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Why is ASP relevant to a consumer? Cheerleading for ASP is about the most vomit-inducing thing I've seen end users do in technology.

Huawei sold more smart phones. They might be crap - and I think they are - but they sold more. End of story. No need for anyone to get out their pram or encourage Apple to gouge us even more.

Why are total unit sales relevant to consumers?
 
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If I had a huge services sector I was making money off of and dependant on a large user base to grow, I would want to sell a lot of units.

How many of Apples services are cross platform and will grow even if the competitors hardware (and OS) gets the upper hand?

I can only think of Apple Music as being cross platform tbh.

Conversely speaking, how many of the Android smartphone companies have services and ecosystems of their own that will have meaningful growth in the future? How many are as successful as Apple’s services division and do you think they’d give Apple any true competition in that regard?

I think Apple is very smart in terms of business acumen and many people don’t see the genius or give much credence to how well the company is run.
 
I am a consumer. Would I rather the tablet manufacturer made more profit from me? No. The numbers for Samsung and Amazon are available in the article. I mentioned Android tablets as a category while replying to the claim that Android tablets are dead. There are different contexts. In some, it makes sense to compare vendor vs vendor. In other contexts, talking about OS (ecosystem) is more appropriate.

Have you not wondered why the iPad is pretty much the only viable tablet option left in the market?

I wonder if it’s because Apple seems to be the only company actually making any money from them? It’s not exactly rocket science. A profitable product justifies continued development in it, while an unprofitable product eventually gets discontinued.

We are seeing the same situation play out with the Apple Watch right now. Of course nobody want to spend more money than they absolutely have to, but lets not delude ourselves that there aren’t ramifications in this regard.
 
They aint... unless you have some weird perspective on the world... I also am not bothered how many pairs of jeans Levi sells either... but I'm.sure on levirumours.com there's some weirdo knows and dates...
Financial information about Apple in general has no place in many conversations on this site.

It does serve a purpose when the “Tim cook is running Apple into the ground” narrative surfaces. (and quite frequently) it reminds those who believe the current management is incompentent how far Apple has become. Gross margins, asp, revenue, profits are all part of the conversation.
 
Financial information about Apple in general has no place in many conversations on this site.

It does serve a purpose when the “Tim cook is running Apple into the ground” narrative surfaces. (and quite frequently) it reminds those who believe the current management is incompentent how far Apple has become. Gross margins, asp, revenue, profits are all part of the conversation.
That's fair point, it's the "We don't care if Apple have lost their innovative edge, look aT the profits" brigade that make you want to vomit!! Huge profits usually come from selling something at a much higher price than it COSTS to make, so bragging about this as if its a good thing is the most bizarre thing ever... it's only slightly worse tho than folk who don't want Apple to lower their prices as "poor people" could then afford this luxury niche brand and it would.then somehow dilute the premium experience.. lol.
 
And the ASP of the Huawei phone was?

Again, who cares about shipping cheap junk.

Apple owns the smartphone and tablet markets from a profitablity perspective.

And all a consumer cares about is how much profit a company makes.
 
They don’t, but the profit shows Apple makes what the consumer wants.
Nope, it shows they over charge them for the same items that other firms charge less for.. and still you seem somewhat proud of this fact... if Apple right now offered 200 bucks off your next iPhone purchase, would you accept? Or would you be strangely worried about their balance sheet?
 
Nope, it shows they over charge them for the same items that other firms charge less for.. and still you seem somewhat proud of this fact... if Apple right now offered 200 bucks off your next iPhone purchase, would you accept? Or would you be strangely worried about their balance sheet?
The term over charge is purely subjective and if applied in your context, for example car companies vastly overcharge on most models. If BMW offered 20 grand off on any m4 model I might leap at it.
 
Nope, it shows they over charge them for the same items that other firms charge less for.. and still you seem somewhat proud of this fact... if Apple right now offered 200 bucks off your next iPhone purchase, would you accept? Or would you be strangely worried about their balance sheet?
No it doesn’t. It shows people paid the price and didn’t choose the competition because of things they valued like, software, FaceID, the best processor, screens, design, camera, security, support, the whole package, etc.

