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Maybe with the overtime and whatever else, this additional remuneration is really reducing the suffering of humans in China that we don't know about. In other words, it's a blessing, not a curse.

I agree so much with this statement. I am against human exploitation of course, but I also know many people would rather go for the extra compensation to support their families, you cannot compare it directly to US mentality, many of these guys are getting paid more than the average factory worker over there. I have been to China, it is magnificent, but many people live in pretty bad conditions and I know for a fact they would love having this job.
 
Maybe with the overtime and whatever else, this additional remuneration is really reducing the suffering of humans in China that we don't know about. In other words, it's a blessing, not a curse.

Come on, they are feeling so blessed they jump out of the windows so Cook needs to go there personally to meet with the suicide experts and the factory needs to install the suicide nets?


I am not naive and understand that this issue might be widespread and common in Asia, but I do not want to treat it neither as normal nor acceptable.
 
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Come on, they are feeling so blessed they jump out of the windows so Cook needs to go there personally to meet with the suicide experts and the factory needs to install the suicide nets?


I am not naive and understand that this issue might be widespread and common in Asia, but I do not want to treat it neither as normal nor acceptable.
It's certainly terrible, but unfortunately not unique in terms of workplace violence and self-harm:


But are attempting to form a link between additional overtime and compensation and suicide. Seems tenuous at best.
 
Steve Jobs was a genius, but he was a psychopath that demanded just as much or more out of his employees and partners.

Tim Cook has a resume unmatched by any CEO on the world. He’s done an amazing job with Apple...Better than Jobs on many metrics.

Steve is dead, you don't know if Apple would be this big or bigger if he was still alive.

Tim does a great job at Apple, I am not sure though if it got so much better under him, financially Apple got huge, this might also be the case if Steve was still amongst us.
 
Oh great so we have the guilt of slave labour when we’re holding our new iPhone 12’s.

China is such a terrible place for workers rights.

You do realize people come to Foxconn voluntarily to get money for a job right? Crunch time overtime is not an uncommon occurrence elsewhere for manufacturing.
 
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LOL at all clueless comments from random western guys that know nothing about China
  1. It’s not communism. It’s the opposite of communism. Regardless of what CCP stands for.
  2. It’s difficult to find a job in China. And Foxconn is a rather ok alternative if you have no education.
  3. Regarding no vacation. This is basically true for the entire China. When you have a holiday, you then have to work an extra days to “compensate” for that holiday.
  4. Regarding the low salary. My wife’s father is a brain surgeon in China and earns $500 per month. Basically, the living cost is extremely low unless you live in the giant cities. And guess what, they don’t put factories where the cost of living is super high.


I taught English in China for 15 years. The make up days were the worst lol
 
Steve is dead, you don't know if Apple would be this big or bigger if he was still alive.

Tim does a great job at Apple, I am not sure though if it got so much better under him, financially Apple got huge, this might also be the case if Steve was still amongst us.
I know how big it was when he was alive and how big it is now...and who has run it.

Saying Apple would be X bigger or better now is a waste of time And an unknown.
 
I didn't say that the American economy was weak. I am just saying that there are other countries in the world (some of which have even higher per capita GDPs) that have higher standards in personal and social coverage. I have lived in the USA and love many aspects of this country. But that doesn't mean that there aren't other countries that have even higher standards in one regard or another - and the ranking of these countries on the world happiness report seems to support that this can definitely make a difference.
I said we know how to make money...happy is a completely different story, but many people aren’t happy.
 
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I know how big it was when he was alive and how big it is now...and who has run it.

Saying Apple would be X bigger or better now is a waste of time And an unknown.

You said
Tim Cook has a resume unmatched by any CEO on the world. He’s done an amazing job with Apple...Better than Jobs on many metrics.

You don't know, it's you who started speculating.

Tim does a great job, I am not denying it but to say Tim is better than Steve is ...speculating.

Better than Jobs on many metrics

Enlighten me....(with facts).
 
Apple supporting COMMUNISM once again... Move your factories somewhere else!!!
Yep except communism actually means equal pay no matter what you do. China is definitely not actually communist any more. It's actually capitalist but run by a non-democratic totalitarian (sort of) government. No country is communist anymore, hardcore communism was attempted in Russia, but failed miserably, as it is human nature to want yourself and others to be rewarded accordingly for effort, so all that happened was corruption (which destroys any economy, as it is horribly inefficient). The reason it was attempted is because the opposite existed beforehand, where all the wealth was concentrated in the very few, to the point that the masses were starving to death (this is also not reward according to effort, so it also fails), and the masses held a revolution and the new leaders tried communism. Most modern countries have some variation of capitalism, as it is the easiest system that works itself towards reward according to effort. However, it is also easily distorted if the correct checks and balances aren't in place, and more and more we are seeing heavy concentrations of wealth to the few (who are rewarded far more than effort), and if it keeps going, eventually it will break. History is one long story of systems and empires working well at first, but then failing when the reward according to effort breaks down.
 
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Really, this graphic says otherwise.

View attachment 960994
Official unemployment rates are garbage unfortunately. For example, here in Australia, if you work one single hour in a month, then you aren't counted as unemployed for that month's stats. Similarly, if you are out of work and looking for work, but haven't signed up for unemployment benefits, then you also aren't counted as unemployed. So these days (well, pre-covid), if someone loses their job, they often sign up for a bit of uber driving, or uber eats or similar gig work while they look for a job. So how do you think the unemployment stats in Australia look compared to the real numbers of people looking for work (we will never know, as those figures either aren't counted, or aren't available)? Why is it done that way? Because it makes the government look like they are doing a better job then they are.
 
