It's one thing for people to people to be critical of Apple's handling of their current product line. But in this thread people are critical because they believe Apple would screw up a company that's on a roll. That seems more telling.
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McLaren Confirms Talks With Apple, But They 'Never Matured to Definitive Proposition'
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The Pixel is to some degree a the-grass-is-always-greener-on-the-other-side thing. Additionally it is a pure Google phone, ie, offers pure Google Android including timely OS updates which makes it stand out from other Android phones. Of course all the iPhone killers didn't affect the success of the iPhone much and the marketing power of Samsung (and cheaper prices on many models) so far have limited the success of pure Google phones to a small niche.
Maybe MS will. The open source community is too fragmented in their ideas for a unifying UI. It's tech-user friendly but not end-user.
Apple could use Dell's attention to detail right now.
It's so bad that even giving it away for free wasn't working so they had to sneak it and force it onto machines behind the users back.
All the forced mobile apps, the built in adware and malware, worst of all is the spyware, it's a POS.
As a former Detroit area resident, I never understood why a NON-automotive company would want to get into the car-building business. After all, Chrysler is owned by an Italian company. GM is no longer the 800pd gorilla. I am glad that this fantasy that Apple had of becoming an auto giant is almost over.
Apple building a car is just a stupid idea. They need to put more attention to the Mac and forget about all the stupid things they're wasting the money with.
Whose fantasy was it, exactly? Are you sure it was Apple's, and not just a wet dream of the rumor media?
Man, reading the comments here can literally give a person cancer.
It's clear that many of the posters here are simply not equipped with the right background knowledge and objectivity to properly discuss such as issue. As such, I am proposing that everyone read this article first. It analyses Apple's recent moves and puts them in the proper light.
https://www.aboveavalon.com/notes/2016/11/17/skating-to-the-apple-car-puck
What do you all think? Or are you all content to just continue mindlessly bashing Apple for no rhyme and reason?
It's clear that many of the posters here are simply not equipped with the right background knowledge and objectivity to properly discuss such as issue. As such, I am proposing that everyone read this article first. It analyses Apple's recent moves and puts them in the proper light.
https://www.aboveavalon.com/notes/2016/11/17/skating-to-the-apple-car-puck
Only with such perspective do I think any subsequent debate will be more informed and meaningful.
What do you all think? Or are you all content to just continue mindlessly bashing Apple for no rhyme and reason?
They put there name along with Tag Heuer onto high end home audio equipment, don't think they make them anymore though.
Putting aside your bizarre comparison of the Apple and market conditions of thirty years ago with today's market and Apple, your fictional account of Apple's growth and profits during Job's absence is demonstrably wrong, which should give you pause when commenting on the current state/trends of Apple.
John Sculley took over from Jobs in 1985 and Jobs returned in 1996. You claim that there was a period of huge growth and profit, followed by a slow excruciating decline in growth and profit. The truth is that rather than a "slow, excruciating decline" in growth it continued at a steady pace in Jobs absence, other than two record growth years in 94 and 95.
You're also wrong when it comes to profits "slow, excruciating decline." In reality, they jumped up and then had steady growth. Indeed, it was two years of PRECIPITOUS decline, i.e., LOSSES in 96 and 97 that led to Jobs coming back as CEO.
Financial period Net sales (Mil USD) Net profits (Mil USD) Revenue growth
FY 1985 1,918 61 27%
FY 1986 1,902 154 -1%
FY 1987 2,661 218 40%
FY 1988 4,071 400 53%
FY 1989 5,284 454 30%
FY 1990 5,558 475 5%
FY 1991 6,309 310 12%
FY 1992 7,087 530 12%
FY 1993 7,977 87 13%
FY 1994 9,189 310 46%
FY 1995 11,062 424 20%
FY 1996 9,833 -816 -11%
FY 1997 7,081 -1,045 -28%
FY 1998 5,941 309 -16%
FY 1999 6,134 601 3%
FY 2000 7,983 786 30%
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Did you just wake up from a dream? When did Apple ever say what it's automotive plans were?? Oh, sorry, I forgot you read it on the internet.
