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Mac OS X 10.6.2 Confirmed to Drop Support for Intel Atom Processors
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OK point taken, I must have missed that one. Lets strike it because its silly anyway.
Why would they be closed on Wednesday? Most corporate offices are still open in most holidays. Government buildings are a different story but I doubt any of us is gonna argue that 1 Infinite Loop counts as one!
However, having the SLAs online doesn't help much per-say if a user is in a store and trying to decide whether or not to purchase Snow Leopard. Granted, many stores now have some form of limited internet access available (plus the fact that the user may have a smartphone), so they can potentially access and read the SLA online before purchasing. But realistically, would the average Mac user truly think to read an SLA online before walking into a store and picking up the copy? (Granted, I doubt any of them would decide not to accept the EULA and return it anyway).
You can see the SLA at any point - before or after the purchase. It doesn’t matter. Your concern with a retailer is following their return policies - If they aren’t in partnership with Apple regarding their return policies (which most are not) its buyer beware. Apple clearly says on their box that usage of the software is subject to license agreements. You never have to break any seal to get access to that license. YOu can buy it, check the license online, say “no way” and return it wherever you got it. One can reasonably argue that you breaking the seal is not Apple’s fault in any way since that is an action independent of buying the box and licensing the software - they are two distinct actions.
That may be - that information was cited by BaldiMac and I was quoting him - I couldn’t find anything to back him up. But again, the retailer is probably gonna argue legitimately that you have access to the license independently of the purchase which is stated on the product.
If that was the case than I misunderstood and I apologize.
My understanding of contract law is this: Until it gets voided by a court, it is considered valid and binding if you accept it. That’s the basis I go by. Right now - Apple’s license has yet to be voided and nobody but a court of law can decide otherwise. Hergo it is valid.
Must have missed it. My answer is: it depends. Honestly. I consider the sale of the box and the licensing to be to independent actions. Unless you get the box from Apple directly, the guy selling you the box has no say whatsoever to the licensing portion and therefore their actions regarding returns can very well go against the licensing. Apple cannot dictate how the box gets sold everywhere. That goes for all software companies - and nobody has brought this kind of problem before.
The guy I was talking about is named Matticus - the guy knows his stuff based on what he posted - read his postings if you want proof - but I have been following these discussions for a looong time - check my posting history and see where I have commented and who I have replied to - my feelings are really clear - you will have to go outside of this thread. My lazyness makes me unable to dig up my prior postings I have done months ago.
Sorry, that doesn’t mean that you dismiss critics and throw around the fanboy term. That is just stooping down to their level. You don’t agree with something, its much better to ignore it and move on. Makes you look a lot better.
ETA: If you do not wish to engage in further discussion with me for whatever reason you choose if you do not wish to, simply ignore me and move on. I do not wish to get into a debate that goes nowhere because I cannot get my point across regardless of if the fault is mine or not. I am giving you an out because I feel that I have said what I thought and I am not going to change my mind. My conclusions are based on tons of prior discussion and frankly, people are doing a much better job at this than I am. I personally feel that retail store policies are not pertinent to the licensing terms of Apple’s software. I am sticking by that because I can find no law that says that retailers have to return open software. My guess is that they don’t. Apple provides a copy of the license and that in my mind is sufficient. The software license industry still operates when this is the norm. I see no need to debate this further. I do not wish to make enemies with anyone so I humbly offer the chance to agree to disagree should you wish to see things as such.
So? Nobody in this thread is serioiusly bashing Microsoft. We are just saying that MS’s business strategy is very different from Apple’s because, for the most part, MS does not sell hardware. Where they do sell hardware, they follow a closed approach like they do with Apple (like the XBox where they control who can develop officially, they decide what the development is, they control the XBOX live system, they only sell console hardware they approve of etc)
The only real comparisons that are valid to MS is that they license their software in a restricted fashion. Sure Apple is more restrictive, but so far, the courts have been fine with that.
But there are significant differences between Apple and MS. Apple is largely a hardware company, MS is not. MS is a convicted monopolist, Apple has not. These significant differences make MS comparisons very difficult and pretty much obviously invalid. It just furthers a religious debate that I dislike arguing. He has a point.
Oh and by the way..... MS sucks!!!!
[SIZE="1”]Kidding folks![/SIZE]
Hmmm... Formatting isn’t working. Odd
Who should people blame? Santa Clause? Screw Apple. They're just a bunch of greedmongers. They have no other possible reason to do it other than to stop people from using the hardware they don't even offer.
Apple is a business. They have no obligations to support activities that do not support their business ends. That is their right and obligation as a business.
your the only one confused here,
pc users hate being ripped off on ridiculously priced slow garbage hardware but find the OS easy to use, they pretty much solved there own problem by creating the hackintosh.
kick ass hardware with a good OS.
PDJudd, we both know that the whole discussion about return policies is utter ********. Everyone posting here knows Apple's SLA. Nobody has ever gone to an Apple Store and asked for a refund because they refused the license, we all know that. And all the people claiming they want to are not really concerned about the return policy; their problem isn't with the return policy, their problem is with the license that doesn't allow them to do what they want to do, and with Apple who refuses to sell MacOS X with the license that they want.
