You don't necessarily need a lot of power to develop software, you just need a compiler. There are no compilers that run on iOS as far as I'm aware.
Microsoft Shares Holiday Ad Promoting Surface Go Over Apple's iPad: 'Big Dreams Need a Real Computer'
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
You don't necessarily need a lot of power to develop software, you just need a compiler. There are no compilers that run on iOS as far as I'm aware.
rafark
macrumors 68000
Yeah but worldwide most phones are Android, which is a more desktop-like os.
Unreliable sounds like a statement from someone who has used it once or only occasionally.
Functionally bizarre sometimes, sure. But far from unreliable. And I cannot disagree with this ad. The new iPad is labeled as a "Pro" device yet it lacks some basic features that normal computers have and Apple touts it as a laptop replacement?
You cannot:
-Plug in an external storage device and have it directly recognized as such
-Import media from an external device directly into an app of your choice. ex: cannot import images straight into lightroom, must go into Photos then copy from there
-Change default apps system-wide. Apple desperately wants you to use their apps even when they know many users do not. On my computer I may choose what browser I would like, mail application, messaging app, etc.
-Modify the system to ways that suit me
Let's not kid ourselves, the iPad Pro is not a laptop replacement, it is a very big iPhone. It runs the same iOS 12 as other devices.
It does, however:
-Have a very crisp display that runs 120hz. This is awesome.
-Have Apple Pencil, which I admit is a fun tool to use.
-Have very specific uses to professionals, but cannot possibly replace a "real" computer.
There is a reason why people jailbreak their iDevice that is important to why this ad exists: to break limitations of the OS.
If Apple wants to position the iPad Pro as a true laptop replacement, then something has to change. Either iOS has to mature and become a "big boy" OS, or the Pro specifically needs to be allowed to run macOS.
Call W10 unreliable if you really want to, but for this discussion, it's at least functional. My biggest hesitation in buying the Pro is the fact that it's just bigger than my iPhone and doesn't do anything particular that is much, much better. Adobe showed off this neat use-case of a full version of Photoshop with AR capabilities, but if you're going to use it for pro work, it's big enough that why wouldn't a pro user just get a laptop anyway?
Quu
macrumors 68040
Writing software and testing it is not that demanding, I'm not writing (and thus testing) video game builds. I suspect you don't write software so you may not be aware of this but I could write what I do on a PC from 2003 on a Pentium 3 and it would still work fine.
The only part of software development that is slow and demanding is compiling your source code into machine code but modern compilers do this while you're writing the code as a low priority background service so once you've finished a build and you're ready to test it the final compilation takes mere seconds.
But the actual writing of the software is no more taxing on a system than writing a letter in a word processor. You're literally just typing out things into a text file.
The Pentium Y in the Surface Go is thus perfectly adequate, I used less powerful machines for development on the go. The main thing is, do they run the development environment I use and can they run the resultant software I write. The answer to that for the Surface Go is yes.
EDIT:// I just want to make clear I am talking about my own software development needs. I write a medium sized desktop application with a GUI and some server software and do some web stuff. All this is fine for the Surface Go. I would not write like the equivalent of Photoshop CC on this thing.
Last edited:
Sabelonada
macrumors 6502
Quu
macrumors 68040
Of course not, why would you think I am making such a broad statement from what I said? - This whole conversation string that you've waded into is about my usage.
Sabelonada
macrumors 6502
The switch between first and second person in the post I quoted generalizes the usage beyond your general development.
I do agree that a great deal of coding can be done using just an editor. I don't know how well the Surface Go would work with a modern feature editor. It probably would be adequate. Losing intelligent text and auto fill for member names would be a big step backward.
Quu
macrumors 68040
Its CPU isn't that bad. It's a Kaby Lake generation 1.6GHz Dual Core with 2MB of cache. Sure it won't win any benchmarks but it certainly is fast enough for a lot of tasks especially for people who can only afford this.