Value is not defined by what you think. When a consumer buys, they see the value, so it’s a free choice. Apple showed you they have pricing power and offer products and services that in FY2018, 218M people were willing to pay for in the iPhone.

If you don’t see the value, buy the competition. That’s capitalism. 218M others didn’t buy the competition for their own reasons. These phones aren’t a commodity or a spec war.
 
At no point in history iOS (iPhone) was the biggest mobile operating system. The market share crown went straight from Symbian (Nokia) to Android (Google) years ago. Apple always only leads the market in quality and innovation. Just like BMW never sold the most cars. Volume sales are for brands like GM and Toyota. Has Toyota taken over the world?


Toyota almost did own the world car market. Then they added awful electric steering, combined with the cheapest possible rear suspensions that actually make their cars dangerous on the roads now. Insurance companies have been raising rates dramatically on Toyota recently because of this.

Like Apple, Toyota... blah blah...
 
Toyota almost did own the world car market. Then they added awful electric steering, combined with the cheapest possible rear suspensions that actually make their cars dangerous on the roads now. Insurance companies have been raising rates dramatically on Toyota recently because of this.

Like Apple, Toyota... blah blah...
Only in the anticompetitive US market. Everywhere else in the world Toyota’s brand is untarnished. If a foreign company becomes too successful, expect something to happen.
 
Y
But you can’t buy this phone officially in the US.

You can buy Huawei (and Honor) phones officially in the US but not through carriers. Carriers want to sell them but were pressured by government to back out of deals with Huawei. AT&T spent a year tuning the Kirin 970 to its network. The problem is that although Microsoft and Amazon will offer these phones, the user has to make sure they will work on the network and the situation works out to a de facto ban. That makes Huawei's success all the more remarkable.
 
They don’t, but the profit shows Apple makes what the consumer wants.
Well I care about unit sales because the more successful a device is, the more the manufacturing company will expend efforts in progressing the device. Developers will focus on more successful products and it’s even important for things like accessories.
 
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Well I care about unit sales because the more successful a device is, the more the manufacturing company will expend efforts in progressing the device. Developers will focus on more successful products and it’s even important for things like accessories.
Apple sold 2M more iPhone units in 2018 than 2017 and 20% more revenue.

Apple should have stopped reporting it 3 years ago, in my opinion. Analysts are focused on the wrong thing while Apple continues to grow revenue and eps. Good for Apple and will be better for investors longer term.

Services/consumer products company transition time.
 
Y


You can buy Huawei (and Honor) phones officially in the US but not through carriers. Carriers want to sell them but were pressured by government to back out of deals with Huawei. AT&T spent a year tuning the Kirin 970 to its network. The problem is that although Microsoft and Amazon will offer these phones, the user has to make sure they will work on the network and the situation works out to a de facto ban. That makes Huawei's success all the more remarkable.
The phones won't work on Verizon. And that one has to make sure the phone works on a US network and one has to work this out with the carrier, means that all but the most persistent will buy an unlocked phone. The phone may be a success outside of the US, but what are the US sales of unlocked phones.
 
Apple sold 2M more iPhone units in 2018 than 2017 and 20% more revenue.

Apple should have stopped reporting it 3 years ago, in my opinion. Analysts are focused on the wrong thing while Apple continues to grow revenue and eps. Good for Apple and will be better for investors longer term.

Services/consumer products company transition time.

Analysts are focused on manipulating Apple stock indirectly. Apple is a great buy for anyone who is looking for a LTI. The way the stock moves is pretty funny.
 
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That's fair point, it's the "We don't care if Apple have lost their innovative edge, look aT the profits" brigade that make you want to vomit!! Huge profits usually come from selling something at a much higher price than it COSTS to make, so bragging about this as if its a good thing is the most bizarre thing ever... it's only slightly worse tho than folk who don't want Apple to lower their prices as "poor people" could then afford this luxury niche brand and it would.then somehow dilute the premium experience.. lol.

You miss the point.

Apple’s sales and profit numbers are evidence that they are still every bit as innovative, and that more importantly, people value Apple products enough to pay those handsome prices for them.

