iPhone - Apple Phone

[G4scott]

I think that the major reason that the US is behind in the cell phone market, is because of the corporate leadership... In the US, things like mobile phones are driven by how much money the companies can make, not how many features they can give their customers...

I don't know what else to say about this rumored phone... My cell phone is a year old Nokia, cheapo phone... It's the one you get free with the plan... I use it mainly to keep in touch with my family, since we have a free phone-to-phone plan, and I'll use it to call friends sometimes, but that's about it. It only stores phone numbers, and not much else. It would be nice, though, to put my friends phone numbers on my phone, and then hook it up to my iBook, and transfer the contact info... Of course, this is what iSync is for, but I don't have the phone to use it. It is really hard to keep and maintain 3 contact lists: 1 on the computer, 1 on the PDA, and 1 on the phone. Apple's trying to make this much easier for everyone. There are so many times that I wished I could have all of my contact info together... I know for sure, though, that any iPhone that Apple may introduce will have tons of Apple innovations... We've seen what they can do to the MP3 player market, maybe they can do the same with the cell phone market. (the only thing, is that I'm skeptical about the cell phone market, because it's a more professional market than the mp3 player market, and there are many more companies with plenty of good innovations...)

If this post confuses you, don't worry... I'm just really sleepy, and on medication for a cold... Who gets a cold in the middle of August with 100° weather... man this sux...

 

[beatle888]

Re: CountZero

Originally posted by Vic in response to CountZero
After I read a follow-up post, I realized that I misunderstood your position and offered a quick apoligy.

I did go back to read my original post to you and in hindsight, it was much too negative. My intent was not to insult you, but my post was much to negative toward you. Please accept my regret and misunderstaing.

And oh yes, Sprint is not 3G, no matter what their slick ads say.

Vic

very cool

 

[christof]

cdma2000 / 1xrtt

To be honest with you...

Apple's going to market this phone for the USA first. While it makes totaly business sense to develop the phone for GSM/GPRS networks, which it seems will be the case (because of the Cingular Wireless "partnership"), I really hope that Apple considers a cdma2000/1xrtt-based device.

The problem with GSM/GPRS deployment (in the USA) is that it seems that the USA cannot stay in line with the rest of the world in regard to GSM-based 3g networks. EDGE and UMTS... The USA wants to go in one direction while the rest of the world wants to go in another...

Yet... In the USA, there's one thing that's for certain... The #1 and #4 carriers, Verizon Wireless and Sprint PCS, have their "3G" networks ready... And will be able to provide services that Cingular and Voicestream/T-Mobile have yet to deliver to their consumers. AT&T Wireless, it seems, will be able to bring GSM/GPRS services that will appeal to many via mMode, but Cingular and VoiceStream/T-Mobile have yet to show their guns.

Verizon Wireless and Sprint PCS have a network in place... Verizon Wireless has a large customer base and many business customers... Everything has come together on the cdma2000/1xrtt side here in the United States... In fact, it's going to cost less to implement and bring more users to cdma2000/1xrtt than GSM/GPRS/W-CDMA/EDGE/UMTS...

Check out this very recent report put out by Morgan Stanley

According to the report, all that's really missing are killer apps and killer handsets. Sprint PCS (and Verizon Wireless) have brought to market many killer applications... There are many more to come. While Sprint PCS has some killer handsets, there is nothing that has truly tested the boundaries... Sure, Treo's and Pocket PC's by Audiovox/Toshiba are great, and Samsung phones that have a camera dongle to attach to them are great, and Kyocera Smartphone PDA's are great... But slick phones that enable true usability are what Apple can bring to the market...

An application like Sherlock would be killer... iChat... Rendezvouz... Those are just the beginning... Once we see MPEG-4 playing on QuickTime Player, ON OUR iPhones... Apple will have one the game... No one sees it.

Apple will become the power house... Video is the wave of the future... You and I will be able to e-mail movies to our iPhones... CNN will be able to stream the latest news to Quicktime player. AOL will provide the instant messaging network for iPhone... iPhoto... There are too many possibilities...

Ultimately, however, we return to the three main players... The device/handset makers... The service providers... And the killer app developers... It In these three positions, Apple can make a killing on two of them... Killer apps and device/handsets... Let's just hope that they choose the right service provider(s).

 

[senjaz]

Re: Re: Re: iPhone - Apple Phone

Originally posted by CountZero

Symbian was designed for the ground up to be a smart phone OS. Lightweight, emphasis on communications, etc.

