Microsoft Announces Surface 2 and Surface Pro 2

[Dr McKay]

Yes, Microsoft tried a "tablet PC" first. But so what? The "pen computing" concept never caught on. Unlike the iPad, it didn't have anything like a capacitive touch interface. At best, you got a simple resistive touch-screen that couldn't do multi-touch at all. And you did it all on top of an older version of Windows that used the pen just like a mouse unless you ran specific apps that used some bolted on software to let you draw with it.

I think the industry accepts that the iPad was a truly new way to approach the whole idea, and one that made it commercially viable.

What was your point? You said Microsoft copied Apple? Apple took an existing product and made improvements. Microsoft have been making Windows more touch friendly with each release. Apple didn't invent the capacitive touchscreen or multi touch.

You said Microsoft copied Apple, but "Shoe-horned" a desktop OS onto it? So what aspect of what Apple did, did Microsoft copy?

 

[moxin]

wow, who wants viruses and desktop apps on their hybrid device.
while they have everything in iPad too.
M$ is producing JUNK!

 

[ZackaryVS]

Balmer logic: If you fail miserably at something, double down.

WHY did they keep the arm model? It splits their OS, office suite, app stores + developers, etc.

Isn't that what Apple did with the iPad? Use ARM CPUs and split their OS, office suite, app stores + developers, etc.

 

[Colino]

Microsoft Announces Surface 2 and Surface Pro 2

Another failure

Indeed.

And to anyone who will reply to this topic: be reminded of our community's line of conduct which is to effectively discredit all competitors products.

 

[Renzatic]

And to anyone who will reply to this topic: be reminded of our community's line of conduct which is to effectively discredit all competitors products.

All I do around here is talk about how everything sucks while trying to get everyone to notice how I'm reading Catcher in the Rye so they'll know how smart and edgy I am.

 

[yakapo]

I think I'm going to sell my ipad mini and my macbook air and buy the Asus t100. Well, obviously I want to try it out first. So far it's received glowing reviews.

 

[rowspaxe]

The surface pro is a great device that was marketed very poorly. Microsoft should have marketed it to students and design professionals--The surface plus oneNote provides the ultimate student support. The wacom pen interface is blows away any stylus implementation on the ipad. Unfortunately--its likely this technology will not catch on until apple repackages it as the ipad pro.

 

[IconicM]

Can't wait for this to fail so that MS finally caves in and returns on their promise to make office for iPad. just sayin

 

[steve119]

with microsoft h/w has always been reliable. its the lack of s/w that makes surface 2 less appealing. however surface pro is the best there is. i have 1.0 an i love it. my ipad is gathering dust....

I nearly choked on my coffee, please tell me you are being sarcastic?

The xbox360's kept dying of the red ring of death.

Yeah reliability is microsofts strong point.

 

[MacFetish]

I hope this time round the Surface is more successful. It's an innovative bit of kit, beautifully designed and well executed. Price must be the key factor. Microsoft aren't trying to ape Apple at every turn, they're trying to move things forward. They should be commended for that.

 

[Gudi]

"Another failure"? Surface Pro 2 IS a Windows 8 PC. You can run anything you want.

PC Sales Slump Continues
On Thursday, IDC revised its 2013 projections, downgrading an expected 7.8% slide to 9.7%.

The biggest issue with Surface Pro was battery life, and if they have sufficiently resolved it, this might just be what I buy to replace my iPad 3 (which is now experiencing Home button failures).

I want to run ARM-based apps on a computer that is way lighter than an iPad 3 and has no fan. Can you do it with Surface Pro? No! So it can't run anything I want. Maybe everything you wanted was another PC form factor. But Tablet-PCs failed a long time ago.

 

[Renzatic]

I want to run ARM-based apps on a computer that is way lighter than an iPad 3 and has no fan. Can you do it with Surface Pro? No! So it can't run anything I want. Maybe everything you wanted was another PC form factor. But Tablet-PCs failed a long time ago.

