Microsoft Confirms Multi-Touch Zune HD to Compete Against iPod Touch

[Popeye206]

What the F#@*!

People... be real... haven't you all in the Mac community figured it out? It's not about the feature list. It's about "how" it's implemented that makes Apple so darn appealing.

Windows 7? Come on... it's not even released yet! Remember... Vista was going to bury OSX too and look what happened. This new Zune... who cares! I'm guessing it will be typical MS stuff and be a little clunky and awkward... again another "me too" product that is 2 years too late. Let's face it, the real advantage to the iPod Touch and iPhone is the App store and iTume. How the heck is "The Social" going to compete?

Wake me up when the hype is over... at least my Mac will still be running fine!

 

[applecultvictim]

Maybe some of you need a quick reminder on how gorgeous the iPod Touch is, and how iTunes store, Mobile Me and the OS makes anything MS tries to copy irrelevant.

Yeah but MS Zune Hd has Marketplac and Social.

 

[MacFly123]

But people here tend to forget that Apple just like all companies buys innovation, not invents it. Most of the Apple "inventions" we see are small companies Apple buys and stamps that little logo on. Again I love Apple I am not a blind fan boy.

I agree with you, but also remember the countless cool patent filings with actual Apple employees listed as inventors.

Either way they are buying it because they pay their employees. I know every company does these things, but Apple is pretty innovative in what it puts out in contrast to Microsoft and other companies that just jump on the bandwagon late in the game.

I think there are obviously lots of bright people at Microsoft with great ideas, the problem is the suits and the vision or lack thereof with Ballmer and the executives etc. Ballmer is a flat out idiot period!

I love Apple too, and am not a blind fanboy. Just wanted to give my two cents.

 

[applecultvictim]

I think there are obviously lots of bright people at Microsoft with great ideas, the problem is the suits and the vision or lack thereof with Ballmer and the executives etc. Ballmer is a flat out idiot period!

Exactly, that's my take too, surely there ARE some people at MS with half a brain, even if they are about 0.00001% or so it seems, but they get evened out. May I also add that if the corporate structure of junior project managers is one where mediocrity rises to the top and the good minds get squashed you get a MS situation. That is it's not only the suits lacking the vision but also the lower echelons not attracting enough creative people, and when by chance they do get someone in they squash him or her with their mediocre way.

I mean for crying out loud how can a new product ad leave the building with a "marketplac" error, surely someone must have noticed it and thought, damn we are going to make fools of ourselves again, why didn't they say it? They didn't cause they are in a corporate environment that fosters mediocrity and squashes any innovation to the point of complete ineptness, and where no one really cares if they come up with something decent even. "So, it's marketplac and not marketplace" they seem to think, "I am not going to put my head on the line for that, let's release the ad as marketplac, it's not like anybody is expecting anything really good from us in the first place anyway..."

To me Microsoft is officially retitled as Marketplac, that kinda sums up everything they are about: stupid, unimaginative and completely inept at implementation.

 

[mattlane]

iPod is only part of it

The iPod itself is only half of the success. Without iTunes, the iPod is just another cool device, like the Zune. So until anyone can match the ease and power of iTunes and complete seamless interaction it allows with the iPod, iTunes Store, etc., Apple has nothing to worry about.

 

[seashellz]

DOA

Looks like a TI calculator w/o the buttons-for corporate execs from 1990-really

Im afraid with MS's lack of market savvy in the 20-30s demographic that this will go over like.....like....
a Zoon™. At least in the Zoon Marketplac

There are more reported sightings of the Sasquatch and the Loch Ness monster than there have been of the MS Zoon

Unemployment will continue to rise -more business closing shop

for the REAL unemployment numbers, pay no attention to what the BLS reports to the mainstream media-the U3 'cherry-pick' accounting method-the TRUE measure is U6-last I checked was near 16%, and this doesnt account for self employed people-more likely 20%; http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t12.htm
and get this-once you finish collecting unemployment-you are not counted as unemployed! stunning!

students will need to scramble just for books-or jobs-

A great time to re-launch an already failed product!

Good luck to MS

Apple may hurt, but the Zoon will stillbirth--and generally, APPLEs demographic is of a slightly higher income/intelligence level than MS-thus the last to lose a job or cut back to bare necessities-yet.

 

[Perrumpo]

It sure is fugly, but competition is a good thing!

 

[Unprocessed1]

It sure is fugly, but competition is a good thing!

I actually like the design. OLED is a huge step forward though, and could make the touch's screen look like crap.

 

[Kyprioth657]

It's going to be like any other device with a version of windows on it: with laggy controls, and a piss-poor touch screen. I hope they prove me wrong. Or perhaps that Apple makes significant improvements to the iPod Touch, particularly the wifi antenna.

