LED Screens in All MacBooks by 2009?

[ibjoshua]

As I said a few posts above, hopefully this will pave the way for OLED/PLED technology as well.

Hear hear.

Now, am I the only one who gets frustrated by the use of the term "LED screens" when they should be referred to as "LED backlit screens" or "LED backlights" for short.

Arn should know better than to confuse the terms like that. He only once says "LED backlit screens" in the original post. It would have been so simple to have titled the post "LED Backlights in All Macbooks by 2009".

I know we can't stop commenters saying LED screens when they mean LCD screens with LED backlights but at least front page posts shouldn't assist in perpetuating the misconception.

I hate to sound like a picky old man, as Arn does such a great job usually, but it's such a small thing and it would make the whole (ongoing LED/OLED) story so much simpler and more accurate.

ibjoshua

 

[ibjoshua]

On a tangent, imagine a MacBook case made out of this stuff mentioned on ecogeek.org.

The molecular soup mixture would have organic light-emitting diode (OLED) and solar cell building blocs that can be spread or even sprayed like paint in an ultra-thin layer that is only 100 nm thick. By combining both technologies, it may be possible to have displays on the market that don't even have to be plugged in but charged using solar panels. The companies even say it could be sprayed onto the back of cell phones to charge up the device.
​

Charge your machine and at the same time check your iCal (or whatever) without plugging it in or opening it.
Nice.

ibjoshua

 

[JeffDM]

As I said a few posts above, hopefully this will pave the way for OLED/PLED technology as well.

More alphabet soup!

 

[kresh]

I'm still waiting for Apple to update their Cinema Displays!

… would be nice with a 24" LED though!

I have a nasty suspicion that Apple will exit the standalone display business and instead recommend a few preferred partners. Since they only manufacture two computers** that require a standalone display, and one of which is rumored to be discontinued shortly, I hope they don't decide that R&D dollars would be better invested elsewhere.

Surely if it was a lucrative segment of their business they would have been updating their offerings regularly.


** I have not included Xserve since they do not require high end displays, or really displays at all.

 

[MacFly123]

MacFly123 "Jobs in the same letter added that Apple also has a plan to completely eliminate the use of arsenic in all of its displays by the end of 2008."

So does this mean that hell will officially freeze over and the FREAKING Cinema Displays will get an update at least by the end of this year???

Seriously, is it so much to ask for a built in iSight, remote sensor, new panels (don't even have to be LED yet), and a little slimming??? I mean they discontinued the external iSight like what, over a year ago with nothing to replace it since. Come on Apple!!!
__________________________________

-Yes, this means that we will se upgraded ACD this year.

But seriously man, LED displays is a MUST if I am even going to consider buying a new laptop. I agree on the slimming part, though

I was referring to the Cinema Displays and the LED. Is it even feasible cost wise to think they would upgrade LCDs that big to LED this time around???

 

[JeffDM]

I have a nasty suspicion that Apple will exit the standalone display business and instead recommend a few preferred partners. Since they only manufacture two computers** that require a standalone display, and one of which is rumored to be discontinued shortly, I hope they don't decide that R&D dollars would be better invested elsewhere.

Surely if it was a lucrative segment of their business they would have been updating their offerings regularly.

** I have not included Xserve since they do not require high end displays, or really displays at all.

They do have dual head being a selling point for their notebooks though, even dual link with their MacBook Pro.

 

[aethelbert]

What ever happened to all LED screens in their products by the end of 2008?

 

[Quillz]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

I don't understand why its taking Apple this amount of time to rollout LED displays. Doesn't Sony have OLED display out already - by the time Apple gets to OLED Sony may be on the next generation tech.

Because Apple holds a monopoly on Apple hardware, that's why. Since they are the only ones who will ever build Mac hardware, they can take their sweet time with new and improved features, like LED displays. Of course, also consider that while the MacBook doesn't have LED displays, both the Air and Pro do. Right now, it's just another incentive to upgrade to an Air or Pro.

 

[Quillz]

What ever happened to all LED screens in their products by the end of 2008?

Remember when Leopard was going to be released in spring 2007, then June and finally October? Or when Vista was going to be released in 2003, then 2005 and then finally 2007? Same thing here. Chances are, they got delayed by unforeseen issues, probably hardware related, and that's why it's taking longer than expected.

Remember in 2004 when Steve said we'd have 3 GHz PowerPC chips?

 

[urbanskywalker]

The implication of "by 2009" suggests that the next MacBook update will not have an LED backlight.

 

[JeffDM]

What ever happened to all LED screens in their products by the end of 2008?

It doesn't look like the panels are available. If Apple can't get the supplies, then Apple can't switch to them completely.

Because Apple holds a monopoly on Apple hardware, that's why. Since they are the only ones who will ever build Mac hardware, they can take their sweet time with new and improved features, like LED displays. Of course, also consider that while the MacBook doesn't have LED displays, both the Air and Pro do. Right now, it's just another incentive to upgrade to an Air or Pro.

