It's insulting that OSX is receiving iPhone features rather than the other way around

[Aidoneus]

It's 2012. Users shouldn't have to deal with a file system.

 

[Calidude]

Not everyone in the world wants or cares to know how their electronic items work, so they shouldn't have to.

This is what really worries me. A few generations of this and gone are the tinkerers, the modders, the garage enthusiasts, the self-educated programmers, the overall spirit of curiosity and mastering of computer systems...

Make way for the proles that make the shiny pictures under glass move from point A to B with their fingers.

 

[mrochester]

This is what really worries me. A few generations of this and gone are the tinkerers, the modders, the garage enthusiasts, the self-educated programmers, the overall spirit of curiosity and mastering of computer systems...

Make way for the proles that make the shiny pictures under glass move from point A to B with their fingers.

Let the people who want to work in this area worry about how these things function. The end user shouldn't have to worry about that sort of thing. The tinkerers and modders will still be there, they'll just be a far far smaller percentage of the overall total and there'll be increasingly fewer and fewer products aimed towards them. But that's only common sense.

 

[Wrathwitch]

The iPhone and iPad have been very popular compared to the Mac.

Apple sees this and wants to make the Mac as much of a post-PC device as a PC can be.

The thing Apple forgets, though (or maybe they don't), is that the entire world has been trained to use a more complex computing environment and is capable of doing so. Sure, there are use cases where a senior citizen would be better off with an appliance-like interface, but is it right for everyone?

At times I've seen Apple's desire to make things simpler make things more complicated if you want to do something Apple doesn't anticipate. Or, you need an app to complete a very specific function.

Apple is a bit like a poet who is able to non-sentimentally erase lines that don't serve the singular purpose of a poem, even if they were really clever lines.

I think there is a case to be made for PC era devices with features that Apple's OS will lose over time. And I hope Microsoft is there to make that case. But I am starting to get where Apple is going. I don't know if I like it—it's a very sterile, unemotional, inorganic, intuitive-only-through-appliance-like-nature paradigm. It's not intuitive like pre-Mac OS X or Mac OS X had been. Instead it's bold and obvious like primary colors. It's less intuitive and more simple.

Apple has often stripped itself of aging technology before consumers were ready, but then they did it with serial ports, floppy drives, and DVD drives, not software features.

If you want to feel really paralyzed try using a ChromeBook. It's unnerving to use one. You can't do anything with it but what it was designed to do. You want to close the browser window to see the desktop, but you can't. It's just there, waiting for you to pick a web application. It's like an appliance. People don't sit with their washing machines, playing with the knobs, customizing them just so. It's the same with the direction Apple is going. And if you want to feel what too fast in that direction feels like, the ChromeBook is the perfect example.

Apple's vision is to create devices that people use for their intended functions. Apple doesn't seem to any longer want to create devices that people love. It's about making the same PCs of the 90s and 00s not more advanced, but more like appliances. You could take the complex, interesting, quirky, emotionally connected OSes from the 90s and 00s and make them more advanced, but Apple's not doing that. It's making the PC for everyone (not just the rest of us), all over again, starting from scratch as if it's the late 1970s, as if no one had ever learned how to use their computers over the last few decades. As if the last few decades didn't happen. They are abandoning the computer of the last 20 years to build one from scratch. And it's boring, and it's like a washing machine. But it works, and people like it. One app, one button, one tap. Nothing more.

If you're looking for meaning in an Apple device, an emotional connection to the software, a camaraderie with the underdog, I think those days are over.

I really agree with your post. I don't like making a power machine like a toy with pretty swipes, whistles and flashy things. Mobile devices, sure that works, you dont' have time to be flipping around with complex procedures but I want my desktop (iMac) to feel like the adult device and the iPhone/iPad to feel like the younger generation.

 

[decafjava]

This is what really worries me. A few generations of this and gone are the tinkerers, the modders, the garage enthusiasts, the self-educated programmers, the overall spirit of curiosity and mastering of computer systems...

Make way for the proles that make the shiny pictures under glass move from point A to B with their fingers.

Well I see your point but...do you drive? Do you know how to fix your own car? I don't have one right now but other than the most basic stuff like putting windshield fluid and maybe-in an emergency-changing a tire I haven't a clue about maintenance let alone major repairs. I think tech is headed the same way.

 

[Calidude]

Well I see your point but...do you drive? Do you know how to fix your own car? I don't have one right now but other than the most basic stuff like putting windshield fluid and maybe-in an emergency-changing a tire I haven't a clue about maintenance let alone major repairs. I think tech is headed the same way.

