iOS 10.3 Beta Says 32-Bit Legacy Apps Will Not Work With Future Versions of iOS

[rp2011]

Sure one can stop at 10.2.1 and all you have to do is put up with Apple nagging you 19 times a day and not accidentally dismiss a random popup message the wrong way when in a hurry and authorize it to update the next night...

Look if your hammer works, and you like it why buy a new one? If it doesn't anymore then you got to buy a new one. That's how it goes.

If you like typing on a typewriter, no one is going to take it from you. But don't expect to be able to post online with it. Or expect everyone to conform to your needs or wants.

I've seen old timers use tacks and hammers for upholstery or nails and hammer for construction and there is a tool for a purpose. But they went out of business using hard headed mentalities real quick.

But you can't complain when people use staple guns and nail guns or computers for typing.

No one likes getting old and I've seen old timers not want cell phones or nail guns or computers. It's a choice and that's cool. But why complain when new tools and new needs come to market?
Honestly. People need to chill and let go. Change and death are the only certainties in life.

 

[redheeler]

Before people are too critical of Apple-

https://www.macrumors.com/2014/12/17/apple-64-bit-support-reminder/

They're being generous for letting 32 bit apps work 2 years after the deadline.

If Macs can still run 32-bit apps nearly a decade after the last 32-bit Mac was superseded, why shouldn't iOS get at least half as long?

This is even more serious when iOS users don't have downgrade rights, meaning an accidental update could break a critical out of support app with no way to fix.

 

[briloronmacrumo]

Developers being lazy is not a valid reason.

Many developers ( Art of Warfare's earlier post contains similar comments ) simply quit because there isn't enough money to support them with the current low app prices. Yes, some developers hit it big and some have large programming teams ( Nintendo etc. ) but there are many who don't survive and can't compete at current app price points. That's how capitalistic markets work but your favorites might be the ones created by those who have bailed. I don't know about iOS apps but many Mac apps have been around for years and years ( some of my own for six or seven ) and at least some developers have kept them running from Snow Leopard through Sierra.

 

[applezulu]

"Needs to be updated". Please tell Apple, by who? Me the user, the app maker, and how do I get the update, when is it available? It's a rather ambiguous message. That's the point. It's not graceful. The message is giving stupid feedback with one option "OK". Pointless from the user perspective. This should be a silent thing, the developer is notified about the issue to either get their house in order or not.

Uh, the answer to your question 'by who?' is right there in the alert. "This app will not work with future versions of iOS. The developer of this app needs to update it to improve its compatibility."

The developer has been made aware for a couple of years now that iOS is moving to 64-bit. This alert, along with the previous one that's out there in the wild now indicating that 32-bit apps will slow down your phone, are there to create a mild awareness among users that developers of certain apps are not keeping them current with compatibility requirements. That way when iOS 11 breaks those apps, users will have been warned. Some will still complain, mind you, but they will be using "alternative facts" if they say they weren't warned what would happen.
[doublepost=1485897854][/doublepost]

Has Apple stated that there is legacy 32-bit bloat currently in iOS? And have they indicated what the savings/improvements will be? Or is that just an assumption?

https://developer.apple.com/library...ual/64bitPorting/indications/indications.html

 

[Rafagon]

Will this brick my iPhone 5C? Or does this mean iOS 11 is most likely not compatible with iPhone 5c?

The latter. Apple will [generally*] not release an iOS update that will brick a phone. It simply makes it so that the affected phones will not “see” the new iOS update.

*And if it does, it will fairly promptly remove said update — https://www.macrumors.com/2016/09/13/ios-10-update-bricking-iphones-and-ipads/

 

[sracer]

It's not an acceptable situation and any apps that ios breaks I'd ask for a refund. It's giving information but it's rather odd and not graceful. Errr err iM gonna break soon. Ok?? Prompt. Computes??

I agree.

I find it sad that people are more willing to defend Apple's decisions (that affect customers) than defending customers. Anything that removes customer choice seems to be applauded.

 

[JamesPDX]

I will miss the greatest app ever created:

 

[Rafagon]

While they are at this, they should also allow us to permanently delete purchased history. Also would be nice to have an ability to sort apps by rating, last update date, kind/genre etc.

Until they give us the option to do it ourselves, Apple can do this for you—you have to contact them. It only takes a second if you use the official Apple Support App.

I totally agree with you about those sorting options!

 

[sracer]

https://developer.apple.com/library...ual/64bitPorting/indications/indications.html

That article is about OSX not iOS. Although there are similarities between OSX and iOS, how much of that article (if any) is applicable to iOS is not clear.

 

[SourceSunTom]

Rip flappy bird :§

 

[Rafagon]

I’ve seen apps that still don’t even support the larger screen space of Plus-size iPhones! That is pathetic! I hate to see those “letterboxed” apps not making full use of the screen space of the iPhone I chose to put my money on.