That's also assuming there are enough supplies of the LED screens to satisfy Apple's volumes. Air and Pro are probably lower volume computers. When the 13" LED backlit panels are available to the tune of maybe half a million a month, then Apple can switch the MacBooks.

 

[onicon]

[...] Not sure when we will see the 23 and 30 Inch monitors going with LED. According to Apple is a matter of cost for larger panels. However the iMac 24 has it and the 23 inch monitor does not. What's up with that?

IMac screen is probably a cheaper panel than Apple would use for their professional 23 inch monitor, so they are probably waiting for cheaper LCD screens and cheaper LED lighting. -- Just a guess.

no imac, current or past, has or had a led backlit display. and as prices for led backlit displays in 24" size currently are equal to the price of a whole imac, not accounting for the prices of 30" led backlight, i don't see apple using them in the very near future.

 

[Bleestha]

I would love to see the LED technology on the Mac Books, it looks great on the MBPs and MBAs. but it is to bad that they won't come out till next year. I expected them to come in the next update

 

[kjs862]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/4A102 Safari/419.3)

I don't understand why its taking Apple this amount of time to rollout LED displays. Doesn't Sony have OLED display out already - by the time Apple gets to OLED Sony may be on the next generation tech.

Because Apple holds a monopoly on Apple hardware, that's why. Since they are the only ones who will ever build Mac hardware, they can take their sweet time with new and improved features, like LED displays. Of course, also consider that while the MacBook doesn't have LED displays, both the Air and Pro do. Right now, it's just another incentive to upgrade to an Air or Pro.

I definitely understand where you are coming from, but after reading this section of Apple's mission statement...

"Today, Apple continues to lead the industry in innovation with its award-winning computers"

... it just make me feel uneasy about the entire situation. Companies already have OLED displays out, and here we are talking about LED displays. Get with the program Apple!

 

[kockgunner]

I definitely understand where you are coming from, but after reading this section of Apple's mission statement...

"Today, Apple continues to lead the industry in innovation with its award-winning computers"

... it just make me feel uneasy about the entire situation. Companies already have OLED displays out, and here we are talking about LED displays. Get with the program Apple!

I think Apple is going at a steady pace. LED backlit displays are still not widely used by laptop manufacturers. There is a computer at DELL that had a BTO option unlike the them being standard on 15" MBPs. OLED displays are not economical to put in laptops either. The biggest OLED display I've seen was at a Sony store and cost about as much as a Macbook Air and it was only an 11 incher. I agree how Apple's laptops aren't as competitive as other manufacturers as before. Maybe technology is coming to a standstill and we're in for another MHz war (except this time with GHz)? I think part of the reason Apple computer's don't have as much hardware as other companies' laptops is also because of their aesthetic philosophy. We wouldn't want fingerprint readers and media card slots marring our Macbook Pros' design would we?

 

[CWallace]

But this LED lighting thingy is better right? Why do you need to pay a 100 dollar more to have that new shiny thing on your 17" MBP, while the 15" has it as a standard? It sounds strange to me, because I assumed the 17" MBP is the top of the line.. So with all the extras including this LED lighting, and if you want that on your 15" you should pay a hundred dollars more.. But that's not the case..?

The cost is driven in part by volume. 15.4" is a popular laptop LCD panel size so chances are the majority of LED-backlit panel production is in this category, which drives down the cost. There are likely less 17" panels being made (especially at 1920x1200) so they cost more to buy, hence Apple charges a $100 more to help defray the extra cost.

I was referring to the Cinema Displays and the LED. Is it even feasible cost wise to think they would upgrade LCDs that big to LED this time around???

The only LED-backlit monitors I have seen in 20", 24" and 30" sizes are Samsung's latest and their prices make ACDs look down right cheap.

 

[AidenShaw]

We wouldn't want fingerprint readers and media card slots marring our Macbook Pros' design would we?

Certainly not. We can't let function get in the way of form...

 

[goosnarrggh]

wow. who ever wrote this article has no clue what they're talking about. from apple:


"15-inch MacBook Pro

15.4-inch (diagonal) antiglare widescreen TFT LED backlit display with support for millions of colors; optional glossy widescreen display"

"Optional 17-inch (diagonal) antiglare TFT widescreen LED backlit display with support for millions of colors; optional glossy widescreen display"

I don't think I understand your criticism.

Of course, the mention of "TFT" implicitly means that the display itself is an LCD panel. It happens to use an LED light source as a backlight.

Regardless of what Apple is stating, the displays would be more correctly correctly described as,
"15.4-inch (diagonal) antiglare widescreen TFT LCD using LED backlight, with support for millions of colors; optional glossy widescreen display"

_________
By the way, high intesity LEDs do decay in brightness over time. However they may not decay as quickly as a CCFL would.

