Many Retailers Hesitant About Offering Support for Apple Pay

[Max(IT)]

Well everyone here seems to hop on NFC bandwagon all of a sudden especially when hypocrite apple execs claim NFC was lame and refused to even acknowledge its existence. Most of you have no experience softcard/isis when most of us have been using that and or google wallet for a while now. Even with those options you are limited to these stores mentioned here in thee article. Sure get couple kof jamba juice drinks and pay over 9 bucks!

Where these NFC payments should be accepted at are gas station pumps,7-11, mom and pop groceries, and supermarket self checkouts.

Having it at these toysrus stores, macy, , and other sikmiolar big chain stores means nothing

Look at the 200k locations they are either majority of coca cola vending machines or McDonalds, lol

It's hilarious to see how many times you wrote Google in a thread about Pay
I can see your frustration, but get over it: Apple will probably have more success in a couple of months in facilitating NFC payments than Google did in a couple of years. Move on.
The good news for you is that Pay will indirectly help also your beloved Google payment system in the process...

 

[Max(IT)]

Right, like every store who doesn't invoke NFC is going to suddenly go out of business. That's hilarious.

No they won't, but they surely will be pushed to implement it in the near future.

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Wth why are you here?

Do you really need an answer?

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Yeah, the world doesn't quite work like that.

Apple does not dictate how people make purchases and how people spend their money. People will continue to use plastic and stores will continue to accept plastic for many many years.

NFC will slowly start coming into play, but it isn't even close to being a primary payment method at this point. While some major companies are on board, plenty more smaller companies and Mom and Pop stores won't.

Imagine, if you will, you're taking a vacation somewhere outside of a major city. You only have your iPhone with you and no plastic, because you don't want to do business anywhere you can't use your iPhone for purchases.

You run out of gas. The only gas station near you still accepts plastic.

You're going to feel mighty silly trying to pay for gas using your iPhone.

Actually the world, and USA comes first, listen to what Apple "dictates" because Apple has millions of customers with high potential buying power, and commercial world is all about money. Like it or not.

 

[creediddy]

Why would this be anything surprising? Google and NFC has been available long before apple was in on it. This applepay noise isn't going to motivate the push for more acceptanc . You guys act if apple is some holy grail of mobile payments just because they decided they want in on NFC payments.

Get In line those 200,000 terminals are using Isis and other NFC payments long before apple is. In fact most of those 200k terminals don't even work!

Example is at rite-aid, Walgreens, bestbuy which doesn't even work at all even when tried by employees.

Maybe in 2017 we will see more acceptance widespread but for sure nothing will change. Apple pay isn't some awesome free or beneficial incentive for retailers at the moment. Those 200k locations consists of mostly coke vending machines too lol

You aren't understanding that Apple users are quite different than Android users. Its due to the fact that Apple has a larger cult than any other technology company. Google isn't great at marketing their products. If so why isn't NFC relevant for the past 3 years? Why does Google need a hardware alliance to push the Android product? Google had every opportunity back then to change the perception of our payment system. They have provided us the landscape, but unfortunately have failed miserably at adaption. It's mainly because Google didn't target a specific user, but relied heavily on their manufacturing partners for marketing.

 

[dontwalkhand]

You aren't understanding that Apple users are quite different than Android users. Its due to the fact that Apple has a larger cult than any other technology company. Google isn't great at marketing their products. If so why isn't NFC relevant for the past 3 years? Why does Google need a hardware alliance to push the Android product? Google had every opportunity back then to change the perception of our payment system. They have provided us the landscape, but unfortunately have failed miserably at adaption. It's mainly because Google didn't target a specific user, but relied heavily on their manufacturing partners for marketing.

Exactly. Most people didn't even know their phones could even do this. If they did they would be using it because they do after I told them.

 

[Padaung]

It is weird how some (major) US retailers are saying they are not going to accept ApplePay/NFC (or Contactless, as it has become known here in the UK).

If the US system is to be changed to chip and pin over the coming year (2015), surely the sensible thing is to upgrade to chip and pin terminals which have NFC built in? One cost, and a cost which will have to be made by all retailers soon. Citing complexity and cost about implementing ApplePay/NFC is an excuse to delay a decision, but is one that they will have to face soon none-the-less.

ApplePay/NFC/Contactless is great and simple: the entirety of the London Transport system now uses it (which equates to millions of people a day!)
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/fares-and-payments/contactless

Heck, even my local bar and dry cleaner accepts NFC.

