Kroger Begins Accepting Apple Pay After Years of Holding Out

[lartola]

Does it work on an Apple Watch? As I said, I do not shop there very often, but there is a Wal*Mart along one of the routes that I run/jog/walk (depending on the day and my mood). I often do not have my iPhone with me, just my Apple Watch, and might stop there to grab a protein bar and/or a Gatorade/Powerade.

No, afaik walmart doesn’t have a watch app. And walmart pay can’t work on the apple watch anyway because it relies upon scanning a QR code and the watch has no camera.

 

[lartola]

If Home Depot supported it, all the big retailers at which I shop regularly would support it. I do not shop at Walmart regularly, and will probably never use their own app, unless they offered Apple Pay in it (like Lowes did before they started offering it in store).

And target did the same as Lowes: for years they held out of accepting contactless/apple pay at their stores, but they did accept it in their app all that time.

 

[tmiw]

Maybe pushing curbside pickup and delivery would make having nfc in store moot, but it wouldn’t necessarily make taking apple pay or google pay moot since walmart could still add the respective buttons to accept them in its app and on its website.

It would be nice if they did but saving your actual card number on their website/app wouldn't necessarily be the end of the world, either, especially if they tokenize it on their end. After all, a lot of other places don't support Apple Pay in app or on their websites, but people seemingly don't complain about those nearly as much as they do with Walmart. And it's probably more of an issue with those other places since they're probably not using whatever their merchant provider offers for tokenizing card info (or possibly even following PCI rules in general if they're small enough).

 

[lartola]

It would be nice if they did but saving your actual card number on their website/app wouldn't necessarily be the end of the world, either, especially if they tokenize it on their end. After all, a lot of other places don't support Apple Pay in app or on their websites, but people seemingly don't complain about those nearly as much as they do with Walmart. And it's probably more of an issue with those other places since they're probably not using whatever their merchant provider offers for tokenizing card info (or possibly even following PCI rules in general if they're small enough).

While it might not be the end of the world, there’s little excuse for merchants to only allow payments online by manually entering all the card details when there are more secure alternatives. Most merchants already accept at least paypal even if not the mobile wallets. And people complain about walmart because it’s one of the few online merchants, along with amazon, still not offering any alternative to manually entering card details for payment, not even paypal. It isn’t 1998 anymore.

 

[Alan Wynn]

While it might not be the end of the world, there’s little excuse for merchants to only allow payments online by manually entering all the card details when there are more secure alternatives.

More secure and more convenient. I am way more likely to buy from someone that accepts Apple Pay on the web or via their app, than one who does not.

Most merchants already accept at least paypal even if not the mobile wallets. And people complain about walmart because it’s one of the few online merchants, along with amazon, still not offering any alternative to manually entering card details for payment, not even paypal. It isn’t 1998 anymore.

Yup.

 

[echopulse]

If Home Depot supported it, all the big retailers at which I shop regularly would support it. I do not shop at Walmart regularly, and will probably never use their own app, unless they offered Apple Pay in it (like Lowes did before they started offering it in store).

Maybe all the stores you shop at, but there is still 5 major retailers that don't support it. Wal-Mart and Sam's Club, Hobby Lobby, HEB, Winco, and Fleet Farm. With the exception of Fleet Farm, they are all in the top 50 retailers.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Maybe all the stores you shop at, but there is still 5 major retailers that don't support it. Wal-Mart and Sam's Club, Hobby Lobby, HEB, Winco, and Fleet Farm. With the exception of Fleet Farm, they are all in the top 50 retailers.

Yes, that is why I said: “all the big retailer at which I shop regularly”, not ”all retailers nor even: “all retailers at which I shop“, just the major ones I use regularly. I will also note that Hobby Lobby is not in the top 50, but is somewhere near 63. However, everyone of those has at least one direct competitor in their territory that supports Apple Pay.

