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Microsoft Was Willing to Bring Xbox-Exclusive Games to iPhone via xCloud

How many AAA games would the App Store policies actually bar from iOS on content alone?

GTA V as just one example. It's full of bad language (including the N-word), sexual references, and "glorifies violence" (depends on who you ask I suppose, but since many of the missions require you to screw with NPCs in various ways, up to and including killing them, "glorifies" would definitely be how Apple would define it I'm sure.)

I get that Apple wants to offer a family-friendly experience. I have no problem with that being the default. But games like GTA V didn't become top-5 bestsellers by being family-friendly - it's obvious that the AAA gaming community at large is pretty cool with edgy content. If you really want in on the AAA gaming market, you're gonna have to be OK with edgy content that violates many "family-friendly" standards. I suppose it's really Apple's loss though, because it's honestly not too hard to just pick up a used Android device, even if you only use it on wi-fi via hotspot or something, to do your mobile AAA gaming on. The only reason you would really want to cloud-game on your iOS device is for simplicity and the ability to not have to carry a separate device. Of course Apple has never taken gaming seriously, and it's shown over and over through the years. Hell, didn't iOS just recently get proper Bluetooth game controller support?

The Steam Deck will make this even more interesting. Being able to locally run many AAA titles will likely give even cloud gaming a bit of a run for its money. OT, but I just wish the Steam Deck had gone with an OLED display...
 
OK I am struggling with this scenario. in general I am in defense of Apple regarding its policies. Its "walled garden" so to peak offers developers access to a set of consumers that are willing to spend money at a much higher rate than android users. So for that reason alone I do see apple has an argument that there need to become paid access on the part of the developer to access that group of consumers. Instead of charging the developer directly for access they take a cut of their sales... in effect a royalties only contract with the developer. In general this is not bad for the small developer (low barrier to entry) but the large developer feels like they are being taken advantage of because of the large dollar amount spent to play in Apple's garden.

Where Microsoft and their xcloud services is concerned, I don't see any benefit here but access. Microsoft isn't looking to push massive sales through xcloud and the app is a static window so to speak to Microsoft service. A lot like Netflix, only catch is the content is interactive. (which I will make an argument that Netflix is "interactive" if necessary.). Also I see little here that adversely impacts Apple. Unless you consider a competitor to Apple Arcade with is a joke.

a current gen iPad mini and a little hardware magic could essentially make an Apple Switch 2.0... with a library of games that could run on just about any apple product currently released.
 
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I'm playing Xbox games with xCloud on both Mac and iPhone so well. I dont need to pay money for stupid Apple Arcade games instead of Xbox games such as Halo, Gears of War, and other AAA games. Since the cloud gaming service allow you to play many games without worrying about the hardware performance, they dont need to binrg their games to specific platform cause it just works with a web browser thanks to Apple.
 
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contacos said:
Thats so dumb. Imagine Netflix having to send in every movie or tv show for review before offering it
Click to expand...

I'm guessing it has more to do with the fact that a content/movie on Netflix doesn't suddenly require a purchase. Though, I don't honestly care, this would have been really cool.
 
I was impressed with how well xcloud does work via mobile safari. It's hard not to think Apple is on the wrong side of this one. The only difference between xcloud and Netflix is how often you push buttons. Its Apple's platform, but they're obviously using the individual apps as an a (barely) defensible reason. As a long time iPhone users (OG to 13) and a Xbox Game Pass customer this is very disappointing.
 
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DevNull0 said:
So, we could have had AAA gaming on Apple devices. Instead we get siri only Music.

What visionary leadership, Timmy is truly worth his $1 billion with this kind of innovation and personal integrety. Most CEO's would have gone for the games and shamefully made a huge pile of money while making a decent chunk of their customer base happy. Good thing we have Timmy to stop that nonsense.
Click to expand...
Wait, you’re saying that Timmy DIDN’T shamefully go for the money grab? Oh, no, that breaks some of the prevailing sentiment here… darn! :)
 
xpaulso said:
I was impressed with how well xcloud does work via mobile safari. It's hard not to think Apple is on the wrong side of this one.
Click to expand...
If it’s working fine via mobile safari (and, indeed, Apple actually helped Microsoft to get it running), then how are they in the wrong? Microsoft gets access to iOS, Apple maintains their store the way they like and customers get to play the games? That’s a win/win/win by my accounting. Well, accept for the loss for Apple where they helped Microsoft get the web solution working smoothly in Safari. I’m sure Microsoft didn’t pay a penny over $99 for the year to get that additional help.
 
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fmillion said:
How many AAA games would the App Store policies actually bar from iOS on content alone?

GTA V as just one example. It's full of bad language (including the N-word), sexual references, and "glorifies violence" (depends on who you ask I suppose, but since many of the missions require you to screw with NPCs in various ways, up to and including killing them, "glorifies" would definitely be how Apple would define it I'm sure.)

I get that Apple wants to offer a family-friendly experience. I have no problem with that being the default. But games like GTA V didn't become top-5 bestsellers by being family-friendly - it's obvious that the AAA gaming community at large is pretty cool with edgy content. If you really want in on the AAA gaming market, you're gonna have to be OK with edgy content that violates many "family-friendly" standards. I suppose it's really Apple's loss though, because it's honestly not too hard to just pick up a used Android device, even if you only use it on wi-fi via hotspot or something, to do your mobile AAA gaming on. The only reason you would really want to cloud-game on your iOS device is for simplicity and the ability to not have to carry a separate device. Of course Apple has never taken gaming seriously, and it's shown over and over through the years. Hell, didn't iOS just recently get proper Bluetooth game controller support?

