iPhone Was Best Selling Smartphone in Q4 2017 Amid Industry Wide Decline

[dilbert99]

The iPhone X won't appeal everybody based on the price point, Apple knows that, the consumer knows that. That's why they have an expansive iPhone lineup, there's a price point and model for everybody. But for the iPhone X to be the top selling iPhone every week since it's launch is impressive.

I didn't want to upgrade from my 6 to a 7 or 8 I wanted the best.
But I am not paying the price Apple wants for an X.
So I will wait some more and keep my 6. I really do wish they kept the 3.5mm jack, I hate dongles.
If a competitor takes my fancy before Apple brings out a phone I want then they will get my money.

 

[Leguna24]

Apple could have sold way more iPhone X at a more decent price point.

Most companies probably could have sold way more product if they had a lower price point. But yeah, thanks for the smart input .

 

[I7guy]

Of course iPhone sales are going to be higher then everyone else. They’re the only major manufacturer that has all their phone releases in Q4. Everyone else staggers releases. Samsung for example gets the S8 out in March and note 8 out in September.

The surprising bit here is that Samsung was still close with a phones like the S8 that was 6 months old and note 8 which only really allures a niche buyer. I took a look at the note 8 and that phone is massive.

The surprise is that Samsung’s range of prices for phones goes from cheap to expensive and Apple still managed to sell more phones.

 

[Leguna24]

Of course iPhone sales are going to be higher then everyone else. They’re the only major manufacturer that has all their phone releases in Q4. Everyone else staggers releases. Samsung for example gets the S8 out in March and note 8 out in September.

The surprising bit here is that Samsung was still close with a phones like the S8 that was 6 months old and note 8 which only really allures a niche buyer. I took a look at the note 8 and that phone is massive.

A lot of people don’t but their phones on release schedules. Kind of surprising that Samsung can’t keep up even with a diverse lineup of devices.

 

[EdT]

I didn't want to upgrade from my 6 to a 7 or 8 I wanted the best.
But I am not paying the price Apple wants for an X.
So I will wait some more and keep my 6. I really do wish they kept the 3.5mm jack, I hate dongles.
If a competitor takes my fancy before Apple brings out a phone I want then they will get my money.

Similar opinions, especially about the 3.5 mm jack. I'm not saying I will never spend $1000 plus dollars on a phone, I'm saying I see no reason to spend that much on a phone that doesn't do things that much better than a $700 dollar phone, not that $700 is cheap either.

And I don't care if we are talking about Apple or Samsung or any of the other smart phone manufacturers. The price increase for the feature and performance increase just isn't significant.

 

[Mike MA]

Most companies probably could have sold way more product if they had a lower price point. But yeah, thanks for the smart input .

You missed the point. With the introduction of the iPhone X Apple tested the price sensitivity of its customer base. Before, you could chose between the iPhone 6/6s/7/7s and the lower cost models. Now you have to pay an additional premium as their current flagship is the third phone in the lineup. Many customers didn’t accept it and went for the iPhone 8. So, iPhone X sold well, but not as well as thought. This is what I was referring to.

 

[I7guy]

You missed the point. With the introduction of the iPhone X Apple tested the price sensitivity of its customer base. Before, you could chose between the iPhone 6/6s/7/7s and the lower cost models. Now you have to pay an additional premium as their current flagship is the third phone in the lineup. Many customers didn’t accept it and went for the iPhone 8. So, iPhone X sold well, but not as well as thought. This is what I was referring to.

What was the sales targets for the iPhone X to be able to judge whether the phone sold as well as thought?

 

[Kmart9419]

You say about the iPhone X - "continue to stagnate". Are you implying that iPhone X sales are not good somehow? Please explain. I read that the iPhone X was the best selling iPhone each and every week since it's introduction right up until Jan 31, 2018. Tim Cook said this I believe.


You say the average person will not buy a phone at $1000.00. Probably true. The average person probably wants a 7 or an 8 or 8 plus, and maybe even some average persons want the $350 iPhone SE.

Above average (income) persons probably lean more towards the top of the line phone perhaps.

