iOS 10.3 Beta Says 32-Bit Legacy Apps Will Not Work With Future Versions of iOS

[crashoverride77]

I hope so. They should do this to Mac OS more than iOS, but having both rewritten entirely in swift with bug cleanups and security improvements would be most welcome.

That will probably take years. They mentioned in a developer keynote that the dock is written in swift, and it's around 200 000 lines of code.
[doublepost=1485947328][/doublepost]

Oh dear, it seems you didn't read it fully. $1000 is not for any app. It is for installing a new CCTV system because the 5 year old CCTV system's free app on app store was 32 bit only. Once iDevice is updated to iOS 11 this fall, the old 32 bit app will become useless.
Unless the CCTV company has a change of heart and updates their app to 64 bit. You do know how good are the Chinese companies with software updates.

A CCTV company that doesn't support 64Bit? Run
[doublepost=1485947554][/doublepost]

I love all these people that have never programmed telling us how easy it is to update to a completely different API from Apple. Psst API is the Application Programming Interface that lets my code talk to Apple's libraries and Apple likes to change them CONSTANTLY.

It's not like one can just load their code and then press the huge button labeled "recompile to 64 bit"

You kind of do.

 

[JGRE]

That kinda sucks...I've got a really old game that I enjoy playing to pass the time but it's not been updated since the days of the iPhone 5.

You can still play it on a 32 bit device...........
[doublepost=1485950308][/doublepost]

Looking forward to seeing millions of 32-bit apps disappear from the store because the developers don't see it as worth the cost to update

You are probably one of the 0,0000001% of people doing so. I rather have a stable OS without 32 bit support and good security. Reasoning like you, you could also still demand 8 or 16bit support. Times change and you cannot design a good OS based on things from the past.
[doublepost=1485950706][/doublepost]

Not good for me. Im using an app for work, which has not been updated for a long time, but still works perfectly. I paid around £60 for the app, and the developer decided to switch with a new app to a costly subscription model which I and many other users are not willing to support. This would mean that my £60 app, which still works perfectly would suddenly be blocked by apple. Bad move!

I think you problem is not with the strategy of iOS but rather with the strategy of the developer. I agree, I would never go for one of the subscription models as they mostly are just in the benefit of the developer; we pay a multitude compered to the simple purchase model. I think this is more like a collateral damage. Soon or later we all will have to accept that the earning models have changed, but supporting legacy software will hold back OS developlements.
[doublepost=1485950989][/doublepost]

I have at least two old apps (dating back to iPhone 3G) that contain a ton of archived data (contacts, notes, etc). I use them sporadically now - but I do still use them. So it's going to be a royal pain extracting all that old data and stashing it somewhere safe. And I guess I have to do it now, while the old apps still work.

Guess I need a Data Migration strategy for my phone? Maybe I should hire a consultant?

Apple: It Just Works! (until it doesn't)

Really? You want to hire a consultant for migration that you can do fully automatic via iCloud or iTunes? Or simply syngronize via the cloud? You must be an iOS expert.

 

[Arran]

What I'm trying to get at is a message like "slow down your phone" and "the developer of this app needs to update it to improve its compatibility" are terrible. The user should never see something so inane like this. It's such poor design. It makes the user think about maintaining their device. The "iPhone" user, as a priority, should need never think about maintenance and these kinds of things if they are getting a true "it just works" user experience.

Less BS prompts and messages from the operating system is my mantra. These messages from iOS fit clearly in the category of BS prompts.

It seems more like a CYA notification Apple's legal dept demanded and the OS team reluctantly implemented.

A more useful, customer-friendly, approach would be to send an email to each owner with an inventory of their apps that will stop working and the exact date that will happen. Give people time for proper planning and a checklist to work from.

 

[peter2]

You're welcome to keep using that app. Just don't upgrade to the latest version of iOS. Apple doesn't require you to. If you want to keep using it, keep on your current OS.

Oh, please post a procedure how to get previous iOS versions on hardware that started to be sold with newer versions only. BTW Apple is bugging me every other day to update my iOS 9 to iOS 10 and there is no option to stop the bugging. You do one tap without paying attention and your phone is upgraded (happened to my old father in a moment he least wanted it). Apple is behaving worse than Microsoft!

You're demanding the latest and greatest but also want to be able to use old legacy systems. It's like someone complaining that they can't run their old DOS apps on their new Windows 10 machine, and then blaming Microsoft for it.

You're demanding to drive your Model-T and getting mad that they don't still sell leaded gas.

