Microsoft Bashes Apple's iWork Software, New iPads

[winston1236]

Nothing says "better" than having to tell everyone your competition sucks.

 

[Cryptex]

Obviously, "better" is a personal assessment, right? I'm struggling to think of a product that Microsoft has really nailed - Xbox maybe (not a gamer, so don't know). I have the opportunity to use a Surface as part of what my team does at work, and I find it (to me) to be neither a good tablet experience nor a good laptop experience. And this isn't casual use. And doesn't Microsoft have the blame for their image? If it's truly unpopular, it's not because ickle Microsoft is being beaten up by playground bullies.

To summarize a point I was trying to get across (albeit poorly) in a previous post, Microsoft's business model is "ubiquity". People use it because it's there. People use it because that's what work provides. And it used to be true in a previous decade that because new technology often appeared first in the workplace, people wanted it at home. Now that paradigm has been turned on its head. I'm lucky enough to be part of a BYOD program where I can utilize my Mac, iPad, iPhone as my main productivity ecosystem. My Mac gives me an extremely sophisticated OS in Mavericks that lets me be productive in multiple ecosystems - Linux and even various versions of MS Windows, as needed. It lets me switch over to being productive in my hobbies like Photography with a variety of applications, some of which appear in one form or another on the iPad BUT are also designed for the iPad and the tablet experience. I love the industrial design too (obviously, that's a personal thing).

I actually like the new iWork for what I do and it is well on its way to having a good experience across multiple devices designed for those specific devices. While not everyone will like it, there's at least some thought put in to how things work across different devices.

So while Microsoft might not be getting a fair rap for what they are doing, reasons why might include the decisions that come out of Redmond. And the rant from their employee which is the subject of this thread is an example of that - someone decided that should be public. Instead of telling me why I shouldn't be using someone else's product, they should be telling me why I should be using theirs: Why is it so great? How is it going to change the way I do things? Tell me why they made the design decisions they made. Make the case to me.

Yes, yes, the I'm-a-Mac ads poked fun at Microsoft and the fragmentation that is life with a PC, but the tone was nothing like this in my opinion.

And I know there are some super smart people at Microsoft, including in their design and product engineering teams. Maybe their leadership team should let them speak for their products, I don't know.

Industrial design is certainly a matter of preference, but the raw capabilities of one product to the other are kind of unmistakable.

The original Surface Pro was a mistaken product for one reason alone. Battery life. In the end, it's the most important feature in a portable device and they didn't deliver on that. A great decision Apple made juxtaposing this is making the iPad 3 fatter to compensate for a bigger battery and not compromise on battery life to power the new Retina display. I actually wish the iPhone 5 had retained the depth of the iPhone 4/4S for a bigger battery.

Alas, the Surface Pro 2 is among us, and they claim to improve battery life to 10 hours, and beyond with that power keyboard accessory should you want more. I really think Microsoft nailed it with this product. I suppose all that's hindering it now is the price, but against the iPad, I think it's fairly priced considering all the more it can do.

 

[HenryDJP]

So, Apple can poke fun and make fun of Microsoft, but if Microsoft fights back, they're mean?

Get real. MS was not "poking fun", they were crapping on Apple's product suggesting that it's not fit for even toy computers. I just love the MS supporters on here. Keep it up guys. You're hilarious.

 

[nefan65]

Nothing says "better" than having to tell everyone your competition sucks.

Yes! Don't tell me/us WHY your product is so good, and show off it's features.

"Wow, MS just said Apple sucks!? I guess their right...I'll just go buy a Surface..."

WTF?

 

[Amazing Iceman]

not the 2.

wanna bet how long before the price drops on this one?

The 2 has already killed the salability of the 1.

And the 2 is already doomed anyways.

I walked by a Microsoft mall kiosk in Boca Raton on Tuesday evening, and it was empty, with about 6 guys just staring at people passing buy.

They saw me carrying my iPad and got mad.