I think this guy is noodling around without any real knowledge and trying to sound insightful and deep at the same time. He falls off that wire when he starts with the preposterous statement:"It is conceivable that Apple had begun to contemplate new product categories after Apple Watch."
It's conceivable? Really? Is it conceivable that Apple doesn't contemplate new product categories every minute of every day of every year? No, it is not. Kind of goes downhill from there, which is a trick, considering it was never uphill to start. In the end he just illustrates the problem with speculating about an Apple project that nobody outside of the company knows a single, real fact about.
BTW, everybody tries to "skate to the puck." It's a cliche to say it, and very hard to do, or everyone would.
You bring up some good points, but there growth has come from new markets, and how much have Andriod devices grown in China? The answer is the majority.
I agree that Apple is in a strong financial position with there efforts in China being extremely fruitful, but if you look at the entire Chinese market, new players are dominating. The reality is if Apple dominated China, there sales would be wildly more.
Anyways, I don't look at where they have been, but where they are going. Apple's products have never been weaker. Sure, what idiot couldn't be successful taking the product lines Steve left to new markets. I think a chimp or a gold fish could have been CEO and let the Apple engineers make those products incrementally better. But let's be honest, without leadership and strong focus, competitors have caught up and are exceeding Apple at there own game now. As for smart watches, I'm glad those figures don't include wearable like Fitbit, that Apple doesn't consider as a competitor in the statistics you cite. Funny, thing though, I skipped the Apple watch and got a fitbit
Anyways, citing that they got more money doesn't mean anything about long term potential. Personally, I don't want a new macbook pro, I don't want millions of dongles, I don't want an Iphone 7, and I don't want an Apple Watch. Personally, I hope Captain Dongle head days are numbered so we can get some outstanding products again.
You bring up some good points, but there growth has come from new markets, and how much have Andriod devices grown in China? The answer is the majority.
I agree that Apple is in a strong financial position with there efforts in China being extremely fruitful, but if you look at the entire Chinese market, new players are dominating. The reality is if Apple dominated China, there sales would be wildly more.
Anyways, I don't look at where they have been, but where they are going. Apple's products have never been weaker. Sure, what idiot couldn't be successful taking the product lines Steve left to new markets. I think a chimp or a gold fish could have been CEO and let the Apple engineers make those products incrementally better. But let's be honest, without leadership and strong focus, competitors have caught up and are exceeding Apple at there own game now. As for smart watches, I'm glad those figures don't include wearable like Fitbit, that Apple doesn't consider as a competitor in the statistics you cite. Funny, thing though, I skipped the Apple watch and got a fitbit
Anyways, citing that they got more money doesn't mean anything about long term potential. Personally, I don't want a new macbook pro, I don't want millions of dongles, I don't want an Iphone 7, and I don't want an Apple Watch. Personally, I hope Captain Dongle head days are numbered so we can get some outstanding products again.
I'm not sure there is much more to say to someone who says "Apple's products have never been weaker," when Apple just reached an all time high in percentage of the entire industry's profits. When they are the only cell company making any profit, yet you say their competitors have caught up with them and are beating them. When no competitor's flag ship phone is on the same planet when it comes to sales. When almost a quarter of a billion people are going to buy their latest phone in just the next 12 months. No point in going further. Good night.
Look, Jobs is gone, and without him Apple will flounder and sink as it did in the past. Without Jobs, Apple is blind.
Anyway, I reiterate: It's clear that you weren't around to witness what happened first hand, and don't understand what these numbers are telling you. And because it's pointless to argue with the ignorant, I won't try. I'll just point you to the Wikipedia page describing Apple's history post-Jobs and hope that you glean some insight from it.
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Seems to me he's speaking from the perspective of someone who actually does stuff with his computer — in that regard, he sees Apple's products as having never been weaker — whereas you're looking at Apple's success selling toys to consumers who don't do anything but take selfies and text emojis. They've done amazingly well at that, but their sales are in decline. So good luck with that.
johnnyturbouk
macrumors 68000
Sounds very much on like how the iphone 10 will cost in 2020 at it's current appreciation, whilst still offering base 16GB option.