Symbian was an OS designed from the ground up to be a multi-tasking palmtop computer (organiser) OS. Being a Psion owner for many years I know that Symbian was once EPOC32, used on the Series 5s and 7s palmtop computers.

Because of the threat of WinCE now PocketPC Psion started (with a mobile producer, Nokia I think) a neutral organisation Symbian to act as custodian for the OS and develop it for it to be used in future pocket devices, especially communications ones.

Psion did not create EPOC32 as a smart phone OS. Smart phones were not even conceived then. Also do not confuse the desktop version of Windows with the Embedded versions, they are totally different code bases. Windows Embedded is a much better engineered product than Windows on the desktop. That said, EPOC32 because of its engineering made a good base for all manner of portable devices.

Psion used to publish a news letter for its customers which allowed us to follow this transition through to their exiting the market.

 

[whatever]

Why would Apple need to make a PC compatible phone? Most phones currently out are not PC compatible and most people out there who have phones which are PC compatible don't connect their phones to their computers.

If, which I doubt they ever will, Apple came out with a phone it would be in their best interest not to be compatible with a PC. Instead they would need to be compatible with PALM OS, but only to the degree where someone could beam addresses or appointments to the phone device for either a first time sync or as a way to get info from someone else.

 

[skunk]

Isn't that just vCards? Even the iPod does those...

 

[iH8Quark]

Re: cdma2000 / 1xrtt

Originally posted by christof
I really hope that Apple considers a cdma2000/1xrtt-based device.

That's absurd. Although you backed your opinion up very well, the very reason why the USA is of the LEAST importance to cell phone companies is because of our differing technology. Companies have to manufacture an entirely different standard just for us, making it expensive and impractical.

CDMA is far inferior to GSM. We need to get with the program. Have you ever seen the phones in europe and japan? They're incredible. It will be 2 or three years before we see those products here...if at all. We're last priority.

I read the article, it's such hollow speculation, it can't even be elevated to the level of "rumor". I doubt Apple will make a Cellular phone / PDA. IMO. Not a single cell phone company on the market makes money off of their phones. They make money on service contracts, and kickbacks from service providers. And, mostly, routers and switches for the services. most phones are a loss leader.

We all know Apple. They're about one thing and one thing ONLY...MOO-LAH. Phones are not a high profit item, and there's fierce competition. I personally doubt this speculation will produce anything.

 

[Stalker]

Greetings,

Several years ago the Bang & Olufsen company released a very nice and designed version of an Ericsson cell phone. This was in the mid 90's and it was based on one of the first Ericsson GSM phones.

Bang & Olufsen, known for their beautiful video and audio systems, took the core of an ordinary phone, put their own speaker technology into the unit, made a lot of design improvements (a beautiful cradle etc) and released it under their own brand.

Apple might do exactly that.

Take a look at the slick new SonyEricsson P800 or the Nokia 7650. These phones are available today. Try to understand that the world uses the GSM system and that the U.S. is lagging. Forget about bulky and user-unfriendly palm- and pocketpc cell hybrids.

Try to understand that Ericsson and Nokia rule this market.

Ladies and gentlemen, start writing your aqua-enabled midlets. This is a new market.

 

[skunk]

You could be right

Some of these phones go for a ton of money over here, like $500-600, and that's without all the Apple bells and whistles. It could just work, dammit!

 

[Gigglebyte]

Originally posted by crazy_will
i think that toshiba (correct me if i'm wrong) makes the hds for the iPod

Smartdisk supplies the drives for the iPod

 

[Wry Cooter]

Originally posted by Gigglebyte


Smartdisk supplies the drives for the iPod

Everyone knows the iPod uses Sony MemorySticks. The Spearmint flavored ones. Of course you can't get to the data because your computer doesn't have a floppy. DOESN'T HAVE A FLOPPY.

Now this Mavica Phone Apple is thinking of making, after Sony buys Apple, should really be something. You can save your phone call on an ordinary Floppy disc! How about them Apples? You don't even have to call anyone, because you can simply mail them the disk. Or walk it over to them. Here's your "voice mail"- Look-- its on a *FLOPPY*!!

And your teeth won't change color either, like those memory sticks do when you chew them. Who wants to talk on the phone when their teeth are blue? Someone might see you!

 

[macman21]

Originally posted by Gigglebyte


Smartdisk supplies the drives for the iPod

Um, it is most definately Toshiba.

 

[BongHits]

Re: Re: I agree with the article...the evidence is obvious!