When I got to the Apple Store, it was packed as usual, with people buying stuff (I guess many were not aware of the new product releases that same day...

 

[brianvictor7]

It would still be nice to use ipads for both entertainment and productivity.
And to be honest the MS Office is better than iWork.

I think Microsoft should find a way to get MS Office on the ipad, and improve user experience on this device.

MS Office is better than iWork at many things. I am still, however, waiting for Office to catch up with the refined, professional look that iWork lets me create when I want to take things that extra step visually.

 

[Aye]

There is a MS store in the mall by my office. I have never seen it busy. A lot of the times the only folks there are a gang of kids playing on the demo xbox and a couple of very bored staff.

That is why they are seething of jealousy. They act like they are the superior ones and the leader.

Stinking so bad in MS all throughout Ballmer's tenure ... From it's culture, the leadership, down to the marketing heads. I wish it is Nokia saving this company, not the other way around.

 

[trip1ex]

Depends. I like the Surface Pro for the simple fact it's the only tablet with a Wacom tablet quality digitizer on the screen. This is something no one else but Wacom themselves have done well. And Wacom's tablet starts at...what...$1799?

There are always exceptions to the rule.

 

[Meister]

The 2 has already killed the salability of the 1.

And the 2 is already doomed anyways.

I walked by a Microsoft mall kiosk in Boca Raton on Tuesday evening, and it was empty, with about 6 guys just staring at people passing buy.

They saw me carrying my iPad and got mad.

When I got to the Apple Store, it was packed as usual, with people buying stuff (I guess many were not aware of the new product releases that same day...

MS is still doing good in europe cuz mac is very expensive here.

 

[Martyimac]

MS Office is better than iWork at many things. I am still, however, waiting for Office to catch up with the refined, professional look that iWork lets me create when I want to take things that extra step visually.

Are you using the new pages/iWorks now? The ones just release as a free update for Mavericks users? I ask because I am seeing an initial surge of folks reporting that iWorks/pages/etc have been gutted and aren't even supporting applescript anymore?!

Are you seeing that?

 

[osofast240sx]

That was contradictory. You quoted that the Surface and Surface 2 are cheaper, then go on to criticise Microsoft for their over-priced software. What?! I'd hate to imagine what the world would be like if Microsoft didn't make significant profit off their globally-leading productivity software to bail out Apple in the 90s. And the grounds they did it? FOR THE COMPETITION. Apple simply wants to eliminate competition with patent wars and make profit off its servants with exclusivity.

Also your OS and iWork software has and never will be free. They sneak it in the premium you pay for your device.

Your just trolling now#

 

[Bill Killer]

And that's why Apple has put iWork (no "S" ) on iOS devices so you're wrong about that. Microsoft Office got big because yes, the world adopted Windows machines rapidly. Well mobile devices have not only taken off but Apple iOS devices are in the hands of millions and millions and they are being used in the business world so the tables have turned. Put your great product on a high-profile device and it will get success so just sit back eat your words.

The vast majority of people do not use mobile devices for content creation, merely consumption. You can't be expected to write a report on am iPad when you have Word available for every Mac and Windows computer.

 

[osofast240sx]

Industrial design is certainly a matter of preference, but the raw capabilities of one product to the other are kind of unmistakable.

The original Surface Pro was a mistaken product for one reason alone. Battery life. In the end, it's the most important feature in a portable device and they didn't deliver on that. A great decision Apple made juxtaposing this is making the iPad 3 fatter to compensate for a bigger battery and not compromise on battery life to power the new Retina display. I actually wish the iPhone 5 had retained the depth of the iPhone 4/4S for a bigger battery.

Alas, the Surface Pro 2 is among us, and they claim to improve battery life to 10 hours, and beyond with that power keyboard accessory should you want more. I really think Microsoft nailed it with this product. I suppose all that's hindering it now is the price, but against the iPad, I think it's fairly priced considering all the more it can do.

