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Jobs Tips Execs About Napster Security Flaw
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Ask not. . .
The only way that a subscription service will enjoy long-term survival in the market, that is to say, not be shut down by the RIAA and the legal hounds, is to stream the data to the user on demand. This, however, brings up an interesting paradox. Streaming the data to all of the users would be far too expensive. Therefore, with a rudimentary knowledge of a) bandwidth costs, and b) the tendencies of the RIAA to bust the sack of anyone who they think is getting too much and not paying enough, has shown us all that the Subscription model for distributing music will never fly. Apple did it first, apple did it right, and I don't see that changing any time soon. Apple may not have a monopoly on computers, but it would seem that they have a monopoly on talented designers.
The only way that a subscription service will enjoy long-term survival in the market, that is to say, not be shut down by the RIAA and the legal hounds, is to stream the data to the user on demand. This, however, brings up an interesting paradox. Streaming the data to all of the users would be far too expensive. Therefore, with a rudimentary knowledge of a) bandwidth costs, and b) the tendencies of the RIAA to bust the sack of anyone who they think is getting too much and not paying enough, has shown us all that the Subscription model for distributing music will never fly. Apple did it first, apple did it right, and I don't see that changing any time soon. Apple may not have a monopoly on computers, but it would seem that they have a monopoly on talented designers.
topgunn said:
True to an extent....
It also depends on the expertise of the mail admins and to what extent they log and keep the logs. Most admins dont really have the know how and dont even bother with trying. They are usually just to busy and their security suffers. HEck most of the time they dont even keep up with patches.
Depends alot on the SMTP implementation of the mail server too.
For example.
MS Exchange is not extremly difficult to fool and Since it is the most common corporate email server in use today one could reasonably assume it could be involved as the recieving server. It can be very difficult sometimes depending on the expertise of the sender/hacker and the poor logging capability of exchange to figure out if where an email came from was legit or not.
Usually a careful reading of the SMTP headers WILL show the correct IP address of the originating mail server
But when weak SMTP implementations like MS exchange and some others are involved, Most of the header info can be forged and in some cases all of it can.(Although in the latter case it requires expertise in packet forging too.)And also requires access to an intermediary network between legitimate Servers which is all very difficult but not impossible to accomplish.
My gut feeling in this case would be the email was legitimate, especially since it isnt a very attractive use of time for Hacking( I mean really why would anyone waste their time exploting a mail server in the way I described for such little effect.)
Since I dont really know the facts of this case it is only speculation on my part.
old news, so anyways my mac mini and shuffle are great! I got a few other people to buy the shuffle 2. I might just buy some stock even now
digitalbiker said:
Looking into Jobs's personality, it is pretty interesting. In his view, he didn't cheap Woz out of anything. Woz was given the money he had been told he would get, and was happy until he learned the truth. Jobs didn't see anything wrong with that, he just didn't take into account that Woz would find out later. I'm not saying Jobs was right, just trying to give some insight here.
And I just did the math... Free for a month+Free Music Extractor=70 40GB iPods filled. iTunes can't give me that.
topgunn said:
Which is also easy to change. Not only that, if it was spoofed by any .Mac user, it would have come from Apple. (or anyone with a trial .Mac account) Do you think the reporter that got a scoop on this is going get access to and/or corellate SMTP logs?
sinisterdesign said:
No kidding! It's almost hard to believe that the whole Gil Amelio/Performa nightmares/OS 7.5.5 era ever existed at this point, huh? That was such a low-point, such a mess.
I'm in the same situation and I remember in late 2000 being sorely tempted to switch to Windows. I had a new job that put me in front of a Windows NT machine nightly and I have to say that OS 9 didn't hold its own against that. Windows still had myriad problems--many of which undercut its supposed advantages--but at that stage, Windows had stability and software that OS 9 couldn't even imagine having. It was discouraging to see the only Mac in my office relegated to graphic work--the one area where the Mac still demonstrably reigned... and in that, only barely.
It just seemed to me that around 2000, the Mac was over with. I could see them doing good things, innovative things, but it didn't seem like enough to dig them out of that bottomless pit they'd stumbled into in 1996. I still recall the Mac I bought in 1996--a Performa 6200CD. What an utter piece of garbage--IMO, the single worst machine Apple has ever created. (Read about it here at lowendmac.com to see what I'm talking about.) The monitor the Performa shipped with failed over a dozen times and each time Apple shipped me another of the same kind and it failed again. What a disaster. I bought a used PowerMac 7500 in 1999 to keep me going for work purposes, but I was fairly certain that it was the end of the road for me and the Mac. I couldn't imagine risking my money on a new Mac ever again. I thought Apple was going down and it was only a matter of time before I had to face my smarmy Windows-lovin' colleagues and admit that they were right.
