MacMall's ridiculous "No Return's on Apple Products" Policy..

[CanadaRAM]

Sense of entitlement? Please. It's basic consumer support. Nothing more. I didn't say I should get special treatment I merely said that if I am dissatisfied even if apple attempts to fix the problem (if it exists for me) I should be allowed to return the product within the first 30 days. This is basic consumer support, nothing more.

But your impression of what you 'should' have the right to do is just not true. Your basic consumer support is the warranty, there is nothing that says that you have a right to return a product for refund (in contravention of the sales contract you agreed to, which specifically states you cannot).

Laws vary in different countries, I believe the EU has some rights of return enshrined in law.
You can check out the Texas statutes to find out what your real rights are (and aren't). O'course it would be pretty ironic of you to lean on your state for remedy, seeing as you bought from this seller to avoid paying the TX sales tax, but that's another issue...

 

[gnasher729]

Laws vary in different countries, I believe the EU has some rights of return enshrined in law.

Not in Britain, as long as you started the negotiations (if someone were to knock on your door and offered to sell you a Mac, and you bought one there and then, you would have seven days to return it). If you go to a shop and buy it or order it, or you get on your phone and order it, or you order by email or internet, that's it. You bought it.

Obviously the seller has to fix problems, and if they are not capable of fixing the problem, you can then return the goods.

There are shops that accept returns, usually depending on the nature of the goods and the business. Clothes shops usually, and DIY shops. You won't be able to return a Mac though, just because you changed your mind, not even at an Apple Store. And I don't think anyone would expect it.

 

[uaaerospace]

Because thus far, Apple ISN'T fixing the problem. The displays they've replaced have the exact same issue (for better or worse by a degree). Apple did warranty work, but the root cause of the problem still exists, faulty panels or low quality panels.

I'm not saying I deserve a new unit because of anything. I understand they'll replace faulty components.

Seems to me you are worked up over a repair that hasn't been performed for a problem that doesn't exist on a product you haven't yet received!

If you have the above feelings about Apples products/repairs, then why on earth did you buy an Apple product? Your logic makes no sense. If Apple's replacement panels are no better than the original faulty ones, why do you think you'll get a good panel to begin with? Me thinks you should calm down until you get your machine.

 

[gnasher729]

You can check out the Texas statutes to find out what your real rights are (and aren't). O'course it would be pretty ironic of you to lean on your state for remedy, seeing as you bought from this seller to avoid paying the TX sales tax, but that's another issue...

Aren't you required in the USA by law to make a list of all items you bought outside the state without paying state sales tax on your next tax return, and pay the tax then? Except that (at the moment) nobody is checking and you are not likely to be caught if you don't pay?

 

[CalBoy]

Sense of entitlement? Please. It's basic consumer support. Nothing more. I didn't say I should get special treatment I merely said that if I am dissatisfied even if apple attempts to fix the problem (if it exists for me) I should be allowed to return the product within the first 30 days. This is basic consumer support, nothing more.

Yes, but you paid a reasonably lower price for your iMac, and you went around sales taxes (though I suggest you find out if your state has "use" taxes in place, as these are the responsibility of the consumer). This is often the price on pays for lower prices. Walmart sells computers too, but they have no "service" to speak of. Conversely, you can walk into an Apple Store and have a great deal of your questions answered (albeit not all of them) about Macs and OS X. It's all a trade off.

I dunno, I kind of agree with him.

As do I. My comment wasn't directed at what you think it was directed at.

It isn't entirely rational to expect the same level of service that you'd receive from an Apple Store, when you're paying $400 less to buy mail order.

Why would you be dissatisfied after Apple fixes the problem?

I think that's the crux of the issue here (in terms of entitlement). Let's say your iMac arrives with dead pixels, and Apple replaces your display.

Where's the problem there, other than you not being able to have it replaced with an entirely new unit (which is indeed special treatment, common or not)?