The reason I despise Apple is that they're SOO damn concentrated on sexiness. They'll keep making the Touch thinner or lighter, rather than keep the same width and improve battery life or performance. Some of us aren't girls Apple, and we don't give a **** that you cut .05 ounces off the weight.

I use an iTouch, btw.

 

[DMann]

We Mac users are afraid that Windows 7 will kill Mac OS X.

Sadly, it will be axphyxiated quickly by the 67% of Windows users and businesses who are currently satisfied with XP.

But people here tend to forget that Apple just like all companies buys innovation, not invents it. Most of the Apple "inventions" we see are small companies Apple buys and stamps that little logo on. Again I love Apple I am not a blind fan boy.

Implementation is a major constituent of innovation. Has it occurred to you that the following Apple innovations were not purchased?

QuickTime

MacPaint

Visi-Cal - the first ever spreadsheet software

Hardware:

Floppy Disk Drive

First Digital Camera

Laserwriter

Firewire


The iPod’s innovative design and integration with iTunes

The App Store

Exposé

Magsafe

Unibody

NeXT (Steve Jobs)

Open Step

Cocoa and Obj-C

to name some few...

 

[kdarling]

Implementation is a major constituent of innovation. Has it occurred to you that the following Apple innovations were not purchased?

Visi-Cal - the first ever spreadsheet software

Floppy Disk Drive

Eh? If you meant Apple inventions...

Visi-Calc was not done by Apple.

Nor did they invent the floppy (although they tried to create their own non-standard disk, which was thrown away.)

 

[brop52]

It's going to be like any other device with a version of windows on it: with laggy controls, and a piss-poor touch screen. I hope they prove me wrong. Or perhaps that Apple makes significant improvements to the iPod Touch, particularly the wifi antenna.

The reason I despise Apple is that they're SOO damn concentrated on sexiness. They'll keep making the Touch thinner or lighter, rather than keep the same width and improve battery life or performance. Some of us aren't girls Apple, and we don't give a **** that you cut .05 ounces off the weight.

I use an iTouch, btw.

You cut off 0.05 ounces off the name of the iPod Touch too.

I don't really know what you mean by "keep" since it's only on its second generation.

 

[Roessnakhan]

I welcome the competition. The Zune marketplace, UI, and hardware is actually pretty well done (I have a first generation Zune). I'm also glad the back of the device looks like it can take some scuffs with little worry unlike the scratch/smudge-prone iPod touch.

And for the people criticizing the "marketplac," screen images on all electronics are simulated. Its a goof on the PR department's part, not the device itself.

 

[MorphingDragon]

Mobile IE?
Windows CE in general makes this a bloated crasher.

And why are people gushing over a radio feature when like at least 50% of you probably pirate?

 

[MorphingDragon]

I welcome the competition. The Zune marketplace, UI, and hardware is actually pretty well done (I have a first generation Zune). I'm also glad the back of the device looks like it can take some scuffs with little worry unlike the scratch/smudge-prone iPod touch.

And for the people criticizing the "marketplac," screen images on all electronics are simulated. Its a goof on the PR department's part, not the device itself.

If its the same UI as on the original Zune its going to phail in a touch world.

 

[DMann]

True, but I think he meant how the scheme was positioned check this out...

Maybe some of you need a quick reminder on how gorgeous the iPod Touch is, and how iTunes store, Mobile Me and the OS makes anything MS tries to copy irrelevant.

So typically blatant - so typically MS...

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Jeez. What is with all the vitriol and hate? Holy cow, I would never think any company could illicit such hatred. Did Microsoft kill your dog or something?

It must suck to not have an open mind.

It only reinforces my belief that 30-50% of all Mac users are "fanatical" about Apple. I must be crazy to support the better product, regardless of name. I used to hate Microsoft and it's what got me to try the Mac a couple of years back (I used to be an Amiga user if that explains it for you since I blame Microsoft for helping to put them out of business, but it was also partly Commodore's inept management as well), but the thing is, the more I got to know Apple the more I realized they're JUST AS BAD AS MICROSOFT if not worse in their behaviors. They litigate with anyone that even looks at one of their patents funny. They set up "support" that is comprised of people that have to incorporate themselves so they can bypass worker laws in this country. They move operations to China, which I hate of ANY U.S. company (at least Dell still assembles their desktops in the USA) because it's a giant Communist country that doesn't care about human rights and would probably wipe us out if they could without consequence to themselves. Apple couldn't care less what you the user WANTS, they only care about what they can dream up and try and force on you (for better or worse; when it's good it's really good and when it's bad it's really bad and if it's sorta good, they'll probably mess it up since they don't listen to users much). Yes, Microsoft is guilty of anti-competitive behaviors too. But that doesn't make Apple good because Microsoft is bad.