With the exception of Wal*Mart, every time a major retailers adds support, it puts pressure on all others to do it. Kroger adds pressure on WinCo and HEB. Lowe’s adds pressure on Home Depot. Interestingly, one of the obstacles that Sam’s Club has faced with its attempt to move upscale to compete with CostCo, is its lack of Apple Pay. Higher end retail customers disproportionately use ApplePay/Tap-to-Pay.

 

[lartola]

Interestingly, one of the obstacles that Sam’s Club has faced with its attempt to move upscale to compete with CostCo, is its lack of Apple Pay. Higher end retail customers disproportionately use ApplePay/Tap-to-Pay.

Surprising, considering that in exchange for the lack of apple pay Sam’s has two things costco still lacks: self checkout, which makes checkout at the store faster, and Scan & Go, which even allows customers to skip the cash registers altogether. The latter actually beats apple pay in convenience.

 

[tmiw]

With the exception of Wal*Mart, every time a major retailers adds support, it puts pressure on all others to do it. Kroger adds pressure on WinCo and HEB. Lowe’s adds pressure on Home Depot. Interestingly, one of the obstacles that Sam’s Club has faced with its attempt to move upscale to compete with CostCo, is its lack of Apple Pay. Higher end retail customers disproportionately use ApplePay/Tap-to-Pay.

I don't think it adds pressure to WinCo. They've always hated accepting cards and basically only started accepting debit (not credit) cards when they had no other choice. They could just claim that accepting contactless costs them more, so they don't to keep prices low. (And they wouldn't necessarily be wrong, either, especially if their IT has to do some custom software development to get/keep that working.)

Additionally, it might not actually be in their best interest to enable contactless even if they wanted to. After all, contactless debit has never worked all that well in the US, which is why a lot of stores that tried to support it in the past eventually just reverted to running all contactless as credit.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Surprising, considering that in exchange for the lack of apple pay Sam’s has two things costco still lacks: self checkout, which makes checkout at the store faster

CostCo has had self checkout for at least 5 year.

Scan & Go, which even allows customers to skip the cash registers altogether. The latter actually beats apple pay in convenience.

Faster in some ways, more of a hassle in others. It means that I need to keep my credit cards updated on one more service and cannot use my watch for quick purchases when I am out without it. I have no problem with an app like that, I just would never use it because I do not shop there enough. I avoid shopping there because they do not take Apple Pay.

 

[Alan Wynn]

I don't think it adds pressure to WinCo.

Probably does not add significant pressure, but there might be some. Really depends on who their competitors are by market. If their biggest competitors did not accept ApplePay/Tap-to-Pay before and do now, it might hurt them on the margin.

They've always hated accepting cards and basically only started accepting debit (not credit) cards when they had no other choice. They could just claim that accepting contactless costs them more, so they don't to keep prices low.

I do not know enough about their business, but I do know that in almost every segment, accepting credit cards increase the average price per transaction enough to make the additional cost worth it.

Additionally, it might not actually be in their best interest to enable contactless even if they wanted to.

If they do not accept credit cards, there is not enough value in accepting ApplePay to make it worth it (by my read of the market).

 

[echopulse]

Apple Pay has always worked just fine with debit cards.

 

[tmiw]

Apple Pay has always worked just fine with debit cards.

When run as credit. The problem comes when stores try to route it over, say, PULSE instead of Visa or MC. Even with a correct PIN, the transaction fails way more often than it should.

That said, stores always running contactless as credit does provide a better user experience if you're using Apple Pay. Why require a PIN again when Touch/Face ID is supposed to be enough?

 

[Alan Wynn]

That said, stores always running contactless as credit does provide a better user experience if you're using Apple Pay. Why require a PIN again when Touch/Face ID is supposed to be enough?

I am curious why any merchant would care about how the card was processed, as it was my understanding that a debit card run as a Visa or MasterCard, still get charged at the same interchange fee as one run through the debit card network requiring a PIN. I am not sure Visa/MasterCard allow one to support only debit cards (i.e. not their credit cards), when using their network.

