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macs and gender/sexual preference

We're straying back into theological relativism here guys.........

To bring things back on topic:

An anecdote:

While my wife and I were first dating we frequented a Gay coffee house in Santa Cruz. Milady liked flirting with the Barrista-ette and it was a wonderfully SAFE place to just hang out. Any idiot who walked in with an attitude was in for it. Picture getting chewed out by a (very cute) petite Lez then getting politely muscled out by 3-4 flamers (new context here I suppose;) ).

There were pool tables (the coin op variety) and we were using the middle of the 3. There was a roup of 6 flamboyantly Gay men at the back table and I had a thing for tight jeans and silk shirts at the time...........

We played pool for about 10 minutes without noticing how much I was being watched until I leaned over to kiss milady........ one of the group in the back wailed "nnnoooooooo!!" and we all had a good laugh (his friends included).

It's funny how being a bit risquee in my behavior can confuse folks on that score.:D I was rather flattered and still am when it happens. I just wish I could find silks that were not, without question designed for a Gay, Black or Asian man.

It's funny how being sexy and open in public is viewed as "Gay" if you also happen to be white. I'm rather jealous of Asian and Black males that can wear fur and polished silk without coming across as a Pimp or a flip.
 
info and thoughts

First, I have to say how impressed I am that this thread is so positive and affirming of all people. When I saw how many people had posted to it, I was almost afraid to open it up. I am so pleased to see such positive and creative conversation on such a volatile (especially on the 'net) subject! One more reason why Mac users should run the world. :)

As for the "choice" thing... I think I do have a choice! I have a choice to be authentically who I am (which just so happens to be queer) or to conform to what is expected of me by society and destroy my life with self-hatred and anger. I choose happiness and lots of soft, spiritually evolved women! :)

Also, some relevant web sites:

http://www.qmug.org/
A Queer MUG - Check out "Why a Queer MUG" under the FAQ

http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/scotts/bulgarians/rainbow-flag.html
The history of the gay rainbow flag (someone was asking about this earlier in the thread)

Rock on!
 
Funny thought:

If you follow the "GayDAR" analogy than I'm like a Sparrow missile.

A Sparrow missile has the RADAR signiture of 4 B-52's but it's only 12 feet long and is most certainly NOT a bomber. Some cheaper gaydar gets confused.:D

I've had many Gay and Lesbian friends. Cool folks. The only thing I don't like are "Attention" Gays. The ones who are only homosexual to bug a parent or gain popularity.
 
when i go out in public with my ibook, i am an attention mac user...i can't help it:(

i do it to piss off bill gates, my employer
 
Wow!!

76 posts in one day!!!

Thats got to be a record.

My thought is that sexuality doesn't enter into it. Face it, Macs are a way of life. Macs are no more heterosexual, homosexual, republican, democratic, liberal, conservative, scientific, financial, graphical, audio than any other computer. Sure, they appeal to certain kinds of people, but those people fall into a wide variety of personal and professional categories.

I've met rich, poor, liberal, conservative, gay and straight people who preferred Macs. Each of these people's way of life really didn't enter into it--they just liked Macs. Its just like how a variety of people like baseball, mathematics, music or plants. It just engrained into some people.

Matthew
 
Re: info and thoughts

Originally posted by cleo
First, I have to say how impressed I am that this thread is so positive and affirming of all people. When I saw how many people had posted to it, I was almost afraid to open it up. I am so pleased to see such positive and creative conversation on such a volatile (especially on the 'net) subject! One more reason why Mac users should run the world. :)

As for the "choice" thing... I think I do have a choice! I have a choice to be authentically who I am (which just so happens to be queer) or to conform to what is expected of me by society and destroy my life with self-hatred and anger. I choose happiness and lots of soft, spiritually evolved women! :)
Click to expand...

