Seems like a no-brainer if the offer is 5 USB-C ports, with 3 of them being Thunderbolt ports. An adapter is less of a headache to use since the desktop is stationary. I understood the pain in 2016 when the technology was new and required adapters to be carried around, now this is a minor inconvenience at most.
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Mac Mini to Lose Its USB-A Ports Later This Year
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There's no reason anyone even has to throw out an older device just because it shipped with a USB-A cable. Replace the ****ing cable and move on.
(I think MR only posts about non-issues like this is to rile up engagement. And here I am, falling for it 🤦♂️ )
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My comment about the 3.5mm jack was in response to another user's comment talking about the introduction of airpods which paved the way for apple dropping said ports on mobile devices, it was not in the context of a mac losing a 3.5mm.
Nope!
Disagreeing with your opinion does not make one "negative"
Sorry - not accepting your framing there
I have too many Satechi products
. I would love to see a TB5 hub that has room for at least 2-3 M.2 SSDs (running at PCI Gen 4 or 5 speeds with room for cooling said SSDs. Then we can gave 4-8 additional TB4/USB4 ports on the hub along with 10G Ethernet. Attach two of those to a Mac mini and you have a "Pro Desktop". P.S. Their latest USB4 SSD Enclosure can do about 3GB/sec That is well short of the 5-6 GB/sec that the WD SSD I have installed in it.
HDMI doesn't use PCIe lanes. AFAIK the HDMI in the Mac Mini uses the spare internal DisplayPort connection that would drive the internal screen in a laptop.
The M-series chips clearly have a few spare PCIe lanes - but it takes 4 - plus some plumbing for DisplayPort and power - to implement a Thunderbolt port. That's enough to run a USB-A port or two, an ethernet port and a SD reader (you can see how the SD reader and Ethernet are connected on a Studio by rummaging around in System Report). Or you could plug just one of those into a TB port and waste 3 lanes of PCIe bandwidth... or plug in a display and waste 4... or plug in a hub, connect USB 3 devices to it and still waste 3 out of 4 PCIe lanes of bandwidth.
The thing about all of those technologies is that they were well and truly obsolete when Apple dropped them: the new alternatives were many times faster, had many times the capacity, were a fraction of the physical size and were cheaper. I mean... my optical drive still comes out of the cupboard a couple of times a year but I surely don't need one built in (they were always the first component to fail anyway...)
What the disciples of the One True Connector still seem to be in denial about is that, even today, the majority of "USB-C" peripherals are still running the same 15-year-old 5Gbps protocols as USB 3, if not 480Mbps USB 2. 4 USB 2 devices plugged into a Thunderbolt hub are still only sharing 480Mbps of bandwidth with the same USB 2.0 hub latency. DisplayPort over USB-C is still just DisplayPort. HDMI over USB-C is just DisplayPort with a DP-to-HDMI chip in the adapter. Devices that actually use Thunderbolt/USB4 are still priced at a whopping premium - partly because USB 3 speeds are already "good enough" for so many purposes (e.g. all but the fastest external SSDs).
The reason USB-A hasn't died is because, for many people, there is no advantage to it that justifies buying new kit.
Talking about old tech, TOSLink - est. 1983!!!
Beautiful example of something that doesn't need to be thrown away because it still does its job... but if USB-A is obsolete (it isn't), that would make TOSLINK archaic (it isn't).
...but I make that 13 years older than USB 1.0
Remember the good old days when Macs had an optical out buried in the 3.5mm jack?
Because the typical DAC only needs USB 2 speeds (CD-quality stereo audio is 1.5Mbps, USB 2 is 480Mbps) and there haven't been any huge advances in the state of the art (the frequency of the human ear is still 20kHz less than 'audiophiles' think it is) to change that. USB-C is more expensive to implement, Thunderbolt/USB4 even more so, some people prefer the larger USB B jack for studio/stage work and you can always get a USB-C to USB-B cable if you need it. However, most people recommend connecting DACs directly to the host rather than via a hub.
This appears to be in-jest so I'll treat it as such but let's not conflate matters by suggesting retaining the widely USB-A port on a desktop is somehow handicapping technological progress - you sound like the type to also say ethernet ports are handicapping technological progress as well.
My MacMini already has it although I only use it at 2.5Gbps because more would have required updating cabling in my walls.
And supporting their position does not make us fanboys.
Sorry - not accepting your framing here.
It's not more flexible if it doesn't support 40Gbps. The USB-C port is more adaptable because it supports higher speed connectivity, it just needs an adapter. USB-A tops out at USB 3.2 with is 20 Gbps.
my preferred mouse happens to be wired and USB-A. Should I get a new hand so I can get a wireless mouse? /s
I agree, having to replace my current USB-A hard drive cable with a new USB-C cable is far too complex and expensive. I am simply not up to the intellectual and financial challenge.