Remember - Apple has something for everybody right now $350 - $1000


Double digit growth in the world's biggest cap company is hard to conceive. If this growth continues at double digits, Apple will DOUBLE in size in less than 7 years. 11% growth would be a 7 year doubling. I think Apple is beating 11%. In some things it's closer to 20%. Wow!

The number of iPhone's sold yearly is one thing, but the company revenue and earnings appears to be growing incredibly for the largest company ever. It really boggles the mind.

It is already the world's largest company, and it's going to double in size in 5 years.

Next quarter will be very different for the x. The early adopters and hardcore fans all got the X already. The mainstream crowd is a lot harder to convince since there are still issues of cost, notch and heavy skepticism about Face ID. In regards to the iPhone 8 and 8s, there’s so little change between the 7 and 8 that most people would simply stay put. Phones are fast enough that the upgrade cycle has pushed out to every 3 to 4 years.

Tim Cook says throttling issue won’t hurt sales. Don’t believe it. If just 10% of users don’t upgrade because they got new batteries, that’s a 10% miss in revenues.

Apple is a whale, expecting a whale to double every 8 years is highly unlikely. Sales are already plateauing. Apple is no longer a growth stock and more a traditional dividend paying value stock. This is the reason why Apple shares sell at a chronically cheap prices.

Either way, if Apple drops to $150, that would be a great entry point. Apple had its correction and might overshoot to the downside presenting a delicious opportunity. Most of the bad news factored in at that point.

 

[Mike MA]

What was the sales targets for the iPhone X to be able to judge whether the phone sold as well as thought?

Many indications like the reported inventory, faster back to normal availability compared e.g. to iPhone 6/6s after its initial launch in the Apple Store, reduced supply orders or reports claiming that most of the global companies only provided iPhone 8 to its employees hint into exactly that direction. Indications assuming the opposite have been weaker. To be on the same page, nobody was talking about a fail.

 

[I7guy]

Next quarter will be very different for the x. The early adopters and hardcore fans all got the X already. The mainstream crowd is a lot harder to convince since there are still issues of cost, notch and heavy skepticism about Face ID. In regards to the iPhone 8 and 8s, there’s so little change between the 7 and 8 that most people would simply stay put. Phones are fast enough that the upgrade cycle has pushed out to every 3 to 4 years.

Tim Cook says throttling issue won’t hurt sales. Don’t believe it. If just 10% of users don’t upgrade because they got new batteries, that’s a 10% miss in revenues.

Apple is a whale, expecting a whale to double every 8 years is highly unlikely. Sales are already plateauing. Apple is no longer a growth stock and more a traditional dividend paying value stock. This is the reason why Apple shares sell at a chronically cheap prices.

Either way, if Apple drops to $150, that would be a great entry point. Apple had its correction and might overshoot to the downside presenting a delicious opportunity. Most of the bad news factored in at that point.

Neither you or I know how things will go next quarter. Apple has already issued their guidance and they seem to be extremely accurate looking backward.

Notch, batteries, throttling, price etc. in my circles I have yet to hear anybody discuss these issues. Each person has their own opinion.

Under Jobs Apple was far from 1T. Under Cook within arms reach. Yes Apple is big but they are agile.
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Many indications like the reported inventory, faster back to normal availability compared e.g. to iPhone 6/6s after its initial launch in the Apple Store, reduced supply orders or reports claiming that most of the global companies only provided iPhone 8 to its employees hint into exactly that direction. Indications assuming the opposite have been weaker. To be on the same page, nobody was talking about a fail.

We’re in the same page as to fail or no fail, but i was interested in the back story. Still and all nobody really knows as Apple doesn’t publish these numbers but assumptions are being made.

 

[neutralguy]

I also think it best to look at actual profit, who cares what market share is if you don't make any profit. I believe Apple is blowing Samsung out of the water.

True. But once the saturation happens and the company starts selling less phones, then the profit will start dropping. It's evident from this quarter that Apple's price hike brought them good profit even they sold less. Will they be able to keep doing that and for how long? Also I can tell you that Apple have got there fans hooked onto iPhones using annual upset plan. As long as the monthly lease price does not go up to $100, Apple would be ok. What that means is you will see a stagnation in profit year over year.