We need to keep in mind the advert was about a 10 year old girl and she was doing some rudimentary coding on it in the advertisement. I can comfortably say all the software I use would run on it in Visual Studio with all the bells and whistles on as I've run it on a netbook recently with an AMD processor that's weaker and older than that Pentium.
In-fact you know what I found was my main issue? the storage drive speed. That netbook had a really poor eMMC based flash solution. But this Surface Go can be configured with a proper SSD. For me that'd make a big difference.
But I don't want to suggest I would buy one, I have more money to spend on my personal machines. The point is, it can perform the more advanced coding needs as it can physically run the software, that's what makes it a real computer in Microsofts lingo.
Personally I'd love an iPad Pro using the ARM CPU it currently has running macOS. I'd certainly buy one then, I've not bought an iPad in a long time.
No, I don’t blame windows for admin.
I have said I have had a constant problems with register and dll missing and updates at undesired times. Yet I did never touch register and never remove any dll. And these are just some of the problems.
On my home Mac, the problem ratio compare to windows is minuscule.
Had a few freezes here and there, in Tiger and Leopard and High Sierra.
DNichter
macrumors G3
Looking at what sells - Apple's approach is working better. Not everyone wants to or needs to run old legacy apps on an OS stuck in the 90's. Windows will always have it's place, but unfortunately for Microsoft, the younger generation prefers iPad's to Surface laptops. An okay laptop combined with a crappy tablet isn't going to change that.
- Force Touch Track pad
- Retina Display
- 17% less volume, and smaller footprint/bezels (also .25lbs lighter...not a big deal)
- Better Geek bench Scores on base models
- Touch ID
- T2 security chip
- Better Speakers
Hardware maybe not Microsoft’s core business and neither it’s Google’s. But somehow they’ve learned Apple’s tricks very fast and all I see is Apple is getting stagnant in hard- and software for years. Apple is getting fragmented by releasing different iOS, MacOS, TVOS and watchOS. With each release I see only small incremental updates. Microsoft and google even managed to get better versions of Word, PowerPoint, outlook and the google equivalents to iOS than even Apple itself with pages, mail and keynote. Haven’t seen a big update to apple’s iMovie in years, nor have I seen any big step forward in Apple software lately. The Mac hardware line is full of compromises. To be honest, I personally think Apple is a big mess today. An overpriced mess. I first thought they maybe working on some kind of secret project to leapfrog the competition. But after waiting for something special to come out of that pipeline for 6+ years, I’m afraid it’s wishful thinking.
MacBook pros with the touchbar
MacMini with same form factor but only the tech a little bit up to date. Really.... 4+ years for this from a hardware company?...
All computers suffer from overheating issues so you’ll never be able to get the power out of it where you pay for.
Nice new ipads with a phone os and another connector, USB-C
There is no consistency whatever except upping the prices.
[doublepost=1543954002][/doublepost]
its shameful they kept the old MacBook Air for that price. It’s ancient technology now and parts are very cheap.
Pure greed the prices of the new MacBook Air and Pro’s. Certainly no match for the new Dell’s and HP’s which saw their unit sales grow significantly lately. Anyone wonder why?
Justanotherfanboy
Suspended
The “learning how to code” for a 10 year old, shown in the commercial could CERTAINLY be achieved using the free app, Swift Playgrounds, on an iPad...
There are certainly more examples of very young people designing wildly successful Apps for the iOS platform than any other, in the last decade.
I understand that an App can’t be end to end coded, compiled, & submitted (yet), on an iPad... but a 10 year old could cut their teeth on Playgrounds.
Last edited:
The lack of consistency was driven home to me when Apple released a Mac that couldn't connect to an iPhone (the "hero" device in their lineup) without an extra purchase.
dwig
macrumors 6502a
False !!! The Go ships with "Windows Home in S mode", not "Windows S", and the "S mode" can be turned off quickly, easily, and at no charge. With the currently shipping machines, you do need to update the Windows Store app first, but that is simple and part of the usual updates you need to do with any new machine. This need to update the Store will likely vanish when the devices ship with Win10 1809 instead of the 1803 with which the current sample ship.
