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Many Retailers Hesitant About Offering Support for Apple Pay
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Many of us who appreciate good service. I patronize a mom and pop shop anytime it is feasible.
It has been documented that the .15% fees that Apple collects come from the banks (visa, MasterCard, etc) and not from the stores. The banks see apple pay as a more secure payment system that will lower their risk and liability vs a normal swipe, so the money saved on this is well worth it to them.
Yeah locking down NFC is not an innovation.
Apple does not innovate they iterate. I can not name a single thing they did all on there own. That is ok as they are not display maker or battery maker etc. I find there product curation to be top notch.
Google Wallet uses a virtual number that effectively acts as a token for the real numbers that are registered. The real numbers cannot be seen.
As for TouchID, it's optional even with Apple Pay. (A PIN can be used in place.) The banks don't care which one is used, which is why older iPhones without TouchID can still use Apple Pay. TouchID is mostly about making it easier to make purchases.
You see, in order to make more money, the banks want customers to feel that purchases are safe and perhaps more importantly... convenient. The amount spent via convenience overrides security issues. That's why, for example, that they don't require any authentication below a certain amount even with fraud-prone mag-stripe cards.
That's a good point. Banks love Apple Pay because they stay in the catbird seat, and can continue to collect and sell our collective purchase history, as they've been doing for years.
Well, besides the fact that it's no doubt easier to start with coordinating with local country bank organizations...
If it's true (and we really don't know if it is or not) that US banks are paying a 0.15% cut to Apple, then that's going to be a blocking point in many other countries. Especially in Europe, where the bank transaction fees are much tighter than in the US... so such a high cut would not be a viable option.
Apple Pay only works on iPhones, so it's not going to gain a foothold over anything else.
PS. Folks, it's "Apple Pay", not
Pay. Would you guys please stop using ""? It makes it hard to read your posts, and your Pay points will be lost. Forum posts are not texts! Thanks! I'm not sure about the nomenclature...
I know I need a new credit card terminal (the device that sits on our desk). At this time, with my processor, to use the only NFC terminal they offer they charge a greater monthly fee to process the transactions. This is the case even if I don't use the NFC feature. I *think* they are trying to bundle in more services (digital signature capture, recurring payments), but still trying to get to the bottom of it.
It *feels* like a money grab opportunity to up-sell from my current processing company. Why? Because they only have one terminal that supports NFC and it comes with lots of other bundled services. I'm hoping things will come more inline next year if this takes off and NFC becomes more prevalent. For starters, they should be offering more machines that read NFC.
I have shopped around for other processing companies, but the fees were higher than my current processing company based on our volumes.
A few other items -
- I did the majority of the research on NFC prior to Apple Pay. Primarily due to the Oct 2015 deadline. At that time I was thinking I'll just get the chip card reading machine and be done with it so I don't have to worry about next year.
- After the Apple announcement, I called them back and they confirmed Apple Pay would be the same as my earlier NFC research. With NFC only available at a higher monthly price through them.
- With the updated info, I'll just hold off until closer to the Oct 2015 deadline and hope something changes. I'm guessing there will be more inexpensive Swipe/Chip/NFC desktop terminals at different price points. Its funny that with the 2015 deadline, there are still lots of swipe only card readers that are available and being promoted.
The industry runs slow... I'm sure because us retailers don't like spending money upgrading. We also don't want to get burned buying something that will need to be replaced in a year or two if we can avoid it...
Right now, I'll spend my $$ on a iPhone 6 and wait on the Apple Pay support for our business for 6 months.
Good info.
Yeah, I think you're right on the money grab opportunity. We are going to wait as well closer to Oct. 2015 to see what comes of all this.
We use WorldPay as our CC processor and they are quite reasonable.
Don't know what, if any, upcharges are for using NFC with them are though.
I guess small joints are all in the same boat.
I read the entire list of posts, and nobody is suggesting that every single merchant is going to run out and get an NFC POS just because Apple is now using Apple pay. Everyone understands that widespread NFC availability will take some time. You are splitting hairs.
I agree with the other posters when they say that this is the prime time for Apple to make this move. With NFC technology about to become more commonplace, and Apple providing the most secure method of payment with great ease of use, I think this is the tipping point.
I agree with the other posters when they say that this is the prime time for Apple to make this move. With NFC technology about to become more commonplace, and Apple providing the most secure method of payment with great ease of use, I think this is the tipping point.
That makes sense.
As a frequent credit card user, I like the idea of Apple Pay primarily because of increased security. For most transactions, the time saved won't make much of a difference.
But I don't have an iPhone 6, and may not upgrade until next year. And my wife, who makes the majority of our purchases, probably won't have a compatible iPhone until later than that. So it's going to take time for this to get traction. When it does, however, more large retailers and maybe smaller businesses will jump on.
Because like he said people with android phones have been ABLE to make nfc payments for years. The reality is of course they are not, not in the US and not anywhere else.
Nfc usage for payments will become ubiquitous soon.
