If GPU is important in pro apps, why did Apple put a lowend in thier macbooks pro's?
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Microsoft Offering MacBook Owners Up to $650 Trade-In Credit Toward Surface Pro or Surface Book
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If GPU is important in pro apps, why did Apple put a lowend in thier macbooks pro's?
Because Apple could not care less about the pro market....should be clear by now!
The question should be : Since GPU is important in pro apps, why don't you Apple put a higher end VC in your MacBook pro's?
G1: "the Surface Studio is an embarrassment for a "pro" machine. .. It has only a single mini displayport (driven by a single notebook GPU no less)"
G2: "True, but it's not a gaming machine. It's business and art like machine."
G1: "Who said anything about gaming? GPU is important in pro apps as well."
If GPU is important in pro apps, why did Apple put a lowend in thier macbooks pro's?
I know it is hard for you, but do try to keep up.
Surface Studio is a desktop
Macbook Pro is a laptop
Having said that, on a these new Macbook Pro, you can use external GPU using Thunderbolt 3.
On the Surface Studio, you're stuck.
Whatever they do, APPLE CAN'T DO IT RIGHT! In related news, the Microsoft Studio will launch with the exact same processor in December.
So sick of uninformed haters on MR.
And the thing is, most of them probably cannot even tell the different between this and KabyLake. I think many said KabyLake simply because it's newer, and that's it. I mean what does KabyLake bring to the table?
What's even funnier is that how people made it like MS did wonders. Microsoft did not even do anything to their Surface Pro line (that only has one USB port, mind you. People forget about that). They only added a more expensive Surface book. So from a portable lineup perspective, Apple did more than Microsoft.
Perhaps Microsoft wants the Macs for their own staff, to make them more productive!
Not to mention their $3000 machine sports an i5 and 8 gigs RAM.
But hating on Apple is hip.
Don't be tempted.
Microsoft is making hardware that looks tempting these days, but the Surface line has been plagued with bugs for YEARS. I've owned two of them since the release of the first model.
Microsoft doesn't have good QC in place, and their support is a nightmare unless you happen to get lucky at one of the few Microsoft Stores. I ended up paying $450 out of pocket for a replacement unit when my battery went 'bad' at 14 months old. Microsoft later realized it was a firmware issue. It took them six months after acknowledging this to actually fix it though, during which time owners couldn't use their machines without being connected to a power cord!! They made a promise that they would contact those of us who had paid the $450 to fix this firmware problem, which of course they never did.
And don't discount the number of times MS has abruptly discontinued a hardware lineup with no further support offered.
Switch at your own risk.
Microsoft is making hardware that looks tempting these days, but the Surface line has been plagued with bugs for YEARS. I've owned two of them since the release of the first model.
Microsoft doesn't have good QC in place, and their support is a nightmare unless you happen to get lucky at one of the few Microsoft Stores. I ended up paying $450 out of pocket for a replacement unit when my battery went 'bad' at 14 months old. Microsoft later realized it was a firmware issue. It took them six months after acknowledging this to actually fix it though, during which time owners couldn't use their machines without being connected to a power cord!! They made a promise that they would contact those of us who had paid the $450 to fix this firmware problem, which of course they never did.
And don't discount the number of times MS has abruptly discontinued a hardware lineup with no further support offered.
Switch at your own risk.
considering the ridiculous prices they are asking for Surface machines - they need to! I may be tempted to give up one of my MBPs, but I wouldn't know which one - I think I would keep the 2012 because it's upgradeable and has a CD Drive - which, yes I still use. I have a 1TB SSD and 16 Gigs of ram in it and it's just as fast as my 2015 - with the same specs. Only reason I don't use it more is the poor battery life on it.
As a Surface Pro 4 owner, you're right on the money. My previous SP3 had the exact same battery issue - luckily the retailer I'd bought from had their own 2 year extended warranty on it. Got a full refund for the battery issue and bought an SP4 for the same productivity reasons as the SP3. Fantastic machines but without the on-hand, no quibble support that Apple provides. Had my late 2011 MBP logic board replaced outside of warranty for free due to it being a known problem.
It's that lack of after-sales support that is having to be seriously considered when the time comes to move on from the MBP.
The Surface machines are fantastic devices but the after-sales (also Dell etc) has to be considered along with the virtues of the machines themselves when planning a purchase.
I use it at work regularly. In my view it is prettier than 7 (but an over make up sort of pretty). However, in many ways it was a step backwards. Sometimes it takes more steps to accomplish stuff. It is also buggy on older machines. When I first installed it, my monitor started flashing rapidly so that I couldn't use anything.