You hit it on the nose here. If the OP finds hardware defects, Apple will repair/replace such defects as they arise (up till the warranty period that is). If the OP truly has a hardware problem, then this is the best way to have it corrected. Returning a product doesn't guarantee that the next iMac he buys will be problem-free either.

Aren't you required in the USA by law to make a list of all items you bought outside the state without paying state sales tax on your next tax return, and pay the tax then? Except that (at the moment) nobody is checking and you are not likely to be caught if you don't pay?

This depends on whether or not your state has a "use" tax in place, which taxes the use of certain products that are bought online. This would be a part of your state tax return, not your IRS tax return, as the Federal Government doesn't care about sales taxes (nor does it engage in them).

 

[Mindflux]

Seems to me you are worked up over a repair that hasn't been performed for a problem that doesn't exist on a product you haven't yet received!

If you have the above feelings about Apples products/repairs, then why on earth did you buy an Apple product? Your logic makes no sense. If Apple's replacement panels are no better than the original faulty ones, why do you think you'll get a good panel to begin with? Me thinks you should calm down until you get your machine.

I wasn't aware of this issue prior to purchasing.

 

[CalBoy]

I wasn't aware of this issue prior to purchasing.

I wasn't aware your iMac even had an issue yet.

 

[Mindflux]

Yes, but you paid a reasonably lower price for your iMac, and you went around sales taxes (though I suggest you find out if your state has "use" taxes in place, as these are the responsibility of the consumer). This is often the price on pays for lower prices. Walmart sells computers too, but they have no "service" to speak of. Conversely, you can walk into an Apple Store and have a great deal of your questions answered (albeit not all of them) about Macs and OS X. It's all a trade off.

I paid what someone with an educational discount would have paid for their iMac directly from apple. Less Sales tax, too. But even you pointed out that's the consumers responsibility at that level.

Walmart doesn't offer support, but they'll allow me to return anything I'm dissatisfied with within 30 days of purchase. Which is my point entirely.

Also regarding returning the product. If I had to return it for defects (if I could) would not purchase another at this point. I'd continue to use my PC until I had reasonable belief that the problem(s) have been addressed.

Also RE: Use tax. Texas does not have a state tax return. Thanks to CanadaRam for divulging my whereabouts.

 

[GFLPraxis]

That's fine and dandy and I'm happy for that. However if Apple "Repairs" the screen by replacing it, and the new screen has the same problem (this has been posted on AI, Apple Discussions and here AFAIK) I'm not going to want to keep it. I didn't skip BUILDING another PC in favor of an iMac to end up with sub-par quality parts.

If in the end I'm dissatisfied with the product I have NO recourse for return. That is insane to me.

Apple has a three-fixes-equals-replacement policy most of the time. If you have the same problem, after the third time Apple just replaces the unit.

 

[hunterjoules]

What State do you live in (I assume your in the US)? Most states have implied warranty laws, regardless of the store's official policy. Basically implied warranty laws state that merchandise has to be sold in a proper working condition, and if you receive a defective product the vendor is required to replace it with a working one.

 

[CalBoy]

I paid what someone with an educational discount would have paid for their iMac directly from apple. Less Sales tax, too. But even you pointed out that's the consumers responsibility at that level.

Do you qualify for an educational discount? No, so don't bring that up because it's a moot point. You are a standard consumer, and you paid less than other consumers who buy from Apple or retail stores like Best Buy. By paying less, you sacrificed something somewhere, and in this case, it was the service of being able to return your product. If you didn't know this before hand, all I can say is that you should have been a smarter shopper. Maybe you'll read more of the "fine print" before typing in your CC number next time.

Also, don't confuse sales tax with use tax. Sales tax is levied on the business, while use tax is levied on the consumer/individual. It's the state's way of trying to get you to buy local products.

Walmart doesn't offer support, but they'll allow me to return anything I'm dissatisfied with within 30 days of purchase. Which is my point entirely.