How is competition good here? I guess that depends on whether you think the product being offered by Microsoft has any value (HD video output sounds good to me; I'd love to be able to show my photos stored on my iPod Touch to friends when visiting their houses in full HD instead of mere DVD quality. Why limit the device? To push to sell you a laptop too? Why not offer HD radio or any radio directly on an iPod? It's simple. They want to sell you songs from the iTunes store. In other words, Apple compromises the USER EXPERIENCE to make more money. Yes, a lot of companies do that. That doesn't make Apple alright. It just means a lot of companies have no ethics, soul or patriotism. Screw the consumer. Take all their money and to heck with the country as long as I'm OK. Maybe that really is the American way. It'll probably soon be the Chinese way the world is going. They're going to be the new SuperPower of the decades to come, not the U.S. They practically own us now already.

 

[DMann]

Although Apple does have most of the MP3 player market share with the iPod/iTunes, that's not a monopoly in the same sense that MS is a near-monopoly with Windows. Apple invented the iPod, made it easy to use, and put it up for sale. Its popularity took off. People now snap these things up.

Windows, however, isn't ubiquitous because it's popular, it's ubiquitous due to Microsoft's dishonest schemes to force it down everyone's throat. Did I mention the lack of quality? Windows sucks because it can. People have to use it whether they like it or not, so MS doesn't give a flying s**t about how well it works. Now pretty much everyone lives in a world where Windows is the only game in town, and all they know.

Let the truth be known.

if they don't give a flying s**t, why do they bother putting out new versions? it just costs them money to write. They could just push out XP on the people who are forced to buy machines and continue to make profit on it.

And this would have been a much more successful and welcomed solution. Too bad for MS it's not 1995 anymore - we've been swindled for almost two decades, and are slightly less prone to being fooled.

Not only that, the Zune itself can't even play the HD content on its own screen, Ha!

Typical deceptive MS marketing - use a buzzword like HD, that'll get people's attention, heck, it at least almost supports HD (720p).

Obviously they don't give a **** how it works because Vista did nothing but make things worse for everyone...

Just wait and see, Windows ME is gonna fix all of that.

 

[krzyglue]

Typical deceptive MS marketing - use a buzzword like HD, that'll get people's attention, heck, it at least almost supports HD (720p).

At least the videos in iTunes are 1080p right? Oh wait...

Seriously this forum is scary sometimes.... In THAT thread, everyone was screaming how useless 1080p is compared to 720p, and yet here you are scoffing at the Zune's 720p...
http://tinyurl.com/odnqvv

Seriously though... I do think that 720p is a minus for the Zune... Why not go all the way with 1080p? (reasonably though, I'm thinking either space restrictions or hardware performance restrictions are why it hasn't been implemented)

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Let the truth be known.

And this would have been a much more successful and welcomed solution. Too bad for MS it's not 1995 anymore - we've been swindled for almost two decades, and are slightly less prone to being fooled.

Typical deceptive MS marketing - use a buzzword like HD, that'll get people's attention, heck, it at least almost supports HD (720p).

Oh, you mean like how AppleTV says it's HD when it's also "only" 720P??? Get your hypocrisy behind thee already. The iPod Touch can only output 480P to a TV at best, so I'm afraid the Zune HD wins there for now. Frankly, I'd like that capability for showing home movies and photos on an HDTV when visiting friends. 480P pales compared to 720P and 1080P would be better yet.

Just wait and see, Windows ME is gonna fix all of that.

Apparently, you never tried XP. It's not too bad at all, IMO and I didn't like Windows98. XP doesn't crash anymore for me than OS X does (usually kernel panics there isntead). Vista sucks, but I'll wait and see about Windows7. I wish I could root for Linux, but I'm not holding my breath there. I like some of their open philosophy, but their product need a lot more uniformity and some commercial software support (some of their developers prefer to remain "elite" instead; it's not open, it shouldn't be supported).

Frankly, I think there's still room for a better overall OS than any of them out there. OS X isn't as stable as it should be for a Unix OS and it lacks things like modern up-top-date 3D APIs like Microsoft has for DirectX. OpenGL is too far behind and Apple's implementation is even further behind. The thing is Apple doesn't seem to care about supporting gaming on their computers (save the iPod Touch and only because it's selling like hotcakes in the App store which makes them a small fortune given their monster 1/3 take of all incoming cash on the backs of developers). Microsoft is just plain inefficient and Linux isn't much better these days in the latest whiz-bang versions. They're both behemoth operating systems (now the Amiga was extremely efficient!) Apple could easily stay ahead of the pack, but with their massive cash reserves, I think they could afford to hire more programmers and support people to make OS X the full-featured OS it really should be (i.e. get some feedback options in there, theming options and gaming capable APIs already and for goodness sake, fix the kernel panic causing bugs already. I think XP is more stable some days. It almost never crashes, but then I use OS X a lot more and leave it running 24/7. But it crashes often enough, just the same and often goes wonky long before that happens and I don't just mean my PowerMac. The fairly new MBP I have has had its share of kernel panics over the past 8 months as well.

