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Mac Mini to Lose Its USB-A Ports Later This Year
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I wonder if it will have any active cooling, which means internally, dust will be an issue.
And knowing Apple, they will make it as user hostile as possible to open it up to dust them off.
Just look at the Studio.
But hey, they must keep AppleCare and the Geniuses active.
And knowing Apple, they will make it as user hostile as possible to open it up to dust them off.
Just look at the Studio.
But hey, they must keep AppleCare and the Geniuses active.
What's the difference between connecting 3 cables to your PC, vs connecting 3 cables to an adaptor, then connecting said adaptor to a usb-c port on your PC? Assuming there is no degradation in performance.
I have always viewed usb-c ports as a solution to the "no wrong port" problem with PCs, where manufacturers ponder over what the right selection of ports for a user is. Now, you can turn those usb-c ports into any combination of ports that best suit your use case.
For example, say I am attracted to a usb-c monitor because it can also double as a hub of sorts.
Dell S2722QC Monitor - 27 inch 4K USB-C, UHD (3840 x 2160) Display, 60Hz Refresh Rate, 8MS Grey-to-Grey Response Time, Built-in Dual 3W Speakers, 1.07 Billion Colors - Platinum Silver
The Dell S2722QC usb-c monitor is designed with an elegant 27-inch screen boasting outstanding visuals. This 27-inch 4k monitor has integrated dual 3W speakers so you can listen to whatever you want without having to purchase speakers. The In-Plane Switching (IPS) technology together with 99% sRG...
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This means I have no use for HDMI ports on my computer. Someone who needs them can get an adaptor like this to connect two HDMI monitors to his computer while still using up only one port. Or heck, maybe even a combination of HDMI and DisplayPort.
Plugable USB C to HDMI Adapter for Dual Monitors, 4K 60Hz USB C Hub for Windows and Chromebook, Driverless
You have two 4K HDMI screens and one USB-C port. It’d be nice to find an easy way to combine them. Now the Plugable USB-C Dual 4K HDMI MST Display Adapter (USBC-MSTH2) has you covered. Compatible with Windows and Chrome computers with USB-C DP 1.4 support—so most modern laptops—a single USB-C por...
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And if a new display standard is available in the future, I can also connect that via the correct adaptor. I don't have to worry that said HDMI port becomes obsolete one day because I might want to use a different type of monitor.
Each of us can get the right selection of ports that best suits our individual use cases. Everyone's happy (in theory). 😛
The difference is that the adapter has to exists somewhere inside my room. Hence I don't have a small, compact computer anymore.
True. But these days Apple are using the number of ports (and types of ports) as a differentiator between pro machines and the regular lines. If you want a bunch of extra ports, you can pay a bit more and get a pro machine. If you’re happy with just a few USB-C, you can save some money and stick with a non-Pro one.
I think I’m using 3 of the ports. Monitor, external NVME, and cable for phone/iPad.
Does anyone buy based on that differentiator? I mean in any significant numbers, not like 10 people globally. Dongles suck, Apple knows we hate them, but we'd tolerate them rather than spend £500 or £1000 more.
I think the big limit on ports during the M series years has been the fact that the base M chips are essentially beefed up iPhone chips, and aren't designed to have much connectivity. That's different on the Pro series chips.
Based on it alone, probably not, but I can imagine "…it also gives you extra ports" as an argument to go from MBAir to low-end MBPro. Same for, say, mid-range mini to Studio.
What device that you use today requires a USB A port on the computer end? Save for Micro USB for some of my older devices, everything in my computing life is USB C. My iPhone 12 Pro Max which uses lightning will be replaced in a few weeks.
I have a tiny and very low cost Anker USB-A hub that sits on the floor against the wall, behind my two desks. It handles all of the low-bandwidth USB-A legacy devices and connects to my Mac Studio computer via a *single* USB-C cable.
I don't even see it. The cables are out of the way, and out of sight. No cable clutter on my desks to get in the way. It just works. And have pretty much forgotten about it.
I would much rather have that than a bunch of USB-A cables hooking directly into my Mac Studio, and having fewer USB-C/Thunderbolt ports that I really need for my four displays.
...so do several USB cables have to exist - attached right to the back of your small and compact computer (if you're not using a hub). A computer that's designed to be within arm's length on your desk (otherwise you couldn't turn it on).
