iPhone App Sideloading Coming to Users in the EU in First Half of 2024

[sehns]

We already do. And believe me, if Apple thought they could get away with charging more than they already are, they would.

We will pay the 15-30% on new devices.

 

[TheSynchronizer]

Happy to see that this time we in the EU get some good stuff first after waiting years for Apple Pay 😉
Looking forward to finally being able to install emulators on my iPhone, was always bugging me that Apple didn’t allow those 😁

People have been doing emulators on iOS for a long time now, usually by using developer certificate marketplaces to sign the apps for longer than a week.

This sideloading business is a welcome change though as I'm sure all of this will become even easier (and cheaper) now!

 

[MacBuddyz]

EU taxing +30% VAT for $1200 iPhone = good
Apple adding +30% to your $9.99 app = bad

Okay, EU

 

[Hrvoyay]

Until the EU or other governments mandate the removal of such steps.

What paranoid nonsense. EU just said they are fine with 10€ a month for ensuring “privacy” on Facebook/Instagram. Now you can either pay or be tracked by Meta everywhere for free. EU wants OPTIONS for users.

Also, somewhere you wrote ‘a German is being forced …“. That German right now can do A), nothing else. At some point, in EU, that German will be able to do A) or B). So that German can continue doing A) as he always has, but rest of us can finally chose an occasional B).

If I pay my iPad, MY IPAD, over a 1000€, I want freaking porn and torrents on it. Simple. Not even about money for me, I have no problem buying apps, I bought a subscription for 40€ recently through App Store instead of paying 30€ on website because it was easier to pay with FaceID then go through filling out credit card data.

 

[ZachApple]

The sandbox is not total security, just look at how many "execute arbitrary code with kernel privileges" CVEs are in the security notes each update.

Apple security releases - Apple Support

This document lists security updates and Rapid Security Responses for Apple software.

support.apple.com

 

[SactoGuy18]

I think a very likely change is in the App Store app, you now can select from multiple app stores. I think a future iOS 17.x release may get that ability worldwide.

 

[sehns]

Nah, my banks business banking portal doesn't have a mobile app it's all handled in a web browser and i've survived all this time. You guys really are buying apples pitch hook line and sinker. They have a lot of control over iOS Security and and that will include for side loaded apps.

You really think that they go through every app line by line already that passes through the app store? well they don't. Whatever malware thats possible with side-loading can already be done with apps in the app store. The only thing reviewers do is check the app works, meets guidelines and most importantly, gives Apple their 30% cut.

The hardest part is getting someone to install your app in the first place.

No banking apps? No Apple Pay? Or you will understand only after you get a text at 3AM that some boi in Singapore paid for Disneyland tickets with your card.

 

[MilaM]

So, to be clear then, you support the EU's actions here? Why, specifically?

Because I am pro competition and pro small business. And as things are right now, there is no real competition. Not on iOS, and also not on Android. I'm pro small developers, who practically have no recourse when one of the two giants decides to close their business down because of a technicality or wrong automated decision (you know, because competent support is to expensive), or even worse, by competing with them unfairly.

How so? Google charges the same if not more than Apple in their App store, even though most of what the EU is mandating is already available in the Android world.

Google has adopted almost the same rules as Apple. You can't be on the Play Store without paying Google for every transaction.

 

[djphat2000]

People angry that Apple won’t make as much money. Poor Apple!

I'm worried about security. Apple isn't poor.

You are rejecting freedom just so a multi-trillion dollar company can make money.

I have freedom. The freedom to pick a locked down wall-gardened iPhone. OR, not and pick Android.

This is a win for everyone unless you’re a hardcore fanboy or shareholder.

This is a win for those that "want" this. It's not a win for those that see it VERY differently from that point of view.
We are on MacRumors, so being a fanboy/girl/person is likely. Also being a shareholder is likely. We can still will if some of those that want it are also either or both. But, I'll state the obvious. Apple is a multi-trillion dollar company WITHOUT having had sideloading on the iPhone. So they are doing something right.