You missed the entire point of the Walmart example. Walmart gives you less service in exchange for lower prices. Sure they happen to allow returns, but compared to other electronics stores, they offer less customer service and aid, which is how they keep their prices lower. What one gives up to shop at Walmart doesn't have to be the same thing in order for the analogy to hold true.

 

[Mindflux]

Maybe you'll read more of the "fine print" before typing in your CC number next time.

Being that being unable to return a product purchased is completely UNHEARD of to me I had no reason to check the fine print. Now I have reason when dealing with APPLE Products. Which is the only thing MacMall does not allow returns on up to their given 30 day (or X day) policy.

Nowhere in this thread did I ask for MacMall to give me support (your wal-mart analogy). I asked that they allow me to return a product if deemed unacceptable to the consumer (ie me, you and canadaram even).

 

[Twinkie]

Aren't you required in the USA by law to make a list of all items you bought outside the state without paying state sales tax on your next tax return, and pay the tax then? Except that (at the moment) nobody is checking and you are not likely to be caught if you don't pay?

No.

Right off the bat, not all states in the US have a sales tax to be recovered.

In my state (Michigan), you're supposed to list anything you bought anywhere (mail / online orders, garage sales, eBay, states that charge less than 6% sales tax, Canada, etc.) if you didn't pay Michigan sales tax on it. Then you're supposed to take your list and multiply it by the state's sales tax (6%), and add that to the tax you owe on your income tax.

Or, you can check the box right under that line that says you don't remember how much you bought, and pay a standard amount based on your AGI. Doing so still leaves you open to audit, if the state can prove that you owe more money... but the state has 4 years to do it, before hitting the statute of limitations. (If you pay nothing, there is no statute of limitations, as it is considered "failure to report").

Not that this has a lot to do with the OP. But buying online to skirt sales tax isn't necessarily as cut and dry as it seems.

 

[CalBoy]

Nowhere in this thread did I ask for MacMall to give me support (your wal-mart analogy). I asked that they allow me to return a product if deemed unacceptable to the consumer (ie me, you and canadaram even).

This is the last time I'm going to repeat this, so I hope you understand what I'm trying to say.

Let's say you're buying a Mac (much like you were). Here are your options:

Store A
Good service(reps help you refine your options and help you customize you computer)
Good return policy
More expensive

Store B
No service present(you pick up the computer and take it to the register)
Return policy is non-existant
Prices are at least 10% lower

Now let's pretend you're buying a piece of clothing

Store 1
Good service (reps help you pick out clothes that fit you well)
Good return policy
More expensive

Store 2
No service present (reps only scan and bag-no one is there to help you with anything, including finding your size).
Good return policy (same as Store 1)
Less expensive

Do you see how in both cases, you gave up something in order to get a lower price? You don't always have to give up the same thing in order to get less service. In your case, you gave up the service of being able to return. In another case, a clothes shopper gave up the service of getting help.

 

[CanadaRAM]

Also RE: Use tax. Texas does not have a state tax return. Thanks to CanadaRam for divulging my whereabouts.

Sorry, I could have sworn one of your earlier posts specified how much state tax was saved. But I could have misread Taxes for Texas. Or maybe it was the accent. I dunno.

 

[Mindflux]

Do you qualify for an educational discount? No, so don't bring that up because it's a moot point.

Who's to say I don't? I could be buying it for my mother to give to my brother who is in school.

How to get your discount
If you’re a college student, a parent buying for a college student, or a member of the faculty, administration, or staff of a college or K-12 school, simply visit the Apple Store for Education. Discounted prices will appear automatically as you shop.

So, in this case all I saved (essentially) was sales tax. Still no after purchase work with MacMall at all according to their policy. All they're doing is selling them at the EDU price, to someone who 'happens to be buying it for his brother'

 

[Twinkie]

Being that being unable to return a product purchased is completely UNHEARD of to me I had no reason to check the fine print. Now I have reason when dealing with APPLE Products. Which is the only thing MacMall does not allow returns on up to their given 30 day (or X day) policy.

You're the luckiest shopper ever, if that's true. I can't think of many places that have a flat "30 days on anything for any reason" policy.