Of course, ALL of those also happen to be 32-bit.

Forcing those devs to provide updates may (or will?) force them to support the larger screens as well? Can any dev answer this question?

 

[applezulu]

That article is about OSX not iOS. Although there are similarities between OSX and iOS, how much of that article (if any) is applicable to iOS is not clear.

Good point. I don't have time to dig around for an Apple-sourced article, but this secondary source makes the same explanation about legacy 32-bit apps forcing iOS to load the additional 32-bit framework, which has the same effect as described in the link about OSX. The article, which appears to be from 2014, already says Apple was indicating that 32-bit iOS support probably would come to an end. So that covers both the bloat issue and also the fair warning issue.

https://www.smartface.io/ios-64-bit-transition/

 

[Scottsoapbox]

I'm not sure if this is strictly true. I've been looking up other app tracker apps. AppZapp does the same thing as AppShopper and was updated in June.

And I remember AppShopper having to change the way it worked in order to get reapproval after the rule.

Well there are Apple's rules and the application of said rules by probably an $8/hr worker in a dark cubical somewhere...
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I’ve seen apps that still don’t even support the larger screen space of Plus-size iPhones! That is pathetic! I hate to see those “letterboxed” apps not making full use of the screen space of the iPhone I chose to put my money on.

Of course, ALL of those also happen to be 32-bit.

Forcing those devs to provide updates may (or will?) force them to support the larger screens as well? Can any dev answer this question?

If the app hasn't been updated yet the likelihood of it being updated for this is very low. So ask yourself: do you prefer an app that doesn't use the full screen of the plus or doesn't work at all.
[doublepost=1485900532][/doublepost]

Look if your hammer works, and you like it why buy a new one? If it doesn't anymore then you got to buy a new one. That's how it goes.

If you like typing on a typewriter, no one is going to take it from you. But don't expect to be able to post online with it. Or expect everyone to conform to your needs or wants.

I've seen old timers use tacks and hammers for upholstery or nails and hammer for construction and there is a tool for a purpose. But they went out of business using hard headed mentalities real quick.

But you can't complain when people use staple guns and nail guns or computers for typing.

No one likes getting old and I've seen old timers not want cell phones or nail guns or computers. It's a choice and that's cool. But why complain when new tools and new needs come to market?
Honestly. People need to chill and let go. Change and death are the only certainties in life.

Your examples make no sense. And your constant references to old timers doesn't change that fact. If the best argument you can make is that it is newer and not actually better well...

Here I'll try and make your example relevant:

• I have the newest nail gun they make (7+ 10.2.1).
• I have purchased many nails while being a carpenter (apps).
• Now the hardware store (Apple) wants me to trade until in that two week old nail gun for one coming out next week. But it only works with some of the nails I own which seems less useful as nail guns go.
• If I decide to keep my current nail gun, hardware store employees are going to follow me around and ask me every 15 minutes if I want the newer, but less useful nail gun. forever.

So the choice Apple is giving customers is A) lose functionality or B) get nagged forever.

That doesn't seem very customer friendly. And this isn't just impacting people still clinging to an iPad 2 it is ALL of their customers.

 

[briloronmacrumo]

If Macs can still run 32-bit apps nearly a decade after the last 32-bit Mac was superseded, why shouldn't iOS get at least half as long?

For all the similarities, macOS and iOS are different. Apple has OS X's Carbon 32-bit framework which they still maintain but don't enhance ( much ) and AFAIK, iOS doesn't have a separate 32-bit framework. While Apple could eliminate 32-bit Carbon from OS X, there is nothing compelling them to do so. A hardware change of some kind ( say a CPU that supports only 64-bit ) might force Apple's hand and it wouldn't surprise me if a hardware change ( or anticipated change ) is part of Apple's iOS plan.

 

[konqerror]

I have the perfect amount of RAM because Apple said I don't need any more.

Libraries load when a program calls them. So it will load one or the other - not both. You don't think your iPhone is holding every 32 bit library and every 64 bit library all the time do you? Oh wait you do.

Completely wrong. Libraries load when the program loads. It's called a dynamic linker. The system is smart enough to only have to load one copy into memory through the magic of virtual memory. (Let me guess, you're going to argue that VM is bad)

People know what they're talking about here. So you might want to consider what you actually know before accuse.

 

[dampfnudel]

I have about 5 apps that would stop working if iOS 11 was incompatible with 32-bit apps. I would only miss one of them, CityTime. I already sent an email to the developer of that app to update the app to the larger screen of the iPhone 6/6s/7/Plus, but I didn't receive any response. I'll try again. I just checked and it's still available on the App Store.

 

[Cougarcat]

Well there are Apple's rules and the application of said rules by probably an $8/hr worker in a dark cubical somewhere...

Like AppShopper, it was pulled and then re-uploaded after it made the required fixes. It has also been updated many times since then. So it looks like AppShopper could be updated if it wanted to.

