Is the new MacBook Pro a dud?

[Mr. Dee]

The fact that you are using a 7+ year old Apple computer it pretty telling in and of itself. Most Windows computers that are that old have long been rendered obsoleted by Microsoft and an OS that either doesn't work or is no longer supported. Apple still lists the min-2010 Macbook as able to run the latest version of macOS... and it runs it pretty well, I might add.

Brothers 2006 Dell Inspiron 1525 running Windows 10 1607
Other brother 2008 Dell Inspiron running Windows 10 1607

2008 HP Workstation Windows 10 1607

You can't say most either, since you have no factual proof of that. In most cases, even if a manufacturer list it as not supported, doesn't mean it can't run it.

 

[jerryk]

Brothers 2006 Dell Inspiron 1525 running Windows 10 1607
Other brother 2008 Dell Inspiron running Windows 10 1607

2008 HP Workstation Windows 10 1607

You can't say most either, since you have no factual proof of that. In most cases, even if a manufacturer list it as not supported, doesn't mean it can't run it.

Definitely true. I was just at a client and printed a document from a Windows XP system running some ancient version of word to one of there new fancy copier sized printers (color images, dual sides, automatic stapling, ... ). The document had images from a gigabit camera connected to another XP system.

 

[MDePew24]

I am in the market for a new MacBook, and I feel so torn. It's hard to believe laptops from 2013 are a viable option, but it certainly seems that way. I guess there is no way to know when Apple may release an updated MacBook Pro, but its hard not to feel like a sucker if I buy the new Touch Bar model, when there is potentially a new improved model just around the corner.

What do people think, is this new MacBook Pro a lemon in a long line of excellent MBP's?

I just upgraded from a 2009 model and I love it.

 

[jerryk]

I'm a college student and don't care about the touch bar and the non touch bar version is $1449 before taxes and dongle purchases (I don't care about USB-C either, nothing I have uses it).

The new Surface Laptop is touting 14 hours of battery life and with a student discount the 8GB/256GB version can be had for $1169.

I love my current Late 2013 Retina Pro, but battery life is suffering after 400 charge cycles. I can use my current Retina Macbook Pro for home use as a media player, music production in garageband, and other uses while I could also have the Surface Laptop for it's ridiculously high battery life.

The Surface Laptop looks like a purposely crippled machine to me. I really do not see the value there since you cannot just load an .exe of some product and run it. I am not sure who this machine is made for.

 

[HalloweenMisfits]

The Surface Laptop looks like a purposely crippled machine to me. I really do not see the value there since you cannot just load an .exe of some product and run it. I am not sure who this machine is made for.

The Windows 10 S thing is goofy, but you can update to Windows 10 Pro for free until the end of 2017. After that it's a $50 upgrade.

 

[jerryk]

The Windows 10 S thing is goofy, but you can update to Windows 10 Pro for free until the end of 2017. After that it's a $50 upgrade.

Yet another weird thing about this laptop. If you need Windows 10 Pro to make it work, why have Windows 10 S.

 

[HalloweenMisfits]

Yet another weird thing about this laptop. If you need Windows 10 Pro to make it work why have Windows 10 S.

As a former tech administrator and someone with parents over 60+ - the Idea of a version of windows that is locked down like iOS isn't that bad...but the windows store is garbage.

 

[Mr. Dee]

As a former tech administrator and someone with parents over 60+ - the Idea of a version of windows that is locked down like iOS isn't that bad...but the windows store is garbage.

Bingo, WIN32 and all the legacy that comes with such as .exe is pretty much being phased out. They are even moving big desktop apps like Office to the Windows Store. It is only a matter of time until Microsoft work with partners like AutoDesk, Intuit, Adobe and many others to bring their classic desktop apps to the store. Apple and Google are likely to be the two party poopers though. Lets hope not, because I think WIN32 has been holding back Windows for a long time now.

 

[csurfr]

I'm a college student and don't care about the touch bar and the non touch bar version is $1449 before taxes and dongle purchases (I don't care about USB-C either, nothing I have uses it).

The new Surface Laptop is touting 14 hours of battery life and with a student discount the 8GB/256GB version can be had for $1169.

I love my current Late 2013 Retina Pro, but battery life is suffering after 400 charge cycles. I can use my current Retina Macbook Pro for home use as a media player, music production in garageband, and other uses while I could also have the Surface Laptop for it's ridiculously high battery life.

I appreciate that you said "reported" battery life, as there are no real world use cases just yet. That being said, from my experience most PC manufacturers over-estimate their battery life by quite a few hours. . . When all of the fiasco around the new MacBook Pro and consumer reports was going around, another company did tests on the MacBook Pro, the Dell XPS, and many others and Apple was the only one that met (and actually exceeded) their advertised battery life.

I owned a surface pro 4, and my only two complaints with it were the display scaling in windows...it seemed that I wanted to be in between 100% and 150%, and 125% wasn't an option. One seemed too tiny, and the other too big. The other issue that I had was with font management. Suitcase Fusion just didn't like the machine at all. I can't speak to the battery life as I really only owned it for a couple of weeks.. no real long term testing.