Yes I do know how to do all those things except for the major repair, and not knowing how what you own works is a bad thing for consumers but a good thing for companies only.

Besides, a car and a computer are different things. One needs special equipment, the other just needs a small toolbox. I'd like to keep my small toolbox for my computer instead of going to a store when something goes wrong. That's why I built my own Windows PC. So I could just fix everything myself because I know better than anybody what was in it.

 

[buddybd]

I like it, at least for my MBA at least. Both are highly portable machines, so there's no reason why they can't share more of the same features.

 

[Kyotoma]

Yes I do know how to do all those things except for the major repair, and not knowing how what you own works is a bad thing for consumers but a good thing for companies only.

Besides, a car and a computer are different things. One needs special equipment, the other just needs a small toolbox. I'd like to keep my small toolbox for my computer instead of going to a store when something goes wrong. That's why I built my own Windows PC. So I could just fix everything myself because I know better than anybody what was in it.

Actually they really are the same. They both require sets of specific tools and generally also require an amount of knowledge in order to perform a repair. One may need a small toolbox while the other needs a bigger toolbox, bu the principles are the same.

 

[lordofthereef]

Jailbreaking allows customization, and if that's all he wants, then fine. But the OP's original argument was that he was angry that Apple is adding iOS features to the Mac, and not the other way around. You can jailbreak your iPhone, but you can't jailbreak Apple itself.

His original argument, at least how I saw it, was missing certain features, such as a file system. This can be done through jailbreak. If you feel his original argument was only regarding iOS features added to Mac, I find suggesting Android to be even less appropriate. To me, it pretty clear that the OP's issue was deeper than just the title of the thread he created.

 

[Calidude]

His original argument, at least how I saw it, was missing certain features, such as a file system. This can be done through jailbreak. If you feel his original argument was only regarding iOS features added to Mac, I find suggesting Android to be even less appropriate. To me, it pretty clear that the OP's issue was deeper than just the title of the thread he created.

Yes the title seems to be freaking a few people out, but reading the actual post should make it clear to people. I guess I overestimated people.

 

[Eso]

Do you people really WANT your phone to lack things like a filesystem or even a file repository?

Apple new system for file management is app based. The finder app isn't going to be added to iOS, it's going to be removed from OS X. The future for Apple is every app stores its own files.

 

[cotak]

The loss of the file system is a disaster for the average user.

File systems are not on the way out. They are better for any user than any alternative so far.



Rubbish.



Huh? Lion is a *disaster* usability wise. Really, the file system changes in Lion are as popular as syphilis, and have very signifcantly increased the pain in the ass that is moving the vast majority of novice users from Windows to OSX. If Apple weren't forcing Lion adoption with lack of hardware drivers, destroying MobileMe and shipping all new Macs with it then it would have failed totally due to it's file system changes. Windows 8 has a complete and full file system, even in Metro.



The reality is that iOS already has file systems. Dozens of file systems. All of which are useless for some things and have an inconsistent UI from app to app. And you really think this is better? That every app might react differently when presenting you with a file list - swiping might send the file somewhere else, or delete it, or send it to everyone in your address book, and there is no consistency to this whatsoever.

You really think that's better than a file system? Let's just look at the epic fail that is not being able to attach a photo to a pre-written mail in iOS. That's better for novice users? Really??? How many times do we see new iOS users come on to this board and ask because they think they're being stupid?



Nope, this is nonsense. There's actually not much reason to move things between apps at all. What users want to do is precisely move things themselves. That's pretty much the entire purpose of computing. Users want to send their pictures to people. Or share them with the world. And they will pick thousands of different ways to do it and iOS is really failing to keep track with them.



Unless the app developer hasn't thought of the other app it might want to pass it over to. Or just hasn't updated it for a year. Then you're completely screwed.



Does it allow all the same things? Okay then: use your share sheet solution to...

Upload a photograph you've taken yourself to a web forum where Apple doesn't like the content enough to allow an app (say, because it features content too rude for a Victorian era sexual morality).

Copy an answer phone message from the iPhone to your new, non-Apple phone if you've decided you don't like iOS any more (I had this happen to a girl I knew who rang me in floods of tears as her iPhone had a broken screen, she could only afford to replace it with an Android handset, and she had an answer phone message that was the last recording she had of her recently deceased mother. And what was the answer? Apple's "better" way is that you should lose that, unless you're able to find someone techy like me to jailbreak the device and get file system access to it).