Yes - I had my card info mis-used in the Target breach and again in the Home Depot breach. So I like the tokenized security model! Our business has drivers licenses on file, so not as concerned there (for now). I'll spend my 2014 biz tech budget on me
I purchased a brand-new iPad just prior to going on a business trip to Taiwan. Use my American Express card. While in Taiwan, in the hotel, I dropped my iPad on the marble floor. Shattered the screen. I could still use it but there were shards of glass falling from the screen. LOL Slapped a screen protector on the top and used it until I got back to the states.
Called American Express when I got back, and they reimbursed me for the entire replacement cost of the iPad.
Since then, I only use American Express for my major purchases.
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....said no merchant ever.
Called American Express when I got back, and they reimbursed me for the entire replacement cost of the iPad.
Since then, I only use American Express for my major purchases.
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....said no merchant ever.
So I am enjoying all this and people who post links about more info, thank you. Now I have a question and please go easy as I am still learning about this whole NFC stuff. Android fanboys rave about this and they had it for a few years now, so what's the big deal about NFC if now one is using it much yet? I see very little stores in my area using this way of payment. So is there another use for NFC besides paying for stuff?
Yes you can program nfc tags to do certain things when scanned. For example when I get home I scan the tag by my door, and it turns my phones wifi on and sends a magic packet to my desktop to turn on.
Apples nfc implementation is locked down though i believe and can only be used for apple pay.
Clarifications:
It isn't a new law. It's a new policy by the card issuers to shift liability for fraud to merchants if they don't accept EMV cards. The deadline is 10/15 for most.
however, NFC support is an option, not a requirement.
Google Wallet uses a virtual number that effectively acts as a token for the real numbers that are registered. The real numbers cannot be seen.
PS. Folks, it's "Apple Pay", not
THIS. Stop it with the dumb apple logo. It's APPLE PAY.
When was the last time you bought gasoline at a station that only took cash? When was the last time you shopped at a department store that only took cash? Over time, cash has faded and plastic has taken its place. Would you even shop at a place that only took cash today? That will be what happens with Apple Pay for me.
In terms of technological adoption and cultural change "the next few years" is actually soon.
If they have what I want at the right price, I'll get cash and go there.
There's a restaurant/bar around here that has some of the cheapest burgers and drinks you'll ever find. Cash only. I go there all the time, it's not that big of a deal to stop at an ATM on the way.
I prefer plastic, and rarely carry cash on me, but I'm not going to boycott a place because they don't take my preferred payment method.
To us older people, a few years' difference is really not very far
Aso, an advantage to the delay, is that now most chip terminals also come with NFC support built in, or at least, cheaper than a few years ago.
So when the EMV switchover is done in the US, it's more likely that NFC will be widely supported than some other countries.
Interestingly, Australia kept missing its changeover deadlines for years. The US is still meeting its deadlines. They are just later deadlines.
That's because it's not a contest. It's a staggered rollout controlled by the banks and CC schemes.
In a similar way, Apple Pay is being staged outward from the US. It doesn't mean other countries "are far behind".
1. Most major US carriers blocked Google Wallet from using the Secure Element on their phones, as they were trying to promote their own wallet.
2. Some major retailers are trying to promote their own payments system (MCX).
3. It's not 2015. Many stores have yet to pay for new terminals. And those who have, often have not turned them on yet.
I suspect that people will likewise have to get used to Apple Pay only working at certain stores for a while.
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I also think, just as with Google Wallet, that it won't be that big a deal either way. Sure, it'll be convenient if you're in a rush or if only your hand with a phone is free, but it's not going to stop anyone from still using their physical credit cards.
e.g. Who's going to say, "Oh gosh honey, I couldn't buy you an engagement ring because the jewelry store doesn't take NFC payments."
Well that's dumb on the restaurant's part because if you were a thief, that is the place you would pick to rob being that it's all CASH!
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You always have to most informative posts.To us older people, a few years' difference is really not very far
Aso, an advantage to the delay, is that now most chip terminals also come with NFC support built in, or at least, cheaper than a few years ago.
So when the EMV switchover is done in the US, it's more likely that NFC will be widely supported than some other countries.
Interestingly, Australia kept missing its changeover deadlines for years. The US is still meeting its deadlines. They are just later deadlines.
That's because it's not a contest. It's a staggered rollout controlled by the banks and CC schemes.
In a similar way, Apple Pay is being staged outward from the US. It doesn't mean other countries "are far behind".
1. Most major US carriers blocked Google Wallet from using the Secure Element on their phones, as they were trying to promote their own wallet.
2. Some major retailers are trying to promote their own payments system (MCX).
3. It's not 2015. Many stores have yet to pay for new terminals. And those who have, often have not turned them on yet.
I suspect that people will likewise have to get used to Apple Pay only working at certain stores for a while.
--
I also think, just as with Google Wallet, that it won't be that big a deal either way. Sure, it'll be convenient if you're in a rush or if only your hand with a phone is free, but it's not going to stop anyone from still using their physical credit cards.
e.g. Who's going to say, "Oh gosh honey, I couldn't buy you an engagement ring because the jewelry store doesn't take NFC payments."
Please keep posting them.
They do not, and never did. This is a total myth. They used to invest in Chipotle, never having a hand in its business practices, but they completely parted ways many years ago.
No,
pay is implementing an EMV tokenizatiin standard. It just happens to be one of the first, if not the first.