Strange you would find such amusement in people discussing the value proposition of new iPhone price after significant increases across the entire range and their continued nickel and diming of customers. Apple have always been expensive but often justifiable from a total cost of ownership perspective. However, their new strategy to offset falling demand with higher ASPs to maintain earnings seems shortsighted, particularly in countries/regions with exchange rate-related prices increases. Despite what you claim, sales of the SE demonstrated that there was a significant market for a smaller iPhone and arguably the only reason there isn't a SE2 (this year) is more likely due to the Apple's desire to push people into the higher priced XR by not updating the SE with faster SoC. Despite what you claim, iPhones are not a Veblin goods for most people, they just want a phone which provides them with value and which lasts. My own take on the prices is that Apple may sell them at a higher rice but will likely lose the Halo sales as people buy fewer complimentary Apple products; I was planning on upgrading three products this year but am now I'm only going upgrade one when it dies. I fully expect Apple to increase prices again next year in an attempt to move to the higher prices.
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Strange you would find such amusement in people discussing the value proposition of new iPhone price after significant increases across the entire range and their continued nickel and diming of customers. Apple have always been expensive but often justifiable from a total cost of ownership perspective. However, their new strategy to offset falling demand with higher ASPs to maintain earnings seems shortsighted, particularly in countries/regions with exchange rate-related prices increases. Despite what you claim, sales of the SE demonstrated that there was a significant market for a smaller iPhone and arguably the only reason there isn't a SE2 (this year) is more likely due to the Apple's desire to push people into the higher priced XR by not updating the SE with faster SoC. Despite what you claim, iPhones are not a Veblin goods for most people, they just want a phone which provides them with value and which lasts. My own take on the prices is that Apple may sell them at a higher rice but will likely lose the Halo sales as people buy fewer complimentary Apple products; I was planning on upgrading three products this year but am now I'm only going upgrade one when it dies. I fully expect Apple to increase prices again next year in an attempt to move to the higher prices.
Having nearly ever iPhone replaced is not anecdotal but shows there is a problem, couple that to all the recalls/replacement programs and this points to a problem.
Its obvious that you as a shareholder will be biased.
And my never having to replace a device, except for the 6s battery, shows their is no problem. But your own statistical luck is in play with your devices.
Every company has/had a recall problem. Those programs aren’t indicative of system wide issues.
I bought a samsung phone for my son when his hand me iPhone 4 developed touch disease. So anyone who says that iPhones last must be selling their phones every year and not seeing all the issues.
I just asked him which phone he likes best and he just said they both have their good and bad.
As for me, only having used older flip phones and then Apple phones, comparing the two of them obviously Apple is much better. I can't really comment about iOS vs Android in usability because I have spent so little time on my sons phone or even my inlaws phones as tech support, but in the time I did spend, I didn't think oh my go this is horrible. Both are OSs that you would get used to after the usual, humans don't like change.
I like Apple products, just don't like the direction that Apple has gone in. I don't wear Rose Coloured glasses any more. I suspect that a lot of Apple fans look though rose coloured glasses to the point that they don't see the issues that others see. But that is fine, as long as they are happy then that is all good and well and I wound't want to change their views.
What I do object to is when people when rose coloured glasses try to apologise for Apple when I have had more than my fair share of Apple device issues. They use the Apple rule book of excuses.
1) You have a problem with 1 device - thats anecdotal.
2) You have a problem with nearly every device you have purchased - thats anecdotal
3) list is too long to write.
Its the Apple fanbois, trolls and shareholders that respond to brush things under the carpet rather than empathise that it does suck to have so many issues and be involved in so many repair programs.
I'm still running an iPhone SE. It only cost me 99 cents a few years ago from Verizon. Yes, I know true price is absorbed into contract - but newer phones were $200. up front and had the same contract price. Has been a great phone and still is. Have no need to upgrade, it does everything I need it to, and it has a headphone jack - a big plus for me.
I really don't want any MORE things in my life that i have to keep re-charging. So much simpler to just plug in headphones when you want to use them.
In fact, my wife has in iPhone 5s that she is very happy with, she has small hands and is turned off by larger phones. Neither of us have any issues with processor speed or any need for more frills / or features. Both of these phones are very reliable and serve all our needs quite well - this is a perfect example of why we buy Apple products - in general they seem to hold up well long term, we are not fond of disposable products.