Phazer

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The alternatives might also lack features that are important to him.

There's also the minor matter that getting data that's imporant to him off his iOS device and on to another platform is made much harder by the lack of a file system...

Phazer

At least I don't have to write out my thoughts cause you got the perfectly!

Frankly I really don't like the direction they are taking. Yes it will maybe work for the masses but man I suspect it's going to add nothing of substance to what you can do with the Mac.

That's sad because the success they have had for both the Macs and i-devices was based on substance. Macs the build was unique till recently and OS X was better than windows XP. Iphones took over from mediocre smartphones and made a new model world. In both cases Apple open new doors allowing it's users to do new things.

Adding more limitations is going to turn that tradition around and I really don't like it.

 

[onthecouchagain]

I have yet to use any of the major 'iOS-like' features in Lion with my Macs. Launchpad is just too cumbersome to use on such a large screen, in my opinion.

 

[Calidude]

Apple new system for file management is app based. The finder app isn't going to be added to iOS, it's going to be removed from OS X. The future for Apple is every app stores its own files.

Considering that Apple's iOS software profits depend mostly upon apps, it makes perfect sense that they obscure and ignore file management. But of course, you guys will say this is the future and not just clever marketing.

 

[Shadyriley]

Don't worry they are going to release an iPad with a file system that connects to a keyboard dock and runs like a MacBook, iPad Pro.

 

[MattInOz]

Considering that Apple's iOS software profits depend mostly upon apps, it makes perfect sense that they obscure and ignore file management. But of course, you guys will say this is the future and not just clever marketing.

Well Apple doesn't make a lot of profit from App sale
sooooo.... the alternative theorem might be....

The file system is a constant source of process locks that even today can bring a Mac OS X to its knees with a big files and few network collisions. The simplest answer is the file system as it stands, embedded in the kernel, just isn't good enough to be exposed on iOS with out the restrictions currently in place.

 

[lordofthereef]

Well Apple doesn't make a lot of profit from App sale

You lost all credibility right there as far as I am concerned. Apple doesn't make a lot of profit? It's basically pure profit to them. They pay to host the file and rake in the dough.

 

[Calidude]

Well Apple doesn't make a lot of profit from App sale.

You are living in an alternate reality...

 

[mrochester]

You are living in an alternate reality...

Didn't Apple once say that the cost of running iTunes and the associated stores means they only just break even?

EDIT - This was possibly the story http://www.macnn.com/articles/11/06/13/apple.says.store.runs.slightly.above.break.even/

 

[Eso]

It's 2012. Users shouldn't have to deal with a file system.

Storing files in a grid w/ folder within apps is a file system (a system of managing/organizing files).

 

[Buildbright]

The iPhone has alot of OSX.

iMovie
Garage Band
Pages
Keynote

A file system is coming soon.

 

[hakuna-matata]

The iPhone has alot of OSX.

iMovie
Garage Band
Pages
Keynote

A file system is coming soon.

I don't think anyone is realistically asking for the system files to be as open and accessible as they are in most other operating systems.

Just my own data.

MAYBE AN APP(File manager) to store files(sorted by extensions in folders) in one place that allows me to transfer them in/out via windows/mac filesystem. Also, there an added feature to open files in any of the corresponding apps installed on ios..this would be a cool way to manage/store files..

 

[jabingla2810]

The iPhone has alot of OSX.

***
A file system is coming soon.

Apple have been quite vocal about their dislike for the file system.

Who wants to manage files on a mobile phone?

But I do think how apps talk to each other will be improved a lot in coming years.

EG, in the photo's app, selecting a photo and then choosing an app to open the photo in?

A nice little drop down saying,

Open this photo in: Photoshop
Colorsplash
Snapseed

This could be done from the browser too.... instead of holding your finger on a picture and saving it, also offering an "open in app" option.

Same for video you've got etc.

 

[Buildbright]

There is already file systems on the iPad and iPhone.

Photos
Video

These are file systems. Next will be the one for Documents. Hence why Apple has Docs in iCloud in Mountain Lion.

Apple dislikes Traditional file systems they are going to reinvent it for portable devices.

 

[MattInOz]

You lost all credibility right there as far as I am concerned. Apple doesn't make a lot of profit? It's basically pure profit to them. They pay to host the file and rake in the dough.

Then I Encourage you to set forth and create a better outlet for Developers and Customers alike.