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Haha, a bonus of about *25-30 cents an hour.

Mandatory overtime, Hmmm.

*Yes..yes, I know, it's China/Asia, cost of living is much lower than here.
Actually now I think about it, 55 days is not much less than 3 months, so a bonus of more than ~$400 ain't that bad, but, do they also get hourly overtime paid, if not then that's a different case.

Is your pet that taught you math?
 
You said


You don't know, it's you who started speculating.

Tim does a great job, I am not denying it but to say Tim is better than Steve is ...speculating.



Enlighten me....(with facts).
What are you taking about? You don’t know the numbers?

Cook created more shareholder value ($1.6T), sold more iPhones (by giving people larger screens), created the wearables business, and made services a revenue stream that got Apple the multiple and respect it deserves.

Cook objectively grew Apple to a bigger, more valuable company that sells more devices that Jobs ever did. Those are facts verifiable by the 10K and public data.
 
You said


You don't know, it's you who started speculating.

Tim does a great job, I am not denying it but to say Tim is better than Steve is ...speculating.



Enlighten me....(with facts).

To me, it’s not about who is better than the other.

Different people are needed at different points in a company history. Jobs was right for his era, but he would have been a disaster for the Cook era. Cook is amazing, and has been responsible for most of the achievements of Apple, just not the initial innovation and concept that Jobs provided. Rather, what Cook has done is refine the culture and expanded it, and I feel he has done as fine a job as any CEO in American history, if not world business history.

Tim Cook is Eisenhower, Steve Jobs is Churchill.
 
oh.well., no rest ...

cancelling holidays just because Apple wants to be ahead? That's not on my list.

There would be few reason why people have to cancel holidays, to work and one of them would be because Apple is behind. (no idea wha the other one is)
 
Official unemployment rates are garbage unfortunately. For example, here in Australia, if you work one single hour in a month, then you aren't counted as unemployed for that month's stats. Similarly, if you are out of work and looking for work, but haven't signed up for unemployment benefits, then you also aren't counted as unemployed. So these days (well, pre-covid), if someone loses their job, they often sign up for a bit of uber driving, or uber eats or similar gig work while they look for a job. So how do you think the unemployment stats in Australia look compared to the real numbers of people looking for work (we will never know, as those figures either aren't counted, or aren't available)? Why is it done that way? Because it makes the government look like they are doing a better job then they are.

There's hidden unemployment everywhere, not only in China, numbers are always off.
 
What are you taking about? You don’t know the numbers?

Cook created more shareholder value ($1.6T), sold more iPhones (by giving people larger screens), created the wearables business, and made services a revenue stream that got Apple the multiple and respect it deserves.

Cook objectively grew Apple to a bigger, more valuable company that sells more devices that Jobs ever did. Those are facts verifiable by the 10K and public data.

You still don't seem to get it, I was saying that if Steve was alive the company could be as big if not bigger, you just don't know, I am pointing that out to you in the last few posts.

To me, it’s not about who is better than the other.

Different people are needed at different points in a company history. Jobs was right for his era, but he would have been a disaster for the Cook era. Cook is amazing, and has been responsible for most of the achievements of Apple, just not the initial innovation and concept that Jobs provided. Rather, what Cook has done is refine the culture and expanded it, and I feel he has done as fine a job as any CEO in American history, if not world business history.

Tim Cook is Eisenhower, Steve Jobs is Churchill.

As above, Steve is dead so we never know how the company would be now if he was dead, Tim does indeed do a good job but we will never know if the company would be the same or bigger now if Steve was still alive.

Is your pet that taught you math?

Haha, you're right, I was off by about 10 times.($1466/55/hours made per day)
It looks much better, a few $ per hour ain't bad, this will almost for sure include overtime, so overtime is paid by the bonus, dependable on how many hours a day you make this could be a great deal or just good.
 
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Will you quit with that already? What's that fit to do with the story?

My iPhone will need to be replaced next year. iPhones are the only smart phone I’ve ever had. That will change next year if Apple doesn’t get on board with Xbox X-Cloud support.
 
You still don't seem to get it, I was saying that if Steve was alive the company could be as big if not bigger, you just don't know, I am pointing that out to you in the last few posts.



As above, Steve is dead so we never know how the company would be now if he was dead, Tim does indeed do a good job but we will never know if the company would be the same or bigger now if Steve was still alive.



Haha, you're right, I was off by about 10 times.($1466/55/hours made per day)
It looks much better, a few $ per hour ain't bad, this will almost for sure include overtime, so overtime is paid by the bonus, dependable on how many hours a day you make this could be a great deal or just good.
Talking about what COULD be is a total waste of time. Apple could be bankrupt if Jobs were alive too. So what? The whole point I made was that Cook’s record is verifiable with facts.
 
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Talking about what COULD be is a total waste of time. Apple could be bankrupt if Jobs were alive too. So what? The whole point I made was that Cook’s record is verifiable with facts.

This is what you said, or did you forget what you said, I reacted to that post, now you try to turn things around.


Steve Jobs was a genius, but he was a psychopath that demanded just as much or more out of his employees and partners.
Tim Cook has a resume unmatched by any CEO on the world. He’s done an amazing job with Apple...Better than Jobs on many metrics.


I am done here, I pointed out what I meant multiple times, you just ignore my point.
Have a nice day.
 
This is what you said, or did you forget what you said, I reacted to that post, now you try to turn things around.





I am done here, I pointed out what I meant multiple times, you just ignore my point.
Have a nice day.
So you don’t understand the metrics in which Cook has done better? Both have metrics you know.

Your point is based on nothing. My point it factual.
 
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