Android, Windows, and MacOS have “side loading” so it’s not as scary and dangerous as Apple would like you to believe. If you believe their lies then stay in your little walled garden safe space and Apple will hold your hand.

You also get virus/malware/ransomware on those. MacOS, due to it not being as popular as Windows and or Android and iOS. Doesn't get the attention the rest do. You can get malware on MacOS. It will do its best to prevent you from doing something stupid. But, you can override. On iOS (which you know). You can't override. If it doesn't come from the AppStore (and you didn't already Jail-Brake it). You "can't" very easily install anything. It's not foolproof. Zero days still exist. BUT, you're WAY less likely to get your device broken into unless you're literally a target of some government. Travel to places that have state sponsored hacking, etc. Or someone had physical access to your device.

There are a lot of people out there that have no idea what they are doing with anything that resembles a computer.
Now, they get to be exposed more easily to said hacking. Because the function to open it up exists. And many don't read what the messages say on their screens. I work in IT so I have some experience with this. I get it all the time "I don't know what I did, it said to click here so I did now it doesn't work". Thankfully I'm in the US. So I'm not worried about this today for us. Enjoy EU.

 

[Hrvoyay]

There are a lot of people out there that have no idea what they are doing with anything that resembles a computer.

Those people will never find, activate or successfully use the option of installing from a non-AppStore source. Have you ever actually used an Android in your life?

 

[anthogag]

Sideload some malware with your morning tea.

 

[MilaM]

That you currently like what the EU is doing doesn't mean that you will always like what the EU is doing.

And, that you think the EU's actions will benefit you doesn't guarantee that the EU's actions will benefit you.

And just because there is a possibility they could make a decision to my disadvantage, I should not applaud them when they today make a decision that benefits me? That's strange logic.

 

[SactoGuy18]

Why do you think that will happen on IOS when it hasn't substantially happened in the Android world?

Because it's more useful than sideloading. And since all the stores on the updated App Store app have to meet the same set of security criteria, probably a lot safer, too. That way, the likes of Epic Games and Amazon can have their own app stores but still be "safe" under iOS, in my opinion.

 

[MilaM]

And, what will you think when the EU or any government forces companies to do things you don't like? You'll still support it?

I won't, and why should I? I'm against many legal initiatives by the EU, like for example weakening end to end encryption of messages.

 

[Hrvoyay]

That you currently like what the EU is doing doesn't mean that you will always like what the EU is doing.

And, that you think the EU's actions will benefit you doesn't guarantee that the EU's actions will benefit you.

Yeah, well, currently EU actions benefit me/you/users, so hooray. It is a very poor reply to me saying “you are getting options”. Also, US mobile networks suck and cost 10x what EU offers. Food sucks. Airline compenations and passenger rights suck. Generally speaking, NOTHiNG properly regulated is worse than letting corporations run rampant unchecked. Facebook is a textbook example of rampant evil doing whatever they want. And they cried when Apple took a few tiny measures to block how much access they have, just as Apple is crying when EU did it to them. They all need to be reigned in.

 

[djphat2000]

Those people will never find, activate or successfully use the option of installing from a non-AppStore source. Have you ever actually used an Android in your life?

Yes I have. I have an Nvidia Shield. My TV runs Android. I've used Android on tablets and phones as well.
It sucks. But, that's my opinion.

"Those" people do dumb things ALL the time. It's one of the reasons they purchase an iPhone. They don't have to worry about certain things. It has historically and continues to be the easiest option for many. And more secure.
Again, I work in IT. I deal with hundreds of people and their work and personal devices. I'm not pulling this out of my rear end. But, take it as you will.

 

[scorpio vega]

Well yall wanted IOS to be like android...so here you go.

Hopefully this doesnt effect the overall IOS experience becuase if i wanted android, i would buy an android.

 

[tann]

About time! Thanks EU.

Hope it comes to the UK… lol

And for those who are about to wail and moan: don’t use it. Simple!

Unfortunately I very much doubt they will include the UK when they don't have to. Like with Facebook and their ad free tier, EU only.