You may find that the surface laptop does everything you need in a package that is a little bit cheaper than the non touch bar MacBook Pro. If that is the case, then I applaud you for having an open mind, and the not posting "that's it apple I quit, yadda yadda yadda".

Good luck with whatever you decide on. And if you do buy the surface laptop, I'd be curious as to what you think about it....

 

[jeremiah256]

I am in the market for a new MacBook, and I feel so torn. It's hard to believe laptops from 2013 are a viable option, but it certainly seems that way. I guess there is no way to know when Apple may release an updated MacBook Pro, but its hard not to feel like a sucker if I buy the new Touch Bar model, when there is potentially a new improved model just around the corner.

What do people think, is this new MacBook Pro a lemon in a long line of excellent MBP's?

I wouldn't call it a dud, but I do feel that the significant price increase, the initial shock of no legacy ports, and the new Touch Bar vice function keys was a serious shock to the system of those who had been waiting and waiting for the new MacBook Pro.

I've had both the 2006 and the 2011 15" models. It's what I prefer in screen size for my workstation.

I spent $2,500 on the 2GHz upper level model in 2006. Core Duo CPU - I can't remember the HDD (80GBs?) or RAM, but I ended up with 2GBs.

In 2011 for $2,500, I got the upper end 2.2GHz model, 4GBs, 750GB HDD. I upgraded the RAM to 16GBs, upgraded the HDD to a SSD, and swapped out the Super Drive for another SSD. And it still runs well.

In 2016, upgrading is a thing of the past, so I'd need to get my money's worth. Unfortunately, I have to go Touch Bar if I want a 15" model and unfortunately, $2,500 would have gotten me the base model Touch Bar MBP, with 256GBs SSD.

Not a deal breaker, but close enough that I'm willing to wait until 2018 (with the help of a 2015 MacBook to take most of the load off my 2011 MBP) to see what Apple has to offer. But, others may not be able to wait. They may also see that they can increase their computer replacement rate and buy a new PC every 2 years vice every 5 for a Mac. Then, dependability and loyalty becomes less and less of a concern.

 

[Mr. Dee]

I wouldn't call it a dud, but I do feel that the significant price increase, the initial shock of no legacy ports, and the new Touch Bar vice function keys was a serious shock to the system of those who had been waiting and waiting for the new MacBook Pro.

I've had both the 2006 and the 2011 15" models. It's what I prefer in screen size for my workstation.

I spent $2,500 on the 2GHz upper level model in 2006. Core Duo CPU - I can't remember the HDD (80GBs?) or RAM, but I ended up with 2GBs.

In 2011 for $2,500, I got the upper end 2.2GHz model, 4GBs, 750GB HDD. I upgraded the RAM to 16GBs, upgraded the HDD to a SSD, and swapped out the Super Drive for another SSD. And it still runs well.

In 2016, upgrading is a thing of the past, so I'd need to get my money's worth. Unfortunately, I have to go Touch Bar if I want a 15" model and unfortunately, $2,500 would have gotten me the base model Touch Bar MBP, with 256GBs SSD.

Not a deal breaker, but close enough that I'm willing to wait until 2018 (with the help of a 2015 MacBook to take most of the load off my 2011 MBP) to see what Apple has to offer. But, others may not be able to wait. They may also see that they can increase their computer replacement rate and buy a new PC every 2 years vice every 5 for a Mac. Then, dependability and loyalty becomes less and less of a concern.

I hope for the 2017 model, they make the Touch bar optional on a base model 15 inch and also have a iGPU option too. This should bring the price significantly down to about 1,700. This would be great for those wanting a large screen, but not necessarily all the bells, whistles and gimmicks.

 

[SarcasticJoe]

Bingo, WIN32 and all the legacy that comes with such as .exe is pretty much being phased out. They are even moving big desktop apps like Office to the Windows Store. It is only a matter of time until Microsoft work with partners like AutoDesk, Intuit, Adobe and many others to bring their classic desktop apps to the store. Apple and Google are likely to be the two party poopers though. Lets hope not, because I think WIN32 has been holding back Windows for a long time now.

I really wouldn't say that this is an actual improvement seeing how all of the "Metro" UI stuff as been pretty much universally hated to the point where they had to roll back much of it in Windows 10. There's a reason why there's such a huge amount of media on the subject like this:

https://www.penny-arcade.com/S=0/comic/2013/06/28

Besides, legacy support has been one of the main selling points of both Windows since the first versions that weren't just an add-on to DOS and x86 CPUs since the 286. Killing win32 support is going to need to be a very gradual process taking the better part of a decade. My suspicion is that Windows 10 S is part of this gradual process to phase out everything that came before Windows 8 in terms of UI and application-OS interaction.

Just the thought of more and more desktop applications written in JavaScript gives me goosebumps and not in a good way.