OS X is much better.
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That's just Microsoft playing dirty again -$650 is quite a bit. Not that they are trying to buy Apple fans or anything.
They might attract a few fans sitting on the fence still, but not pro users who use Macs for a reason.
It also shows Macs hold their value well. Microsoft isn't junking the macs it collects.
Yes I'd rather have that then the constant whining and complaining in every thread. If people hate this stuff so much quit buying it. Buy android and windows and leave...Might not want that... unless you want to remain in 3 /4 people here
This just shows how uneducated some people are and how they just want to blather the same rhetoric over and over ad nauseam. So boring. Have fun with a dying brand.
Apple didn't put in a powerful unit simply because it'll use more power. That takes away from the battery life. It also generates more heat. Furthermore, while I think the new MBP is bollocks, I can't understand why people are comparing it to a GTX 1060... The Radeon Pro is a workstation grade video card. GTX are not workstation cards. They are general graphic cards aimed at graphics such as games that don't mind corrupted frames or dozens of dropped frames over a 60 minute period. A workstation card makes use with ECC memory and focuses on accurate frame replication and rendering. Want to compare to NVidia? Compare it to the equivalent workstation card available for dGPU.
So true. I've owned four different Surface devices since the original (including the RT) and all of which I either took back within the first 30 days or sold at a small fraction of the MSRP within just 6 months. The original Surface Pro was far too heavy and buggy for any kind of long-term use. The RT actually wasn't a bad little machine, but limited in functionality and usage (RT was also abandoned within, like a year). The Surface 3 was riddled with literally hours worth of system updates and patches the moment you took it out of the box and powered it on. Once I WAS up and running there was also the aftershock of being outside of the Apple ecosystem (Messages, Photos, etc - although iCloud.com these days can supplement some of those services a bit).
I keep reading in these forums of how many MacBook owners were disappointed with yesterday's Apple's Mac event and had decided to just hold off on buying a new one; still using their trusty 2013, 2012, 2011 or even 2010 MacBook. How many original Surface owners can say that? Are those devices even still receiving any kind of updates or support? The original was only just released October 2012, the Pro in 2013. Can any "long-time" Surface owners weigh in on this?
I'll admit that I was salivating during the Surface Studio unveiling (and even almost pre-ordered) until I remembered just recently how last year's Surface Book owners were crippled for 2 months waiting on device drivers so they could properly use their brand new device (don't get me started on all the bad customer service stories I read about MS during that time). I have yet to walk into any Microsoft Store or Best Buy and test a Surface Book that actually worked (software to undock the screen, really MS?).
Within the first week after the Surface Pro 4 and Surface Book were first released I ran over to our local DC Metro area Microsoft Store to try them out. The only Surface Pro 4 display unit had a broken pen tip. I couldn't even undock the screen (yes the OS was on and logged in) on the only Surface Book display model and not one MS Employee came over in the 15 minutes I was there to help. But I have YET to walk into any Apple Store and find a demo unit that doesn't work or has broken hardware (I'm sure a few Apple Store customers in Dijon France had a different experience though a few weeks ago).
I'll admit that Microsoft is taking steps in the right direction lately with their OS, engineering and designs (HP admittedly has had a couple of great designs as of late as well); giving the market some healthy competition. What Apple has done is set a standard that consumers have come to expect, as well as appreciate, and PC manufacturers are finally starting to take note (albeit slowly). Microsoft really went after Apple's core following with the Surface Studio and it's a great looking device (the stand is pretty "meh" though). They gave us the device that I've dreamed of from Apple since before the release of the first iPad, but is it a "Cintiq killer"? Professionals will have to weigh in on this after they've had some substantial time with it, but I personally doubt it.
The 1,028 levels of pen pressure sensitivity on the Surface Studio pen is pre-2010 Wacom. Wacom's latest device, the MobileStudio Pro (a 4K IPS portable device that comes in both 13" and 16" screen sizes, runs Windows 10 natively and can also be used as a pen input display with a Mac), comes with the Pro Pen 2 that has zero parallax, is 4x more pressure sensitive than the 2,048 levels of the original Pro Pen (that's over 8000 levels of pressure sensitivity!) and is 4x more accurate.
My Wife works as a sketch artist, graphic designer and video animator. For drawing she prefers an actual pencil (or chalk or water colors) and paper. If I put her in front of a Cintiq though, she goes nuts and loves the natural feel and responsiveness of the pen. Same goes for the iPad Pro and the Apple Pencil (anytime we go to the Apple Store we're there for over an hour while she draws with the iPad Pro display units). But the times she's demoed a Surface, it only holds her interest for less than five minutes and she comments that the pen experience just doesn't feel right. She also gets frustrated by the constant interruption while drawing as menus keep popping up from unintended palm inputs (Windows 10 palm rejection needs some work).