 

[MilaM]

The point is allowing Government to dictate the parameters of business products is problematic. Outside of specific safetey requirements and actual monopolies, I don't see evidence that Government makes these decisions better than do consumers in a market place.

But that is exactly what the whole point of the EU is. To make trade inside the European Union easier and to ensure fair competition. Almost all the EU rules are about exactly this. Most businesses support the right amount of regulation. Of course, you can debate what the right amount is.

 

[scorpio vega]

They all need to be reigned in.

I disagree. The government having too much control is worse than any corporation choosing to make closed/proprietary software.

 

[Hrvoyay]

Yes I have. I have an Nvidia Shield. My TV runs Android. I've used Android on tablets and phones as well.
It sucks. But, that's my opinion.

"Those" people do dumb things ALL the time. It's one of the reasons they purchase an iPhone. They don't have to worry about certain things. It has historically and continues to be the easiest option for many. And more secure.
Again, I work in IT. I deal with hundreds of people and their work and personal devices. I'm not pulling this out of my rear end. But, take it as you will.

And have you ever installed an app outside of Play Store? I will assume, based on your stance here, you haven’t. Because you never went to Settings - Security - Allow from untrusted sources - pop up warning about the drama it can cause - click Yes - search an app apk, download, install.

How will adding the same thing to iOS change your iOS experience exactly? Whether Android “sucks” or not is a personal preference, but if you weren’t hacked to hell with malware, you don’t have a point. IT or not.

 

[ifxf]

With side loading, I predict, you will be able to subscribe to channels in the discord and other apps that Apple finds objectionable.

 

[Pack Leader]

I know the biggest push for this is to not pay Apple's commission but theoretically what's stopping them from charging that commission in some other way?

 

[MLVC]

What paranoid nonsense. EU just said they are fine with 10€ a month for ensuring “privacy” on Facebook/Instagram. Now you can either pay or be tracked by Meta everywhere for free.

Actually the EU is investigating whether this meets the requirements, the last word has not been said about this at all, neither has the EU said they are fine with the subscription charges from Meta.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

But eventually, "better than the others" will only be determined by "acceptable to the EU."

You seem to want to have it both ways; you want business to provide better services as determined by market forces (what customers freely choose) and also have Government dictating the choices business makes (because the EU "knows best" what customers want).

Nope I want competition, better is just an arbitrary line. You think the AppStore is better, I think steam is better.

And I want to own my own device. And eu is enforcing private property rights and freedom for undertakers to interact with consumers.

That's it. You don't, because you will lose. It's the real world. They have nothing on Apple, so they simply create a retarded law in area they shouldn't be regulating at all unless there's a breach of anti-monopoly laws. And if there is a breach - welcome to court and gl.
Keep up the good job defending this, tomorrow they will make you drink Cola instead of water. Cause you know, reasons.

EU don’t have anti-monopoly, the laws we have is known as abuse of market position.

It’s completely legal to have a dominant position, as long as you don’t abuse it.

And again how do you make laws you enforce if you must go through the court first to enforce a law that doesn’t exist?

Courts don’t make laws in EU, they are codified. And the DMA and DSA laws we have is ex-post. Ex-post means “after the event,” while ex-ante means “before the event.

It’s completely normal legal procedure.

I live in a democracy. We "vote" too. Democracies don't ensure any notion of "freedom," only the notion of law by majority rule. If the majority want to take away what I consider to be my fundamental right, I have very few safeguards. The idea that government makes laws "for the benefit of society" suffers from a couple of problems.

This is likely a philosophical difference in how rights are understood in EU and USA. In EU rights are something the government gives you and ensure you have are protected, while USA it’s something inalienable to you.

First, you have to define "society." For example, in the US, many laws exist for the "benefit of society" but are directly harmful to minority populations. And second, who determines what is of "benefit" to society?

People define society, and the government is just the reflection of its will( when it’s accountable that is)

The irony in your statement here is that there is good reason to believe that Big Business is the primary driver behind these changes to EU law. Funny.

Any proof of that? These laws are built upon case laws by the Supreme Court