Of course every company wants to sell their products for more than it costs to make. I personally see no shame in this. If people thought Apple products sucked or were overpriced, they wouldn’t have bought them, plain and simple.

Just like how more sales numbers mean more units in circulation, which in turn means more third party app and accessory support. So there’s a benefit to us nonetheless. It’s not apparent, but it’s there.

Profits are what allows Apple to stay in business and keep the lights on, continue investing in custom technology and do all the things they are doing now. Nobody likes paying more than they absolutely have to (I don’t either), but I do feel that the critics really need to learn to start looking beyond their own noses and start appreciating the bigger picture.
 
At no point in history iOS (iPhone) was the biggest mobile operating system. The market share crown went straight from Symbian (Nokia) to Android (Google) years ago. Apple always only leads the market in quality and innovation. Just like BMW never sold the most cars. Volume sales are for brands like GM and Toyota. Has Toyota taken over the world?
Quality, maybe. Innovation not so much (anymore)
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SO sick of news like these. Huawei sells phones starting from 100 ish dollars and up. Apple sells WAYYY more expensive phones than these. "Huawei overtakes Apple" no....they did not. They will never in terms of profitability and in high end devices. Literally NOBODY will buy Huawei phones if they're priced like an iPhones and the P20 smthn (no fkn clue of the name lol) is an incredibly a niche market with probably less audience than the pixel audience.

Its the same as saying "Honda overtakes Lamborghini in total qty sold". Selling more $14k civic than $250k Lamobo is supposed to happen because its cheaper. Huawei sells most of their phones in China you know why? Because majority of the people of China have lower disposable income compared to developed countries obviously. No money = buy cheap phones.
Lol, so much anger. BTW I actually just bought the mate 20 Pro.
 
Profits are what allows Apple to stay in business and keep the lights on, continue investing in custom technology and do all the things they are doing now. Nobody likes paying more than they absolutely have to (I don’t either), but I do feel that the critics really need to learn to start looking beyond their own noses and start appreciating the bigger picture.

Are you sure you are looking at the bigger picture?

There are tons of tech companies that continue to invest in custom technology without raking in increasing profits. Examples? Look at Tesla and Uber to start. You may not like their business model or some of their ethics, but they stay in business, keep the lights on, do all the things they are doing now, and continue investing in custom technology.

/shrug
 
Apple sold 2M more iPhone units in 2018 than 2017 and 20% more revenue.

Apple should have stopped reporting it 3 years ago, in my opinion. Analysts are focused on the wrong thing while Apple continues to grow revenue and eps. Good for Apple and will be better for investors longer term.

Services/consumer products company transition time.


Developers want to know how many devices and what kind are out there so they know where to direct limited resources.

Less info is bad for developers - and bad for iOS in the long term.

If developers walk en mass, like they did from Windows Phone, Symbian, and BlackBerry, iPhone is dead.

No one ever thought what happened to those platforms would happen... until it happened.
 
Are you sure you are looking at the bigger picture?

There are tons of tech companies that continue to invest in custom technology without raking in increasing profits. Examples? Look at Tesla and Uber to start. You may not like their business model or some of their ethics, but they stay in business, keep the lights on, do all the things they are doing now, and continue investing in custom technology.

/shrug

That’s because these companies are still at the early growth stage, where it’s considered acceptable to make a loss while you set up your fundamentals and chase market share. These companies are essentially buoyed by investor money and sold on dreams of upending the current status quo and replacing it with a new world order.

Eventually, they will have to not only turn a profit, but make a lot of it in order to keep shareholders happy. Otherwise, the board will simply replace the CEO with someone who can and will.

I don’t think you will find a company whose shareholders will be happy to see it keep reporting losses every quarter in perpetuity. None of them are charities. Not even Spotify.

Apple is a mature company. They will not be able to produce the same growth they did like 5 years ago. So it’s only natural that they transition from chasing market share to selling more hardware at increasing prices.

https://stratechery.com/2018/apples-middle-age/

It’s basic business 101. I have no idea why people are acting all shocked or surprised.
 
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