But since Apple has the right to use any license they wish (with certain legal limitations), they have to come up with these straw men again and again. To any non-expert and non-deluded customer it is clear that if you have to go to some dodgy website to download some hacker tools to install MacOS X, then there must be something dodgy going on.
But since Apple has the right to use any license they wish (with certain legal limitations), they have to come up with these straw men again and again. To any non-expert and non-deluded customer it is clear that if you have to go to some dodgy website to download some hacker tools to install MacOS X, then there must be something dodgy going on.
Wasn't there enough outrage over Apple not including support for PowerPC processors in Snow Leopard for you?
Intel Atoms are in question here. Hardly kick ass.
the only purpose installing OS on a netbook is to avoid paying 300-400 dollars more for a macbook (and in this case, i would consider hardware much better than found in a netbook)
No see there is where your Kool Aid drinking has blinded you. Apple's own "portable" is the Macbook Air, which for many netboook users simply isn't portable enough. Whats more, its overkill for what they intend to use their netbook for which is basic websurfing, checking email and perhaps the odd Word document or two. Apple's closest competing product in fact would be the iPhone and do I really have to list the failings of that device compared to a netbook?
My guess it is the reason Apple did it was because of SO,; but not so much for real accounting purposes but to avoid having the SEC decide they should have and thus triggering potential individual liability for Apple execs. It's easier to charge a nominal fee then do what you may honestly believe is OK under SOX and then discover later when you do a perp walk that the Feds see it differently. If I was an auditor I'd err far on the side of safe than risk an expensive legal battle for a trivial sum of money.
Yes, please do.
I don't see the point of netbooks. The iPhone lets me read e-mail/surf the web in an ultra portable way. My Macbook fits in my backpack neatly and is lightweight.
Why do I need a netbook again ? Netbooks are just a fad, and they are cheap to boot. They aren't really useful.
Great. You've found a tool that meets your needs for portable access.
Can you install MS Office (Word, Excel, Outlook...) on your Iphone. Photoshop (yes, I have Photoshop Elements on my Asus eeePC)? Can you touch-type on a real keyboard? How about installing OSX or Win7?
That's the point - a netbook is a real laptop for lighter duty use. You can install just about any application that you use on your desktop or laptop, and it will run fine (but a bit slower).
... and it's small and cheap. (MBA fails both those tests.)
how is this any different from say, installing boxee on the apple tv? technically you're not meant to install anything else on that.
there will be a hack eventually. why people are screaming at each other calling for heads on the hacker community is a bit baffling..
there will be a hack eventually. why people are screaming at each other calling for heads on the hacker community is a bit baffling..
I know that. I just feel that concerning this point I am arguing against a brick wall. I am not getting anywhere so I ain’t arguing anymore. I know this is all an attempt to end-run the EULA/SLA. I aint falling into that trap. I refuse to.
Pretty soon we are going to be fighting the tired old argument about a “Mac Market share” argument again which we know is complete bull too. It just goes in loops.
Why must you put things so eloquently? Are you the intelligent clone that I have?
Seriously, I would love to have a beer with you so we can laugh at the many times we explain these things. I have seriously lost count at the many times we have addressed all these stupid talking points. Must we keep doing it. I suppose we must. I have a great deal of respect that you can keep this up - I have to back down all the time since I tend to get that “The stupid - It burns!” feeling. We need a “Why Hackintoshing is bad 101" that lists all these points along with evidence that keeps getting dredged up so that we can cite it. It won’t stop the arguments, but it makes our jobs easier. At that point though you know your going to hear:
1) What does it matter to you? Why should you care?!?!?
2) The old fanboy cannard.
Sometimes I wonder why we bother right?
netbooks aren't a fad, they're handy. when you do travel, there's nothing worse than lugging your video camera, phone, and the heavy lappy. sometimes a keyboard is handy. typing something out while you're away, proper web access with a keyboard. it's a godsend. mind you, if apple were to make a 9 or 11 inch lappy tomorrow, most people would be praising them
Thats different. End users modifying hardware and software after purchase is no big deal. I can buy a mac, and install whatever software I want (as long as it was legally obtained) including haxies. Thats what the Apple TV Mods are and I dont think there is any licensing provision that says you cannot do that that would survive a legal dispute. Sure Apple warns you that they dont support it and dont plan for these things when updating, but its still legal since you own the hardware. You cant make the same argument for hackintoshes because the software is never owned. Hardware ownership never takes place and thats part of the licensing requirements - Apple hardware.
good point. ehh, there will be a hack eventually anyways. TBH i wish apple would get off their asses and just make a slightly smaller lappy. things are getting smaller and smaller all of the time, i'm sure the tech is there. pricing is probably an issue, but half of you out there would gladly pay the price, im sure...
Thats not the point. Apple makes whatever products they feel that they can make money from. Nobody but Apple gets to dictate what products they make. Saying "i wish apple would get off their asses and just make a slightly smaller lappy" is meaningless because Apple doesn't do that. They make products the way they want to, not necessarily what the public wants.
If you want a smaller laptop than what Apple sells you there are many vendors that will offer that. You won't get OSX, but nobody is going to offer 100% - there are always compromises.