark_chart.html

If you scroll down a little bit you'll find that the Ipad 2 was only a couple hundred points away.

 

[kemal]

intel should have consulted with the schedule for completion of AC2.

 

[Wildkraut]

Btw. Macs and Pro? Where are the Macs here? http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/making-of-ice-age-collision-course/
Saw one untouched on the table, probably displaying some text or running itunes.
See all the HP keyboards?

 

[Daws001]

Who needs Ricki Lake processors when I have the mighty A9X powering my rig!

 

[keysofanxiety]

Challenge accepted:
The Dell Precision Workstation, the Dell XPS15, the Dell Alienware, the Asus zenbook, and almost any high-end PC laptop

Ah yes.

1) That well known laptop known as the Dell Precision Workstation desktop computer.
2) The XPS 15 that sports an i7-6700HQ at its highest configuration, a processor absolutely creamed by the BTO 2.8GHz i7-4980HQ in the 15" rMBP.
3) The back-breaking Alienware. When they said it was portable, they meant on wheels.
4) The ASUS ZenBook doesn't touch the specs of the 15" rMBP.
5) 'Almost' any high-end PC laptop will not have anywhere close to same build quality, support, battery life, thinness and weight as a rMBP.

Again, Macs are wayyyy too expensive for what they are. I'm not denying that. But posters are acting like there are a sleuth of incredible processors that Apple are flat-out refusing to put in their portable machines (Mac Pro aside). That's really not the case.

 

[dollystereo]

Sorry if you're late to the party, but Skylake was an absolute disaster. Thank goodness Apple didn't use them.

Yeah, but when Haswell was released, people where saying that Skylake was going to be game changer, and now we are still stuck with Haswell.
USB 3.1+TB3 is pretty good anyway. I think the problem is that the stock of Iris Pro CPU's is low, or non existent and apple doesn't want to put discrete graphics.
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Ah yes.

1) That well known laptop known as the Dell Precision Workstation desktop computer.
2) The XPS 15 that sports an i7-6700HQ at its highest configuration, a processor absolutely creamed by the BTO 2.8GHz i7-4980HQ in the 15" rMBP.
3) The back-breaking Alienware. When they said it was portable, they meant on wheels.
4) The ASUS ZenBook doesn't touch the specs of the 15" rMBP.
5) 'Almost' any high-end PC laptop will not have anywhere close to same build quality, support, battery life, thinness and weight as a rMBP.

Again, Macs are wayyyy too expensive for what they are. I'm not denying that. But posters are acting like there are a sleuth of incredible processors that Apple are flat-out refusing to put in their machines. That's really not the case.

I find the Asus pretty good, but it is expensive. The GTX960 is nice, and has fast PCI storage. The precision is super nice, my colleague has it running UBUNTU and it sings, and 3 year warranty is nice to.
The Dell Precision is a laptop, not a desktop, and is lighter than the Macbook Pro. 1.8Kg
I wouldn't mind if apple dropped the prices of the 15MBP to 1499 ad 1799.
The solution for us, is that apple licenses OS X .

 

[keysofanxiety]

I find the Asus pretty good, but it is expensive. The GTX960 is nice, and has fast PCI storage. The precision is super nice, my colleague has it running UBUNTU and it sings, and 3 year warranty is nice to.

I won't deny it's nice and that there are plenty of lovely laptops out there. Thankfully other companies are really doing what they can to make laptops appealing and desirable, to compete with Apple's aesthetic and build quality. It's only benefited the consumer and that can never be anything but a good thing!

The trouble is that I've seen so many end-users over the years sink so much money into expensive laptops – but when they go wrong, the manufacturer is terrible in getting it solved, or just flat out denies there's an issue. And boy, Windows can be an absolute nightmare.

At the moment, the Mac hardware and software works well enough for me that the alternative really isn't worth it. Even if we're talking 1/4 off the price. I can't contemplate spending £1500+ on any other laptop than a Mac. It's not so much when they go right; be it hardware, or software. It's what happens when they go wrong and how the OEM deals with that appropriately.

