Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
I don't understand why you are all saying that Microsoft doesn't make the hardware. Of course they don't.

But when HP sells a laptop, Microsoft also gets a sale of their OS. I'd bet that a huge portion of Microsoft's income from its OSs comes from them being sold pre-loaded on machines in this way, rather than in a box on their own.

Does anyone know what model the computer was that he eventually bought?

SWEET!!!

Another "Microsoft vs. Apple; via You Get What You Pay For Ad" = More "Neiltc13 scrambling to come up with any and every way possible to back up Microsoft's new ad campaign."

Seriously though folks, I love reading this guy's crazy antics every time a new Windows ad comes out (even though Windows is attacking the hardware market????)
 
Vista problems? We encountered one last week. Turns out people where I work buying new Vista machines can't use our existing VPN because Cisco doesn't make a 64-bit version of the VPN software for compatibility with Vista. The solution? Update our hardware and use newer software.

Oh yeah, I know... that's Cisco's fault, right? Well before we jump to that conclusion, let's ask ourselves why a company the size of Cisco would choose not to make a VPN client update for Vista. Doesn't really make much sense, does it? That begs the question of what exactly MS broke in Vista that would cause a company like Cisco to balk at updating their software for it. It also makes you question how much effort MS put into ensuring some path for backward-compatibility, so you could run XP software in Vista.

Uh, yes, I am pretty sure that your problem is indeed a Cisco problem.

Leopard broke plenty of software when I upgraded, and some apps I have for Vista don't work either, but it's really not fair to hold application incompatability due to a lazy developer, and count it as a "issue" with the OS, especially considering the broad variety of software new and old I have had work 100% with Vista x64.
 
Yeah, alright, PC's are cheaper than Macs. Fine. I don't think i really care.

I saved up the money to get a Mac, because i knew that it would be right for me, and i preferred the OS. Why do all the fanboys convince others that their OS is better? Well OK, yeah, they might want to get more people using it, because they think their OS is better. I say be happy with the OS you have got, You brought it for a reason.

There is no best OS. It is purely opinion, and reason.

-Sam
 
You ever notice how DeBeers advertises diamonds, not "DeBeers's Diamonds"

Thats because they own almost all of the Diamond Market.

The same concept is happening here, Buy a PC, give microsoft money.

I do feel like they're acknowledging a lackluster OS(I mean lackluster in sales and popularity. I only messed with Vista back in its Release Candidate stages, so I cant form an opinion on modern Vista). Rather than talk about Vista, and say, its on a PC, they advertise the end product that happens to be preloaded with it.
 
There cannot possibly be any other purpose of such ads than to spread Fear, Uncertaindy and Doubt about the competitor's product.

Fear? I can't agree with you on that one, mate. They are a bit of fun at the failings of Vista. I'm not sure how those adverts can spread fear.

Well, the bleeding edge of industrial design comes with a price. Apple tries all sorts of things that nobody has done before, which is guaranteed to generate problems.

Amen to that. I think we should probably clarify what I mean by 'hardware' - I'm talking spec for the money. Again, notable exceptions. I totally agree you pay for design and innovation.

They're advertising the world of Windows.

Sorry, I'm not buying that. The 'world of Windows', that is hiding a world of sins in my opinion.
 
... because Cisco doesn't make a 64-bit version of the VPN software for compatibility with Vista. The solution? Update our hardware and use newer software.

You are barking at the wrong tree. Why do you hold MS accountable for Cisco's lack of timely response and/or unethical sales tactics.
BTW what kind of IT manager/director made uneducated decision to go for 64-bit OS w/o checking compatibility with existing infrastructure. He should be fired.
 
My biggest qualm with these ads is...

MICROSOFT DOESN'T MAKE HARDWARE.

If the PC manufacturers wanted to compare prices, they would. The software retards in Redmond need to be concerned about what they actually do for a living.

Or perhaps they've simply given up on Vista, are acknowledging that they can't even come up with a campaign to have it even compare to OS X, and are forced to resort to sell OEMs computers FOR them... even though they INCLUDE Vista.

Agrees totally, I mean, wouldn't it be very interesting and somewhat amusing if microsoft tried to square or better there operating system against OSX. I can see why they have skipped the OS pitch and chosen this route.
Its a shame such a large and wealthy corporation can't get its act together and produce a solid operating system (probably from scratch).