 

[Spidesol]

watch out !!

 

[krzyglue]

watch out !!

*Shudders*

 

[Sehnsucht]

Let the truth be known.

I forgot to mention one more thing...if the whole OS X EULA/iPod+iTunes thing were really a "monopoly" as some are saying, then there would be no way to "opt out." Want an MP3 player but don't like iTunes? Then buy a Sony Walkman, Creative Zen, or horrors...even a Zune. No big deal. Apple isn't trying to force their sh*t on anybody. If you don't like the way Apple wants OS X to run only on their own hardware, then don't buy a Mac. Apple won't miss you or care. But what about PCs? You can have a PC with any OS as long as it's Windows. Windows is literally freaking everywhere...can't escape it.

Apple's iPod actually merited the huge popularity it enjoys. Can't say the same for Windows.

watch out !!

We already know what some people do with "iTouch." As for "iPlay", well...let's just not go there...

 

[krzyglue]

But what about PCs? You can have a PC with any OS as long as it's Windows. Windows is literally freaking everywhere...can't escape it.

Wait wait wait... what?

Linux DOESN'T run on any PC? Hackintoshes are FAKE? All these things don't actually exist?
[/sarcasm]

Dell a while back (perhaps they still do, I'm not sure) offered Ubuntu Linux as an option instead of Windows on a few desktops, and I'm pretty sure it didn't really get anywhere.

 

[DMann]

At least the videos in iTunes are 1080p right? Oh wait...

Seriously this forum is scary sometimes.... In THAT thread, everyone was screaming how useless 1080p is compared to 720p, and yet here you are scoffing at the Zune's 720p...


Seriously though... I do think that 720p is a minus for the Zune... Why not go all the way with 1080p? (reasonably though, I'm thinking either space restrictions or hardware performance restrictions are why it hasn't been implemented)

Seriously though..... The names for the device and software in question are not iPhone HD and iTunes HD.

Oh, you mean like how AppleTV says it's HD when it's also "only" 720P??? Get your hypocrisy behind thee already. The iPod Touch can only output 480P to a TV at best, so I'm afraid the Zune HD wins there for now. Frankly, I'd like that capability for showing home movies and photos on an HDTV when visiting friends. 480P pales compared to 720P and 1080P would be better yet.

Hypocrisy? no. Perhaps if it were titled AppleTV HD, I would heed your criticism. You seem, however, to believe that the Zune HD has already been released

Apparently, you never tried XP. It's not too bad at all, IMO and I didn't like Windows98. XP doesn't crash anymore for me than OS X does (usually kernel panics there isntead). Vista sucks, but I'll wait and see about Windows7. I wish I could root for Linux, but I'm not holding my breath there. I like some of their open philosophy, but their product need a lot more uniformity and some commercial software support (some of their developers prefer to remain "elite" instead; it's not open, it shouldn't be supported).

Frankly, I think there's still room for a better overall OS than any of them out there. OS X isn't as stable as it should be for a Unix OS and it lacks things like modern up-top-date 3D APIs like Microsoft has for DirectX. OpenGL is too far behind and Apple's implementation is even further behind. The thing is Apple doesn't seem to care about supporting gaming on their computers (save the iPod Touch and only because it's selling like hotcakes in the App store which makes them a small fortune given their monster 1/3 take of all incoming cash on the backs of developers). Microsoft is just plain inefficient and Linux isn't much better these days in the latest whiz-bang versions. They're both behemoth operating systems (now the Amiga was extremely efficient!) Apple could easily stay ahead of the pack, but with their massive cash reserves, I think they could afford to hire more programmers and support people to make OS X the full-featured OS it really should be (i.e. get some feedback options in there, theming options and gaming capable APIs already and for goodness sake, fix the kernel panic causing bugs already. I think XP is more stable some days. It almost never crashes, but then I use OS X a lot more and leave it running 24/7. But it crashes often enough, just the same and often goes wonky long before that happens and I don't just mean my PowerMac. The fairly new MBP I have has had its share of kernel panics over the past 8 months as well.

Tried? I rely on XP, which runs much more efficiently than Vista, as well as manages memory better, and feels much more responsive. I was simply referring to the (over)hype we have heard consistently from Redmond, which has left many bewildered at the outcome. XP has been improved greatly over the past 9 years, I agree. The fanfare for both ME and Vista wasn't quite realized, however.