I am not demanding the latest and greatest at all. In contrary, I want more stability and less non-sense "advancements". There is absolutely no reason (apart from Apple's arrogant whims) why 32bit apps should not continue running normally.

Regarding your DOS analogy: I am certain there is a way how to run your DOS applications in Win 10 (at worst you can virtualize), and that is how it should be. Devices should evolve to being more capable, not more crippled.
[doublepost=1485954285][/doublepost]

I’m curious—did any of you people crying about this upcoming change buy software a few years back? Did you ever purchase Windows 98? Lotus 1-2-3? Can you use those now, on current-generation hardware? Did you ask Microsoft or Lotus Software for your money back?

Well, technically, you can still use Lotus 1-2-3, but that’s because third parties created DOS emulators, like DOSBox—not because the original companies went out of their way to ensure their apps still work.

Yes, indeed, I am still running some old apps emulating or virtualizing.

Also, Apple is -not- flipping a switch and breaking them. If you keep your current device and your current version of iOS, you can use your 32-bit apps for as long as you like—at least until your iPhone stops working.

Ahhh, so the solution is to carry around 5 phones, each with the app that can run on the given version of iOS.

I truly don't understand some of you no-matter-how-stupid-the-current-Apple's-non-sense-is Apple apologists. There is no harm done to you if the possibility to run 32bit apps stays. Still you want to remove it no matter the consequences for those who will be harmed. Ever heard of empathy?

 

[Liebo]

Looks like I'll eventually have to stop playing Flappy Bird. When I got my iPhone 6, I did a full iTunes restore but mysteriously Flappy Bird was not re-instated... Lukily I had the IPA file and so I manually synced it back in and am still able to play it (it is my go-to game when I've got no service on a train or plane etc).

 

[peter2]

Old software isn't guaranteed to be compatible with new operating systems. Apple has done this on the Mac. Heck, 16-bit software no longer works on 64-bit Windows, and Microsoft is known to value backward compatibility.

You realize I am complaining about compatibility one generation back (32 bit on a 64 bit system), while you speak about the impossibility to run two 16bit programs on a 64bit system... which you technically can do on the system you give as an example anyway.

But of course, as always, Apple knows best what all of us need! Tim for president! (preferably of the whole galaxy, or at least the Earth) ;-)

 

[applezulu]

Well there are Apple's rules and the application of said rules by probably an $8/hr worker in a dark cubical somewhere...
[doublepost=1485899204][/doublepost]

If the app hasn't been updated yet the likelihood of it being updated for this is very low. So ask yourself: do you prefer an app that doesn't use the full screen of the plus or doesn't work at all.
[doublepost=1485900532][/doublepost]

Your examples make no sense. And your constant references to old timers doesn't change that fact. If the best argument you can make is that it is newer and not actually better well...

Here I'll try and make your example relevant:

• I have the newest nail gun they make (7+ 10.2.1).
• I have purchased many nails while being a carpenter (apps).
• Now the hardware store (Apple) wants me to trade until in that two week old nail gun for one coming out next week. But it only works with some of the nails I own which seems less useful as nail guns go.
• If I decide to keep my current nail gun, hardware store employees are going to follow me around and ask me every 15 minutes if I want the newer, but less useful nail gun. forever.

So the choice Apple is giving customers is A) lose functionality or B) get nagged forever.

That doesn't seem very customer friendly. And this isn't just impacting people still clinging to an iPad 2 it is ALL of their customers.

Your example doesn't make sense. Most importantly, you're suggesting that the newer nail gun is no better than the old one, and offers no additional functionality. In reality it does. Other customers want those additional functions. If the store didn't respond and offer those improved nail guns, they'd go out of business. Not making new versions of nail guns or bloating them up in perpetuity just to accommodate people holding on to some old nails isn't good customer service either.

You're ignoring the fact that the makers of the old nails have had several years to replace those old nails with new ones that meet the new standards.

You knew when you bought your nail gun that it would have a limited life span, and in fact it was almost certainly an upgrade from a previous nail gun. You've also left obsolete, unsupported nails behind before, and you know that's the nature of nail gun technology.
[doublepost=1485956613][/doublepost]It's sort of entertaining, actually. There are a couple of major categories of whingeing that appear on these boards:

1) Apple is too slow to upgrade various product lines, and when they do, they don't have every last possible new, bleeding edge component possible.

2) Apple is too fast at upgrading various product lines, and should never cut loose legacy technology.

