Microsoft Not Planning on Xbox Cloud Gaming App for iOS Because There's 'Not Room' for Monetization

[Ethosik]

Malicious compliance by Apple: trying to obey the law without actually obeying. Let’s hope the EU strikes down Apple

That’s exactly what malicious compliance is in his case. There’s the exact letter of the law and there’s the intend of the law.

And? Apple is doing everything legally possible to protect all revenue sources. Something they are also REQUIRED to do being a public company. If they just rolled over without a fight and they lost 50% of their revenue by everyone leaving App Store and can purchase elsewhere, shareholders have the legal ground to sue that Apple didn’t do enough.

This isn’t a simple problem that people make it out to be. This is mostly why I’m BEVER for my own company going public. It just causes so much complexity.

 

[GroovyCatticus]

Want what for free? Apple already charges developers for access, even if they don't use the app store.

Not true — XCode is free and you can build apps for yourself for free.

You need a developer account to publish on the App Store.

People arguing that the $99 developer free covers Apple’s costs are ridiculous — a company only needs ONE developer account to publish an unlimited number of apps to an unlimited number of customers.

Do that math.

 

[1129846]

Something they are also REQUIRED to do being a public company.

Stop repeating that lie. That is a complete lie that activist investors sucked people into believing and you repeating.
They are not required to everything possible to make maximum profit. The only thing they are legally required to do is follow shareholder best interested.

So stop repeating the lie that they are required to be greedy POS's and have zero ethics.

 

[ArtOfWarfare]

He’s a big fan of how Windows works … except that’s not even how Xbox works. Game consoles are arguably even more locked down than iPhones. This feels like misdirection.

Game consoles have an enormous difference from phones and computers though - game consoles have vastly more associated spending on their games. The game console itself is useless - it's just a vehicle for consuming games. It's not uncommon for game consoles to be sold at a very slim margin, or even a loss, because it's known that the average game console will have $400 spent on games for it over the following four years (some will buy fewer games, some will buy more games.)

Since the company making the console sells the initial hardware at low or no margin, they have to make up for it with profits from games.

In contrast, nobody sells computers or phones at a loss, because there's a lot less spending on apps. Yes, people have a lot more apps for their phones, but the apps are all much smaller and less valuable than games available on consoles.

If Apple wants to sell the iPhone at low-to-no-margin and strip out every app beyond Settings and the App Store, that would make it more akin to a game console, then maybe we could talk about how Apple should be paid for the apps. That's clearly not their business model, though.

 

[Ethosik]

The big (in fact, fundamental) difference is that developers have the option to sell through the MS Store (for which MS will take a cut), but they can also choose to sell through online retailers like Amazon (for which Amazon will take a cut), or through a bricks-and-mortar store (who will take a cut) and so on. Microsoft only get a cut from third party titles sold through their [optional] store, they get nothing from sales through non-MS channels.

So that's where your competition is, and the fact that I can see a variety of prices for the same game across multiple retailers is good evidence that it's effective competition.

Nope. Microsoft and Sony get a cut even if you have a physical copy.

 

[I7guy]

Stop repeating that lie. That is a complete lie that activist investors sucked people into believing and you repeating.
They are not required to everything possible to make maximum profit. The only thing they are legally required to do is follow shareholder best interested.

So stop repeating the lie that they are required to be greedy POS's and have zero ethics.

Wait, you’re saying that is not the truth as told by MR members. /s What is discussed is the apple should suck it up, sfter all they are rich enough. People play fast an loose with others peoples money.

 

[smulji]

Xbox is a gaming device, like GameBoy. Both are incomparable to a mobile OS.

Irrelevant. iOS has been a walled garden from day 1

 

[Ethosik]

Stop repeating that lie. That is a complete lie that activist investors sucked people into believing and you repeating.
They are not required to everything possible to make maximum profit. The only thing they are legally required to do is follow shareholder best interested.

So stop repeating the lie that they are required to be greedy POS's and have zero ethics.

Yes you are. I have looked into this extensively for my business. Which is why I remain private so I can dictate how my business works. Shareholders best interests is most commonly want maximize profits. So you basically said the same thing.

 

[Victor Mortimer]

Xbox is a gaming device, like GameBoy. Both are incomparable to a mobile OS.

Both are computers. Neither should be allowed to be a walled garden.

 

[makitango]

Both are walled gardens.

My mom's sex life is a walled garden. So?

 

[makitango]

John Gruber makes the perfect poetic point on this. This guy is the CEO over XBox and XBox is a more closed system than iOS is on mobile. Why doesn’t XBox work like Windows with a zero-royalty for developers?

The same reason why GameBoy is.

 

[Ethosik]

The same reason why GameBoy is.

Not really compatible. Xbox and PS5 now are just mini PCs with the exact same hardware as your PC. Game boy didn’t have an equivalent of an AMD GPU/CPU and desktop-like hardware.

Heck Xbox OS now is just a thin Windows 11 OS.

 

[makitango]

Irrelevant. iOS has been a walled garden from day 1

No it hasn't.

 

[makitango]

Not really compatible. Xbox and PS5 now are just mini PCs with the exact same hardware as your PC. Game boy didn’t have an equivalent of an AMD GPU/CPU and desktop-like hardware.

Heck Xbox OS now is just a thin Windows 11 OS.