Their color also degrades over time too. The semiconductor inside any LED can only emit light in a very narrow band of wavelengths; by definition a single wavelength of light by itself can never be white. In a "white" LED, the light emitted from the electronics is typically a bluish color, and this blue light strikes a phosphorous coating on the inner wall of the LED's surface - when excited, this phosphorous coating emits a range of other wavelengths approximating white light. The phosphorous coating degrades over time, and those extra wavelengths lose their intensity, causing the white light to start looking increasingly bluish.

It's possible, though, that Apple has secured a supply of white LEDs in which these decays are much slower than they have been in previous generations.

 

[deputylove8]

Macbook + LED displays = Sexyness

 

[AidenShaw]

...and this blue light strikes a phosphorous coating...

I assume that you mean phosphorescent, not phosphorus ...

 

[JeffDM]

By the way, high intesity LEDs do decay in brightness over time. However they may not decay as quickly as a CCFL would.

Their color also degrades over time too. The semiconductor inside any LED can only emit light in a very narrow band of wavelengths; by definition a single wavelength of light by itself can never be white. In a "white" LED, the light emitted from the electronics is typically a bluish color, and this blue light strikes a phosphorous coating on the inner wall of the LED's surface - when excited, this phosphorous coating emits a range of other wavelengths approximating white light. The phosphorous coating degrades over time, and those extra wavelengths lose their intensity, causing the white light to start looking increasingly bluish.

It's possible, though, that Apple has secured a supply of white LEDs in which these decays are much slower than they have been in previous generations.

I forgot about that. One way to make phosphors last a long time is to not overdrive them. So double the LEDs at half the light intensity might make it last more than twice as long. And Apple's ambient light sensor more or less adjusts the light to what you need, so hopefully it's not any brighter than it needs to be.

 

[drrich2]

Since some Macbook Pro's have LED-backlit displays, how are they holding up over time compared to conventional displays?

Until an unfortunate dog-related accident rendered the display on my old 15"1.5 GHz G4 Aluminum Powerbook non-functional (can still run using an external monitor; would cost too much to get the thing accessed to see if repairable & do it, compared to what it'd be worth), we were quite happy with it at my house.

Is there any reason to think a modern MacBook display would be WORSE than that old Powerbook display?

Are MacBook displays really that bad, or is the LCD-backlit screen just such eye candy peoples' standards have changed?

Also, the brighter, high-contrast quality that people seem to love about the LCD-backlit screens sounds like the very quality so hated by the mat screen lovers who complain about some of Apple's notebooks only offering a glossy option.

Can the LCD-backlits do mat well?

Richard.

 

[MacFly123]

The only LED-backlit monitors I have seen in 20", 24" and 30" sizes are Samsung's latest and their prices make ACDs look down right cheap.

That's what I thought, so for this refresh I would be fine with a built in iSight and built in remote sensor with a little slimming and maybe some slight exterior changes. Also drop the prices just a bit at least and bump the 23" up to 24" obviously. That is all I am asking for! Seriously what is Apple's problem with this??? Why would they possibly take this long to update them?

 

[mdriftmeyer]

I get a chuckle how my undergrad work on Heat Transfer using LEDs back in 1992 for data acquisition points are just now finally, with advances, getting to be mainstream in laptops?

Classic. Only 17 years later.

 

[digitalbiker]

Since some Macbook Pro's have LED-backlit displays, how are they holding up over time compared to conventional displays?

Until an unfortunate dog-related accident rendered the display on my old 15"1.5 GHz G4 Aluminum Powerbook non-functional (can still run using an external monitor; would cost too much to get the thing accessed to see if repairable & do it, compared to what it'd be worth), we were quite happy with it at my house.

Is there any reason to think a modern MacBook display would be WORSE than that old Powerbook display?

Are MacBook displays really that bad, or is the LCD-backlit screen just such eye candy peoples' standards have changed?

Also, the brighter, high-contrast quality that people seem to love about the LCD-backlit screens sounds like the very quality so hated by the mat screen lovers who complain about some of Apple's notebooks only offering a glossy option.

Can the LCD-backlits do mat well?

Richard.

The current Macbook displays are the same as your G4 Powerbook only slightly smaller 13" vs. 15.4'. The brightness, contrast, color, etc is approximately the same, as it is using the same technology.

The new LED backlit LCD displays are brighter, have better contrast, and use much less power. However they are more costly.

Matte screens and glossy screens have nothing to do with the backlighting. Basically matte and glossy refer to the finish of the screen.

A glossy finish appears to produce a clearer, more color saturated, and better contrast image but it can be plagued with glare and difficult to use under certain lighting conditions.

A matte screen is a gaussian blurred finish that scatters reflected light to reduce glare. However the finish also slightly blurs the direct image causing some to perceive the image as dimmer, less color saturated, and of less contrast.