 

[pacorob]

That kinda sucks...I've got a really old game that I enjoy playing to pass the time but it's not been updated since the days of the iPhone 5.

I have that as well.

I now wonder if this also has affect on me if I would update my 64bit iPhone 5s and iPad mini2 to iOS10.3 or newer when it has been released and no longer get the note with older apps like the ones below that your device could be slow but that it would result in the apps no longer being working on your device. Or is this only connected to the App Store availability of such old apps?

Kids apps I still use: KoeDoetBoe 2013, Kinderliedjes - May 2014 and the game review app TouchArcade (November 2013).

 

[tipoo]

If you have a 32 bit device, will the old 32 bit app download remain on the App store?

this probably means they won't get app updates anymore, eh? Bummer, some people are still served fine by an A6/A6X.

 

[moonjelly]

While I applaud Apple for cleaning out the crap in the App store. The reason so many great older apps haven't received attention is because the design of the app store buried them under a never ending stream of in-app-purchase-crap-ware. Apple - First fix the app store. Wait two years for good apps to be findable, rediscovered, profitable, updated. Then discontinue legacy support.

There are some very mature, lightweight, and stable 32 bit apps that only need some very conservative legacy support to remain great. Examples include Cove entertainment console games ported to iOS. Better than most recent chart toppers. Pay once, play off-line, premium games that look great and run smooth.

 

[KPOM]

You realize I am complaining about compatibility one generation back (32 bit on a 64 bit system), while you speak about the impossibility to run two 16bit programs on a 64bit system... which you technically can do on the system you give as an example anyway.

But of course, as always, Apple knows best what all of us need! Tim for president! (preferably of the whole galaxy, or at least the Earth) ;-)

Apple has required all submissions, including updates, to be 64-bit compatible for the past 2 years. So at minimum this means that the developer hasn't touched the app at all in 2 years. So it is probably not commercially viable. And the only reason Windows supports 32-bit applications as much as it does is that Microsoft botched the 64-bit rollout (they still default to 32-bit Office in Windows).

 

[Rocketman]

Do any devs have any expectation that 128 bit will emerge anytime soon as a (currently) fringe use case?

 

[goosnarrggh]

And the only reason Windows supports 32-bit applications as much as it does is that Microsoft botched the 64-bit rollout (they still default to 32-bit Office in Windows).

That's absolutely not the *only* reason. I'd venture to say it's not even the most important reason. Microsoft has a long track record of acknowledging the importance some of its customers place in the ongoing ability to run legacy software.

 

[C DM]

What I'm trying to get at is a message like "slow down your phone" and "the developer of this app needs to update it to improve its compatibility" are terrible. The user should never see something so inane like this. It's such poor design. It makes the user think about maintaining their device. The "iPhone" user, as a priority, should need never think about maintenance and these kinds of things if they are getting a true "it just works" user experience.

Less BS prompts and messages from the operating system is my mantra. These messages from iOS fit clearly in the category of BS prompts.
[doublepost=1485937682][/doublepost]
High five to you, good person!

They are there essentially as warnings to basically get the user ready for the app to no longer work at some point in the future.
[doublepost=1485969760][/doublepost]

Oh, please post a procedure how to get previous iOS versions on hardware that started to be sold with newer versions only. BTW Apple is bugging me every other day to update my iOS 9 to iOS 10 and there is no option to stop the bugging. You do one tap without paying attention and your phone is upgraded (happened to my old father in a moment he least wanted it). Apple is behaving worse than Microsoft!



I am not demanding the latest and greatest at all. In contrary, I want more stability and less non-sense "advancements". There is absolutely no reason (apart from Apple's arrogant whims) why 32bit apps should not continue running normally.

Regarding your DOS analogy: I am certain there is a way how to run your DOS applications in Win 10 (at worst you can virtualize), and that is how it should be. Devices should evolve to being more capable, not more crippled.
[doublepost=1485954285][/doublepost]
Yes, indeed, I am still running some old apps emulating or virtualizing.


Ahhh, so the solution is to carry around 5 phones, each with the app that can run on the given version of iOS.

I truly don't understand some of you no-matter-how-stupid-the-current-Apple's-non-sense-is Apple apologists. There is no harm done to you if the possibility to run 32bit apps stays. Still you want to remove it no matter the consequences for those who will be harmed. Ever heard of empathy?

Delete the downloaded update and install the tvOS profile so that updates wouldn't get downloaded automatically and you wouldn't get promoted to update.