Best Buy: 14-day return and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, monitor GPS, radar detector, digital camera, projector, or camcorder. No restocking fee if unopened.

Circuit City: 14-day return and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, digital camera, camcorder, monitor, printer, scanner, projector, PDA, mobile video, GPS, or radar detector. No restocking fee if unopened.

WalMart: 15-day return on computers, GPS, mobile video, and mp3 players. No restocking fee. 30, 45, or 90-day return on other items (depending on department).

CompUSA: 14-day and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, monitor, printer, projector, camcorder, camera, or GPS. No restocking fee if unopened. 21-day return on everything else.

MacMall: No returns on anything made by Apple, 3Com, Compaq, Cisco, IBM, Intel, HP, Toshiba, Adobe, Quark, Lenovo or Sony. 15% restocking fee on any refused order.

This isn't a "check the return policy on Apple, because buying anything Apple is different from everything else in the world" problem.

 

[CalBoy]

Who's to say I don't? I could be buying it for my mother to give to my brother who is in school.

Like I said before, now you know better and you'll buy from elsewhere.

 

[Mindflux]

You're the luckiest shopper ever, if that's true. I can't think of many places that have a flat "30 days on anything for any reason" policy.

Best Buy: 14-day return and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, monitor GPS, radar detector, digital camera, projector, or camcorder. No restocking fee if unopened.

Circuit City: 14-day return and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, digital camera, camcorder, monitor, printer, scanner, projector, PDA, mobile video, GPS, or radar detector. No restocking fee if unopened.

WalMart: 15-day return on computers, GPS, mobile video, and mp3 players. No restocking fee. 30, 45, or 90-day return on other items (depending on department).

CompUSA: 14-day and 15% restocking fee on any opened computer, monitor, printer, projector, camcorder, camera, or GPS. No restocking fee if unopened. 21-day return on everything else.

MacMall: No returns on anything made by Apple, 3Com, Compaq, Cisco, IBM, Intel, HP, Toshiba, Adobe, Quark, Lenovo or Sony. 15% restocking fee on any refused order.

This isn't a "check the return policy on Apple, because buying anything Apple is different from everything else in the world" problem.

Yes, but in EVERY ONE of those instances save macmall you CAN return it. Mind you if the unit is defective they wave the restocking fee.

I worked at Best Buy eons ago when they instituted the 14 day return policy on Computers and Cameras. It's to prevent people from using them when they go on trips or for a term paper or whatever and then returning them.

Like I said before, now you know better and you'll buy from elsewhere.

Precisely right there.

 

[Twinkie]

Yes, but in EVERY ONE of those instances save macmall you CAN return it.

I worked at Best Buy eons ago when they instituted the 14 day return policy on Computers and Cameras. It's to prevent people from using them when they go on trips or for a term paper or whatever and then returning them.

Sure, and pay a restocking fee -- which is the same that MacMall would charge you for refusing delivery.

You'll typically have a difficult time convincing the average manager that something is wrong with your purchase, when the problem is so obscure and minor that you wouldn't have noticed it yourself, had you not read the forums here. (See also: iPhone 5xxxx vs 7xxxx screens, etc.) Unless you choose to be so irritating that they just want you to go away

 

[Mindflux]

Sure, and pay a restocking fee -- which is the same that MacMall would charge you for refusing delivery.

You'll typically have a difficult time convincing the average manager that something is wrong with your purchase, when the problem is so obscure and minor that you wouldn't have noticed it yourself, had you not read the forums here. (See also: iPhone 5xxxx vs 7xxxx screens, etc.) Unless you choose to be so irritating that they just want you to go away

Actually I found the problem after perusing apple's discussion boards regarding my very flaky Airport Extreme I just bought.

 

[Twinkie]

Actually I found the problem after perusing apple's discussion boards regarding my very flaky Airport Extreme I just bought.