The Steam Deck will make this even more interesting. Being able to locally run many AAA titles will likely give even cloud gaming a bit of a run for its money. OT, but I just wish the Steam Deck had gone with an OLED display...
Click to expand...
The steam desk will be interesting. But it will have some major negatives vs mobile stream-based gaming. It's much larger and heavier than a Switch or 13 Pro Max. It will definitely be battery hungry and run hot. It's a valid attempt but it won't be without its own compromises. I have a switch which is great for lots of games. But I'd love to use the power/efficiency of a iphone 13 SOC to stream some of my xbox one games. With a $60-$100 controller adapter you have a very good game streaming device.

Thankfully the HTML5/mobile safari access is very good. But I can't help but feel like a native app would be just a bit better. I have a feeling that mobile edge will become the defacto platform for xcloud on iOS.
 
sunny5 said:
I'm playing Xbox games with xCloud on both Mac and iPhone so well. I dont need to pay money for stupid Apple Arcade games instead of Xbox games such as Halo, Gears of War, and other AAA games. Since the cloud gaming service allow you to play many games without worrying about the hardware performance, they dont need to binrg their games to specific platform cause it just works with a web browser thanks to Apple.
Click to expand...
Not defending Apple arcade, but AAA controller based games and lots of apple arcade games are different. People can enjoy either or both. Not everyone want to play complex controller based games.
 
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TheYayAreaLiving ? said:
Then what happened? They couldn’t see/face how Apple is dominating the gaming market, ?
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They're far from dominating the "gaming market". There are lots of different types of gaming markets. Lots of people that play iOS games would never play xbox/ps/pc games. There are plenty of people that play xbox/ps/pc games that couldn't care less about mobile games. There is some overlap, but the amount of concentration and intensity is major factor. I think both markets can bring people joy. Even if mobile is mostly freemium games that try to get people addicted to micro-purchases.
 
I empathize with MSFT here, but Apple has a point. If they allowed this, it'd contradict how they handle all the smaller devs' apps, which wouldn't be fair. And MSFT was able to launch xCloud on iPhone anyway:
Despite the near agreement, negotiations between Microsoft and Apple ultimately fell through and Xbox Cloud Gaming did not launch as separate apps in the App Store, but as a web-based platform that does not need to follow the App Store rules.
Click to expand...

Unrelated, what Xbox exclusives?? Halo was the big one in its day, but 3 was the last good version.
 
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Unregistered 4U said:
If it’s working fine via mobile safari (and, indeed, Apple actually helped Microsoft to get it running), then how are they in the wrong? Microsoft gets access to iOS, Apple maintains their store the way they like and customers get to play the games? That’s a win/win/win by my accounting. Well, accept for the loss for Apple where they helped Microsoft get the web solution working smoothly in Safari. I’m sure Microsoft didn’t pay a penny over $99 for the year to get that additional help.
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Maybe Apple helped, maybe they didn't we won't know for sure. its better than I expected, but the UI does have lots of latency issues. But once you are streaming a game, the input latency was better than I had expected. (Its horrible on MacOS) Streaming games always feel slightly off, because of the input latency.

Based on what I know about online gaming code. I'd say most of it had to do with the server side, but there is a very good chance Apple made a few changes to Mobile Safari based on MS requests. Also the iphone's various hardware accelerations is definitely a major factor.

The reason I said wrong side is because game streaming will become as regular as streaming music, and movies. At some point I believe apple will relax their position. Most likely after making some major strides in the gaming market. (AR/VR gaming ?) In the meantime I'm happy to have a solution that works decently.
 
contacos said:
Thats so dumb. Imagine Netflix having to send in every movie or tv show for review before offering it
Click to expand...
Film and Television aren't generating application code and potential violations in using private frameworks and exposing security risks to iOS, macOS, tvOS, etc. If you can't discern between the two stop demanding Apple open up their ecosystem to multiple stores.
 
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bassjunky said:
I'm 44, been in tech. for as long as I can 'member. This video makes me feel really ***** old.
Click to expand...
I'm right there with you 44 in January. Been working in tech since 1998. I'm sure at some point the electrical engineers started thinking you want to use electricity for what ??
 
mdriftmeyer said:
Film and Television aren't generating application code and potential violations in using private frameworks and exposing security risks to iOS, macOS, tvOS, etc. If you can't discern between the two stop demanding Apple open up their ecosystem to multiple stores.
Click to expand...
The code isn't running locally. There is no local game logic or game physics running on the iOS device. It's literally a low latency video stream of the game. With button presses that are sent back over API calls to the remote server. It why it actually runs pretty damn well from a browser. In fact their running blade server versions of xbox consoles to run the games. They don't need access to any private frameworks. They wanted an app to make the UI a bit easier to use and maintain.

In the end its apple's store so they can make the rules. But this has nothing to do with device security. It's a business decision. My got tells me Tim Apple knows you can't go back once you've opened the gate. So they're holding onto these cards as long as they can. Or until they want something else.
 
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I am not particularly interested in gaming yet as a science fiction fan, I would take the gaming subscription for a month when Starfield comes out.
 
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