 

[KPOM]

That's absolutely not the *only* reason. I'd venture to say it's not even the most important reason. Microsoft has a long track record of acknowledging the importance some of its customers place in the ongoing ability to run legacy software.

It would have been nice if they could have found a way to make 64-bit Office compatible with 32-bit add-ins. The problem we have now is that most of us have machines with 8GB or 16GB of RAM that Office can't benefit from. This is a real issue in Excel.

 

[sracer]

For most apps, the "cost" of recompiling for 64-bit is pushing this button:
View attachment 686503

Most apps? Have you surveyed developers to draw that conclusion or are you just making that up?

 

[smacrumon]

They are there essentially as warnings to basically get the user ready for the app to no longer work at some point in the future.
[doublepost=1485969760][/doublepost]
Delete the downloaded update and install the tvOS profile so that updates wouldn't get downloaded automatically and you wouldn't get promoted to update.

I get that they are warnings, but they aren't good design. Users don't need to get ready for anything if it all just works. That's the point. Apple is paid to solve these issues without the end user having to maintain their device this way. It's really backwards in terms of experience. "Slow down" warning. How ridiculous, Apple.

 

[I7guy]

I get that they are warnings, but they aren't good design. Users don't need to get ready for anything if it all just works. That's the point. Apple is paid to solve these issues without the end user having to maintain their device this way. It's really backwards in terms of experience. "Slow down" warning. How ridiculous, Apple.

And I don't want iOS becoming windows. Windows is so bloated because every it can run apps in dos, 64 bit, 32 bit and supports every app and all legacy stuff going to to 1980.

Removal of 32 bit apps is not a bad thing. This is on the developer not Apple.

 

[C DM]

I get that they are warnings, but they aren't good design. Users don't need to get ready for anything if it all just works. That's the point. Apple is paid to solve these issues without the end user having to maintain their device this way. It's really backwards in terms of experience. "Slow down" warning. How ridiculous, Apple.

Apple has nothing to do with developers not supporting their apps for a long time.

 

[DotComCTO]

But Apple gets blamed for not making this move. It means the OS and other apps run slower and then people cry to Apple that their iPhone isn't running right.

Apple could just continue to put up their current message that indicates the 32-bit app may affect performance. To cut off those apps altogether is unnecessary.

 

[smacrumon]

Apple has nothing to do with developers not supporting their apps for a long time.

If you define long time as two years or so, I wonder what your definition of a decade and century might be. Apple certainly does have everything to do with supporting apps for a long time. Developers pay a fee to write for the closed ios system. The implicit guarantee is that Apple allows approved apps to work for a good long time. The gaurentee extends to customers getting what they paid for as well. Considering ios can not be downgraded, users should expect new ios versions won't kill their purchased software.
[doublepost=1485979829][/doublepost]

And I don't want iOS becoming windows. Windows is so bloated because every it can run apps in dos, 64 bit, 32 bit and supports every app and all legacy stuff going to to 1980.

Removal of 32 bit apps is not a bad thing. This is on the developer not Apple.

Please see above.
We are not talking decades of legacy, we're talking < 5 years.

 

[C DM]

If you define long time as two years or so, I wonder what your definition of a decade and century might be. Apple certainly does have everything to do with supporting apps for a long time. Developers pay a fee to write for the closed ios system. The implicit guarantee is that Apple allows approved apps to work for a good long time. The gaurentee extends to customers getting what they paid for as well. Considering ios can not be downgraded, users should expect new ios versions won't kill their purchased software.
[doublepost=1485979829][/doublepost]
See above.

What does that have to do with warnings that were being discussed?

 

[smacrumon]

What does that have to do with warnings that were being discussed?

The warnings shouldn't be there. Apple, just make it work. It just works. That's what's it's meant to do. The two prompts are stupid as bad operating system software gets. Certainly not elegant. Whiffs of 1999 Windows.

 

[KiddKaffeine]

You kind of do.

You can press the button, but whether it will actually compile, and even work correctly is an entirely different matter. Lots of non-trivial apps require a variety of updates and QA.

I mean, what you're saying is kind of like getting a multiple choice test and selecting a bunch of random answers and being like, "Surely this will be fine."

 

[I7guy]

The warnings shouldn't be there. Apple, just make it work. It just works. That's what's it's meant to do. The two prompts are stupid as bad operating system software gets. Certainly not elegant. Whiffs of 1999 Windows.

The are making it work. They are deprecating 32 bit apps. This means they can remove code that runs 32 bit apps from iOS.