Hello Cleo! Wondered who was going to "come out" of the woodwork...
*gives you a hug*
I just happen to be the world's foremost certified dutchboi :) lol

As this thread winds down, or at least seems to, let me again thank you all for having such open minds, thank those of you who chose not to express hurtful viewpoints, and especially thank those that shared in a very interesting dialogue... it's good to know I never have to worry about being myself on this site :)

Arn, you have a *wonderful* thing going here :)

pnw
 
wow....

over the last two days the topics of politics/religion and sexuality have been discussed in an amazing manner. i was pretty involved in the politics thread but this one i've just been a fly on the wall. i guess i know enough to know i don't know enough to propose any theories of my own.
(i do think in our typical human quest to explain and classify the people around us, we grossly oversymplify the complexities of the universe- we're just NOT that smart.)

things would be much easier if we could accept that everyone is part of the master plan and get on with our happiness.

paul and cleo, i appreciate your openness.

i thought about this thread while i was getting my daughter( 18 months today!) ready for bed-i don't care if she's hetero/homo/bi sexual when she grows up. i just hope she finds someone who loves her for who she is.
 
re: mischief

that's pretty damned funny!!! he he he...

I've personally never really had "fun" with it like your story...honestly I didn't become more comfortable with it until the last couple years...

has anyone by chance been to New Orleans? there are certain spots within the French Quarter where u could play that scenerio over and over...he he he...

and to repeat what's already been said a few posts above...this has turned into a great thread...very positive feedback from everyone...I'm really glad to see everyone getting along and discussing this easily...makes it really good to know there are people in this country who don't have their heads up their @sses...

well...afterall...we are Mac users...so it makes sense!! :p
 
the wrath of arn

i can't believe everyone's been so civil-not one warning from arn-makes me a fuzzy inside.

and eye, yes i know of the area on bourbon street you're talking about. wasn't too hard to miss with the balconies and all. and the music. why have gay bars always had the best music-i dunno? i started going to 'em when i was in high school but i had to keep it a secret because....i was a musician. those were the days when any form of dance music was frowned upon by the rock community. then i was "outed" in class by someone who had seen me there. true story. :eek:
 
It has definitely been entertaining and informative...

I think that since enough of us regulars were driving the conversation the people who might have turned things sour stayed away...who knows, maybe I don't give people enough credit...but some of the things I've seen people post here make me think that even Mac users aren't always open minded...
 
Re: the wrath of arn

Originally posted by 3rdpath
i can't believe everyone's been so civil-not one warning from arn-makes me a fuzzy inside.

and eye, yes i know of the area on bourbon street you're talking about. wasn't too hard to miss with the balconies and all. and the music. why have gay bars always had the best music-i dunno? i started going to 'em when i was in high school but i had to keep it a secret because....i was a musician. those were the days when any form of dance music was frowned upon by the rock community. then i was "outed" in class by someone who had seen me there. true story. :eek:
Click to expand...

there's been no animosity here...so why should arn be worried?!

As for music...I'm not really sure. I think it's the whole dancing thing...since most men aren't into it for fun I suppose. Think about it...u go to a club...how many men there are having fun dancing around as opposed to trying to get laid?

what I don't understand is the whole "gay disco" thing....u are right...it is great dance music. (I hope this doesn't fly anyone off the handle) Does this have something to do with the Village People in the 70's?!
 
Re: Re: the wrath of arn

Originally posted by eyelikeart
what I don't understand is the whole "gay disco" thing....u are right...it is great dance music. (I hope this doesn't fly anyone off the handle) Does this have something to do with the Village People in the 70's?!
Click to expand...

My Dad actually knew one of those guys before he joined the group...theater in Sacramento area in the late 60's early 70's...small world...6 degrees of separation...etc
 
Re: wow....

Originally posted by 3rdpath
i thought about this thread while i was getting my daughter( 18 months today!) ready for bed-i don't care if she's hetero/homo/bi sexual when she grows up. i just hope she finds someone who loves her for who she is.
Click to expand...

Kids grow up so fast, don't they? They're so much fun at that age. Until they start the terrible twos. then you need closets that lock.

I think to be loved is the biggest thing anyone can hope for in life - truely loved, I mean. I'm lucky because at age 19 I've found my soulmate. Many aren't so lucky. But to keep such an open attitude at an early age, means your daughter will grow up in a loving environment, she'll love herself, and that's the first step to finding true love :) Hate may beget hate, bigotry bigotry, etc etc... But stronger than any of them, love begets love :)

Your daughter is lucky to have such a great dad :)

pnw
 
and in england...

i just have to say that it's sad that in a culture and a city so open minded for these and mostly all other kinds of things...

england is one of the countries with the most conservative "gay rights" laws in Europe.

I guess I will only get married in the States, when I move to there in a few years...