Xbox is a gaming OS, unsuitable to do other stuff.
It has not the numbers to reach gatekeeper thresholds, not even in ten years, nor does any other gaming console. Which is what this is, a gaming console. A niché market.
Unlike smartphones. Unlike personal computers.

 

[FaustsHausUK]

You said put your money where your mouth is, like an extremist capitalist view on things.
If people would do everything according to twhat their wallets (or debts) allow them to buy, the world would ba an even crazier place.
It's regulators which protect us from ourselves.

It's a very common English language idiom: https://writingexplained.org/idiom-dictionary/put-your-money-where-your-mouth-is

 

[makitango]

It's a very common English language idiom: https://writingexplained.org/idiom-dictionary/put-your-money-where-your-mouth-is

I know that it's common. You ignored the issue at hand if you go absolutist on this one.

 

[1129846]

Yes you are. I have looked into this extensively for my business. Which is why I remain private so I can dictate how my business works. Shareholders best interests is most commonly want maximize profits. So you basically said the same thing.

It more not shareholders best interest or more so wishes. Say in your own company you can take it public but guess what if you control say 40% of the shares then chances are you can still do what ever teh F you want because unless they can 80% of the other share holders to agree on one thing what are they going to do to you. Plus with 40% of the vote you can more or less hand pick the board so again they do what you want.

Just people repeate that same lie over and over again about maximizing profit over the short term instead of looking long term.

Long term this could easily and I hope bits apple in the ass hard.

 

[Ethosik]

It more not shareholders best interest or more so wishes. Say in your own company you can take it public but guess what if you control say 40% of the shares then chances are you can still do what ever teh F you want because unless they can 80% of the other share holders to agree on one thing what are they going to do to you. Plus with 40% of the vote you can more or less hand pick the board so again they do what you want.

Just people repeate that same lie over and over again about maximizing profit over the short term instead of looking long term.

Long term this could easily and I hope bits apple in the ass hard.

It’s technically accurate. When I looked at it and researched and talked to experts, they said it is very common for “shareholder interest” = “maximize profits”. That is highly common. So technically both statements are true and equal. Majority speaking. Especially when you get to medium/big tech.

 

[FaustsHausUK]

I know that it's common. You ignored the issue at hand if you go absolutist on this one.

I'm ignoring it because you are acting bizarrely. My original post was to say if Xbox are so concerned with opening up closed ecosystems, they have a closed ecosystem of their own. That's it, pointing out the hypocrisy. It has nothing to do with guns or any of the other rambling nonsense you're bringing up.

 

[gaximus]

People would care about other marketplaces if Apple had no financial pull over them.

This just isn’t true. The average user, not people in this forum, but the people that ask for tech help from people in this forum, do not choose their marketplace/appstore based on the financial pull of the owner of the owner of the market place. If that were true Walmart wouldn’t exist.

Users almost always use the default apps, that’s why Google pays so much to be default search engine, that’s why Edge asks everytime you open it to be the default browser, that’s why the EU made a law to prompt the user to choose defaults the first time you start your phone, because once you set it, you never change it.

The only time a user will change some from the default is when the default is so horrible that it becomes the “the thing to do” IE -> Chrome/Firefox. Bing -> Google/duck duck go.

Apple AppStore is very secure and makes it so easy to get refunds and cancel subscriptions, all it takes is one other market place to have one report of “I had to CALL” or “It took 2 emails” to cancel. And the word will spread to not side load other market places. And sense most of these other market places will be aimed at kids charging up parents credit cards for in game purchases, it going to be interesting to see how quick the public looses trust in these.

 

[Jumpthesnark]

So, no more Xbox Cloud gaming on iPhone's in Europe, is that really a solution ?

I mean, it's removing the Cloud Gaming service on iPhone from 450 million people.

Yes, this is what they're saying publicly to try to push Apple to do what they want and make them look like the bad guy. "we want people to play our games on Apple devices, but mean ol' Apple is mean and won't let them!" It's a tactic.

 

[hans1972]

I don't blame Microsoft for saying that's not reasonable. Would you be willing to give Apple 2.5% of your pre-tax income, just because they asked nicely?

Yes, it's cheap if it means access to more paying customers.

 

[hans1972]

Want what for free? Apple already charges developers for access, even if they don't use the app store.

No, the $99 is a membership fee for the developer programme.

Not unusual to pay membership fees.

 

[diamond.g]

Yes, it's cheap if it means access to more paying customers.

Is this an assumption that MS would pick up subscribers from folks that don't already have an xbox? Is their xCloud library that robust?

 

[0339327]

This. We've been hearing these overblown fears since video games first became popular decades ago.

Overblown? Do you think people today live healthier lives then in years past? Are people feeling more content with their lives than before? Considering suicide and depression having risen dramatically in Gen Y and Gen Z, I'm not sure I would say this is a good thing.

This is actually Microsoft saying they will not develop for the convenience of their own customers because they can't make more money off of an iOS app. Meaning you pay for their subscription, and having an app to use it within is not something they want unless they can further make money. So not really about how much it costs those of us developing iOS apps. For me it is actually much less expensive in the long run to develop on iOS than it is most other platforms. Specially when I have to consider safety, protection, and exposure.

I disagree. Microsoft is a corporation and they need to make money. If they don't believe they can earn profit from iOS then they should stay out. Yes, sometimes companies need to service their customer base with unpopular items, but I agree than unprofitable items should rarely been on the table.