Exactly. Those companies then write that off as part of their advertising budget because word of mouth is the best form of advertising. (How many people do you tell of your great experience and recommend. Loads right)
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Logic Board Dead - Done With Apple for Good...
- Thread starter keithjfuller
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Exactly. Those companies then write that off as part of their advertising budget because word of mouth is the best form of advertising. (How many people do you tell of your great experience and recommend. Loads right)
If there's currently a pending class action lawsuit for this issue is it any wonder Apple isn't fixing it out of warrant? Doing so would be tantamount to admitting there's a problem.We can argue all day here on MacRumors about what we think Apple should or shouldn't do but seeing that there is already a current class action pending, don't expect any public responses now or in the immediate future.
There is and Apple don't want to pay out any more than they have to. Same happened with the 8600GT GPU`s, likely Apple will just replace bad logic boards with refurbished ones, which are even more prone to failure, but only if they are forced to.
Q-6
Of course they don't want to pay any more than they have to. I think Apple's single greatest achievement is creating the image they actually care for their customers. They've managed to create this illusion even though they're no different from any other company. I suspect it's what has led the OP to his frustrations with this issue. I doubt he'd be as frustrated if we were talking about Dell.
I don't know if the image they have created is that they actually "care" for their customers more so than they try to go above and beyond whenever possible to fix problems so that their reputation for great customer service continues to grow. Surely we can admit that the level of customer service most receive from Apple outpaces just about anyone else in the tech world. Part of that is their accessibility, be it the retail stores or authorized dealers, and how easy they make it to take your device in for service.
Providing great service and doing little things here and there for their customers creates brand loyalty, which is what Apple ultimately wants from its customers.
I think it's as I stated: They're portraying the image they care. Regardless, in this case, they seem to be a victim of their own success. The OP believes Apple should be going above and beyond what they've committed to. Since they're not the OP, for reasons unknown, feels slighted and is now going to be an ex-customer of theirs. I suspect he wouldn't be doing so if we were discussing Dell.
i'm not sure that apple's service really is all that spectacular. first off, to get it you get charged A LOT of money. however, people purchasing apple products tend to have money, so it's not that big an issue.
however, their help seems great if you really don't know anything about technology. every time i'm in an apple store, well over half the people being "helped" are elderly people who have never used a smartphone or computer. there "help" is showing people how to change the volume and send an email.
if you need real help, they typically don't have much to offer. i know this because i've gone to the "genius'" a few times, and not once have they provided anything half as useful as information found on any internet forum.
if you're under warranty, then they replace stuff. somehow, people believe that apple replacing all their recalled stuff is good customer service, when in reality it isn't. it's them doing what you paid them to do.
also, here's another great story about apple's "great customer service."
when i bought my iMac i ordered the beefed up one, so it had to be custom-built. it ended shipping nearly a month after i was originally quoted. to top it off, they sent me one with a damaged fan. i could either a) drag it to an apple store and have them fix it, or b) pack it up and bring it to a fedex location to ship it back and get a new one. of course i chose the second.
on top of that, they would only pay for a standard shipping, and would not begin to even build my new one until they received the damaged one. that would have meant that i would have to wait an extra week (after i'd already waited 6). so, to get them to do it immediately i had to purchase another one (no joke), and wait to be refunded. i had a $5,000 credit card bill that month, because it took forever to get a refund.
as i've said before, apple wasn't this way in the past. they became this way as they moved into the general consumer market and forgot about the customers that made them successful.
i still think OSX is miles ahead of windows, but i don't think it's worth it anymore. i primarily use my computer for photo/video editing, and adobe products run amazingly well on windows computers nowadays. i'd love to stay with apple, but i can't justify their service any longer.
Hmm I don't remember saying you need a psychiatrist.. I remember recommending you look into one though. I guess in my world need and consider are two separate terms (which is why they both exist..)
Also - your statement here is quite contradictory. You made false claims that me and reco were upset when we mearly disagreed with your statement. That falls under a very similar umbrella of me saying you may want to consider a psychiatrist. You can split hairs all day, but you would be doing just that.