Originally posted by Wry Cooter


An Apple phone would have to be-
-branded, manufactured and sold by a major player in cellular
-carried, supported and marketed by at least one major carrier
- a totally useable phone/PDA outside higher bandwidth footprints, perhaps even reverting to analog coverage.
- Great form factor and long battery life

What? Sony Erricson? You don't think....

 

[BongHits]

Re: Re: I agree with the article...the evidence is obvious!

Originally posted by Wry Cooter


An Apple phone would have to be-
-branded, manufactured and sold by a major player in cellular
-carried, supported and marketed by at least one major carrier
- a totally useable phone/PDA outside higher bandwidth footprints, perhaps even reverting to analog coverage.
- Great form factor and long battery life

What? Sony Erricson? You don't say?

 

[shadowfax0]

I just hope they can top an Ericsson T39, this thing (to me at least, but I feel I speak the truth) is the best phone there is. Does *EVERYTHING* Bluetooth, IrDA, GSM/GPRS, you can check your mail, go on the internet, it works in over 120 different countries via tri-band (yes, I *can* use this phone in Afghanistan!) can store alot more addresses/phone #'s/general info (more than other phones I looked at) has the backlight always on, so even if you're walking down the street and wander into a shadow you can still see it, is about the size of a deck of cards (part of the reason it was so appealing), the original battery that came with it was so thin I thought it wasn't there, so I bought the larger one adn get 350 Hrs + of standby time and about 6-9 hours of talk time. ****, the thing even ahs alot of boring , mind-rotting, terribly addictive games on it! Lots of your basic stuff, ring tones, pictures, and and I forgot SMS, good god how I love my SMS! It can alert you if your stock quotes go below a certain level (or if your baseball team loses) I find this phone *amazing* and to tell you the truth only thing it lacks is a colour screen, that's really about it. But hey, Apple always has somethign great to offer, they may miss alot of the features described above, but they ALWAYS make of for it by having somethign else that's really, really well done and/or very unique and useful. So good luck to Apple, but if the iPhone never becomes reality, I'll stick with this baby

 

[shadowfax0]

Just as some food for thought, go here:

http://www.sonyericsson.com/us/spg.jsp?page=start

and look at that little banner in the corner You can make whatever you want of it, that's what you guys are good at

 

[Wry Cooter]

I just want to mention a couple of things I would want to see in a phone related iApp.

-being able to download and sort caller ID info

-caller ID that can interact with a customer database on your computer in realtime via the phones bluetooth.

Those are just a couple of phone like productivity bits I'd like to see. What about listing possible features on the phone itself that could be more PDA like?

- maps...GPS even.

- if not interactive live web pages- the ability to read archived daily news sites from a sync,

-ability to share this info with similar phones during a call

 

[ThinkDifferent]

Originally posted by flanders
it would work; they'd just create a gsm version of the phone first. A tri-band GSM phone would be able to be used almost everywhere in the world--even North America (GSM1900/900) and would just require the usual SIM to be inserted into the phone from any of the providers. I don't think you'd see any CDMA/TDMA phones especially early on.

But who would provide the service for the iPhone? Would Apple provide the service, or would they team up with a provider? I just want to know so I can buy one and use it.

_________________________________

Mac users are the only people who haven't been brain washed!

 

[clubsport]

I think $800 would be fine. Some Nokia and Ericsson phones cost about $700, and imagine all the features an Apple phone would have. Besides, iPods cost $599, and a phone would offer all the features of it, and more.

 

[makkystyle]

notes...

Just a couple of points to add about a previous post by christof.....

The reason for the US lagging behind in the cellular market is not about corporate america, it is about the FCC. The FCC hindered growth in the cellular market by assigning each individual carrier it's own bandwidth. This meant that AT&T phones were not compatible with Sprint networks and vice versa. This meant that for cell phones to become truly useful and adopted by the consumer companies had to develop their own "nationwide" network. This is the reason for Sprint, who is one of the worst service providers with mediocre product offerings, has become the most dominant force in cellular communications, because they were the first with a nationwide network.

As far as 3G services, last time I checked Sprint , running CDMA 1xRTT, is not yet "3G". The max transmission speed for 1xRTT is only 144kbps. This is "2.5G", 3G will become a reality when they implement phase 2 which will be called 3xRTT and will alow transmission of up to 2Mbps. It should be mentioned here that T-Mobile (formerly Voicestream) had a 2.5G system implemented at the beginning of this year. It is a GPRS system used on their GSM networks and handles transmission of up to 171.2Kbps. You'll notice this is still faster than Sprint's.

