BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
Well this will no doubt create a heated debate but after this evening WOW!!! 4K UHD Blu-Ray are you retired yet?
Seriously guys, Thursday evening is our movie night after the gym. Anyway I picked up a film called THE LONGEST RIDE from the iTunes 4K HDR selection.
All I can say is WOW! My 4K Apple TV totally came alive. Apart from the incredible stunning picture quality and vibrant colours of this film (lovely watching it in 24p HDR with no judder), I've never ever heard iTunes Dolby Digital 5.1 sound so alive and spectacular! It felt uncompressed - so clear - solid bass with a high quality treble. The whole TV came alive (Panasonic 4K HDR EX700).
We were bowled over by the quality of both picture & sound (often i'm a little disappointed by compressed sound). This iTunes film truly shines in every respect and it was a lovely, sweet film too - not one for the action lovers though.
It truly shows what iTunes, Apple TV and 4K HDR streaming is capable of.
And, it was in the iTunes store sale - I bought it for £2.99.
With quality like this i'll easily say that this lil Apple TV 4K box is the finest investment for any TV.
Well done Apple. You've a true winner here.
 

priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,812
551
Estonia
4K UHD Blu-Ray are you retired yet?
Can not, Because audio is nowhere near a good UHD BD played through a Dolby Atmos decoder.
Another thinking I have - I prefer to have movies i really like on my own shelf instead of someone else's computer (aka "The Cloud").
You know, the possession obsession. ;)
 

Michael CM1

macrumors 603
Feb 4, 2008
5,680
275
I honestly don't see any reason to buy blu ray or any other physical media ever again

They have a few benefits, namely the obvious physical backup, easier portability between TVs (but that's decreasing), and the fact that you do own the disc. I also think the product is technically superior because of less compression.

BUT. I haven't increased my insane disc clutter since buying all movies through Apple. My purchases are available on any device, and I have shown my parents how to watch my movies through our family group. If extras get added, they get thrown at you for free.

OH. AND SO I BOUGHT ALL THOSE HD MOVIES FOR A FEW YEARS AND NOW I'M GETTING THE 4K VERSIONS AT NO EXTRA CHARGE SO WHENEVER I GET A 4K SETUP I'M GONNA HAVE TONS OF CONTENT.

That's an insane amount of awesome. I would've even paid $5 to upgrade my purchase. It will probably be at least a year before I even think about buying 4K anything since all my TVs are working fine. I've had an Xbox One S for the whole year and haven't really thought I needed to use 4K features.
 

Macalicious2011

macrumors 65816
May 15, 2011
1,041
855
London
I'm glad you are enjoying the image quality. I was massively skeptical about the quality of 4K streaming and even bid on a few M9500 on eBay. Thankfully I didn't win them and ended up buying a 4K Apple TV.

The best image quality I have experience was when watching "The Perfect Physique", a body building documentary in 4k on Netflix. Because it was shoot digitally in 4K using amazing lenses, the clarity and detail was exceptional.

However when I have an Xbox One X, I will have best of both worlds and will be able to pick up cheap UHD titles whenever I see them on eBay.
 
  • Like
Reactions: George Dawes

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
Can not, Because audio is nowhere near a good UHD BD played through a Dolby Atmos decoder.
Another thinking I have - I prefer to have movies i really like on my own shelf instead of someone else's computer (aka "The Cloud").
You know, the possession obsession. ;)

Hi Prilitv :) Yes, that's what I thought until I heard how good DD can sound judging by this film. It's very clear, it all depends on how the studio mixes it I guess - just like music and over processing :) Plus don't forget Dolby Atmos is on its way to the Apple TV.
Now that i've got my iPhone X, i'm really happy watching film or video on my journeys now - it's the perfect size of screen for me :) so the iTunes films are making even more sense for me and yep, I download them to keep :)
 

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
I'm glad you are enjoying the image quality. I was massively skeptical about the quality of 4K streaming and even bid on a few M9500 on eBay. Thankfully I didn't win them and ended up buying a 4K Apple TV.