Buy a Bay Trail tablet and stick in Metro if that's what you want.

 

[FoxMcCloud]

They don't seem to have analysed the reason it failed in the first place. It still has all the things that made it a failure but with an upgraded spec. I find it hard to understand what the people at M$ are hoping to achieve with this. If it had been a substantially new device that addressed issues that had been raised with the original and took the the whole surface project in a new direction then great, but this is more of the same with bells on.

The reason why the first one didn't do so well was because it wasn't marketed, you couldn't buy them anywhere but the online store for nearly three quarters of a year and then all the reviews had a hate-hard-on for the "poor" screen even though it was perfectly fine.

I'd like RT. It gets away from legacy. It's about the new universal Store apps. The desktop is only there for Office. They should rename Desktop to Office Zone and only have it specifically for that. Have nothing else run there.

The metro section is very capable and is very good now with 8.1

People used to whine on about not being able to run photoshop or Xcode on their iPads. They got over it. People should get over whatever they hold over RT.

 

[disinfectant]

They should have lowered the price on the devices and covers and just ditched the RT model.

 

[fullauto]

Round 2 of more heartache for M$. I guess 'keep pushing' worked for Nokia, Blackberry, Kodak, Dell.. So why not?

 

[Bernard SG]

People used to whine on about not being able to run photoshop or Xcode on their iPads. They got over it. People should get over whatever they hold over RT.

Photoshop and Xcode users are not the mainstream. iPad is designed mainly for a mainstream consumer market and it seduced that population from the get-go.

One of the main problems with the Surface, RT and PRO, is that Microsoft designed a product that would "good enough" for all kinds of user-segments and purposes but not "great" at any single thing. On top of that, Surface suffers from UI schizophrenia, between the touch-screen and the keyboard+trackpad.

Bottom-line is that potential buyers end up preferring an ultrabook or a MBAir than a Surface PRO and an iPad rather than a Surface RT.

The Surface is a zombie product.

 

[Gudi]

contrary to popular belief, windows 8 runs great and having a full computer power in place when you normally compromise to an ipad level computing is great

Its not. The only reason to buy an iPad is because it is not a full-fledged computer with filesystem, multitasking and task management. You never 'Save a file' on an iPad. Thats what makes a tablet great. In and out of an app without ever thinking about anything computing related. Just use it and forget it. Any cognitive overhead and your not a contender in the tablet market.

This other market for full-fledged mobile computing without compromise is known as laptops. These devices are well understood and no one needed the Surface Pro to reinvent the ultrabook. A full-fledged computer running all the programs of the past needs a great mouse and a great keyboard. The Surface Pro has neither and is not a good laptop replacement either.

 

[Xiroteus]

wow, who wants viruses and desktop apps on their hybrid device.
while they have everything in iPad too.
M$ is producing JUNK!

Surface Pro 2? I know I would prefer wacom, flash, and desktop programs. Viruses are not an issue for most people.

Bottom-line is that potential buyers end up preferring an ultrabook or a MBAir than a Surface PRO and an iPad rather than a Surface RT.

The Surface is a zombie product.

iPad makes more sense than the Surface RT while the Surface Pro wins out over the Macbook Air.

 

[Steve121178]

wow, who wants viruses and desktop apps on their hybrid device.
while they have everything in iPad too.
M$ is producing JUNK!

Having desktop apps on a hybrid device is what sets devices like Surface apart from the rest.

Having full desktop Office 2013 beats any gimped mobile/web-based version.

 

[Piggie]

wow, who wants viruses and desktop apps on their hybrid device.
while they have everything in iPad too.
M$ is producing JUNK!

Well probably some will as most tablet apps are pretty pale and featureless editions of desktop versions and to get anything serious done you need to junk the tablet and get back to your desk.
So for some it's nice to be able to do real work and real productivity on their tablet also if they wish.