I was unaware about this, did you post this previously and I miss it? Also did all of your issue shappen outside of warranty? If they all happened outside of the warranty that would not change my stance. Similar to a car - the purchase price does not affect the warranty length or covering in most cases. Lexus is an expensive Toyota, Audi is an expensive VW, Cadillac is an expensive Chevy, Acura is an expensive Honda. In all theses cases you are paying a premium for the name yet you are not gaining a special warranty. The warranties may differ but they all conform to some industry standard, as does apples.
Sorry I already completed graduate school, so you are right I do not use it for that. I used my previous 2007 for school. I also use my computers for personal business, and luckily running Excel, e-mail, and chat are not strenuous on my computer. If you are a graphic designer or video editor then yes we do separate things. Apple has never changed it's target market. Their Mac Pro is for createive professionals while their top end rMBP is aimed at being a mobile studio (hence the discrete GPU). Most real programmers or creative professionals I know actually buy laptops and VPN into their home network where the actual powerhouse is. In this instance, they are able to buy, for example, a MBA and have all the power of a fully loaded Mac Pro. Since you clearly don't do that, I can guess where you are too.
Within one week of purchase date, or one week of eachother? I can have 10 various electronics that are 10 years old all break close together, that does not make the company at fault. If they are one week from purchase price and Apple did not take care of you, take them to small claims court. That is well over a few thousand and they will settle quick since they are covered under warranty. For taking trips to the apple store - you are clearly the one with all the time. Taking a trip directly after it breaks three times in a 7 day week (assuming you did not do all trips in 1 day) means you have no priorities that cannot be missed. Or if you did, you were able to restructure them and you should not be complaining about it. Furthermore, my Apple store is a 7 minute drive from my front door, so I am not complaining.
It is not necessarily Apple's job to inform you, as long as the information is out in the public. It is your job as a consumer of expensive product to keep an eye out for what may go wrong. I purchased a brand new car this year and you can bet you bottom dollar that I am keeping an eye on TSBs, recalls, and other issues the car may have. Maybe I am smarter than you? Or less lazy..? For someone who spends all day on their computer having a quick little favorited tab would not hurt you.
Your laptop had an issue past what Apple considers its useful life (3 years). So after that point, it may very well explode in your house. I don't believe you understand how warranties and products useful life work. Generally warranties are given to last the useful life of a product, they do this because that is all they promise it will work. Why do you think cars have separate warranties? 3 years /XXX miles for tech based items but 10 years XXX miles for the powertrain.. Because that is all they can promise it will work for - If it breaks sooner than that they take blame, after that and you failed to maintain.
By the way, not that this is the amount of apple consumers that exist in the world, but 30,000 people is 3 hundredths of a tenth of a single percent of human population. I may be saying that wrong so here is the number (.000375)
According to me you should accept the fact that your product is out of warranty, you should accept the fact that all products have problems, and you should accept the fact that the more you buy from a company the more a problem becomes apparent. I have a better chance of getting hit by a car if I cross a street every day than if I just cross a street once a year.
Yes
is perfect. Since you seem to project that onto other people multiple times. Seems more like you formed an image of their perfect and are being let down by the realization that they are not.Wait.. Didn't you spend $20,000 on Apple products as stated in your first post? I have spent less than $5,000... It's funny how you said you would not argue if I thought that way, then you said I would have zero concept of money and value.. Another great proof of contradiction in your statements.
If you are gone, then please leave. By staying here and posting you are not yet gone.
I don't know reco, in fact I don't know anyone on these forums. As for my feelings you clearly can't read as you never hurt my feelings. I could care less what you think about Apple.
At this point though, I am laughing at your pain. Your arguements are filled with contradiction, anger, and false presumptions. The fact that you attempt to attack me, which fails, gives me great pleasure to laugh at your pain of having a broken laptop.
Now, how do you feel?
that's the problem. even if you had apple care, and it broke under warranty they'd fix it was another faulty one. hopefully, this class action suit forces them to pay the people they sold faulty equipment to.
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i couldn't agree more. that's the sort of company i remember apple being a while back. unfortunately, those days are LONG gone.
Assuming for the sake of argument they did sell faulty equipment. Why should they be forced to pay people? There's an appropriate way to address this situation: Do as you've said you're going to do...forgo doing further business with this business.
