Ashamed of being rational? It's the government's fault if the best thing to do is avoid paying taxes.
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Ireland May End Apple Tax Residency Loophole
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Ashamed of being rational? It's the government's fault if the best thing to do is avoid paying taxes.
Maybe not...but the cost (to the customers) will be reflected in some other way...lower quality, fewer features, etc. All taxes are paid by the end consumer. The sooner people realize this, the sooner they'll stop this stupid-ass Marxist envy-driven "let's tax the rich and big companies" ********.
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Perhaps, but it is the correct perspective.
No, it's not.
Fairness? Penalizing those for working hard to achieve success through taxation, and reward those that sit on their butts and live off of handouts and entitlements all their lives is fair? I think not!
Apple is the biggest taxpayer in the country. Even hinting that they're not paying their fair share just doesn't make sense.
Theft.
Good enough reason to try and pay as little of them as possible.
Or they're paid by shareholders. Just saying, it's not a rule that corporate taxes fall totally on consumers. And FYI, I hate the Democrat party at this point, and that's a pretty recent development.
No, the politicians that created these loopholes should be ashamed. Can you tell me that you've never taken a deduction on your taxes? Like you, companies take every deduction provided by our screwed-up tax code. Loopholes are deductions configured by politicians in an attempt to manipulate commerce and human behavior. People and companies do everything they can to legally operate in accordance with these rules. The Government determined that Apple has followed all the rules, and therefore did not press any charges. There is no shame in following the rules.
It's like those negative externalities things in economics class. Want to encourage unemployment? Subsidize it!
The problem is that these taxes may not be directly comparable.
For example, in the UK, a company will pay about 10% of every employee's salary on top of the salary as employer's contribution to social security and so on. It's not a corporate tax on profits, but it is money the company has to pay to the state. I'd bet that the US tax office wouldn't count that when they subtract "taxes paid to other governments".
There are other differences. The UK tax office gets a lot of income by charging 20% VAT on most purchases, a lot more than sales tax in the USA. So assuming that both governments are equally good or bad on using the tax money, other taxes should be lower in the UK - for example corporate taxes. UK puts taxes on fuel to fund building roads, USA may use corporate taxes for that. So comparing these taxes really doesn't work.
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Sorry I cannot find a way to explain this better and more clearly. But, you're wrong. Sorry.
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Right...like by raising the cost of employees in some way.
If I found out that a company was using a significant part of my investment to pay off taxes instead of using profits derived from customers, I'd drop them like a hot potato.
One would argue that's the price of doing business and having operations overseas.
Using Ireland's tax loopholes, to me, isn't the same as gaining or losing tax credits for operating an actual business (not holding company, etc) in a foreign country.
Two completely separate things.
The Irish tax issue is about hiding US domestic earnings as Irish earnings. This is done simply to move profits from high tax zones to low tax zones. My opinion is that Apple and the other companies doing this are following the letter of the law but are in the wrong.
Taxing profits earned in other countries that has already been taxed by those local countries is an entirely different tax issue. Apple and others are asking for a tax holiday to bring foreign earnings back into the USA to spend it here. They don't want to be double taxed, and it would be wonderful for the economy for those companies to spend the hundreds of billions of dollars here instead of leaving it abroad, but the US wants a piece of the pie. I believe the US gov is wrong here and the companies should be able to bring the money in. It will be good for everyone.
Are you a new account of NewishMacGuy? Are you going to start talking about how they're taking it by force next?
Yes, but it's not exactly an even swap. And I don't know how the US gov figures it has world wide taxation jurisdiction.
No.
If you want, sure. If you are trying to imply they aren't, you're free to prove that claim. I doubt you can.
That's actually what you think isn't it?!
It's what you should think as well. Apple is sitting on $150 billion dollars of unspent cash in overseas bank accounts, simply to avoid having to pay taxes on it. Again taxation can be over done to harmful effects, but it can also be underdone to the point where the corperations aren't adequately benefiting the economy. Apple recieves huge profit margins on the items they sell, and could easily earn less per item while still making bucket loads of cash.
Because it's the US government and it can do whatever it wants to whomever it wants while hypocritically calling out and attacking others for doing the same kind of things it does.
And that's a wrap, folks.
I'm going to try to not get wrapped up in a conversation with somebody who obviously doesn't understand why taxes exist, how they're not theft, and how the Government hasn't physically harmed anyone for not paying taxes.
Politicians did not create these loopholes. These tricks are done by playing different countries tax codes off against each other. Only large international corporations can do this. As such, nobody created them - they arose by chance as laws in different countries evolved differently over time. Some clever accountants employed by big firms spotted these loopholes at some point and quietly enabled Apple and others to take advantage of them. It is in some way similar to a computer hack/exploit. Nobody intended it this way but it happened and people exploited it.
For once, the politicians are not to blame for creating the situation. However, if they continue to enable ti by not working together internationally to close the loopholes - you can blame them for that.
It's a fairly complex set of documents, but that might qualify as an operating expense or something else. In terms of foreign credits, they have to apply for any available refunds in foreign countries where applicable. Effectively they can claim it if it can be proven as a required expense. Someone else can probably explain it more eloquently.
No it isn't because I prefer to think correct things. Thinking that would not be thinking a correct thing.
*sigh* No.
The money isn't just sitting in a bank account. If they had it stuffed in a mattress your argument would have merit.
Private enterprises do benefit the economy/society or the simply cease to exist. Governments on the other hand...well...not so much.
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That's fine.
Then I won't get wrapped up in a conversation with someone who obviously doesn't understand how taxes are theft and are taken by force (or the threat of).
Not necessarily. Apple could cut their margins in half and still rake in the dough. Fact of the matter is the strongest economies the world has ever known employed progressive taxation policies. You don't have to like it, but it is a fact. We all agree that there is such a thing as over taxation, but only some of us believe that under taxation is a possibility. Throughout history we have consistently witnessed the tendency of wealth to migrating to the top few percent; progressive taxation (within reasonable limits) is the only reasonable way to avoid a return to the oligarchic civilizations that humanity has known for the majority of its existence.
Apple could easily pay more in taxes, not raise cost or lower quality and still make huge profits. No company has a right to 33% profit margins.
Yes. They could. Let's have them try that and see what happens next.
Why is it that so many people cannot think beyond the next move?
Oh good now we have someone claiming that correlation = causation because, well it appears to support what they like. Nifty.
Uh huh.
Sorry, I can't help that.
Riiiight.
Sure they do. At least they have right to those margins more than anyone else has a right to simply take it from them.
That's the main reason why Apple is there. I could see Apple moving out of Ireland if the loophole is eliminated.