So, yeah, you aren't kidding. It fills me with joy to see my favorite platform revitalized and doing so well. And hey, if it takes Steve Jobs playing dirty from time-to-time to keep it that way, I say fine.
Bugger 'em
Sorry. But I agree with the posters who are sick and tired of idiots paying out on Apple at nearly everything they do and Apple just has to sit there and take it? No way, they earned their spot on the top of the dowloadable music industry. Why should they have to pander to morons like Napster...arrggh.
Sorry. But I agree with the posters who are sick and tired of idiots paying out on Apple at nearly everything they do and Apple just has to sit there and take it? No way, they earned their spot on the top of the dowloadable music industry. Why should they have to pander to morons like Napster...arrggh.
Two comments.
Regarding companies badmouthing other companies: Don't they do just that, in their TV ads? "Our toilet paper is 25% more absorbent than the other leading brand." "Does the competitor's soap leave your skin feeling dry and cracked? Ours won't..." I remember one commercial, I don't even remember the product they were selling, but they talked about how much fat was actually ADDED to the product in the competitor brands (shortening, oil, whatever) -- "They add fat?!?!" said one incredulous lady in an interview clip.
Regarding whether Steve actually sent this email - if he did not, would Apple have released some kind of announcement detailing how it was a fake? If they haven't, that's telling enough...
Regarding companies badmouthing other companies: Don't they do just that, in their TV ads? "Our toilet paper is 25% more absorbent than the other leading brand." "Does the competitor's soap leave your skin feeling dry and cracked? Ours won't..." I remember one commercial, I don't even remember the product they were selling, but they talked about how much fat was actually ADDED to the product in the competitor brands (shortening, oil, whatever) -- "They add fat?!?!" said one incredulous lady in an interview clip.
Regarding whether Steve actually sent this email - if he did not, would Apple have released some kind of announcement detailing how it was a fake? If they haven't, that's telling enough...
I may have you all beat.
I have been a mac user for the greater portion of my life. In fact, being only 23, and having been usng macs for 18 years, I have been using macs for 80% of my life, and it shows. I've had macs from all ages of disarray, and still have some of them. I've got the Mac II se, the Original iMac . Performa 605. Performa 6400 200, Power Macintosh 6500 250, Power Macintosh 7200 90, B & W G3, a sawtooth G4, and finally, now in business for myself, I have 2 G5 Desktops, and a cluster of 5 XServes that do the dirty work for me, my own personal render farm.
I have seen highs and lows, and ridden the roller coaster. I remember when i was about 12 sitting in front of a TV looking at a PC from god knows who and thinking "Why not." Had I done that, given in at my moment of weakness my life would not be the same. I am 100% convinced that Apple and their wondrous machines of the late 90s thru today have saved me from a life of drab servitude to the Windows driven corporate machine.
Apple has sat by and watched all its competitors bash it for this that and the other thing and said nothing. Now it's time to fight back, now we have the upper hand, and it's the boys from intel who are wondering how long the bubble can last. God bless steve jobs for bringing the company to which I owe my state of mind back from the brink. And God bless him for not letting some snot nosed brat spit at the wondrous onganization of which he is at the helm. From this point forward all apple usere are hereby charged with referring to napster's Chair and CEO as Chris Grogan. The brits will know what I mean.
Yeah, I'm a mac zealot; but damn it, I deserve to be able to shout my point of view from the highest hill I can climb, so does every other person who has been with the movement from the beginning.I will say, at the very least, that this forum is less rife with trolls as some other "mac" forums; but flame me if you wish, I could give a rat's ass.
I have been a mac user for the greater portion of my life. In fact, being only 23, and having been usng macs for 18 years, I have been using macs for 80% of my life, and it shows. I've had macs from all ages of disarray, and still have some of them. I've got the Mac II se, the Original iMac . Performa 605. Performa 6400 200, Power Macintosh 6500 250, Power Macintosh 7200 90, B & W G3, a sawtooth G4, and finally, now in business for myself, I have 2 G5 Desktops, and a cluster of 5 XServes that do the dirty work for me, my own personal render farm.
I have seen highs and lows, and ridden the roller coaster. I remember when i was about 12 sitting in front of a TV looking at a PC from god knows who and thinking "Why not." Had I done that, given in at my moment of weakness my life would not be the same. I am 100% convinced that Apple and their wondrous machines of the late 90s thru today have saved me from a life of drab servitude to the Windows driven corporate machine.