Fair enough, you can get a cheap pc laptop with crappy build and poor aesthetics, but i'd prefer spending that extra money for something that works without all the MS end user annoyance.
 
Sorry, I'm not buying that. The 'world of Windows', that is hiding a world of sins in my opinion.
Well I'm not really offering my interpretation here, I'm going by what I've read about this whole ad campaign that started with the Seinfeld ads. It's a brand campaign, not a product campaign, and the purpose is to illustrate that Windows is this omnipresent thing that works both upfront and behind the scenes to make our lives easier. You may argue that the ads fail in that department, but don't argue with me -- I didn't write their mission statement.

Since I've read about the ads, I understand where they're coming from, but I seem to be the only one because every time a new ad airs the same question comes up: "Why would this make me want to buy Vista?" But it didn't attempt to make you buy Vista or any specific product, and seeing as you're a Mac user, a Microsoft ad will automatically fail on all levels anyway.
 
... You're kidding, right? I thought you'd link to an actual competitor, taking two glances at it and I'm saying, "Of course that's better".

It's well over twice as thick as a MacBook Pro. It's almost twice as heavy. It's made of flimsy plastic. It's a Windows laptop. Asus is an unreliable company with poor customer support.

Yes, in this scenario "better" isn't a strong enough word.

I love macs and think the MacBook pro displays are great but flimsy? You mean lime cheap whit MacBook keyboard cracking or display imposinle to see at an angle or impossible to see outside? Flimsy? Cheap plastic with olde white and crummy gma gpu? That's flimsy.
 
Uh, yes, I am pretty sure that your problem is indeed a Cisco problem.

Leopard broke plenty of software when I upgraded, and some apps I have for Vista don't work either, but it's really not fair to hold application incompatability due to a lazy developer, and count it as a "issue" with the OS, especially considering the broad variety of software new and old I have had work 100% with Vista x64.

You're calling Cisco a "lazy developer?" That's your defense? Do you have any other examples of Cisco's laziness to back that up?

And that still doesn't explain why MS didn't ensure some kind of backward compatibility or why those same VPN clients work perfectly on Leopard, Tiger and Panther. Why does Cisco update the software to work for OS X but not Vista?

You are barking at the wrong tree. Why do you hold MS accountable for Cisco's lack of timely response and/or unethical sales tactics.
BTW what kind of IT manager/director made uneducated decision to go for 64-bit OS w/o checking compatibility with existing infrastructure. He should be fired.

Explain why MS chose to leave out or undercook the backward compatibility. Should consumers have to consult with an entire IT team before buying?

And besides, these are not IT decisions we're talking about. It comes from people buying new personal machines and wanting to install the VPN client. Vista stops them from doing it. Point fingers at Cisco if you want, but that doesn't let MS off the hook.
 
... You're kidding, right? I thought you'd link to an actual competitor, taking two glances at it and I'm saying, "Of course that's better".

It's well over twice as thick as a MacBook Pro. It's almost twice as heavy. It's made of flimsy plastic. It's a Windows laptop. Asus is an unreliable company with poor customer support.

Yes, in this scenario "better" isn't a strong enough word.

But it is better at being a piece of sh*t, by comparison.
 
You're calling Cisco a "lazy developer?" That's your defense? Do you have any other examples of Cisco's laziness to back that up?

And that still doesn't explain why MS didn't ensure some kind of backward compatibility or why those same VPN clients work perfectly on Leopard, Tiger and Panther. Why does Cisco update the software to work for OS X but not Vista?



Explain why MS chose to leave out or undercook the backward compatibility. Should consumers have to consult with an entire IT team before buying?

And besides, these are not IT decisions we're talking about. It comes from people buying new personal machines and wanting to install the VPN client. Vista stops them from doing it. Point fingers at Cisco if you want, but that doesn't let MS off the hook.

When Leopard was released, many applications that used to work with Tiger where no longer functional ie SuperDuper. Was it Apple's responsibility to take few steps back in the OS so that SuperDuper would work. Or. SuperDuper was responsible for bringing their code up to date so it would work with a new platform.
According to your post, Apple should make a swiss cheese out of Leopard so that the old apps would work. Do you see how insane your argument is?
 
It's a brand campaign

Their (utterly bizarre) Seinfeld ads were a brand campaign, these are not even talking about Windows. They are promoting other people's brands for one reason, to attack Apple. That is fine, I don't really have a problem attacking Apple but they should do it on the merits of their own products.