The retailers which say they are not accepting NFC will follow at some point, customer pressure will force them once the US public find out how great contactless payment is. For security reasons, contactless is for payments less than £20 here and occasionally asks for the users pin number, but ApplePay (with its greater security) will open that up to any amount one would imagine.

The future is bright and exciting

 

[OllyW]

Moderator Note:

Please keep the political discussion in the PRSI forum.

 

[vmachiel]

Don't want me to easily spend money at your store? I see...

 

[tmiw]

It is weird how some (major) US retailers are saying they are not going to accept ApplePay/NFC (or Contactless, as it has become known here in the UK).

If the US system is to be changed to chip and pin over the coming year (2015), surely the sensible thing is to upgrade to chip and pin terminals which have NFC built in? One cost, and a cost which will have to be made by all retailers soon. Citing complexity and cost about implementing ApplePay/NFC is an excuse to delay a decision, but is one that they will have to face soon none-the-less.

ApplePay/NFC/Contactless is great and simple: the entirety of the London Transport system now uses it (which equates to millions of people a day!)
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/fares-and-payments/contactless

Heck, even my local bar and dry cleaner accepts NFC.

The retailers which say they are not accepting NFC will follow at some point, customer pressure will force them once the US public find out how great contactless payment is. For security reasons, contactless is for payments less than £20 here and occasionally asks for the users pin number, but ApplePay (with its greater security) will open that up to any amount one would imagine.

The future is bright and exciting

NFC might not be much faster here than swiping/dipping. Unlike in Europe where contactless can run without communicating with the issuer, all transactions in the US are run online. I still run into the occasional store that uses dialup credit card machines from time to time, for instance. There's also the part about how US chip cards won't have PIN, though I don't know how much extra time having a PIN adds to each credit card transaction.

 

[Manderby]

They just don't want a significantly less portion of my money.

There, corrected.

 

[rish]

Soooooooourrrrrccccceeeeee

Awesome clarification. Now let's see how many more posts before it finally sinks in. #

 

[s2mikey]

What about those of us that arent crackhead phone users and actually can't participate in this little coo? We have to shop somewhere else then?

 

[mitty]

This whole thing is hilarious to everyone in Australia, where the majority of retailers already accept NFC. Apple should totally be rolling Apple Pay out here before the US, we're a great Test Market for it.

 

[Vegasman]

Yes, as long as the store accepts payments with the NFC symbol, it will 100% work with your iPhone.

And this is partly the genius of it. It uses hardware that already exists out there, nothing new required. Heck, stores may even get confused at first and not even realize they accept Apple Pay since they never officially signed up.

So, how does Apple make money. Who sends them their portion of the fees?

 

[nick42983]

This is interesting and something I wasn't really aware of. I kind of assumed that Apple Pay, while using NFC, still needed special backend stuff to work.

If this is the case, moving forward should be possible and helped that installing NFC capabilities in stores isn't an Apple only thing.

-Kevin

This was unclear to me as well. So the 220k retailers that "support Apple Pay" essentially have NFC terminals that support any similar system. This bodes well for Europe because contactless terminals are widely used.

 

[haydn!]

Are retailers forced to buy new readers, or does Apple Pay work with existing NFC scanners? If it works with existing scanners, I don't understand the reluctance to support it?

 

[Windlasher]

McDonald's owns Chipotle. How can Chipotle not be on board?

McDonalds does not own them . They sold them years ago.

 

[dannys1]

Its odd but in terms of payments America seems massively behind the UK for once and about the only thing technology wise.

We've had chip and pin for about a decade now, a far superior system to the signature strip American continues to use and we've had NFC for about 3 years - its still not massive adopted and its only for small purchases at the moment (hopefully this is the change Apple Pay implements) but I'm surprised I find it at all my tiny local post offices, at little independent coffee shops - if they've been sent a contactless payment terminal from their credit card payment processor then they accept NFC and, as soon as Apple Pay launches in the UK, they'll accept it by proxy.

I might add in the UK KFC accept contactless payment, I used it on their drive through last week, so they'll accept Apple Pay once its live here too - really tap and pay is the way to go - it takes about 10x longer for the merchant to print off the receipt!

 

[MyopicPaideia]

So, how does Apple make money. Who sends them their portion of the fees?

The card issuing financial institution. Been answered in the thread numerous times already.

 

[Max(IT)]

Be careful you don't wake up from your dream too quickly, it will be a big shock to your system.

Apple does not rule the world. And they certainly don't rule other companies.

If you think smaller businesses and Mom and Pop shops will suddenly invoke NFC just because Apple is finally adding a chip into their new iPhone's, you're in for a rude awakening.

Who cares about small businesses and mom and pop shops in 2015?