About this whole mac thing. I've always been told that Macs were for girls, ever since I can remember and I'm now 23. Of course, at the time I was living in Portugal where every guy has a "i-am-latin-so-i-am-macho" kind of attitude.

I just have to agree that Macs let you express yourself with what you are inside, that's probably why Macs are more of a religion than anything else :)

To all other gay guys/girls in the closet, just be yourselves. Do whatever you feel like doing and what makes you truly happy.

I guess I was lucky to have found my soulmate 3 years ago and have the best parents and friends around.

Never had a single problem with anyone.

(Only the brits for not letting me marry, but that's another story...)

Take care,
Afonso
 
re: machismo

I've met quite a few individuals who fit into that category u just listed afonso...

how exactly was it that u were forced to think that Macs were for girls though?!
 
girls...

I just said that I've always been told that Macs are for girls...

Ever since I got my mac and was 5 years old, I kept hearing from everyone else that Macs were only for girls...

Well, I never agreed with them... I would use PCs if they would let me creative in them, but they just don't make it.

Love Apple, love the Mac and that's what I want to make for as my career...

I'm actually only seeking jobs related to developing on the Mac or for the Mac... let's see what happens :)

Long live Apple and Jobs :)
Later,
Afonso
 
Re: oops

Originally posted by 3rdpath
and thanks jeff-your threads have really built a community.
Click to expand...


thanks, you guys did the legwork

i just wanted to hit 1000...he he
 
Re: Re: oops

Originally posted by jefhatfield



thanks, you guys did the legwork

i just wanted to hit 1000...he he
Click to expand...

I know many of here did some mad posting yesterday...does anyone have any clue how many posts they made yesterday alone?!
 
Being gay hurts society

I get really tired of this one. Whenever straight people say "I dont mind that people are gay. As long as they dont hurt anyone else, who cares?" -this really bothers me.

First, it does hurt people, more than you know. First, from a woman's perspective, there are thousands of men, who are great boyfriend/husband material who are entirely unavailable because they would rather spend their life with another man. So, cultured, polite, and educated men are replaced by the typical ass who end up beating their wives, abusing their kids, and causing more social problems.

From a man's perspective, you can't be mature, stylish, or caring without someone branding you as gay. This can (in many people) change their behavior to appear 'macho' or 'tough' and m ake them do things they normally wouldnt do.

Also, it just totally f*cks up nature, thus society. It is not natural for humans to be homosexual. It is anti-productive, and is NOT good for the general whole of society. Plus, if homosexuality was genetic, it would have died off years ago because it is impossible for them to physically procreate. I also hate the arguement "you cant say it isnt natural to be homosexual, because animals have been known to be attracted to the same sex." Yeah, animals also eat their own kind. Are you going to start a cannibalism society as well?

Does homosexuality exist? Sure. People are gay. People are also sadists, aetheists, christians, murderers, basketball players, and theives. The reason Homosexuality wasnt socially booted from the start is because it is harder to see the repercussions and damages from it, and it is hard to enforce punishment for these acts.

I guess what Im saying is, its awful that the family structure is falling apart. Homosexuality is not to blame, but it certainly doesnt help the situation. The lack of morality in the US is staggering, and homosxuality is just another symptom of this degradation.

Does God hate fags? Well, if God even exists, I doubt he hates fags any more than he hates liars, theives, murderers, alcoholics, child abusers, or anything or anyone else. We all have done things wrong in our lives, but to make these wrong things acceptable and a part of the culture is where I think the line needs to be drawn.

I guess if any of you can tell me one good, constructive thing about being gay-then maybe I can change my mind. But just "wanting to be" gay isnt good enough for me. It does more damage to society in the long run, and it isnt worth it. I know many of you disagree, but I just fear for the stability of our society. One of the last things to happen before the fall of Rome was a breakdown of the social structure: rampant homosexuality included.
 
(click) Flame On.

-agreenster:

Lemme start by saying that you are completely full of ****.

Every social mammal of high intelligence uses physical intemacy as a social behavior beyond reproduction. The most highly advanced (Cetations come to mind) also express bi-sexual behavior. Reproductive rates among species that use mock-sexual behavior as a bonding tool within a social group tend to have a low sex-to-pregnancy rate even in heterosexual occurences. Homosexual animals have been found to be highly effective failsafes against situations where young are either orphaned or abandoned. For example: My 3 year old neutered MALE housecat is a better "mom" than 3 of 4 original mothers of perhaps 20 litters my wife and I fostered last year.