Yes I can imagine Ive and his fat shaming ways gleefully introducing the Apple Maclaren, by slimming down the chassis by 5mm, they have reduced the power by 90%, as it's now driven by a 1970 1000CC skoda engine.
Absolutely, albeit Mclaren is actually worth the cash, unlike beats.
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Always have been curious as to how this rumor came about. Nice to see some more details on it. Speaking of, I didn't know that @OllyW was a McLaren insider. When can I schedule my test drive, and is there a MacRumors discount?
Wonder if they would offer an annual upgrade programme for the McLaren F1s?
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We all noticed you sidestepped the chart that showed you were caught trolling about the "excruciating slow decline in profits and growth" after Steve Jobs left. Way to double down by stating that without Steve Jobs Apple will sink. I miss him at the helm, but you seem to think he was grossly incompetent as everyone who is currently leading Apple was handpicked by him. I see your point though about Apple floundering--All his team has done is to grow Apple's sales, revenue and market share to unimaginable levels over the past five years since he was gone. Maybe you can be more precise about when your prediction of Apple sinking will come to pass?
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johnnyturbouk
macrumors 68000
SMH. Are you at all embarrassed by putting your complete ignorance on display for all to see? You do realize that (a) Apple was the first one of the two to start giving away their OS for free; (b) Microsoft charges for Windows 10 now [and is, newsflash, making money], while Apple gives theirs away for free; and (c) Microsoft sells all of their PC's without any junkware or 3rd party trialware. Either your knowledge is a POS or you're functioning as a useless troll. Kinda interested to know which one...
An oft-heard sentiment around here. That's precisely the predicament for many. Judging from the comments on sites like MR, I believe I speak for more than a few when I say "We all love our Macs, and still choose them time and again over Windows machines, but we're not pleased about the direction Apple seems to be heading in, as well as many of their design choices of late".
Main storage such as SSDs should not be an integral part of the motherboard for obvious reasons, to name just one item. And a $3000+ laptop should be repairable at reasonable cost, once it's out of AppleCare. Most of my Apple desktops and laptops (so far) have had useful life beyond 5-6 years.
In my opinion Jony's design emphasis has shifted too far towards strikingly beautiful creations at the expense of usability and repairability. Tim doesn't have the cajones to rein him in, needlessly worried he'll leave. The truth is, Jony loves his job at Apple and the prestige that comes with it, and has more design freedom there than he knows he'll get anywhere else. I doubt he's ready to walk away from Apple if his designs are questioned or sent back to the drawing board, as Steve reportedly did more than once.
Not ready to give up on Apple by a long shot, but definitely concerned about the future.
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I think I'm going to skip getting trapped in an infinite loop arguing with you and your straw men. Read up on Apple history if you want to know why that chart doesn't say what you think it says, and remember that “those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”
Past results is also a very poor indicator of future performance, if we want to go about recycling tired old tropes.
The Post-Jobs Apple of today is very different from the Apple back then. If anything, Steve made sure to install a design-led culture when he returned to Apple, precisely to prepare Apple for the inevitable day when he would no longer be at the helm. A culture that is still very much alive and thriving at Apple today.
That's the distinction, and that's what makes all the difference. The Apple of today is more than equipped to handle the absence of Steve Jobs. The Apple of the past wasn't. Apple is more than just one man. Yes, Steve Job's contributions to Apple cannot be understated, but he wasn't the sole reason for Apple's success either.
Apple is poised to make great inroads into exciting new markets such as health, self-driving technology, media and entertainment and wearables, and all people can whine about is that their Macs don't support 32gb of ram? I am inclined to believe more and more that people are the problem, more specifically, the very die-hard Apple fans which made Apple successful in the first place. Apple is clearly changing in keeping with the times, but the issue is that these people haven't changed. The mentality of these people appear stuck in the era 10 years ago. They seem to think that Apple exists solely to sell laptops and desktops and nothing else.
Apple has clearly moved on. Maybe it's time all of you did too.