 

[Naimfan]

Apple is riding the crest of the iPhone wave, which will will break . . . eventually. The drop in YOY market share is a concern, because while Apple owns most of the high end phone market, there is little space for volume growth, and ever-higher ASP is not a long term strategy for a disposable product, particularly one that has added no essential functionality sine its introduction.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

The surprise is that Samsung’s range of prices for phones goes from cheap to expensive and Apple still managed to sell more phones.

Only in that particular quarter. Samsung sold more phones over the course of 2017 apparently. Sales for both were down and that’s interesting as the smartphone market continues to shrink.

 

[CWallace]

Apple is riding the crest of the iPhone wave, which will will break . . . eventually.

Which is why they are expanding Wearables (Air Pods, Beats, Apple Watch) and Services and even Mac to serve (together) as the next "wave" of revenue to help keep the boat afloat just as iOS' tide starts to go out.

 

[I7guy]

Which is why they are expanding Wearables (Air Pods, Beats, Apple Watch) and Services and even Mac to serve (together) as the next "wave" of revenue to help keep the boat afloat just as iOS' tide starts to go out.

What are the other phone manufacturers going to do who don’t have other service revenues, or other lines of business to float their mobile phone lineup? Close their doors?

 

[truthertech]

Hopefully the Apple haters got to sleep in this Saturday morning. It was a rough week as Apple's quarterly results destroyed a lot of dreams and claims that the iPhone X would be a fail-- "that notch," "too expensive," "no home button," etc., etc., only to find out it was the best selling phone IN THE WORLD. Ouch. And then all the salt in the wounds with the record setting revenue, records with the App store, Apple Services, etc.

But, take heart, Apple's constant innovation means there's going to be a lot of new products, services, etc., to bash the rest of the year. Now get on the forums and show them you haven't given up--Remember, Apple is still doomed!

 

[CWallace]

What are the other phone manufacturers going to do who don’t have other service revenues, or other lines of business to float their mobile phone lineup? Close their doors?

The majority of them all have massive consumer electronics divisions to support them as well as being parts of larger conglomerates that are heavily diversified across multiple fields. So they're arguably in a far better position that Apple since they can draw upon all these revenue sources to prop up their mobile divisions.

 

[plucky duck]

For those who charge daily, at say 50%, 500 cycles on a battery would mean 1000 days, which amounts to almost 3yrs, at which point battery life has severly degradated to the point you cannot get a full day’s usage. At that point in time I would imagine a lot of people would consider a new phone over battery replacement, unless it’ll become a hand me down device. Perhaps 3yr contracts and subsidies will make a come back.

 

[BuddyTronic]

Next quarter will be very different for the x. The early adopters and hardcore fans all got the X already. The mainstream crowd is a lot harder to convince since there are still issues of cost, notch and heavy skepticism about Face ID. In regards to the iPhone 8 and 8s, there’s so little change between the 7 and 8 that most people would simply stay put. Phones are fast enough that the upgrade cycle has pushed out to every 3 to 4 years.

Tim Cook says throttling issue won’t hurt sales. Don’t believe it. If just 10% of users don’t upgrade because they got new batteries, that’s a 10% miss in revenues.

Apple is a whale, expecting a whale to double every 8 years is highly unlikely. Sales are already plateauing. Apple is no longer a growth stock and more a traditional dividend paying value stock. This is the reason why Apple shares sell at a chronically cheap prices.

Either way, if Apple drops to $150, that would be a great entry point. Apple had its correction and might overshoot to the downside presenting a delicious opportunity. Most of the bad news factored in at that point.

If AAPL drops to 150 I'd be very surprised - I doubt I would have any cash available to buy more because I am already doubling down on my (presently, money losing) call options .

I don't think the "notch" actually holds back any real purchases. The people who tell you that are the same one's who say they would buy that if it were Half price. Then you say "It's half price, will you buy it?" - then they say "I'll think about it".