Sure, but wouldn’t that just be part of that differentiator?
USB-A is a bit different, though, since the base mini has always included it. If they reduce from the current 4 USB ports (2 A and 2 C), that will suck, but if they just switch to 4 C ports, I won’t find it that bad. Worst case in that scenario I can just leave a couple of the cheap C-to-A adapters in the C ports to duplicate the old configuration. They stick out about a centimetre, so it isn’t perfect, but I already have a couple and it isn’t a huge difference to my setup, though it may be a pain for some. I just picked up a few Sandisk dual A&C USB keys, though, and I found them much faster using the C port, so I’m not sure I would even bother until some need arose.
I can see how it could be a pain for those with several USB-A devices always attached, but at least the adapter in this case is a small and cheap port adapter, since it is still USB, versus the large, pricey protocol converters of the past. (Or maybe there is more to that little adapter than I realize, but it is pretty tiny.)
I want a Mac Mini with 8 Thunderbolt Ports that I can connect to my hubs. Any port that that's not Thunderbolt 3 at least is a waste of space. I want every port to be at least Thunderbolt 3 speed. Why does anyone need a USB-A port directly on the Mac mini ?
Well, there often is a degradation in performance - any USB devices are now connected via a hub (adds latency) and sharing a single 5Gbps (USB 3) or 480mbps (USB 2) stream from a single controller on the computer.
Well, the monitor you linked to supports DP 1.4 so there's a chance the USB hub will support USB 3 speeds via a USB-C connection alongside 4k@60Hz. You'd have to download and pore over the manual to be sure. NB: My displays have downstream ports advertised as USB 3 but only if you run the video over HDMI and connect a separate USB cable to the computer. Otherwise, they're USB 2 only - DP 1.2 needs all 4 high-speed lanes of a USB-C connector to support 4k@60hz just leaving the dedicated USB 2 lane to run the hub.
Nope - check the small print: that adapter doesn't support dual independent displays on Mac, only mirroring. In Apple's infinite wisdom, Macs don't support dual displays via DisplayPort Multi-Stream Transport daisychaining.
At the moment, you can only get full dual-display functionality out of a more expensive Thunderbolt or USB4 hub/dock Anything cheaper is likely to:
(a) Require DisplayPort MST daisy-chaining, and not work on Mac, or
(b) Use DisplayLink to send video data over USB 3 - does work on Mac but needs a driver and may introduce lag, artefacts and complications with copy-protected content.
The display you linked to has two HDMI ports. You could connect it to the HDMI port and free up a Thunderbolt 4 port for an actual 40Gbps thunderbolt device, a USB 3.2g2 SSD or even a USB 2 audio interface that recommended a direct connection to the host.
Pretty unlikely, with HDMI, DisplayPort and DisplayPort-over-USB-C there's really no room for a new connector, and if a need does emerge for 16k holographic screens with odourvision then you'll probably need to replace your M4 Mini with an M6 Mac Nano before you can use it - all of the M4's video capabilities rely on DisplayPort 1.4 internally.
Anyway, nobody is asking for the removal of TB4 ports, so nothing about having an HDMI or USB A port prevents you from using USB-C instead.
The M chips - even the base model "2 port" MacBook Airs - actually have pretty good I/O capabilities, with two full 40Gbps TB4 controllers (using the internal equivalent of 4 lanes of PCIe g3 each). That's actually better bandwidth than the Intel Macs where each pair of TB ports shared a single controller.
It's just that they've bet the farm on Thunderbolt 4 so all of that I/O is bottlenecked through just two TB4 ports which also have to double as display connectors and (on MBAs at least) charging ports. Consequence: you need external, expensive, TB4 devices - whether they are peripherals, hubs, docks or display/docking-stations - to actually exploit that bandwidth. Connect a display, charger or USB 2 peripheral directly to one of those ports and that's 4 lanes of PCIe bandwidth that you can't use for anything else.
There may be an argument for that on an ultra-portable laptop like the Air - but it's ridiculous on a desktop machine.
It's a practical non-issue, particularly for MacBook Air or Mac mini users.
And the audio guys know what to do.