The best image quality I have experience was when watching "The Perfect Physique", a body building documentary in 4k on Netflix. Because it was shoot digitally in 4K using amazing lenses, the clarity and detail was exceptional.

However when I have an Xbox One X, I will have best of both worlds and will be able to pick up cheap UHD titles whenever I see them on eBay.

That's include buddy and being honest, I totally agree. I buy skiing & snowboarding films from MSP and The Orchard and they are filmed using 8K Phantom cameras and lenses, so you can imagine how they shine in 4K combined with the natural sunlight bouncing off the snow!
I will check out that documentary although as a natural bodybuilder, I'm rather horrified how the non-natural sport industry operates!
 
  • Like
Reactions: oneMadRssn

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
They have a few benefits, namely the obvious physical backup, easier portability between TVs (but that's decreasing), and the fact that you do own the disc. I also think the product is technically superior because of less compression.

BUT. I haven't increased my insane disc clutter since buying all movies through Apple. My purchases are available on any device, and I have shown my parents how to watch my movies through our family group. If extras get added, they get thrown at you for free.

OH. AND SO I BOUGHT ALL THOSE HD MOVIES FOR A FEW YEARS AND NOW I'M GETTING THE 4K VERSIONS AT NO EXTRA CHARGE SO WHENEVER I GET A 4K SETUP I'M GONNA HAVE TONS OF CONTENT.

That's an insane amount of awesome. I would've even paid $5 to upgrade my purchase. It will probably be at least a year before I even think about buying 4K anything since all my TVs are working fine. I've had an Xbox One S for the whole year and haven't really thought I needed to use 4K features.

Hey Michael, one of there super positive iTunes things over a physical disc is that Apple seem to constantly get updated files from their distributors meaning improved quality. An example was my SD copy of Meet Joe Black which truly outshone my old DVD copy. The colours on the disc were orangey overstated - they all had orangey skin like Donald Trump whereas the iTunes copy was colour perfect.
Sounds like the ATV 4K and your Xbox will be the perfect AV system. Enjoy
 
  • Like
Reactions: George Dawes

Floris

macrumors 68020
Sep 7, 2007
2,381
1,473
Netherlands
Can not, Because audio is nowhere near a good UHD BD played through a Dolby Atmos decoder.
Another thinking I have - I prefer to have movies i really like on my own shelf instead of someone else's computer (aka "The Cloud").
You know, the possession obsession. ;)

"You know, the possession obsession. ;)"

Just realise you don't own those movies, you paid for a license to play the media on that disk.
A bit of a difference with 15+ years ago.
 

richardamp

macrumors member
Jan 18, 2013
38
36
I agree with you OP. I streamed a 4K Dolby Vision movie a few days ago and it was amazing on the LG OLED. HDR really does make a ton of difference. The fact that iTunes has so much HDR content and upgrading previous content for free really does set it apart at the moment.
 

Sakurambo-kun

macrumors 6502a
Oct 30, 2015
521
490
UK
I think it depends on your display, and how you watch movies. Take for example Blade Runner The Final Cut. On iTunes it's in 4K (real full fat 4K, it's not a 2K upscale as most "4K" movies are) and in Dolby Vision. On UHD Blu-Ray it's in 4K HDR10.

My TV is a 65" LG B7 OLED. Having watched both the UHD disc and the iTunes version, the disc absolutely destroys the iTunes version in every conceivable way. The difference is truly night and day.

The problems with the iTunes version are - 1) Greatly elevated black level. This is a common problem with iTunes Dolby Vision releases. This looks truly terrible on an OLED. 2) The fine grain in the 4K transfer (this was shot on 35mm and 70mm for the VFX) is much reduced, which creates a more processed, less film like image. 3) Sound quality is noticeably less clean (iTunes is Dolby Digital+, the disc is Dolby TrueHD).

Blade Runner is a particularly bad example, but I've noticed similar issues with some of the Harry Potter movies (which are all 2K upscales anyway). Elevated black levels are only really an issue if you have an OLED and watch in a dark room. If you have an LCD you'll never see black regardless of what you're watching.