 

[everything-i]

The reason why the first one didn't do so well was because it wasn't marketed, you couldn't buy them anywhere but the online store for nearly three quarters of a year and then all the reviews had a hate-hard-on for the "poor" screen even though it was perfectly fine.

I'd like RT. It gets away from legacy. It's about the new universal Store apps. The desktop is only there for Office. They should rename Desktop to Office Zone and only have it specifically for that. Have nothing else run there.

The metro section is very capable and is very good now with 8.1

People used to whine on about not being able to run photoshop or Xcode on their iPads. They got over it. People should get over whatever they hold over RT.

While it is true that the Microsoft marketing was unbelievably bad for this device I think MS has no clue how to design devices like this. Is it a tablet or an ultra portable? There are now much better devices available cheaper which do a better job of being an ultra portable touch device. Microsoft have missed the boat with pure tablets, the competition is way ahead of them in the ultra portable space too that the pro is aimed at. They needed something radical and innovative to get peoples attention, something unique which they have so far failed to deliver.

 

[Nightarchaon]

The Surface Pro 2, with the Battery cover, is what i wish the Macbook Air was. I know apple doesn't want the air and iPad to compete with each other, but im seriously considering ditching my Macbook Pro for a Hackintosh Surface 2

 

[Gudi]

Buy a Bay Trail tablet and stick in Metro if that's what you want.

Bay Trail Intels x86-64 SoC is at least a way to achieve tablet-like form factors in a Windows PC. You can't have heat and a fan blowing out hot air in a device you hold in your hand all the time. Bay Trail would allow to build a device with the form factor of the Surface RT and the general capabilities of the Surface Pro. Ending this weird split in Microsofts tablet strategy.

All the people who claim to be interested in Surfaces say they want the Pro not the RT, because of all the INTEL apps and not enough ARM apps. So Microsoft should at least replace the Tegra 4 ARM chip in the Surface 2 with a Bay Trail chip. If not kill the Surface Pro 2 and make only real tablets.

 

[TimCook]

Stop with the free hard drive space myth, that just annoys the heck out of me when I see it perpetuated. Take away Office and the recovery partition, and also give the 16gb ipad it's true free space which I believe is something like 14.25gb or something like that. Surface 32gb starts with 15gb free space, on my Atom tablet the recovery is about 10gb, and the Office 2013 install is about 3gb. 15gb free space + 10gb recovery partition + 3gb Office install is 28gb if you clear all that stuff out. Put Office 2013 back in and you are still at 25gb, that's pretty reasonable IMO. Plus my tablet has a microSD slot so I can add 64gb for about $50. Apple will NEVER put a memory card slot in their devices as they make too much money charging for memory upgrades.

Oh nice, that's cool to hear. Thanks for the info - I actually have a mate who bought the surface when it was super cheap lol, and I'm sure he'd love some more storage

You don't happen to know an equivalent thing for windows do ya?

 

[Gudi]

Off the top of my head? Taking photos out in the field with your high end DSLR camera, and editing the RAW files directly off the SD card through Lightroom while sitting in your car.

If editing RAW files is what people use their Surface Pro for, expect the Surface Pro 2 to sell way less than the Surface Pro 1.

Camera shipments continue to fall
The Japanese imaging manufacturers association, CIPA, has just released its global production and shipments report for the first half of the year, and there's not a lot of good news in it. Between January and June 2013 Japanese manufacturers shipped just short of 30 million digital cameras - that's a 43% drop in a single year.

You wanna know why people have stopped buying digital cameras? iPad and iPhone. I am taking all my photos with an iPad 3. The big screen is gorgeous. Consider the old way of making photos dead. Watching with one eye closed through a lens on a reflexive mirror is archaic.

Play heavy games, do heavy photo/movie/music editing are examples.

Thats what Macs are for. With bootcamp and Windows 7 for non-ported Steam games.

But all MS's customers are under a dome that nothing can get in or get out! How will their installed base get their upgrades to the new Surface?

I don't know ... falling pink stars?