 

[Surfer13134]

As I can understand this,It sucks as my Security Camera DVR is a 32 BIT app. So now im either going to have to replace my whole camera system or get another DVR which arent cheap.

 

[ILikeAllOS]

Developers being lazy is not a valid reason. Not everyone has to be like Facebook to routinely update their app with junk lines of code and keep on bloating it till it explodes.

To make your app 64bit you don't have to "routinely update their app with junk lines of code", you update the app ONCE and you don't need to add any new lines of code, just recompile it with the latest Xcode.

I will have to upgrade my 5 year old CCTV camera system which will cost me $1000 because their remote app is 32bit and very old. It may stop working in iOS 11.

Now I will lose $1000 because of DRM.

Wrong. You'll lose $1000 because you bought a CCTV system from a company who won't update their products and provide no support.
A company too lazy to recompile the app one time in the FOUR YEARS they've had since the 64bit chip debuted!

 

[applezulu]

I have about 5 apps that would stop working if iOS 11 was incompatible with 32-bit apps. I would only miss one of them, CityTime. I already sent an email to the developer of that app to update the app to the larger screen of the iPhone 6/6s/7/Plus, but I didn't receive any response. I'll try again. I just checked and it's still available on the App Store.

Bingo. That's what this alert is good for. I also sent a note to a developer of an instrument-tuning app that I like. The developer hasn't updated any of their three apps in several years, so there might not be anyone home. On the other hand, if there is, then receiving a few notes from users might be enough motivation to do an update. In my case, I indicated I'd be willing to pay for a new version. It's something I use, and a few bucks every few years isn't much to ask.

 

[Scottsoapbox]

Completely wrong. Libraries load when the program loads. It's called a dynamic linker. The system is smart enough to only have to load one copy into memory through the magic of virtual memory. (Let me guess, you're going to argue that VM is bad)

People know what they're talking about here. So you might want to consider what you actually know before accuse.

How do you think the OS knows to load the library into memory? Magic? The program asks the OS to load X and Y for it. That is called a call (see what I did there). This is freshman computer science stuff.

And if you are such a firm believer in VM - why do you care how much memory is being used? You keep claiming we need to jettison 32 bit code because it's taking up too much space. There is lots of virtual memory compared to the actual RAM.

But you are wrong about how VM's "magic" works. It is a workaround to not having enough room in RAM. RAM is much faster than VM (also more expensive and power consuming which is why we use VM) so the OS will try and keep the most frequently accessed stuff in RAM and the rest that won't fit in VM. There is no guarantee that this optimization is perfect and thus something will only be loaded once.

Some people here know what they are talking about.

The University that employs me considered my doctorate adequate proof of what I know. What about you?

 

[applezulu]

...

I will have to upgrade my 5 year old CCTV camera system which will cost me $1000 because their remote app is 32bit and very old. It may stop working in iOS 11.

Now I will lose $1000 because of DRM.

Also, it should be noted that if you have CCTVs with an app that hasn't been updated in several years, you can be pretty sure that your cameras are unsecured and wide-open windows for the world to have a look-see wherever you have them pointed. If you're using them for security (or something else you'd prefer was kept private), you probably should consider replacing them with cameras sold by a company that takes security seriously.

Maybe you'll actually not lose $10,000 because you've been prompted to get new CCTV cameras that are actually secure.

 

[apolloa]

So will this make iOS run faster then? Would hope so.

 

[rp2011]

Well there are Apple's rules and the application of said rules by probably an $8/hr worker in a dark cubical somewhere...
[doublepost=1485899204][/doublepost]

If the app hasn't been updated yet the likelihood of it being updated for this is very low. So ask yourself: do you prefer an app that doesn't use the full screen of the plus or doesn't work at all.
[doublepost=1485900532][/doublepost]

Your examples make no sense. And your constant references to old timers doesn't change that fact. If the best argument you can make is that it is newer and not actually better well...

Here I'll try and make your example relevant:

• I have the newest nail gun they make (7+ 10.2.1).
• I have purchased many nails while being a carpenter (apps).
• Now the hardware store (Apple) wants me to trade until in that two week old nail gun for one coming out next week. But it only works with some of the nails I own which seems less useful as nail guns go.
• If I decide to keep my current nail gun, hardware store employees are going to follow me around and ask me every 15 minutes if I want the newer, but less useful nail gun. forever.

So the choice Apple is giving customers is A) lose functionality or B) get nagged forever.

That doesn't seem very customer friendly. And this isn't just impacting people still clinging to an iPad 2 it is ALL of their customers.

Boy oh boy you have a hard head.
Whatever. There no use,

 

[rockosmodurnlif]

Going to miss AppVault. Pain to use but I still use it. Sucks but I came to post to ask when is the AppShopper app going to get updated? Or is there some other updated price tracking app I should be using?