Since I've read about the ads, I understand where they're coming from, but I seem to be the only one because every time a new ad airs the same question comes up: "Why would this want to make me buy Vista?" But it didn't attempt to make you buy Vista or any specific product, and seeing as you're a Mac user, a Microsoft ad will automatically fail on all levels anyway.

Well, I'm a user of both platforms but the intention here isn't to make anybody buy something. The intention is to make them not buy something else. Again, that is fine. I just think they should do it with on their own merits.
 
Their (utterly bizarre) Seinfeld ads were a brand campaign, these are not even talking about Windows. They are promoting other people's brands for one reason, to attack Apple. That is fine, I don't really have a problem attacking Apple but they should do it on the merits of their own products.



Well, I'm a user of both platforms but the intention here isn't to make anybody buy something. The intention is to make them not buy something else. Again, that is fine. I just think they should do it with on their own merits.

Valid point.
 
Great ad.

Apple fanboys up in arms because Microsoft have DARED to do exactly what Apple have been doing for years and years. Only Microsoft are actually basing their ads on real-world, consumer facts and don't sugar coat it with pretentious nonsense like the I'm a mac, I'm a pc ad.

Also amazing how Microsoft have in one campaign completely ruined Apple's "I'm a mac, I'm a PC" slogan.

The apple fanboys bitching and moaning is fun to watch though

Couldn't have put it better myself. Yet when Apple next releases some new Get a Mac ads, people here will think they're amazing. Don't get me wrong, I like Apple products, but I deteste fanboys. At the end of the day this Microsoft ad is just saying you can get more for your money with a PC, and lets be honest, you can.
 
Couldn't have put it better myself. Yet when Apple next releases some new Get a Mac ads, people here will think they're amazing. Don't get me wrong, I like Apple products, but I deteste fanboys. At the end of the day this Microsoft ad is just saying you can get more for your money with a PC, and lets be honest, you can.
You can't.
 
Let's tackle each of these point by point.
P.S.: I think that this is the longest thing ever typed on an iPhone, another amazing Apple product. :D

Excellent effort my friend, that would take me ages. Shows how well the iPhone keyboard works!
 
Probably because the keyboards on Macs are awful. I hate the keyboard on my UniBody MacBook and I hated the keyboard on my plastic MacBooks. The keyboards on HPs are MUCH better.

The glass trackpad is nice, but who uses a trackpad when you're sitting at a desk? I'll take my MX Revolution mouse. Even when I'm on the go, my bag has plenty of room for me to drop my mouse in.

How is 16" not portable? Keep in mind that the plastic MacBooks were only slightly less heavy than your average 15.4" - 16" PC, and were heavier than other 13.3" systems. The UniBody systems are equal to other 13.3" systems in weight.

Who honestly carries around a system out of a bag? The minimal difference between a 13.3" UniBody MacBook and this 16" system will mean nothing considering it will spend it's carried life in a bag.

My real world experience shows that HP's like the one he bought get around 3.5 hours of battery life in a real world situation.

The UniBody MacBook has an integrated GPU with shared memory. I know this because I have one. It's about half as fast as the 9600M GT in the HP he got. Plus the 9600M GPU in that HP has 512MB of dedicated GDDR3 RAM. MUCH faster than the shared DDR3 in the MacBook.

The MacBook would fail because it has a smaller screen, inferior construction (I have a plastic HP and UniBody Mac and yes, the HP is built better), and the GPU is only half as fast at best.

Let's tackle each of these point by point.

1. You're quick to rebut about HP and give your opinion. Let's state facts in addition to our opinions. :)

2. Although this is a matter of preference, I absolutely dislike the HP keys, as my father owns one. They are so easy to be popped off, quite contrary to the new MacBook/Pro as they are a part of the frame. Also, due to the fact that the keys are slightly spaced on Macs, this makes: 1. Typing easier because of less chance of cramping (I know this from experience). 2. Cleaning debris becomes less of a hassle. 3. Typing is relatively faster on Macs because (guitar aficionados will know this term) of the "low action". I average 70 on macs, and the last time I checked my gwam on the HP, I got around 64ish.