The price thing I don't know - it makes no sense when you realize that you spend so much on cellular services in a year, you might as well have a new phone. The percentage "savings" differential is nothing much to ruminate over.

We already know that iPhone X was the top seller for ALL of January. So 1/3 of the next Quarterly Earnings is already determined and Tim Cook told you that the iPhone X was top seller out of the mix. So overall sales for this AAPL FY Q2 we are in right now are going to have the same ASP as we saw in Q1. Numbers are always bigger for the Christmas Q1, than this Q2. Do a YOY comparison, and look at what numbers Apple gave for guidance. Does it equate to growth? Yes, it does!

Apple Guidance is ALWAYS correct - why even think about it. The day Apple does not meet it's guidance is the day I will question the future.

Otherwise "the dogs bark, but the caravan moves on"

Sales are growing at what percentage again? Just imagine if China GDP grew at the same double digits? Guess what? You'd have today's China. Big. No more rickshaws in China, in fact they have more Porsches than California.

You touched on it - The Whale is doubling, and it's doing it in 4 or 5 years most likely.

Go look backwards - when was Apple half the size of now?

It's simply amazing that it can continue to grow at this pace.

Humans are very poor at perceiving exponential growth.
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Apple is riding the crest of the iPhone wave, which will will break . . . eventually. The drop in YOY market share is a concern, because while Apple owns most of the high end phone market, there is little space for volume growth, and ever-higher ASP is not a long term strategy for a disposable product, particularly one that has added no essential functionality sine its introduction.

Yes, possibly. I mean eventually you run out of humans!

1.3 Billion active devices or something? What was it? People? Or Devices?

There are only 7 Billion people on the planet. So yeah, you do have a peak eventually haha. This is big stuff to think about!


But - that's where a lot of people with a negative attitude about Apple need to consider.

Look at the dollars and not only the count of phones.

Revenue Growth.

Tim Cook told us in 2016 that services will double in terms of $ Revenue by 2019 or was it 2020?

That's big stuff.

The scale of this stuff is hard to believe.

Apple revenue was 88 Billion in 3 months time! Profit was $20 Billion from that 3 months!

Ford Motor company - you can buy ALL of it for $20 Billion. You could buy Ford and decide to rename the Raptor to whatever you want because you'd own the whole company - no more other shareholders - just you.

That's the scale of what Apple can do if they want.


Apple will DOUBLE it's size in 4 or 5 years it seems. Can it be stopped?

 

[KidAKidB]

It's insane just how many iPhones Apple sells. Absolutely mind boggling really...

 

[I7guy]

The majority of them all have massive consumer electronics divisions to support them as well as being parts of larger conglomerates that are heavily diversified across multiple fields. So they're arguably in a far better position that Apple since they can draw upon all these revenue sources to prop up their mobile divisions.

So in essence the other manufacturers can bleed money and it won’t make a difference. Having said that my guess is Apple has already accounted for probably all scenarios put forth on this board and others, they are not a stupid company.

 

[Black Tiger]

I didn't want to upgrade from my 6 to a 7 or 8 I wanted the best.
But I am not paying the price Apple wants for an X.
So I will wait some more and keep my 6. I really do wish they kept the 3.5mm jack, I hate dongles.
If a competitor takes my fancy before Apple brings out a phone I want then they will get my money.

No cables at all is even better. Bluetooth and Airplay=future. Hence no jack.

 

[oplix]

iOS and Android co-exist in a perfect harmony of Android releasing devices with "Advanced technology", users switching over for said technology, realizing that Android still sucks no matter what the technology is, and then switching back to iOS. This cycle keeps repeating over and over.

 

[Glideslope]

Apple could have sold way more iPhone X at a more decent price point.

....and sacrifice margins and shareholder return !!!!! Blasphemy I say, blasphemy !!

 

[I7guy]

Apple could have sold way more iPhone X at a more decent price point.

This reasoning could apply to any product, provided they are not constrained by the manufacturing process. If only Ferrari would cut their price in half they could sell twice as many cars.