As to Homosexuality being "moral".

Lets just cut all the dogmatic crap shall we? The original description of God's conversation with Moses and ALL similar God/Promethian conversations go the same way:

Moses: "So what are the rules here?"

God: "Thou shalt not violate."

Moses: " Yeah......they'll buy THAT one.......sure. Look, we're gonna have to break this down to a set of rules. None of these idiots is gonna go for self-regulating their morality and health."

God: " Oh yeah, right. ****......uh......lets start with the ultimate Violatory acts and you can toss in some health-rules along the way."



Basically at the core of every religion is the same principal: All of us must be true to our own sense (not feeling or Dogma) of what's Moral. No-one has any right to override that. Everything else is societally imposed CRAP.

There is no "Gay gene" because no-one wants to find it. No-one wants to isolate the gene for adult epicanthic-folds or hyper-melanin production so why look for homosexuality?

The behavior exists, has always existed and no one is gonna get struck down for it.

Just to shoot down the next idiotic point:

HIV is NOT a "Gay Desease". The largest populations of HIV positive people exist in highly religious, poor HETEROSEXUAL cultures where the religion is so conservative there are no protocols for condoms, clean needles, rape prevention or anything else to slow the advancement of a rather delicate retrovirus into Pandemic status.


Any body disagree? I've got lots more flaming where that came from on this one. Cummangetit.:mad:
 
Too good to last...

Oh dear, where do I begin?

Let me follow up on mischief's post and show agreenster and any other silent readers out there how completely wrong this point of view is.

First off, who says that gay men are all "cultured, polite, and educated"? Men are men. I'm sure paul, afonso and others can attest to abusive relationships between gay men too. We can be ****s and we we can be great guys...regardless of our sexual preferences. Please get the stereotypes out of your mind before they clog your perceptions any further.

Societal restrictions on gender roles are ridiculous, and thankfully, are slowly dying away. If a man is afraid to show his feminine side because of what his friends might think, then he needs new friends.

As for nature...get a clue! The world is overpopulated as it is, and the human race is in no danger of dying out. A little population regulation by this means is perfectly acceptable.


Morality and Christian values are becoming the main arguments against homosexuality these days, and that's just wrong. God, if he exists, loves all people...no matter what! It is completely against the Christian way of life to condemn anyone, and it typifies the hypocritical zeal most of these people display. Don't be one of these people!

Just like mischief...I'm just getting warmed up...don't make me crank this up to 11!
 
one constructive thing about being gay-thats easy

you can find happiness and love with another gay person.

agreenster, you are exceedingly dull and obtuse. the obvious fact that you are the ONLY negative poster on this thread gives me faith that the laws of Darwinism are quickly converging and you will soon be submerged in a mental tar-pit with your destined to fail brethren.

now turn off your computer and go play in the street.:)
 
what's really good for society...

open-mindedness and freeing one's mind of the bullsh*t that's all around us...why is it so hard to just live our lives without having to get so involved in other's?

It's a shame to say that everywhere in this country in the year 2002...not 1879...that we are continuing to be scared of things like homosexuality. so f*cking what?! I honestly feel that this country is far from moving forward. We make such incredible technological advances...but act like complete @sses by being so concerned with how we look. It's not evolution...I know that much. We're not advancing...we're regressing as a species...a society.

I realize there is not mention of it in the bible...but I truly feel that it's called "free will." People are people...period...whether they feel they are "born that way" or just become it....deal with it. Why should u worry about what your gay neighbor is doing when he's living for him/herself? I don't understand why people can have their heads so far up their @sses and be completely full of themselves and be selfish about who they are and what they want to achieve...but when the topic of homosexuality arises..."just don't come near me with it" is often the reply and they want to pretend it's simply not there?!

it's much....much easier to point the finger and lay blame elsewhere...rather than to be a "man" about it and face it without fear...

agreenster...I've always respected your posts and agreed with u on many fronts here at macrumors...but I think u need to have a serious reality check buddy...:rolleyes:

I do not have any gay friends...I've known gay people...and they were always fine...fine people. why do we have to bash this way of life here?
 
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