Personally I'd still rather have at least a single USB-A on device, PLUS 4 USB-C. I wouldn't be bothered if the new products have an equal amount of USB drives in total. I thought 2+2 was needlessly stingy in the past, but probably a problem of using a mobile/tablet chip in a desktop computer- I think they could have offered more USB-C ports previously, but they don't like devices where not all ports are equal in their capabilities, which makes some sense.
If any part of your workflow is dependent on 20 years old technology you're setting yourself up for a lot of hurt. Min letting us know what you're using this for on a "regular" basis.
But is it the same folks, though? None of these folks seem to be berserkers.
And I would definitely take MagSafe over USB-A if I had to choose which I wanted on my MacBook. A breakaway charging port has one purpose, but it is very much a valid one, thank you.
Bigger question is why the hell doesn't Logitech make such a dongle ! USB C is not a new standard.
Me, too. Love the monitor; balk at the cost of the ASD.
Not entirely. I, too, appreciate the cohesive 'oneness' of a Mac over the 'Frankenrig' feel of a Windows PC. I compare a Windows PC to a Mac with the analogy of a house to a home; superficially looks and functions much the same, but there is a different feel to it. That said, that 'feel' could be housed in a mini-tower with spare drive bays.
Yes, but that vision has been far from consistent. For years, Apple fixed on the iMac model - users wanted faster (desktop class) processors, more user-upgradable internals, etc..., but none of that mattered because (per conventional wisdom)...Johnny Ives wanted it thinner. For years the Mac Mini was the rarely updated neglected step child of the Mac world, with people asking if Apple planned to kill it. Many people didn't want an AIO.
And now Apple only offers a 24" and refuses to sell a 27" iMac, the Mini is very much a 'thing,' and people on this thread pooh-pooh laments over losing USB-A ports because dongles, hubs and adapters sticking out of your Mac are just no big deal!
Hah! Wonder if Johnny Ives has a setup with dongles. Would love to see a photo of that. Thankfully there are options, like Satechi's hub, that blend.
Apple does on rare occasion make changes due to a sufficient level of user ire. Butterfly keyboards in MacBooks, the hockey puck mouse, the oft-disdained notebook touch bar, the trash can Mac Pro, putting some non-USB-C ports back on some MacBooks, it can happen. There is a functional place in the Apple ecosystem for customer feedback. As image-conscious as Apple seems to be, a sufficient groundswell of consistently derisive feature condemnation seems to occasionally lead to change. That may be why the Studio has front ports, despite breaking the clean aluminum brick aesthetic.
Not arbitrary. Many people wanting USB-C on iPhones for benefits that had nothing to do with e-waste concerns. The small form factor made having just one port strongly practical, unlike with desktop computers. Otherwise the iPhone could have USB-C and Lightning and people could choose which to use.
Similarly, off all the problems the environment faces today, I don't think the burden of USB-A ports is going to be the straw that breaks the camel's back. The extra hubs, dongles and replaced USB-C version peripherals add up some some e-waste, too.
You mention something that seems to be important to some people, this idea that USB-C is 'the future.' So what? We're living and computing in the present. At this point I imagine many people considering new peripheral purchases will opt for USB-C versions (if offered, priced the same, etc...) going forward. No one takes issue with Mac Minis having USB-C ports.
Yeah, I’m with them on that one, as I’m tired of having to tell people that their blue USB-A port is faster than their notebook’s black one (maybe.) I like USB, but I wish it really was a standardized standard, rather than a multitude of standards combined into a few connectors.
I find I have less need for multiple USB ports these days, but I guess I’m not messing with stuff as much as I used to (that, and almost everything being networked now.)
But what if those existing ports are what is preventing the Mac mini from getting more usb-c ports?
The current (non-pro) Mac mini comes with 2 usb-c ports, 1 HDMI and 2 usb-a ports. Give me a choice between those 5 ports, and 4-5 usb-c ports, and I really see little reason to not go all-in with usb-c at this juncture.
I, personally, dislike that Apple added HDMI and an SD card reader to the Macbook Pro. Never use them (Display port is better than HDMI and it's native to TB) and would much rather have one more TB port.
I appreciated those things too…until I was using a gorgeous 5K display with an outdated 2015 computer inside and wanted to use it with a newer computer instead
My 5K iMac has been turned into a Frankenstein’s iMac, but it lives on as an external display for whatever newer computer (Apple or non-Apple) I want to use with it. It even charges my MacBook Pro over USB-C.