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That is the correct reason to do it. But even still, not every company will start accepting NFC right away. It will take many many years to get companies on board.

Not right away, but the process had started, and Apple is giving it a good thrust....

 

[MyopicPaideia]

Are retailers forced to buy new readers, or does Apple Pay work with existing NFC scanners? If it works with existing scanners, I don't understand the reluctance to support it?

Works with existing scanners. Answered numerous times already in this thread. The title of the article is misleading. It should read the some retailers are not supporting NFC in general at the moment, not exclusively singling out Pay, which is technically impossible.

 

[Max(IT)]

Apple pay works just like google wallet and softcard/Isis wherever u see this logo:

Image

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Bitcoin is terrible.

Except no one knows about Google wallet while a lot of people already know about Pay because of the iPhone 6.

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Google's method of using a virtual debit card for NFC purchases is very secure as it completely hides a customer's financial information from hackers.

Apple's method is a bit more secure as it uses one-time uses tokens, but Google's method is very secure in its own right as well.

You can struggle to find a defense line for Google as much as you want, but the truth is that Google wallet is almost unknown to the mass of customers, even if most of them actually have it on their smartphone, while Pay will probably be a success because Apple know how to advertise and "enforce" a service.
Get over it.

 

[ptb42]

This is interesting and something I wasn't really aware of. I kind of assumed that Apple Pay, while using NFC, still needed special backend stuff to work.

You must not have been reading the threads on MacRumors about Pay. It's been discussed to death.

There is some "special backend stuff", but it's at the bank that issues the credit card, not the merchant, or even the credit card processor. That's why you are seeing banks promoting it: they are hoping it will be a differentiator that brings in new customers that want to use their iPhone.

And while it's being branded Pay, it's really the first implementation of an EMV tokenization standard that was published earlier this year.

 

[bkaus]

As a small business, here is what I have learned:

1. I have to upgrade my terminal to accept chip cards by next year. Cost of new chip card terminal is about $300.

2. If I want a terminal that accepts nfc, I need to pay about $950 for a new terminal.

3. My processor charges a higher monthly fee for NFC compatible service. About $100 more per month.

That's on top of standard charge of 1-3% (depending on card type).

Right now, there is no plan to lower the 1-3% charge due to lower fraud.

So, as a small business, with very little banking leverage, accepting NFC at this time would set me back $1200 per year and it won't increase my business.

What do I like about it?

- reduced liability as we don't have to touch cards at all.

- quick, but not really a big deal.

- no stack of receipts to file and maintain to prove signatures in case credit card company asks.


untill the processing fee comes down, I'll probably hold off on accepting NFC. But I will purchase a card reader compatible with it mid next year.

 

[jomo25]

As a small business, here is what I have learned:

1. I have to upgrade my terminal to accept chip cards by next year. Cost of new chip card terminal is about $300.

2. If I want a terminal that accepts nfc, I need to pay about $950 for a new terminal.

3. My processor charges a higher monthly fee for NFC compatible service. About $100 more per month.

That's on top of standard charge of 1-3% (depending on card type).

Right now, there is no plan to lower the 1-3% charge due to lower fraud.

So, as a small business, with very little banking leverage, accepting NFC at this time would set me back $1200 per year and it won't increase my business.

What do I like about it?

- reduced liability as we don't have to touch cards at all.

- quick, but not really a big deal.

- no stack of receipts to file and maintain to prove signatures in case credit card company asks.


untill the processing fee comes down, I'll probably hold off on accepting NFC. But I will purchase a card reader compatible with it mid next year.

Great info. Helps provide some reason why smaller/independent retailers may not hop on board immediately.

 

[DotCom2]

As a small business, here is what I have learned:

1. I have to upgrade my terminal to accept chip cards by next year. Cost of new chip card terminal is about $300.

2. If I want a terminal that accepts nfc, I need to pay about $950 for a new terminal.

3. My processor charges a higher monthly fee for NFC compatible service. About $100 more per month.

That's on top of standard charge of 1-3% (depending on card type).

Right now, there is no plan to lower the 1-3% charge due to lower fraud.

So, as a small business, with very little banking leverage, accepting NFC at this time would set me back $1200 per year and it won't increase my business.

What do I like about it?

- reduced liability as we don't have to touch cards at all.

- quick, but not really a big deal.

- no stack of receipts to file and maintain to prove signatures in case credit card company asks.


untill the processing fee comes down, I'll probably hold off on accepting NFC. But I will purchase a card reader compatible with it mid next year.

Are you sure you need a new terminal though?
Don't you just need a new credit card terminal and your credit card transaction processor to support it?