If this is the future (no USB-A) then I will never replace my current computer. I will keep it for the rest of my life
It’d be nice if it were smaller, yes. There’s little reason to make it larger than a an iPad Air - sans screen and the humongous battery.
I mean… it‘s not as if Apple used that space to give us something useful (such as an M.2 slot for storage expansion) we would really benefit from.
I‘d argue it‘s „progress“ (a better, more flexible port) - just one that you could do without.
Optical drives certainly weren‘t „truly obsolete“ in 2011.
I‘m not in denial at all. I own USB-C cables that support USB2.0 speeds only. USB 2.0 speeds are totally fine for a wide range of applications - and you named some of them.
Just give me ports that can do everything on my computer - the peripheral devices will automatically sort out the required USB protocol, data transfer rates and power with it.
Since I want to keep informed on the "dark side" aka the PC market I follow Linus Tech Tips and other similar creators on YouTube. Even Linus has admitted that in practice most people buy systems not components. Great on the PC Market for allowing using to customize every component, down to the colour of a cable.
My biggest gripe with Apple is the lack of expandable internal storage. With Thunderbolt 5 around the corner, as discussed earlier in the thread, I hope/expect that Satechi or OWC will make a giant well cooled M.2 dock that lets me get PCI Gen 5 speeds out of my SSDs. At this point, I use spinning disks for archival only.
My home music streaming solution is to stream from my mac mini over my GB ethernet network using AirPlay 2 to multiple AirPort express routers. The one connected to my good stereo is hooked up through a 3.5mm optical cable with a regular TOSLINK connector on the other end. I have no idea when I got the cable, but I found it in my stash when I updated from to AirPlay 2 in 2022 and swapped out my obsolete 1st get Airport Express devices to the newer obsolete Airplay 2 compatible ones.
A client hands you a thumb drive.
Eh, it’s a Mac, so by now everyone should be used to macs being an unruly octopus of adapters and drives hanging out of it.
Eh, it’s a Mac, so by now everyone should be used to macs being an unruly octopus of adapters and drives hanging out of it.
Good gravy people! The sooner we can kill USB-A and all non USB-C variants the better. I remember when the iMac first arrived and didn't have a 3.5" floppy drive - these comments sounds similar.
The iMac only has USB-C ports. It appears that Apple’s consumer grade desktops (e.g. Mini and iMac) will be limited to USB-C ports.
Maybe if Apple would sell higher capacity internal drives at more reasonable prices …
Ethernet is not handicapping technological progress because there’s no better alternative to Ethernet yet. Once there is, it would be prudent to move on to that, just like moving to USB-C and leaving USB-A behind once and for all is the most prudent thing now.
Again - nobody is advocating against USB-C ports
I think we are splitting hairs and choosing to believe what we prefer by saying "having only USB-C is progress"
Functionally speaking, on a day to day usage basis, for many users, it's a lateral move at best
And if one has USB-A needs still, it ends up necessitating adapter purchases to continue doing what they are already doing.
Think about that point...
To keep doing what that user is already doing at this very moment, they now need to buy things to adapt.
That user gains nothing if they already have USB-C ports also (which is highly likely, if not certain, depending upon which Mac model they are coming from here)
There's no way to convince me that's "better" in the short/medium term for a user that has USB-A needs
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How is "leaving USB-A behind" prudent or technological progress?
As a proponent for keeping USB-A I'm certainly not making this case but one could say for ethernet just like I'm sure the case is made for USB-A, is that the ethernet port space could be used for something else, whether for a different port, improved heat dissipation, storage, smaller form factor, or perhaps in the great name of technological progress, etc.
It really comes down to the fact we are talking about a desktop, not a phone or laptop which is designed around portability and thus necessitates a slim design, but a desktop that doesn't necessitate a slim design. The mac mini is already small, so where's the benefit in forcing the end user who on average uses USB-A more than USB-C, to having to adapt to such a loss by means of a hub or adapter cables when a desktop itself previously provided said functionality?
I've yet to a see a single substantive case made for removing USB-A from a desktop device.
There isn't such a case to be made
People are just defending what Apple have chosen to do
Par for the course around here
Taken to its logical extension, those desiring "only USB-C" should be going all the way to "only USB-C ports" and advocating for everything, maybe save for power, being handled via adapters to USB-C plugs.
want to mention that USB-A is about as thick as HDMI (less than 1mm difference), so the decision to omit it from the current MacBook Pro was not due to thickness constraints