Would I love a device right now like the Microsoft Surface Studio? - Absolutely. But if I drop $3000 - $4199 of our hard earned money on their device will it still work in four years, be supported and get the latest updates by then, or even hold a fraction of it's resale value? I'm not so sure...
How are they "outdated?"
Really nice machines, though I don't need the touch bar.
Running Windows on the other hand is something I refuse to do, and poking at my laptop screen is something I want to do even less.
Microsoft should pay people to use Windows. You will regret it after a few weeks when your machine needs to reboot for the third time to patch the O/S from vulnerabilities. I started using Microsoft's O/S when it was DOS 1.0 and up through Windows and WFW and Windows 3/3.1 and on up to Windows 7 for work. Between reboots weekly to patch the O/S to poor integration to blue screens to virus warnings on a daily basis, you finally give up. Now we are rolling out Windows 10 and in testing, it has just grown worse. It's a horrible O/S no matter what price you can get for the hardware. No wonder Mac installs at work have quadrupled...
you get what you pay for... You will need to replace your Windows hardware every couple of years while Mac hardware will last you 4-5 years. I do agree the new Pro laptops are expensive, but they are probably not what most people need.
I think that Microsoft's first-party portables are not there yet to compete with Apple's. The Surface and Surface Book don't have the "wow" factor to woo macOS-loving users away.
Regardless of how disappointed I am in yesterday's announcement, Apple laptops are still far too compelling, especially to those who love the Mac OS (like me).
We'd rather deal with current Mac shortcomings and tradeoffs, and wait for the next generation than switch. Switching is hard. And Apple is still selling their previous gen MBPs, which is a good thing (despite their obviously ridiculous pricing). In my opinion, 2011 17" > 2012 cMBP > Retina > current-gen MB, MBP. But I'd take any of those over any PC laptop, if price was no object.
Now, if Microsoft did that for the Surface Studio and iMac, this would be a very, very different story and far more tempting.
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You have to skip over the whining posts, even yours (whining about whiners) to get to the good stuff.
I am a potential switcher, but I neither dismiss Mac-users' cautions regarding MS, nor Win users praise of current MS products. I want to hear why the people on the other side choose it. It is the side I don't know of.
Personally, I like to hear both sides of the argument and there are a lot of mature, reasoned people here that provide truly useful information.
Cut us "whiners" some slack (I admit I've done my fair share).
The anger comes from our love of Apple products and the disappointment that comes when we lose things we love on our devices (MagSafe is particularly egregious this time).
It's too soon, and we're in mourning.
Regardless of how disappointed I am in yesterday's announcement, Apple laptops are still far too compelling, especially to those who love the Mac OS (like me).
We'd rather deal with current Mac shortcomings and tradeoffs, and wait for the next generation than switch. Switching is hard. And Apple is still selling their previous gen MBPs, which is a good thing (despite their obviously ridiculous pricing). In my opinion, 2011 17" > 2012 cMBP > Retina > current-gen MB, MBP. But I'd take any of those over any PC laptop, if price was no object.
Now, if Microsoft did that for the Surface Studio and iMac, this would be a very, very different story and far more tempting.
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You have to skip over the whining posts, even yours (whining about whiners) to get to the good stuff.
I am a potential switcher, but I neither dismiss Mac-users' cautions regarding MS, nor Win users praise of current MS products. I want to hear why the people on the other side choose it. It is the side I don't know of.
Personally, I like to hear both sides of the argument and there are a lot of mature, reasoned people here that provide truly useful information.
Cut us "whiners" some slack (I admit I've done my fair share).
The anger comes from our love of Apple products and the disappointment that comes when we lose things we love on our devices (MagSafe is particularly egregious this time).
It's too soon, and we're in mourning.
Microsoft's trade-in prices are insulting to say the least. $450 for my $1299 12" MacBook?! I tested the resell waters on craigslist a couple of months ago and got offers for $750. Get real Microsoft...
For those of you that DO make the switch or take MS's offer: best of luck to you at the Geek Squad counter or on the phone with MS support within the first 6 months.
For those of you that DO make the switch or take MS's offer: best of luck to you at the Geek Squad counter or on the phone with MS support within the first 6 months.
I'm rather worried Apple will follow the same strategy when iPhone 8 are being introduced: keeping the prices of the 7 / 7+ while significantly increasing prices for the iPhone 8. Just because it is redesigned and has an USB-c adapter.