Generally older movies with real film to 4K transfers have a lot of film grain which doesn't play well with the limited bitrates of iTunes (15-20mbits vs 70-108mbits on a UHD disc). Newer movies which are virtually all 2K upscales look more similar, as there is very little grain and zero 4K detail to resolve. If anyone has The Revenant on UHD disc and iTunes that would be an interesting comparison, as the disc looks insanely good, and it's real 4K.
 

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
I agree with you OP. I streamed a 4K Dolby Vision movie a few days ago and it was amazing on the LG OLED. HDR really does make a ton of difference. The fact that iTunes has so much HDR content and upgrading previous content for free really does set it apart at the moment.

Exactly, in the UK when ATV 4K launched, we had 66 films and now it's way over 150+ DV/HDR 4K films on iTunes. I bet 2018 will be the year that iTunes catalogue becomes truly 4K DV/HDR just like HD now. :)
Exciting times for everyone!
[doublepost=1511616301][/doublepost]
I think it depends on your display, and how you watch movies. Take for example Blade Runner The Final Cut. On iTunes it's in 4K (real full fat 4K, it's not a 2K upscale as most "4K" movies are) and in Dolby Vision. On UHD Blu-Ray it's in 4K HDR10.

My TV is a 65" LG B7 OLED. Having watched both the UHD disc and the iTunes version, the disc absolutely destroys the iTunes version in every conceivable way. The difference is truly night and day.

The problems with the iTunes version are - 1) Greatly elevated black level. This is a common problem with iTunes Dolby Vision releases. This looks truly terrible on an OLED. 2) The fine grain in the 4K transfer (this was shot on 35mm and 70mm for the VFX) is much reduced, which creates a more processed, less film like image. 3) Sound quality is noticeably less clean (iTunes is Dolby Digital+, the disc is Dolby TrueHD).

Blade Runner is a particularly bad example, but I've noticed similar issues with some of the Harry Potter movies (which are all 2K upscales anyway). Elevated black levels are only really an issue if you have an OLED and watch in a dark room. If you have an LCD you'll never see black regardless of what you're watching.

Generally older movies with real film to 4K transfers have a lot of film grain which doesn't play well with the limited bitrates of iTunes (15-20mbits vs 70-108mbits on a UHD disc). Newer movies which are virtually all 2K upscales look more similar, as there is very little grain and zero 4K detail to resolve. If anyone has The Revenant on UHD disc and iTunes that would be an interesting comparison, as the disc looks insanely good, and it's real 4K.

Great point and maybe it's because you're viewing it on a beautiful 65" OLED. Of course, that size will show every detail. But also, most people who are bowled over with the iTunes film, will not be sat there with a 4K BluRay disc of the film doing a comparison. For me, it looked beautiful and I got totally lost in the film which is the film writers idea. I've often thought, wow why would I look for grain around the edges or critique this or that if i'm swept away by the film. Now, if the audio sounds really dull or if I have to turn the sound up and down constantly, then i get upset!

So true with black on a LCD. I remember having a BANG&OLUFSEN LCD TV way back in 2005 - early Samsung screen and any film buff would of cried. The black in the end credits was a washed out mid grey!!! That was the blackest I could get and text running sidewards was a complete blur. How LCD has improved I guess but YES for TV OLED is the way to watch film - it's beautiful.
But I must say, having given it a lot of consideration recently, I really don't and won't want to return to physical disc. I gave up CD in 1999. Sadly, I moved to MiniDisc and look what happened to that :) :) :) (loved at the time by me). I do love having everything my iTunes library and discovering things in it 5 or 6 years later all in one place! It suits my highly active travelling lifestyle :)
[doublepost=1511616461][/doublepost][QUOTE

Generally older movies with real film to 4K transfers have a lot of film grain which doesn't play well with the limited bitrates of iTunes (15-20mbits vs 70-108mbits on a UHD disc). Newer movies which are virtually all 2K upscales look more similar, as there is very little grain and zero 4K detail to resolve. If anyone has The Revenant on UHD disc and iTunes that would be an interesting comparison, as the disc looks insanely good, and it's real 4K.[/QUOTE]

I've seen my editorials that argue that it is HEVC that does not work well with old film grain compared to h264. It's a mess. This likely explains all.
 