Apple has sat by and watched all its competitors bash it for this that and the other thing and said nothing. Now it's time to fight back, now we have the upper hand, and it's the boys from intel who are wondering how long the bubble can last. God bless steve jobs for bringing the company to which I owe my state of mind back from the brink. And God bless him for not letting some snot nosed brat spit at the wondrous onganization of which he is at the helm. From this point forward all apple usere are hereby charged with referring to napster's Chair and CEO as Chris Grogan. The brits will know what I mean.
Yeah, I'm a mac zealot; but damn it, I deserve to be able to shout my point of view from the highest hill I can climb, so does every other person who has been with the movement from the beginning.I will say, at the very least, that this forum is less rife with trolls as some other "mac" forums; but flame me if you wish, I could give a rat's ass.
I visit my friends at Mizzou alot (Columbia Missouri) and not only does everyone on there schools network do this but they also have a program that lets them share the files with one another with extreme ease. The network is extremly fast for all that crap goin on too, you can get a song from someone else in about 2 seconds!! I would imagine they have a good 500,000 songs at there finger tips now thanks to napster! This happens pretty much at every college campus PC and MAC, theres nothing you can do. No matter what there is always a way around everything, but offering a service like that and trusting people with "leased" music, haha ya right, of course people are going to convert thoes files! I won't lie when I tried napster I searched all night trying to figure out how to do it, there wasn't many programs written at the time, but now they are everywhere. It really isnt napsters fault either, they trusted windows media players copywright encryption, lol windows is the most warezed program of all time
I guess those record companies don't look at anything on the internet, so they need people like Jobs to write them letters..
Steve really does seem like an ass sometimes, I'm sure one day we're going to end up hating Apple as much as Microsoft (well almost).
/Mac mini due for delivery next week
Steve really does seem like an ass sometimes, I'm sure one day we're going to end up hating Apple as much as Microsoft (well almost).
/Mac mini due for delivery next week
I find it ironic. . .
I find it more than a little ironic that you would post some BS about how we're going to end up hating apple, then post a smiley next to a bit about your Mac mini showing up in a few days. We will never end up hating Apple period, let alone as much as Microsoft, for one reason. . . Apple knows that its users are its power. No users = no power. Microsoft has that paradigm all backward. Microsoft sees its power as what gets it users, and at lang last people are starting to get pissed about being force-fed mediocrity after mediocrity. People are starting to open their eyes and see that there is a world out there that doesn't hold one down, that doesn't make one do things by a set of hard rules. It reminds me of the song "Imagine" by John Lennon. We, as mac users, are living in the world that Jobs has imagined, and believe me, compared to the quagmire which is the wintel PC market, our peaceful cove of mac use is as fantastic as Lennon's hope for the world in said song.
Long live the Mac.
(I don't think that there's going to be much of a problem there.)
I find it more than a little ironic that you would post some BS about how we're going to end up hating apple, then post a smiley next to a bit about your Mac mini showing up in a few days. We will never end up hating Apple period, let alone as much as Microsoft, for one reason. . . Apple knows that its users are its power. No users = no power. Microsoft has that paradigm all backward. Microsoft sees its power as what gets it users, and at lang last people are starting to get pissed about being force-fed mediocrity after mediocrity. People are starting to open their eyes and see that there is a world out there that doesn't hold one down, that doesn't make one do things by a set of hard rules. It reminds me of the song "Imagine" by John Lennon. We, as mac users, are living in the world that Jobs has imagined, and believe me, compared to the quagmire which is the wintel PC market, our peaceful cove of mac use is as fantastic as Lennon's hope for the world in said song.
Long live the Mac.
(I don't think that there's going to be much of a problem there.)
It seems to me that this flaw hurts napster more than it hurts anyone else. They are the one's paying for the bandwidth that all these students are consuming... all for free. If people don't want to "rent" their music, then napster's plan is flawed and, security issues aside, will fail in the end.
Trekkie said:
Is Napster CD quality?? I would sign up for a month or two if I could seriously rip 10,000 songs...That would be amazing. Hell I would buy a 60 gig iPod and fill it up.
Sounds like Napster is right back where it started.
I doubt Jobs wrote such an e-mail. It isn't even the CEO's responsibility, nor is that the kind of thing you say on such an informal medium. I wouldn't be shocked at all if Apple had a package put together which was overnighted to the big 5.
savar said:
No Napster isn't CD quality.... but neither is iTUNES.
Does the average person care...or for that matter can they even hear the difference? Usually not.
Especially when you consider we are talking about low the quality speaker systems that are used with portable players and even the players themselves are not that great when one considers the amount of distortion they produce.
That being said they all work exceptionally well for what most people buy them for.