3. The absolute VAST majority of laptop owners use their trackpad at a desk. This is without question. The trackpad on the HP can not compare to the Macs' AT ALL. To begin, I am extremely picky about trackpad surfaces as I hate it when my finger doesn't "glide" over the surfaces. I have relatively tacky fingers. I experience no problem at all when it comes to the Macbook Pro. Multi-touch gestures really make for a better computing experience. For example; two finger scroll rather than having to moving my fingers to the extreme right of the trackpad just to scroll. Since the trackpad is glass, it will always stay silky smooth despite use.

4. You keep on swaying from the new macbooks to the plastic ones. The plastic ones are past. You cannot fairly attempt to compare the plastic ones to the laptops of today. Pick the right fight, and pick the aluminum. The average 15-16 inch laptop is 6.5lbs. That is without question. You will see many heavier, and many lighter, but that is a good rough estimate. The Macbook Aluminum, and yes even the plastic one absolutely destroy it in terms of portability. You are correct, the UMB is relatively equal in terms of wait. But, it blows them away in terms of of battery life (which is why many of those 13" models offer extended batteries which add bulk, and another pound, yet still don't match the UMB), and in terms of performance. I'm not a great fan of integrated graphics. :) Portability is not just about how much something weighs in a bag, it's about having that extra real estate on your school desk (which aren't large by any means), being able to tilt your screen on the airport meal table, or being able to tuck your laptop away in something small. Let's not overlook this.

5. My Macbook Pro gets about 8 and a half hours on light use with wifi and bluetooth off. Apple tells you straight up how it calculates its battery life so as to not get people complaining about less than the purported battery life. They say that the brightness is turned to half and and wifi is on. I don't care how much I lower the brightness, the battery life on most PC laptops does not impress me one bit. I'd have to literally turn it down to almost as low as it gets to even come close to the Macbook's, which isn't close at all. :) :) ;)

6. You have made two very [insert any word here] mistakes. Although using shared memory, it is in NO WAY AN INTEGRATED GRAPHICS CARD. :) And also, I'm pretty sure you're not tech savvy, as you would have known that GDDR3 and DDR3 are not the same thing. Having a 'G' in the front does not make it more powerful. In fact, GDDR3 is based on the same architecture as DDR2!!!!! I don't think we need to have a DDR3 vs. DDR2 discussion. ;) Only GDDR4 is comparable to DDR3 as it is based on that architecture.

7. Man, are you just ignorant or are you trying to get people pissed off. The manufacturing used to make others laptops are completely inferior to the unibody process. Apple has made a great stride with this. When playing Crysis, my MBP only gets slightly warm due to the fact that the aluminum essentially acts as a heat sink. Aluminum has an incredibly amazing strength:weight ratio. The aluminum housing allows it to be thinner than many notebooks on the market right now. The frame itself is designed to protect each component respectively. Wanna talk about crap housing, we can talk about HP all day.

8. I'd like to add that HP customer support are aszholes, unlike Apple. :) Just my 2 cents.

9. For everything that you own, you will pay for design that put's food on artists' and engineers' tables. Everything we see is geared by design so don't try to imply that design doesn't matter. If quality, design, and performance didn't matter, then everyone in the world might as well drive *****ty cars with faulty lights and dents all over that were bought because they were cheap.

Thank You, and Good Morning America.

P.S.: I think that this is the longest thing ever typed on an iPhone, another amazing Apple product. :D

Note: I moved this so that this post as soon as I got on the computer so that this post would not die.
 
You can't.

I'm sorry but this simply isn't the case. Yes, I agree, Macs are better, but for the average consumer you'll get more for your money with a Dell.

You called also bring in the argument that Macs include iLife and whatnot, but to be frank, the average consumer doesn't need iLife. Its not like everyone who uses a computer needs to make movies. And by the way, windows does come with everything that iLife has bar Garageband, although much crappier versions.
 
I liked the first ad but didn't like this one. They should have edited out the picky comment. If he really was picky, he wouldn't have bought such a junk machine - for any price.

When I bought an HP laptop, at least I didn't pretend like I was trying to get something powerful. I wanted something portable and cheap. I got one for $700 after a crapload of rebates about 8 years ago. Biggest piece of junk computer I have ever owned. It irritated me so much that I spent twice as much on a Dell a couple of years later. That one irritated me so much that I spent another $600 on a MacBook Pro a couple of years later. If this thing pisses me off in the next couple of months, I guess I'm going to have to go for the 17" MBP. Luckily, it has done no such thing.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.