Lucky if you get 5 hours out of the surface pro 2

 

[brianvictor7]

Are you using the new pages/iWorks now? The ones just release as a free update for Mavericks users? I ask because I am seeing an initial surge of folks reporting that iWorks/pages/etc have been gutted and aren't even supporting applescript anymore?!

Are you seeing that?

I haven't had the opportunity to play with it since the updates Tues night. Too busy playing with the family to play with my own toys but it would be sad if they stripped features that I use. I'll have to check this weekend. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[nefan65]

Also your OS and iWork software has and never will be free. They sneak it in the premium you pay for your device.

Really? So the MBP that I bought in 2010, that came with SL and a copy of iWork for $20 snuck in the free copy of Mavericks and iWork '13 at an additional premium? What does that work out too...like $1.20?

 

[Tiger8]

I second that!
I have a lumia 900.
The phone hardware is quite beautiful but windows phone lacks even basic functions (vpn, blocking location services)
The "windows market place" is just an insult!!
MS is putting themselves out of business with three OSs.
What r these people smoking??

I am sure there are smart people at Microsoft, but I think big people in black suits and with big marketing degrees are desperate for the Windows 8 brand (and the surface brand) to be a 'success'; so this way if 2 or 1 of the Windows is a hit, they can say 'Windows 8 is a success', same strategy with Surface.

 

[brianvictor7]

Lucky if you get 5 hours out of the surface pro 2

Thanks for the chart! Useful!

 

[HenryDJP]

I think Microsoft should find a way to get MS Office on the ipad, and improve user experience on this device.

That would be great but I don't think they will do that. MS has too much pride to admit that they can't get wide adoption of their office suite in their mobile devices. They should just throw in the towel, they would make money if Office was on the iPad rather than trying to dump it on people in the Surface that isn't selling. You would think MS would be more about money but nope, their pride gets in the way. Here's MS's biggest issue, if they can't get mobile office or 365 off the ground in any decent time, Apple will have a wide adoption of iWork on Macs and iOS and it will be just too late if MS finally offered Office on iOS after much time has passed.

 

[i4m]

... but lets stop being SHEEP!!! I am not a sheep to apple, Microsoft, or Google. I am the BIG BAD WOLF! I will roam to any of their product pastures seeking and devouring what I want and casting out what I don't.

What you fail to understand is that just as you "roam" to any "product pastures" you want, some people may CHOOSE to stick with a particular brand or product because they Damn well LIKE IT or WANT TO. What do you know about what each person's reasons are?

All these animal and sheep analogies are being misused to try and bully people who have strong opinions for a company or product.

And not even sure where the "Big Bad Wolf" comes into this... To me that just smacks of a consumer who can't make his mind up.

 

[Meister]

The vast majority of people do not use mobile devices for content creation, merely consumption. You can't be expected to write a report on am iPad when you have Word available for every Mac and Windows computer.

I know many people who write reports and articels soley in ipad.
When the original ipad came out that was my first thought.
I bought it and immediably started using it for university work and reports.
Now i do almost everything on my ipad mini. With no eternal keyboard.
I work wherever i stand or have to wait for something and i carry it in my pocket.
Thats the future!!

 

[nefan65]

The vast majority of people do not use mobile devices for content creation, merely consumption. You can't be expected to write a report on am iPad when you have Word available for every Mac and Windows computer.

That's old school thinking. My son is heading to college next year, and he uses his iPad [as well as some of his classmates] daily, and that includes homework, reports, etc. all on the iPad. These will be the same ones that will graduate college and head into the workforce in a few years.

Closed minded thinking like yours is why some of these companies don't get it, and fail at what they do..."My way is the way EVERYONE works!".

 

[Cryptex]

Convergence is beneficial only when it makes sense. If Samsung tried to make a wristwatch that can do 4k video editing, the result would probably be unpleasant for watch-wearers and post-production video editors alike.

An iPhone CAN surf the web, but it's not the ideal web-surfing user experience. Apple's design ethic with their phone is to make it do communication-related things (calls, notifications, messaging) and clutch 'n' go media creation (still camera and video) tasks well with great ergonomics, UI and respectable battery life. The other things it does are just frosting on that cake.