Additionally, T-Mobile has always had much better handsets than any of the Sprint handsets because they have been able to tap into the huge pool of resources provided by GSM's worldwide acceptance as a standard. Take a look at the new SonyEricsson T68. When it used to be voicestream they were also the first to have the latest Nokia and Ericsson phones, which have been pretty much accepted as the most user-friendly and well manufactured handsets.

Don't believe everything you see on TV, Sprint is not 3G. It will not be for some time. Effective data rates on 1xRTT are essentially the same as GPRS. 3G phones will not become a viable consumer product for at least another 18-24 months in my opinion.

 

[pretentious]

I just want to mention a couple of things I would want to see in a phone related iApp.

-Being able to download and sort caller ID info

Wry Cooter

I think that iPhone is (or was) just that, an iApp. This could be linked to your phone line, pop up when ever your phone rings w/ caller-id info, and with a separate Apple headset, you could answer off of your Mac, this could also be linked to your Address Book and call directly from it.

But I think it might be dropped, because how long have they registered the name "iPhone" (isp, copy write). Because I think the idea is just too gimmicky, even by Apple's standards.

Although could be cool by an outside vender

 

[Stalker]

GPRS card built in

Greetings,

You might all be barking up the wrong tree.

Maybe Apple is planning to fit a GPRS/GSM card inside the new powerbook. Such card is available today from several vendors like Ericsson and Nokia and is more or less a complete cellphone on a PCMCIA card.

If Apple fits one of those inside the PowerBook, people all over the world will be able to access the Internet without wires, even if they are outside the range of their Airports, automatically switching over to GPRS when needed.

All other functions, i.e. caller ID, SMS, MMS etc will thus be "built-in" and could easily be handled by an iPhone application. You could also connect a headset to the PowerBook and answer/make calls. A GPRS connection usually gives some 30-40 kbit/s at the moment, which is quite acceptable in real life. The cost is zero or almost zero, no connection fees and maybe $2-$3 per downloaded MB.

All it needs is a GSM subscription card (your operator can provide you with a twin-card, a copy of the one you have in your cellphone) and most European operators will happily give Apple some $200 for each new subscriber.

Think different, people.

 

[Wry Cooter]

Re: GPRS card built in

Originally posted by Stalker


Think different, people.

I think 2 bucks a megabyte is not anything the US market would be willing to support. Telephony apps yes, but most comm rates that do well at all these days are flat rate plans.

 

[Stalker]

Re: Re: GPRS card built in

Originally posted by Wry Cooter


I think 2 bucks a megabyte is not anything the US market would be willing to support. Telephony apps yes, but most comm rates that do well at all these days are flat rate plans.

I'm sure most people will love GPRS and paying per recieved info instead of connected minutes and seconds. 1 MB is really a lot of information when it comes to cellphones, wml-pages etc. It is even a lot of video for a small screen @ 28 kbit/s.

Also, I don't believe you if you are saying that you pay a flat rate for _cellular_ calls and data. DSL yes, Cable yes, but cellular? You might, as most operators in Europe, have GPRS access for free for two or three months, but sooner or later, they will start to charge you for the traffic.

And, as I recall, the U.S. are one of the most expensive areas to use cellphones. At my company we pay approx 2.5 cents per minute for calls to and from our GSM phones. How much do you pay in the U.S.?

And according to Cingular I'm not even allowed to use their GPRS services, despite that my cellphone (with an European subscription) roams with Cingular and I can make all kinds of voice calls.

I can't even buy a prepaid card that includes GPRS. I probably need a social security number, valid U.S. address, hand on my heart and pledge allegiance to the flag, etc, before I'm allowed to access GPRS in California.

This is very bad for the wireless market and its customers in the U.S.

 

[Wry Cooter]

Re: Re: Re: GPRS card built in

Originally posted by Stalker


And, as I recall, the U.S. are one of the most expensive areas to use cellphones. At my company we pay approx 2.5 cents per minute for calls to and from our GSM phones. How much do you pay in the U.S.?

As I suggested earlier, a great deal of the U.S. is on a flat rate. I was including cellular traffic, as well as the internet traffic you were speaking of.

There are people paying by the minute, but they are suckers, or simply in a market where there is not enough competition.

However, you will get U.S. customers happy as a clam to pay for MORE minutes than they need-- much of the flat rate anywhere in the U.S. plans are exactly this. They don't mind paying more than they need to to keep their cell phone in a worry free convenient usage plan, they just don't want surprises on their bill, or too many surprises in their service.