AlexJoda
macrumors 6502a
Queen6
macrumors G4
Hardware maybe not Microsoft’s core business and neither it’s Google’s. But somehow they’ve learned Apple’s tricks very fast and all I see is Apple is getting stagnant in hard- and software for years. Apple is getting fragmented by releasing different iOS, MacOS, TVOS and watchOS. With each release I see only small incremental updates. Microsoft and google even managed to get better versions of Word, PowerPoint, outlook and the google equivalents to iOS than even Apple itself with pages, mail and keynote. Haven’t seen a big update to apple’s iMovie in years, nor have I seen any big step forward in Apple software lately. The Mac hardware line is full of compromises. To be honest, I personally think Apple is a big mess today. An overpriced mess. I first thought they maybe working on some kind of secret project to leapfrog the competition. But after waiting for something special to come out of that pipeline for 6+ years, I’m afraid it’s wishful thinking.
MacBook pros with the touchbar
MacMini with same form factor but only the tech a little bit up to date. Really.... 4+ years for this from a hardware company?...
All computers suffer from overheating issues so you’ll never be able to get the power out of it where you pay for.
Nice new ipads with a phone os and another connector, USB-C
There is no consistency whatever except upping the prices.
[doublepost=1543954002][/doublepost]
its shameful they kept the old MacBook Air for that price. It’s ancient technology now and parts are very cheap.
Pure greed the prices of the new MacBook Air and Pro’s. Certainly no match for the new Dell’s and HP’s which saw their unit sales grow significantly lately. Anyone wonder why?
Very much agree, equally people keep buying. Personally I dumped Apple for any professional use as it's hardware is mostly inadequate and or problematic, I see little value in what Apple offers currently.
I've frequently stated that I've never seen so many switch away from Apple, equally all engineers, designers etc. Apple is fast on the track to being little more than a fashion brand where reliability, performance & stability all play second fiddle to looking pretty.
Apple has only one direction now as markets plateau and that is do exactly what it's doing increasing margin, diminishing value. For many professionals the Mac is dead in the water, nor are they likely to come flocking back even if Apple gets it's collective finger out it's ass, as it's hard earned reputation is getting burned up quickly...
New Air is a joke, non Touch Bar MBP is a far better proposition in many respects at a $100 more. Apple is simply trading on the Air's name and offering a sup par underperforming product for it's own greedy motivations i.e. the usual cash grab we've come to expect...
Q-6
Mobster1983
macrumors 6502a
Traded in my iPad for a Surface Pro a couple months ago due to productivitey issues. Things as simple as going through emails for my business, which requires moving into folders, attaching multiple documents, etc, is far easier on a full OS. Even drafting documents is much better. I loved my iPad for reading, watching TV/movies, and other consumption, but for work it just got to the point where I needed a full device.
Apple needs to finally come to the conclusion that it is time to have two OSs on the iPad. iOS can be primary, but with these new iPad Pros matching Macbook Pro benchmarks, there is no reason whatsoever you cannot dual boot into Mac OS, using a keyboard and mouse. The day that happens I will sell my Surface Pro and buy the iPad again.
Apple needs to finally come to the conclusion that it is time to have two OSs on the iPad. iOS can be primary, but with these new iPad Pros matching Macbook Pro benchmarks, there is no reason whatsoever you cannot dual boot into Mac OS, using a keyboard and mouse. The day that happens I will sell my Surface Pro and buy the iPad again.
It is always interesting to hear other people's experiences and how they differ. This past update bug was particularly nasty with Win 10 deleting files for people by "accident".
My past history with Windows was what led me to OS X in 2001 and I didn't expect to have Windows 10 actually be decent for my use cases. Really didn't expect the uptime that I'm getting on it with the VM's and such.
I don't see going back to Apple as an option unless Tim gets his head out of his ass - the new Macs are underwhelming and like 2x the price of a comparable Windows machine. Even my Ryzen 7 box cost less ($1200) to build and will smoke the 27" 5k iMac.
Last edited: