iPad Pro iPad Pro will be a failure...

[zacheryjensen]

True. Times are different though. At the time the iPad came out. There was no other comparable device.

In in the market. At the price point I'd get a surface 10 out of 10 times.

A pro device of this nature that does not run desktop apps is not s pro device IMO.

I would be right there with you if the Surface line didn't have so many stability issues. Windows, and its entire culture of fragmented hardware, driver, etc. is really making that product suffer. You know, the screen part of the Surface Book and the iPad Pro are almost the same size. Really very close. Same weight. Of course, the battery life suffers, but, that device is more powerful (potentially) than the iPad Pro will ever be. It's on par with 13" MacBook Pro, and goes beyond when attached to the dedicated GPU component. Though the cost is much higher for that, but, we're talking "Pro" here so it's fine. $2100 is quite reasonable. I'd certainly have bought one if it didn't launch with so many problems.

In reality, this kind of stability is a huge part of what attracts me to iOS. Tons of apps for peripheral use (task management, note taking, planning, design, etc.) that run quite swiftly on a relatively low power device with very good battery life, and very stable. It's highly attractive.

But none of that matters if it can't run the software you need and nobody is making the software you need for the device :-/

 

[zacheryjensen]

The same criticisms Macs used to get. All we heard throughout the 90s and early 00's is I use my computer to do real work.

However, the path the iPad is taking is nothing like the Mac. Very much UNLIKE the Mac, Apple is maintaining strict limits on what can be done. Whereas, with Mac, the switch to OS X and eventually Intel processors vastly expanded the available software that could be relatively easily ported and eventually customized with no gatekeeper standing in the way. Mac's path through its life has been one of adoptions and expansion of what it even means to be a Mac, shedding outdated OS paradigms and adopting better ones (even if they are technically older) which led to a very good platform for pro work.

A huge part of that effort came from outside Apple, from the open source community at large, and third party companies supporting the platform with development tools that are not as primitive as what Apple has offered and continues to offer.

Conversely, with iPad, you have iOS, which is a great OS for a locked down, safe room type of OS targeting phones and similar types of "closed" devices. It's a lot like a game console in a way. But, that severely restricts the possibility for third parties to expand the capability of the platform beyond Apple's own intention. In essence, iPad/iOS in general, is going the opposite direction the Mac did, if only in the sense that as the hardware grows in capability, the platform remains locked into its original view of what can be accepted there. iPad Pro is no different. It does not change this trend at all.

It is, for example, impossible to write a top class IDE for compiling and debugging native applications, not even for apps targeting the iOS device itself, because that violates app store restrictions. For this type of tool to be useful, you would need to be able to remotely access source code repositories. That's definitely not allowed. It has nothing to do with OS or hardware limits. It's entirely policy driven.

There are other problems for developers as well, again, not so much in hardware. The iPad we're talking about is significantly more powerful than necessary for really any kind of pro app assuming it was actually careful designed. The issues are revolving around app store rules, apple's large cut of purchase fees, their restrictions on things like trial periods, and so on.

So what Apple is doing effectively mutes the potential of the device and limits it to soft work like drawing or writing in lightweight apps that are fragmented all over purely to better cope with crazy ass app store review problems and the like.

 

[T4R06]

How many of you had the 1st iPad? Then they introduced the iPad 2.

This will what happen on the iPad pro. The shortage and hard to find. I'm like crazy looking for one and I almost even payed over $100 thru CL. Then I found like 50miles risking driving at Best Buy just to get one..

 

[daniel1948]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: A laptop and a tablet are such different animals that trying to combine them into a hybrid will produce a device that is a compromise on both. You can do it, and there will be a market of people who need both and want everything in one unit. For such people, it can be worth it, but it's still a compromise. The Surface will never be as good a tablet as a dedicated tablet, and will never be as good a laptop as a dedicated laptop.

 

[AppleRobert]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: A laptop and a tablet are such different animals that trying to combine them into a hybrid will produce a device that is a compromise on both. You can do it, and there will be a market of people who need both and want everything in one unit. For such people, it can be worth it, but it's still a compromise. The Surface will never be as good a tablet as a dedicated tablet, and will never be as good a laptop as a dedicated laptop.

Agreed. Those 2 in 1 laptops on the market from manufacturers just don't cut it either, maybe jack of all trades but definitely a master of none. Besides that, they are too bulky.

 

[mangoman]

I got my hands on the iPad Pro and pencil in early October, at a private Apple event during Adobe Max. As a designer and illustrator who spends a LOT of time drawing, I left that iPad Pro demo thinking, Take my money. Actually, I joked about stealing the device. See the video here (I'm at the end):

Yes, there's palm rejection in the Adobe app I used. Yes, the pressure sensitivity is awesome. Yes, the pencil thickness and weight is fantastic—not the fat, 'stoner crayons' we've known up 'til now.

Yes, I'm selling my fancy pants Wacom and yes, my preorder for an iPad Pro is done.

 

[iTom17]

I don't think Apple should even think about putting OS X on the iPad, because it would completely destroy the idea of the tablet. It was invented to be between the smartphone and laptop, and to be better than a smartphone (bigger) and better than a laptop (more portable), while maintaining usability and great performance. The iPad does just that, and the iPad Pro is the next level of mobile computing.

Like Tim Cook once said (and it has been mentioned in this topic): “You can merge a toaster and a refrigerator, but that’s probably not going to be pleasing to anyone.” That's kind of my idea of the Microsoft Surface Pro. It has great potential, but not as an ideal tablet. That's in stark contrast to the iPad Pro, which shares the simple UI of iOS. So it feels like any other iOS device, making it really easy to use. Not that Windows lacks that, but many people prefer iOS for being so clean. You're not being overwhelmed by useless stuff like on Windows (keep in mind that I still love it since I use it all-day long).

 

[Casuana]

I don't think Apple should even think about putting OS X on the iPad, because it would completely destroy the idea of the tablet. It was invented to be between the smartphone and laptop, and to be better than a smartphone (bigger) and better than a laptop (more portable), while maintaining usability and great performance. The iPad does just that, and the iPad Pro is the next level of mobile computing.

Like Tim Cook once said (and it has been mentioned in this topic): “You can merge a toaster and a refrigerator, but that’s probably not going to be pleasing to anyone.” That's kind of my idea of the Microsoft Surface Pro. It has great potential, but not as an ideal tablet. That's in stark contrast to the iPad Pro, which shares the simple UI of iOS. So it feels like any other iOS device, making it really easy to use. Not that Windows lacks that, but many people prefer iOS for being so clean. You're not being overwhelmed by useless stuff like on Windows (keep in mind that I still love it since I use it all-day long).

The problem is that iPads are in a middle ground between phones and laptops, but yet they share exactly the same software as phones making it hard to utilize the large screen and faster hardware. If Macbooks are refrigerators and iPhones are toasters, then iPads are microwaves running on toaster software.

I would like a separate OS for iPads with a touch friendly interface but with core productivity features like a file system and not being shackled to just the App Store. iPad can never be a laptop replacement as long as it's impossible (or unnecessarily contrived) to do simple things like download a file, open it with an app of my choice, and send it via e-mail.

 

[iTom17]

The problem is that iPads are in a middle ground between phones and laptops, but yet they share exactly the same software as phones making it hard to utilize the large screen and faster hardware. If Macbooks are refrigerators and iPhones are toasters, then iPads are microwaves running on toaster software.

I would like a separate OS for iPads with a touch friendly interface but with core productivity features like a file system and not being shackled to just the App Store. iPad can never be a laptop replacement as long as it's impossible (or unnecessarily contrived) to do simple things like download a file, open it with an app of my choice, and send it via e-mail.

You know you can do all of that, right? I can download files (although, if I do so from Safari I can only download documents), tap the share button and choose an app to open it in and later I can send it to others with Mail. That last thing is possible as of iOS 9, and it doesn't even matter what file you want to send (tried it with an executable file from my NAS using the built-in Document Provider).

And I don't feel like it's hard to utilize the large screen and faster hardware at all, it's just the developers who have to do this. There's Split View, Slide Over and Picture-in-Picture now. And a toolbar at the keyboard, to quickly change basic layout of text. True, Apple could do more things to take even more advantage of the large canvas. Like adding more apps to the home screen (they did it with folders in iOS 9, so why not?). But overall iOS on the iPad does the job just fine.

In fact, I hope Apple is not going to chase Microsoft by making some kind of Tablet Mode of OS X. Because that would show that Apple has really lost vision for software innovation. Anyway, I can definitely see Apple making improvements with iOS 10, so let's have some patience on this. I mean, they thought iOS 8 would get Split View. Turned it, they saved it for iOS 9. They might had even more stuff coming to the iPad, but to ensure iOS 10 gets a lot features, they possibly saved it for that one.

We'll know it at the next WWDC.

 

[Dammit Cubs]

I hope this is a failure - maybe then I can get one of those pencils!!

 

[mattoligy]

The problem is that iPads are in a middle ground between phones and laptops, but yet they share exactly the same software as phones making it hard to utilize the large screen and faster hardware. If Macbooks are refrigerators and iPhones are toasters, then iPads are microwaves running on toaster software.

I would like a separate OS for iPads with a touch friendly interface but with core productivity features like a file system and not being shackled to just the App Store. iPad can never be a laptop replacement as long as it's impossible (or unnecessarily contrived) to do simple things like download a file, open it with an app of my choice, and send it via e-mail.

Well said...

 

[Michael Goff]

Guys, guys, the best thing to do with hardware that's built to be a touch device is to put software on it that isn't touch optimized. That's what you do. It's like how the best way to get to work is to put shoes on your hands and walk on your hands to work...

 

[mattoligy]

Guys, guys, the best thing to do with hardware that's built to be a touch device is to put software on it that isn't touch optimized. That's what you do. It's like how the best way to get to work is to put shoes on your hands and walk on your hands to work...

Because bringing touch functionality to OS X is impossible right? Microsoft must be the exception, because they have super human powers...

I agree that desktop operating systems don't work well with touch, and people keep asking for OS X on iPad because they want a truly powerful OS matched with ultimate portability and the intimacy of touch. I agree. However, I think the answer, rather than trying to make iOS (an iPhone OS) something it's not, is the opposite. Why not develop a lightweight, touch optimised, user friendly OS X to run exclusively on iPad... An OS that looks like the love child of iOS and OS X. That is the answer and would be awesome!

When you watch a good sci-fi, such as Avatar, do you see people walking around with laptops? No, they all have tablets! Do you know why... Because laptops are old fashioned, cumbersome, heavy, prehistoric pieces of point and click! The future is tablets. We just need to work out the best way to bring it all together. Microsoft know this, even though they are barking up the wrong tree! I would say their answer seems like a quick fix, a bodge job if you will. We need something truly new!

 

[pika2000]

Why not develop a lightweight, touch optimised, user friendly OS X to run exclusively on iPad... An OS that looks like the love child of iOS and OS X. That is the answer and would be awesome!

No it won't be awesome. Simply because the apps for that platform will be OS X apps, which are not touch friendly. This is exactly what Microsoft did with Windows 8. They created a touch friendly OS with Metro. However, nearly all the apps still reside in the classic desktop UI, so it doesn't work to the point that people hating Metro and MS reverting back in Windows 10.

Apple is already on its way in making iOS more powerful. Remember, in the past, iOS doesn't even allow 3rd party apps. Then we have apps, then we have background processes and more extensibility, then as the hardware becoming more powerful, we have side by side multitasking. I think it is better to take iOS into new heights then forcing OS X to sing a different tune. And yes, the iOS on the iPad is already "different" in a sense than the one on the phone. I think we just see the starting point. I mean the iPad Pro has 4GB of RAM. That should be a signal that Apple will bring iOS into new levels.

 

[masotime]

my preorder for an iPad Pro is done.

Were you able to get a Pencil? I'm genuinely interested.

 

[mattoligy]

No it won't be awesome. Simply because the apps for that platform will be OS X apps, which are not touch friendly. This is exactly what Microsoft did with Windows 8. They created a touch friendly OS with Metro. However, nearly all the apps still reside in the classic desktop UI, so it doesn't work to the point that people hating Metro and MS reverting back in Windows 10.

Apple is already on its way in making iOS more powerful. Remember, in the past, iOS doesn't even allow 3rd party apps. Then we have apps, then we have background processes and more extensibility, then as the hardware becoming more powerful, we have side by side multitasking. I think it is better to take iOS into new heights then forcing OS X to sing a different tune. And yes, the iOS on the iPad is already "different" in a sense than the one on the phone. I think we just see the starting point. I mean the iPad Pro has 4GB of RAM. That should be a signal that Apple will bring iOS into new levels.

But it's just so far away! And OS X can run iOS apps!

 

[ke-iron]

Long time Apple user here...

The iPad Pro will be a big failure for Tim Cook. Really, he just doesn't have a long term vision for the tablet line. Bigger iPad with stylus, but same OS is honestly the dumbest thing Apple has come up with since the Apple Watch.

The iPad Pro needs to be able to run OSX or have some sort of file system as a lite replacement for a MacBook, otherwise it's just a glorified and expensive version of an iPad Air (which I sold to get a MBP)

Now I read Apple is investing resources to building a car. (Slaps forehead) Laughable Tim.

No. Try again.

 

[BenTrovato]

It really is too early to know how the Pro will fare. So far, Apple hasn't wowed me with what the Pro can do - but I wasn't expecting them to. Maybe it's going to change. The reason I never care about Apple's first iteration is because they often gimp their initial products to leave room for improvement and find out what the customer really wants or how people will use it.

People want to think Apple is this perfect company but they're not, they screw up a lot and then hit it out of the park with the next devices which shows how well they adapt. They have the luxury of operating this way, not everyone does.

 

[AdonisSMU]

However, the path the iPad is taking is nothing like the Mac. Very much UNLIKE the Mac, Apple is maintaining strict limits on what can be done. Whereas, with Mac, the switch to OS X and eventually Intel processors vastly expanded the available software that could be relatively easily ported and eventually customized with no gatekeeper standing in the way. Mac's path through its life has been one of adoptions and expansion of what it even means to be a Mac, shedding outdated OS paradigms and adopting better ones (even if they are technically older) which led to a very good platform for pro work.

A huge part of that effort came from outside Apple, from the open source community at large, and third party companies supporting the platform with development tools that are not as primitive as what Apple has offered and continues to offer.

Conversely, with iPad, you have iOS, which is a great OS for a locked down, safe room type of OS targeting phones and similar types of "closed" devices. It's a lot like a game console in a way. But, that severely restricts the possibility for third parties to expand the capability of the platform beyond Apple's own intention. In essence, iPad/iOS in general, is going the opposite direction the Mac did, if only in the sense that as the hardware grows in capability, the platform remains locked into its original view of what can be accepted there. iPad Pro is no different. It does not change this trend at all.

It is, for example, impossible to write a top class IDE for compiling and debugging native applications, not even for apps targeting the iOS device itself, because that violates app store restrictions. For this type of tool to be useful, you would need to be able to remotely access source code repositories. That's definitely not allowed. It has nothing to do with OS or hardware limits. It's entirely policy driven.

There are other problems for developers as well, again, not so much in hardware. The iPad we're talking about is significantly more powerful than necessary for really any kind of pro app assuming it was actually careful designed. The issues are revolving around app store rules, apple's large cut of purchase fees, their restrictions on things like trial periods, and so on.

So what Apple is doing effectively mutes the potential of the device and limits it to soft work like drawing or writing in lightweight apps that are fragmented all over purely to better cope with crazy ass app store review problems and the like.

No one has made "open" work on tablets and phones. However Apple has loosened up its restrictions on iOS.

If you are a Dev or someone who needs more you can go outside the App Store to install apps you need on your device. Download the code off github then run it in Xcode and boom your iPad has avoided the Apple Store. So there are options if you know what you are doing. Forever tone else they have the options they need.

Because bringing touch functionality to OS X is impossible right? Microsoft must be the exception, because they have super human powers...

I agree that desktop operating systems don't work well with touch, and people keep asking for OS X on iPad because they want a truly powerful OS matched with ultimate portability and the intimacy of touch. I agree. However, I think the answer, rather than trying to make iOS (an iPhone OS) something it's not, is the opposite. Why not develop a lightweight, touch optimised, user friendly OS X to run exclusively on iPad... An OS that looks like the love child of iOS and OS X. That is the answer and would be awesome!

When you watch a good sci-fi, such as Avatar, do you see people walking around with laptops? No, they all have tablets! Do you know why... Because laptops are old fashioned, cumbersome, heavy, prehistoric pieces of point and click! The future is tablets. We just need to work out the best way to bring it all together. Microsoft know this, even though they are barking up the wrong tree! I would say their answer seems like a quick fix, a bodge job if you will. We need something truly new!

Powerful comes with careful thought, time and consideration. You don't get something for nothing. You have to put in the work and get back data etc...

 

[maflynn]

Its interesting as I read various reviews, there's a somewhat common thread.

1. Its like a giant iPhone or iPad (yes, the comparison to the iPhone has been made).
2. its big, too big to hold it for various iPad games.
3. Its fast
4. Its expensive, especially if you consider the pencil and the type cover.

Overall the reviews I've been reading have a fair amount of positive comments but some of their negatives have been quite telling. I truly do wonder if this product will be more niche like, even though Cook is trying to push this for everyone.

I can't see spending close to 1,200 on a tablet that does not run a desktop OS, i.e., I can spend less and get a laptop.

 

[TJone]

I want an iPad Pro with iOS and full OSX installed which lets you switch back and forth as needed, 1TB storage, USB-C, Smart Cover with a trackpad for OSX mode, and ForceTouch. Maybe in 5 years... its good the Surface is pushing the envelope and Apple

 

[AttilaTheHun]

I would be right there with you if the Surface line didn't have so many stability issues. Windows, and its entire culture of fragmented hardware, driver, etc. is really making that product suffer. You know, the screen part of the Surface Book and the iPad Pro are almost the same size. Really very close. Same weight. Of course, the battery life suffers, but, that device is more powerful (potentially) than the iPad Pro will ever be. It's on par with 13" MacBook Pro, and goes beyond when attached to the dedicated GPU component. Though the cost is much higher for that, but, we're talking "Pro" here so it's fine. $2100 is quite reasonable. I'd certainly have bought one if it didn't launch with so many problems.

In reality, this kind of stability is a huge part of what attracts me to iOS. Tons of apps for peripheral use (task management, note taking, planning, design, etc.) that run quite swiftly on a relatively low power device with very good battery life, and very stable. It's highly attractive.

But none of that matters if it can't run the software you need and nobody is making the software you need for the device :-/

You have a point, the way I see it most of the people that using a computer for the wrong reason,
playing games watching movies E mails surf the net and... for them an iPad is perfect.

 

[George Dawes]

I'm a bit of a moaning git about Apple's current state after Steve died but even I have to say that the Pro is imo the best iPad yet !!!

Although charging the pencil with it sticking out IS utterly crazy and is asking to get broken...

Agree about the watch though , first apple product in many years I've never been the slightest bit interested in or seen the point of apart from a Captain Cook ego trip.

 

[masotime]

Although charging the pencil with it sticking out IS utterly crazy and is asking to get broken...

You managed to get a Pencil? Which store did you go to...? Or was it an online order...?

 

[George Dawes]

I ordered one , I'm just observing photos of it. Haven't got it yet..

I thought it was a joke at first- it's just daft !!!