 

[Mr. Dee]

I really wouldn't say that this is an actual improvement seeing how all of the "Metro" UI stuff as been pretty much universally hated to the point where they had to roll back much of it in Windows 10. There's a reason why there's such a huge amount of media on the subject like this:

https://www.penny-arcade.com/S=0/comic/2013/06/28

Besides, legacy support has been one of the main selling points of both Windows since the first versions that weren't just an add-on to DOS and x86 CPUs since the 286. Killing win32 support is going to need to be a very gradual process taking the better part of a decade. My suspicion is that Windows 10 S is part of this gradual process to phase out everything that came before Windows 8 in terms of UI and application-OS interaction.

Just the thought of more and more desktop applications written in JavaScript gives me goosebumps and not in a good way.

Universal apps are much the same philosophy as it was 5 years ago. What users didn't like about them, they weren't windowed and lacked many features. They have significantly matured since then.

 

[MrGuder]

I hope for the 2017 model, they make the Touch bar optional on a base model 15 inch and also have a iGPU option too. This should bring the price significantly down to about 1,700. This would be great for those wanting a large screen, but not necessarily all the bells, whistles and gimmicks.

I agree with this however I bet that if Apple continues to sell the 2015 15" we won't see ever see it. Will Apple finally retire the 2015 15" come this fall? Will be interesting to see.

 

[Dave245]

I agree with this however I bet that if Apple continues to sell the 2015 15" we won't see ever see it. Will Apple finally retire the 2015 15" come this fall? Will be interesting to see.

I think think they will, but I also think we will see a price drop for the MacBook Pro with Touch Bar.

 

[johannnn]

I think think they will, but I also think we will see a price drop for the MacBook Pro with Touch Bar.

No way to touch bar edition will get a price reduction. Too soon, it's still premium and will be priced premium

 

[MrGuder]

I think think they will, but I also think we will see a price drop for the MacBook Pro with Touch Bar.

I agree this is most likely what we will see...Apple doesn't make abrupt changes so in reality we are likely to see the 2015 stay just like it is and a price drop on the new model touch bar wil remain as only option for 2017 for 15" but I think they will update the touch bar to add new features or higher resolution bar possibly adding haptic feeback but that might not come till 2018. Apples not going to rush out new stuff so quickly.

 

[Mr. Dee]

I think the Touchbar is turning out to be an obvious non-essential and Apple is likely to either drop the price of Touchbar or models or end up making it an optional feature across the line. But what about Touch ID? Well, it doesn't really require the Touchbar, Apple, could make that a standard built in feature.

 

[Dave245]

No way to touch bar edition will get a price reduction. Too soon, it's still premium and will be priced premium

Apple always do it, they ramp up prices with a first gen redesign and then the next year is a price reduction, it happened with the 5K iMac as well the first year it was more expensive and the second they reduced the price.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

Yes. the GPU is weaker than the quadro in a year and a half old lenovo P50 that is $1000 cheaper, soldered on SSD, no SDcard slot.. I don't get it... why kill the sdcard slot on a machine that is the DOMINANT choice of amateur photographers/video content creators...

 

[Ethosik]

Yes. the GPU is weaker than the quadro in a year and a half old lenovo P50 that is $1000 cheaper, soldered on SSD, no SDcard slot.. I don't get it... why kill the sdcard slot on a machine that is the DOMINANT choice of amateur photographers/video content creators...

Since when were MBP's GPUs better, or even at the same level, as a quadro? Mt 2013 rMBP had a horrible GPU in it. It did not match Quadro levels. When did a MBP ever reach quadro levels? People will be complaining EVEN MORE if they did as Quadros are worse at gaming.

 

[CaptRB]

Yes. the GPU is weaker than the quadro in a year and a half old lenovo P50 that is $1000 cheaper, soldered on SSD, no SDcard slot.. I don't get it... why kill the sdcard slot on a machine that is the DOMINANT choice of amateur photographers/video content creators...

The SD car is a TRIVIAL loss, a small inconvenience at the worst.

I always used a card reader as every DSLR I own uses more than SD (except for my prosumer Nikon Df).

This 15" touch bar is awesome, but not perfect.


R.

 

[BoxsterRS]

I just got a high end 2016 15" MacBook Pro and don't regret it, it is a very powerful machine. I also had to buy adapters for my external HD but besides that extra expense USB-C is the way to go and the reduced weight and size, color, performance and reliability are superb. At the end of the day it is a very powerful laptop and apps like Apple Motion and FCP are extra fast.

 

[csurfr]

Since battery life was in question earlier, I thought I would take a screen of this. . . open currently: Safari, Illustrator (document has 1000's of objects, and iMessage. Overall I'm pretty pleased.

 

[SarcasticJoe]

Universal apps are much the same philosophy as it was 5 years ago. What users didn't like about them, they weren't windowed and lacked many features. They have significantly matured since then.

If the relative obscurity of the Windows 8/10 app store compared to the install base of the OS they're stuck to and the more recent complaints from people who have tried buying applications from there is anything to go I really wouldn't be so sure about any real improvements having been made. Even if there's been major improvements, first impressions matter and universal apps and the store they're sold in has made and impression comparable to that of the Apple III.