Be that as it may, if your computer doesn't have something demonstrably wrong with it, it would be relatively difficult to convince a CSR that the computer is actually broken, rather than thinking that you're a customer trying to avoid the restocking fee.

 

[MacManTexas56]

for the OP. I ran into a huge problem with MacMall a few years back. I ordered an ibook through them. Didn't think anything of the return policy bc i mean come on it's 2005 every store has some policy. So I wasn't worried about it. I ordered my ibook and got it a few days later. Opened up the box from Fedex and the actual ibook box had been previously open. I take out the ibook and the palm rests were dirty and then when i booted the machine someone elses name was listed as the owner. So i logged onto the site to make sure i didn't order an open box, which i didn't. So I called Macmall thinking OK no big deal they will be cool like dell and just overnite me another one right. WRONG. I'm sorry sir, under NO circumstances do we accept returns from apple. If there is a warranty issue you will need to contact the manufacturer for help. I was like......the laptop has been opened and used by so and so's name I want to return it and get a brand new one. The guy insisted that i couldn't even get an exchange eventhough it had been used by someone else and it obviously wasn't new. I was like i need to speak to your manager......he BS's me for a few minutes to try to stall and then says his manager is not there, but rest assured he will get him to call me in the morning.

So the morning comes and nothing still. So I call and am on hold for like half an hour and finally get to talk to a manager. The guy is just as rude as the first guy and says nope sir, i'm sorry we don't accept any type of return for any reason on apple computers, it says it in our policy. So I told him that I read the policy that nite and it doesn't make sense to me really.......here's the part i didn't understand.....

You will need to contact the manufacturer directly regarding return or replacement of these brands under their respective guarantees and/or warranties.

I said I already tried contacting apple regarding a return and said since i didn't buy it from them i would have to return to macmall from which i bought it. I was like your return policy makes people believe they can go to apple to return their product which is not true. He apologized and said sorry, but contact apple regarding your warranty issue. I said there wasn't a warranty issue, but that i just wanted my money back bc i wasn't happy. He refused and started to get irritated at this point. I told him I would be contacting my credit card company to reverse the charges......that apparently made him react and do something about it. Next thing you know, fedex a few hours later is at my door with a box for a return. I will never recommend anyone to them nor will I ever order from that shady company ever again.

OP read the return policy closely to which i listed above....you may be able to work that to your advantage.

 

[sas76]

I just bought a 24" iMac that isn't even here yet. I ordered it Thursday and they didn't ship it in spite of them saying things ship the same day, then Friday came around and it's still not shipped... it says it is but the tracking info is no good.

So anyway, this will be my first Apple "MAC" and I'm a bit worried about the screen issues and freezing problems. I decided to check with MacMall's return policy just in case I couldn't get an amicable resolution from Apple. Turns out, MacMall doesn't let you return Apple products!

So, what? If Apple replaces my screen (if it's problematic) and I have the same problems I have NO WAY to return the product for a refund. How is this even legal? If I buy something at best buy and it's defective I have 30 days to return it no questions asked.

I don't think Apple will let me return it to them since I didn't buy direct, right?

Just to clarify did you read this (about the return policy ) or did you speak to someone at MacMall ? Surley they cannot have such a black and white no return policy.

I would also give apple a call and explain the situation to them. Maybe they will let you return the product directly to them if you are not happy.

Also I hope you enjoy your new iMac, I have the new 20 and I don't know if my screen has a problem, I have never bothered to test it. It looks great to me.

Cheers
ss

 

[Sun Baked]

He refused and started to get irritated at this point. I told him I would be contacting my credit card company to reverse the charges......that apparently made him react and do something about it. Next thing you know, fedex a few hours later is at my door with a box for a return. I will never recommend anyone to them nor will I ever order from that shady company ever again.

OP read the return policy closely to which i listed above....you may be able to work that to your advantage.

About the only way around MacMall's policy is if it does come down to fraud on their part.

Quite easy to get around it start taking all the information to file a police report (notify them why you need the information, for fraud by a business) and file with both the police and the credit card company.