Seriously doubt that will happen, Apple will just keep recirculating the old boards, worse still refurbished ones which are far more prone to failure. Short of a redesign the issue remains, and apple are not going to invest in product they no longer sell, irrespective of the customer.
Only way you will see any reaction is if Apple are legally bound, or management perceive that negative exposure will be detrimental to business, given the focus on iToy`s don't hold your breath on that one.
FWIW I have two 15" MBP`s that have potential well known GPU issues and have never had a problem, equally it`s grossly unfair for the thousands that have incurred issue and have had to accept a sub standard repair, and in the case of many rejection, when the issue at hand is very clear; depreciation of leaded solder, combined with borderline thermal management.
I rather suspect Apple`s engineering team know this all too well, however increasing the thickness of Apple`s portables has, and will never be on the table
My primary & secondary portable Mac`s are now both Retina models, which have better thermals, the newest no discrete GPU and for good reason...
Q-6
My take is simple; Apple should replace the faulty MBP with an equivalent known good model, not simply replace the defective logic board with another defective unit that is likely to fail (generalising). Nor do I think the OP expects the same or cash compensation, he simply expects to get what he has payed for. There is increasing evidence that the 2011 MBP`s are flawed same as the Early 2008 15" MBP.
It`s not about expecting something for nothing, or out of warranty repair, it`s about getting what you pay for no more no less...
Q-6
i agree completely. it doesn't matter when people realized that the products were faulty, it matters that they were. warranties are for non-faulty items, not ticking time bombs.
it's crazy that it had to come to a lawsuit, but i'm guessing that apple realized this was too big a problem to fix, and they were hoping that it just went away on it's own. i'm glad that there are enough people who fight for what's right as opposed to just rolling over and taking it.
Purely business; not everyone will be aware, not everyone will make a claim, some will accept repair with a 90 day warranty, and potentially suffer failure outside the period, some will just run out of time, some will persist and go through multiple repairs until Apple replaces the complete system, these will likely be in the minority, all saving Apple considerable $$$$.
Personally I believe if the 2011 is proved to be flawed, Apple should forced to replace all defective systems with know good ones, not replace a flawed board with another. It may also make then reconsider their priorities, given a big enough "hit" Cool & thin is far from cool, when it results in a flawed products that may fail prematurely.
Q-6
The problem is he did receive what he paid for. He paid for three years of a guaranteed functional system. He received three years of a guaranteed functional system. He has now past what he paid for. Yet he expects Apple to give him more than he paid for.
I fully understand his frustration. But he got exactly what he paid for and now he's upset because he feels he's entitled to more than that.
Hate to break it to you, but no consumer electronics company has a special obligation to its customers simply based on how much they have spent on said company. Tim Cook might if you mention it to him, but not Apple as a general policy. Do you think they keep tabs on this sort of thing? If you want a loyalty program, get a credit card.
You missed the point the 2011 MBP, like the Early 2008, likely has a manufacturing flaw, and this does not equal premium product. I have personally been lucky and never had issue with any Apple product, equally many have and in the case of 8600GT and now Radeon GPU it`s rather maths 101.
Talking straight, if all Mac`s expired after three years, pretty certain the market share would shrink significantly. Apple is same as any other corporate, wants to maximise profit and minimise any negative exposure. Apple is a good company equally many confuse the language with the intent.
Far too many accept poor service and or poor quality goods, I for one don't, especially if the product is premium. The average MBP should last 5-6 years of reasonable use, not fail due to inadequate cooling/design etc. Apple is smart and has grown a cult following, if more challenged & questioned I wonder if things would be better, I know one thing if you don't, they will undoubtedly get worse...
Q-6
the amount of money i spent wasn't the issue. the issue is that apple sold a faulty product. i'm amazed by the number of people who are totally ok with buying a product that is faulty, and somehow feel that they are to blame for it. thankfully, there are enough sensible people out there to bring a lawsuit.
either way, thanks for the snarky "get a credit card" remark - very informative, helpful, and constructive.
Apple is a big company and maybe what they need is a good way of tracking long-time customers and give them little more attention?
I'm not sure of a good answer here but you can't go around Apple stores and say I've spent $20k on your stuff, treat me different. Not trying to be snarky here because I've spent almost that much and would like to be treated the same way.