  • Like
Reactions: George Dawes

priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,812
551
Estonia
"Just realise you don't own those movies, you paid for a license to play the media on that disk.
A bit of a difference with 15+ years ago.
Yes, I know that. But still, no-one is going to come and take my media away from me. So I can watch it whenever I care to.
There is no guarantee that your purchase will be eternally accessible in the cloud.
Several people have already complained about this happening in iTunes Store as well. Or it has happened that the movie version has been replaced with a different one (same title).
So my point is only about having things under my own (disc on my shelf) or someone else's (the cloud) control.
 
  • Like
Reactions: FrancoisC

Unprocessed1

macrumors 65816
Jun 23, 2008
1,378
46
Is the 4K quality for iTunes video superior to the 4K streaming you get with the built-in apps on your TV?
 

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
Is the 4K quality for iTunes video superior to the 4K streaming you get with the built-in apps on your TV?

I would say yes most definitely. The reason is that Apple is so strict with their form of compression. The file reaches the several companies that Apple deal with as a Pro Res 422 file which is then encoded/compressed to Apple's standard.
I've never been disappointed with a HD iTunes film in terms of picture quality.
I once saw a new HD TV series on Amazon and the picture was so waxy looking that to me, it was no more than 480p.
But see for yourself, trust your own eyes and ears. There will always be people that criticise everything in the world and yet, they couldn't do anything better themselves. Only you can be the judge but I believe the person who finds fault in picture quality beyond reason is never going to be happy and they'd be better moving on to another past time.
[doublepost=1511622242][/doublepost]
Yes, I know that. But still, no-one is going to come and take my media away from me. So I can watch it whenever I care to.
There is no guarantee that your purchase will be eternally accessible in the cloud.
Several people have already complained about this happening in iTunes Store as well. Or it has happened that the movie version has been replaced with a different one (same title).
So my point is only about having things under my own (disc on my shelf) or someone else's (the cloud) control.

So true - I got bitten just the once and was obviously upset. Now I download on a LaCie back up hard drive just for safety. Although Apple were decent in the end and gave me 4 Rental Credits worth £22 (compared to the £5 film).
But I believe doesn't a 4K BluRay player register via the Internet a 4K Disc everytime it plays/loads? I guess if that format dies, I can't see manufacturers especially Samsung helping long term customers. Personally, I really cannot see a future for 4K BluRay. In the UK we've had it for 2 years in January and there's hardly any discs. As a business, doesn't that tell you something? IMO I believe that iTunes 4K DV Dolby Atmos will kill off 4K BluRay.
For me, the only people that I know who are buying disc now are you wonderful people on this forum. Heck, my International friends were downloading film in 2007. It was horrible in those days 240p & 1MB broadband and constant buffering!!! And, that was 10 years ago. We've come a long way in just 10 years :)
 

Moonjumper

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2009
2,525
2,414
Lincoln, UK
I have a mix of physical and digital, and will stay that way when I go 4K (I already have some content in each option).

Physical still has an edge in quality (although often not as noticeable as previously), so will remain the choice for the best content (documentaries such as Planet Earth 2, and films such as Blade Runner). There are also bargains to be had from second-hand to fill out the collection, so it can be the cheaper option. And I can sell weak content that I took a risk on.

Digital doesn't take up space, and is a good option for watching something when staying in a hotel. The main problem is I have ended up with is content spread across different providers. Hopefully Movies Anywhere will spread to UK, and be taken up by everyone (not every film studio has joined yet).
 
  • Like
Reactions: BODYBUILDERPAUL

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
As are HD movies viewed@2160p via Sony 4k t.v.
Everest is amazing he quality-3 quid -what an amazing hillwalking movie.