Apple's idea on "convergence" is to make a consistent UI experience across several devices that communicate with one another intelligently. That means a user can pick the device that best suits his/her application for the task ahead. I'm sure Apple would love for all of their customers to have a desktop, a laptop, a tablet, and a phone so that the user can pick and choose which hardware is best in any given situation. The experience is the convergence--the way all of the devices work together as a system. This is considerably better for the consumer overall, and certainly is good for Apple, who can sell four high-tech devices to their customers instead of just one.

Trying to shoehorn all of the design goals of a laptop and tablet together, do it cost-effectively, while maintaining the computing power expectations of a laptop with the size, weight, and battery life expectations of a tablet is a tall order. Sales would suggest that Microsoft did not effectively achieve that goal.

Apple's UI is consistent, but it shouldn't be. As iPad apps demonstrate, a UI should change when there is more screen estate. In terms of iOS, it doesn't. It's just an expanded iPhone UI. Microsoft is the same with Windows and WP trying to be consistent with the tiles, but there is certainly acknowledgement in that system design for the varied screen sizes.

Anyway, do you honestly prefer having 4 different devices? Not only is that more expensive, but if there is a plausible option to remove the need for at least one of those devices, isn't that worth it? Do you still want that point and shoot camera when you have a good lens on your mobile phone? No...

And the Surface isn't just "plausible". It's actually good. If you think different, then the only way to achieve this perfect device joining the worlds of a tablet and boundless PC is to at least try a design and improve upon it. That's what Microsoft is doing.

I just see so much potential in having a single device that I can take with me to uni encompassing full-featured PC apps optimised for either touch or mouse/keyboard (whichever is more relevant), which also fulfils my entertainment needs and has all my stuff on. I don't see what else I'd want or need...

 

[r.harris1]

... the raw capabilities of one product to the other are kind of unmistakable...

True, but they're not always as important as we make them out to be . I find the important bits are how the whole picture comes together and how that whole picture helps me be productive (in the case of bits of computer equipment).

 

[Bill Killer]

I know many people who write reports and articels soley in ipad.
When the original ipad came out that was my first thought.
I bought it and immediably started using it for university work and reports.
Now i do almost everything on my ipad mini. With no eternal keyboard.
I work wherever i stand or have to wait for something and i carry it in my pocket.
Thats the future!!

Typing and formatting on an iPad is not optimal. My MacBook Air is a substantially more efficient method if just because a keyboard is always better for typing than a touchscreen. Always.

 

[itguy06]

I'm not sure what you're going on about, but exchange is awesome. Sounds like the typical Apple enthusiast bashing anything that isn't Apple to me.

Nope. Exchange is a horrible E-mail and groupware platform. Storing all your mail in a database is a horrible idea. Yes, it makes SIS (Single Instance Store) easy but archiving becomes harder, preserving data for legal audits becomes harder, restoring becomes harder. Corruption also becomes a huge issue as well. It took MS a long while to finally split up the database and start to fix it but it still doesn't scale well.

Despite a bad client, the other enterprise e-mail system, IBM Notes/Domino gets it right. One database for users, a common attachment store, reliability out of the box with free clustering/replication, etc.

Yeah, I know that I speak of, thanks.

Quite frankly, from a productivity perspective, MS is right. iPad is nowhere near as productive of a device as Surface. Anyone claiming otherwise either doesn't know what productivity means or has never used a device that allows you to be productive and doesn't know any better, which is pretty much the same thing. Though it's certainly not an "inexpensive" device. Heck, a Galaxy Note 3 is a more productive device than an iPad.

How so? Getting muscle memory down, you can be quite productive on an iPad. Enable gestures and it's not as good as a desktop/laptop but it's good enough. Heck, I could do most of my admin duties on an iPad. With a good SSH client I'd be fine. Maybe not as productive as a laptop but about the same as every other solution.