I'm not sure of a good answer here but you can't go around Apple stores and say I've spent $20k on your stuff, treat me different. Not trying to be snarky here because I've spent almost that much and would like to be treated the same way.
I'm merely addressing how you tied your expectation of Apple's treatment of your situation to your monetary investment in their products, but if you want to change your stance from your original post, do as you wish.
i'm sorry to say, but the typical apple consumer has changed. they are under the belief that computers are at max a two to three year product that is obsolete after that. apparently, if you expect it to last anymore than that you're a whiny, privileged, entitled brat who needs a psychiatrist and a new credit card.
if you spend $2,500 on a laptop and $350 on an extended warranty and have your laptop last 3 years, you are essentially paying close to $1,000/year for a laptop. that is insane, but according to a few (luckily most people here are sane and reasonable) that is all that you deserve, and you should thank apple for giving it to you. also, if it's a defective product you should get over it and stop complaining.
anyway, i've made my decision and it's worked out well. i spent £50 on an android phone and pay £15/month for unlimited talk, text, and internet. sure, it's not as pretty, fast, powerful as an iphone, but i'm not giving my money to a company that treats their customers the way they do. i've learned that while i prefer apple to other products, i don't find one thing that they offer essential, nor does it have a meaningful impact on my life. i would venture to guess that over 90% of people use their smartphones for calls/web/internet/netflix/social media 99% of the time. earlier in the thread someone said "good luck with that," about me getting an android phone and tablet - well thanks, because it's been great. i'll make sure to let you know how my next windows laptop and desktop treat me also.
i used to buy apple products because not only were they better but they lasted, and their customer service was great (you didn't have to pay %15 of the item for them to "help" you). that's all gone, so i am too. if that means that i'm a whiny, privileged, entitled brat who needs a psychiatrist and a new credit card, then ok.
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if it came off that way, i apologize. i was merely stating that i have been with apple for a long time, so they really pissed me off to have to leave. i think most people understand that leaving a computer system that you are tied into (phones, tablets, TVbox, laptop, computer) that deeply for so long is difficult to do. The fact that I have spent more there than some people is not the issue.
also, i understand that around 25% of the people on this site are die-hard fanboys who act like apple is a religion and steve jobs was jesus, and he will come back to send all windows/android users to burn in hell for eternity. that is why i feel like i have to qualify any apple negativity before i make a comment.
I missed no point. The reality is premium product or not Apple does not warrant these systems to be problem free for anything longer than the warranty coverage they offer. Included in the price is a one year warranty. If you are uncomfortable with the one year warranty you can pay extra to obtain an addition two years. The OP did just that. He received three years of coverage. He is now outside that coverage window. He should not expect anything more because he got what he paid for. Whether he believed or Apple is selling a premium product is irrelevant. Buying a premium product does not entitle a buyer to impose his beliefs onto the seller.
Personally I don't see why anyone would pay to extend warranty coverage on what they buy. If Apple, a premium company, cannot offer a standard three year warranty on their premium products that should be a sign they're not a premium product and to stay away. After all one can buy a $400 PC and receive a one year warranty.
This is the truest piece of information in this entire thread.
Also true. You are on a role.
That is your choice and I am sure no one hates you for it. Many android phones are great phones.
I apolgize the world has changed. I apologize the common Apple consumer has changed. My trading account does not apologize for the increase in Apple share price though.
I would say 50%.
Also - You keep saying you are done and you are still here. try PCrumors.com
EDIT: I LOVE MACRUMORS HAHAHA they own PCrumors.com too and it links back to MacRumors!! That is classic.
No one is saying your expectation of having the system remain functional after three years is unreasonable. I am saying you're expectation Apple fix it for free, 38 months later, is unreasonable. And your behavior / attitude about it towards Apple, myself, and others who state as much, makes you a brat.
One thing I'd also like to make perfectly clear: I am no Apple apologist. My comments / advice would remain the same if we were talking any other manufacturer. I think it's foolish for someone to agree to terms (i.e. through the purchase of the system) and then get mad at the other party when you decide to unilaterally change them. Would you agree if Apple decided to, after you purchase your Apple Care, change the conditions to a single year instead of two?