 

[tmiw]

I am curious why any merchant would care about how the card was processed, as it was my understanding that a debit card run as a Visa or MasterCard, still get charged at the same interchange fee as one run through the debit card network requiring a PIN. I am not sure Visa/MasterCard allow one to support only debit cards (i.e. not their credit cards), when using their network.

Only some debit cards are capped by law. There are still a significant number out there that aren't, thus costing merchants more if they run them as credit. That's a big reason why PIN prompts haven't completely gone away for debit cards (inserting or otherwise).

 

[dontwalkhand]

Only some debit cards are capped by law. There are still a significant number out there that aren't, thus costing merchants more if they run them as credit. That's a big reason why PIN prompts haven't completely gone away for debit cards (inserting or otherwise).

Also some stores like to give customers the option for cash back. Which I believe can only be done with a PIN.

 

[garyjones027]

Maybe all the stores you shop at, but there is still 5 major retailers that don't support it. Wal-Mart and Sam's Club, Hobby Lobby, HEB, Winco, and Fleet Farm. With the exception of Fleet Farm, they are all in the top 50 retailers.

Some workers in HEB say that they will receive contactless payment in late 2023 from a HEB meeting that was done in early 2023.

 

[echopulse]

Just confirmed today that Lowe’s now accepts Apple Pay in store. From what I understand, it has not yet rolled out to every store in the system, so it is best to check with them over the phone before you go. That means that Home Depot is the last place I go on a regular basis that does not offer it.

It's been a month since you posted, and still have not seen one other person notice on twitter or other message boards that discuss Apple Pay post that they have seen Apple Pay in store. Maybe it's a very small number of test locations.

 

[dontwalkhand]

It's been a month since you posted, and still have not seen one other person notice on twitter or other message boards that discuss Apple Pay post that they have seen Apple Pay in store. Maybe it's a very small number of test locations.

Huh?? I have been all over the country and every Kroger store I have been to has Apple Pay. Just look for the 4 dots on top of the screen.

 

[echopulse]

Huh?? I have been all over the country and every Kroger store I have been to has Apple Pay. Just look for the 4 dots on top of the screen.

We are talking about Lowes, not Kroger.

 

[Alan Wynn]

It's been a month since you posted, and still have not seen one other person notice on twitter or other message boards that discuss Apple Pay post that they have seen Apple Pay in store. Maybe it's a very small number of test locations.

Interesting. Their corporate chat says it is in most places, and I have seen it in some. I have not yet done an exhaustive search, but I may over the next few days.

 

[echopulse]

Interesting. Their corporate chat says it is in most places, and I have seen it in some. I have not yet not an exhaustive search, but I may over the next few days.

Again, the original comment was about Lowes, not Kroger.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Again, the original comment was about Lowes, not Kroger.

Again, I was talking about Lowes, not Kroger (as I made the original comment and the follow up). Their corporate staff say that they accept Apple Pay in most stores, and I have found a number that do, but I have not done an exhaustive inventory.

 

[echopulse]

If that's true, it must be an extremely small number of stores, because if any significant amount of stores had it someone would have found out and posted pictures on twitter or one of the varius message boards that talk about Apple pay. People post there even when a new small retailer with just a few locations gets apple pay support.

 

[cub850G2]

Again, I was talking about Lowes, not Kroger (as I made the original comment and the follow up). Their corporate staff say that they accept Apple Pay in most stores, and I have found a number that do, but I have not done an exhaustive inventory.

Take a picture of the Lane/7000s with ctls enabled Lowe's as I went to one and it still didn't have it. Would be cool to know what it will soon look like. Now speaking of Kroger I see why they didn't bother adding a ctls logo to their system as the brand new Verifone M424s have the ctls reader built in with the logo built into the new machine. Still have not seen those here as it's still pretty early in the rollout.