I've enjoyed our debate, dollystereo!

 

[dollystereo]

I won't deny it's nice and that there are plenty of lovely laptops out there. Thankfully other companies are really doing what they can to make laptops appealing and desirable, to compete with Apple's aesthetic and build quality. It's only benefited the consumer and that can never be anything but a good thing!

The trouble is that I've seen so many end-users over the years sink so much money into expensive laptops – but when they go wrong, the manufacturer is terrible in getting it solved, or just flat out denies there's an issue. And boy, Windows can be an absolute nightmare.

At the moment, the Mac hardware and software works well enough for me that the alternative really isn't worth it. Even if we're talking 1/4 off the price. I can't contemplate spending £1500+ on any other laptop than a Mac. It's not so much when they go right; be it hardware, or software. It's what happens when they go wrong and how the OEM deals with that appropriately.

I've enjoyed our debate, dollystereo!

I can assure you that Dell customer service is excellent for professional hardware (workstations and the precision line). Apple is not that good anymore.
I am in the same boat as you, this is my 4th Macbook Pro. And is the only one trouble free.
The first gen macbook pro was really bad, overheating, X1600 card failing. If I didn't had apple care I would have been screwed.
Then, 2008 Macbook Pro, Geforce 8600 (failed 2 times). Had to pay for one, almost $400. Lived in Chile at that time.
Third 2011 AMD6750-gate. 4 year's took apple to recognise the failing cards, 1000 pages of complaints in apple forum.... Also payed for a repair from my pocket, I was reimbursed then, and sold for my current machine.
2012 last gen non retina Macbook Pro, good machine. My colleague had a precision workstation for 5 years...trouble free...now with the 5510 he is very happy, and payed aroun USD1800 (ubuntu version).
I already left my iPhone for a very nice MI chinese phone.

 

[smirking]

Bring on the complaints and crying.

I'm just gonna heavily sigh.

Well, my 2012 MBP is still a trooper with a 2TB SSD. I'll survive.

 

[melendezest]

The film industry moved mainly over to linux or windows.

Look at:
http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/animation-and-visual-effects/behind-the-scenes/
You will have to look hard, to find somebody torturing himself by doing the real work on a mac.

Even the Music industry is more and more moving over to windows.
Apple is the next Nokia, just about iPhones now. Their computers mainly just exist to support the development of iDevices Applications. They don't care much for the rest anymore.

What torture? I mean, seriously, what exactly is the downside to using a Mac? Most software is available for it.

I understand Apple's focus has definitely shifted, no question.

But my Macs have made me more productive, not less, and I don't use iOS at all, so I don't see the correlation of one vs the other, aside from Apple's side of things (largely ignoring the Mac).

As I stated previously, my 2011 17" is still the best computer I've used.

So again, in business the issue is cost. If you can get stuff done cheaper, why not? Both Windows and Linux have improved, and the software available has done so as well.

However, despite what the (applicable) "business" industry is doing, until someone makes an equal or better trackpad/multitouch implementation than Apple's they'll have to pry my Macs from my cold, dead hands.

 

[toddzrx]

Intel delivered Skylake chips 8 months ago. OEMs have been using them since then.

Except Apple.

So... who's delay was it?

Some Macs got Broadwell last year... but no Macs are using Intel's current-gen processor, Skylake.

And then there's the Mac Pro which still starts at $3,000... while using 2013 Ivy Bridge-EP.

So again... who's delaying who?

C'mon; do you know you're making erroneous statements or are you ignorant? The only correct thing you said is what's bolded above.

 

[dannys1]

It's this kind of backwards thinking that causes these kinds of delays and causes Apple to charge $2500+ for a laptop with three-year-old processors...

The Haswell in my Macbook Pro was released on July 21st 2014, my MacBook Pro was released May 2015, so it was 9 months old when it was released - and the equivalent Broadwell still wasn't out. So it was the latest chip suitable at the time, so your "3 year old processor" is both nonsense, wrong and just plain exaggeration.