Dude, I have to check that film out!
[doublepost=1511637511][/doublepost]
Dude, I have to check that film out!

Thank you so much for the recommendation! Just bought it!!! The trailer look incredible AND Kieran Knightly in a film always a pleasure :) Really looking forward to seeing this. An inspiring film :) We've got Song to Song for next Thursday so we'll have to wait until the following Thursday for it unless I get a peep look :)
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Donfor39

Lappen71

macrumors 6502
Nov 16, 2012
290
142
Can not, Because audio is nowhere near a good UHD BD played through a Dolby Atmos decoder.
Another thinking I have - I prefer to have movies i really like on my own shelf instead of someone else's computer (aka "The Cloud").
You know, the possession obsession. ;)

I thought the same when DVD came and now all my DVD´s is in storage and obsolete. Yours will be to ;)
 

priitv8

macrumors 68040
Jan 13, 2011
3,812
551
Estonia
I thought the same when DVD came and now all my DVD´s is in storage and obsolete. Yours will be to ;)
Yeah. I have quite a number of N8 and S8 films, VHS and Digital8 cassettes and DVDs :)
Obviously I have ripped and stored best of them on DAS but they are all stored on my computer, not someone else’s.
And I still have the original media as backup copy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lappen71

coolbreeze2

Contributor
Sep 24, 2009
1,052
660
Well this will no doubt create a heated debate but after this evening WOW!!! 4K UHD Blu-Ray are you retired yet?
Seriously guys, Thursday evening is our movie night after the gym. Anyway I picked up a film called THE LONGEST RIDE from the iTunes 4K HDR selection.
All I can say is WOW! My 4K Apple TV totally came alive. Apart from the incredible stunning picture quality and vibrant colours of this film (lovely watching it in 24p HDR with no judder), I've never ever heard iTunes Dolby Digital 5.1 sound so alive and spectacular! It felt uncompressed - so clear - solid bass with a high quality treble. The whole TV came alive (Panasonic 4K HDR EX700).
We were bowled over by the quality of both picture & sound (often i'm a little disappointed by compressed sound). This iTunes film truly shines in every respect and it was a lovely, sweet film too - not one for the action lovers though.
It truly shows what iTunes, Apple TV and 4K HDR streaming is capable of.
And, it was in the iTunes store sale - I bought it for £2.99.
With quality like this i'll easily say that this lil Apple TV 4K box is the finest investment for any TV.
Well done Apple. You've a true winner here.

Oh wow why did you post this!! All the anti-Apple trolls who are attracted to this forum like flies to honey will be commenting with their gibberish
 
Last edited:

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,436
Barcelona
Oh wow why did you post this!! All the anti-Apple trolls who are attracted to this forum like flies to honey will commenting with their gibberish

Hahaha up to now, it's been all love on this page :) :) :) Maybe even the trolls can't find too much to slaughter when it comes to iTunes. I mean, this beautiful film in 4K HDR for £3 compared to £25 for the UHD disc. :) :) :) It purely sparkled on the screen.
Oh damn, i'm putting out more honey for the flies aren't I. And it's organic honey with no artificial ingredients too, where the profits are invested in the farmers and their families :) :) :)
 

kiranmk2

macrumors 6502a
Oct 4, 2008
977
606
I've always been a fan of physical media. However, I've become accustomed to picking up digital codes for a few $/£ so most of my new films are digital (Movies Anywhere has been a massive boon to those of us using an AppleTV). I've seen, first with DVD and increasingly Blu Ray that the discs eventually become almost worthless. Thus, if in 5-10 years my digital copies become lost via revoked licences or rights issues, I should be able to pick up the physical media version for £1-2 per film as a backup.

When I moved from DVD to Blu Ray I decided I would only upgrade my absolute favourites. For the move to 4K, I'm going to be even more selective on upgrading and in the meatime, picking up iTunes/UV codes online has enabled me to effectively upgrade my SD film collection to HD: even if digital is not as good as a Blu Ray, it is much better than my DVD copy.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: BODYBUILDERPAUL
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.