Icing on the cake is that a recent review of my account with Verizon give me cellular service with data on both lines for only $65. a month since we combined average less than 1 gig of data monthly. Not allot of incentive to "upgrade" if you ask me.
If I get a new phone I spend a bunch of money, loose my headphone jack, and pay more each month in carrier fees.
I really don't want any MORE things in my life that i have to keep re-charging. So much simpler to just plug in headphones when you want to use them.
In fact, my wife has in iPhone 5s that she is very happy with, she has small hands and is turned off by larger phones. Neither of us have any issues with processor speed or any need for more frills / or features. Both of these phones are very reliable and serve all our needs quite well - this is a perfect example of why we buy Apple products - in general they seem to hold up well long term, we are not fond of disposable products.
Icing on the cake is that a recent review of my account with Verizon give me cellular service with data on both lines for only $65. a month since we combined average less than 1 gig of data monthly. Not allot of incentive to "upgrade" if you ask me.
If I get a new phone I spend a bunch of money, loose my headphone jack, and pay more each month in carrier fees.
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And what about the others i see at work and in family, did they also win the lottery
Its not friendly advice though, its the number one putdown that fanbois use.
There are many reasons that one sticks with a company and I've given my reasons before and not going to keep going around in circles.
This goes to show how you think illogically and will stick up for Apple at every turn.
I have helium, phone does not die hence it must be fake news.
Perhaps go do your own research and find out that Apple document the issue with helium.
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Yes and all my friends and colleagues who have had issues are just outliers too.
Remember I make no case as to how widespread this is, just that Apple has issues and when they do, it affects millions of customers.
What does it take for you to see that Apples quality control has gone down? I'll give you some initial google results, its not hard to find.
https://www.cnet.com/forums/discussions/is-apples-hardware-quality-declining/
https://mac360.com/2017/04/a-few-words-on-apples-quality-control/
https://www.technobuffalo.com/2014/09/24/is-apple-having-major-quality-control-issues/
https://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=341716
https://www.imore.com/biggest-problems-facing-apple-2018
https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/34glfa/how_is_apples_hardware_quality_control_now/
https://www.theinquirer.net/inquire...esigns-are-fine-but-its-build-quality-is-poor
https://thenextweb.com/apple/2018/0...-embarrassing-issue-with-the-new-macbook-pro/
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7707226
https://www.infoworld.com/article/2625738/computer-hardware/is-apple-losing-its-quality-magic-.html
http://www.betalogue.com/2010/01/22/quality-control/
https://www.extremetech.com/computi...llowing-iphone-5-scuff-quality-control-issues
https://www.chron.com/technology/bu...ardware-issues-with-its-iPhone-X-13379769.php
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/1862352
https://www.networkworld.com/articl...e-to-delay-imac-orders--resellers-report.html
https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=47&topicid=145455
and it is not just hardware, it is software too
https://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2018/20180111_1812-Apple-macOS-EnoughIsEnough.html
https://www.engadget.com/2015/01/05/is-apple-slipping/
https://www.quora.com/Why-does-it-seem-like-Apple-s-quality-is-declining
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As the others in my life, who don't require the support you and your circle seemingly require has won a different lottery. The lottery apple is known for, which is quality and reliability.
What? It seems to be common sense, if one is unhappy and one posts repeatedly about the same thing, a suggestion is to move on.
I don't care about helium, it's not on my radar of things that I worry about in life. My only comment was about being at kids parties.
With 1 billion devices out there doesn't it make sense there might be some issues within the one billion devices? Common sense says yes. And a post on the internet means exactly zero as it relates to quantifying real hardware issues on a mass scale. These posts amount to what is anecdotal evidence. Making the leap between an internet post and a hardware issue is a common thing that amounts to an illogical conclusion. So I don't agree that apples quality is on the decline based on some internet posts out of 1B devices out there.
At any rate, I'm wondering about the relevance to this in this thread. You can start this up again in this forum https://forums.macrumors.com/forums/apple-inc-and-tech-industry.8/ which is much better suited for this type of conversation.
If you come up with some quantifiable rather than countering with your own anecdotes then maybe we can get common ground but won’t hold my breath, looks like links from large sites isn’t enough to sway you that Apple has qc issues compared to earlier days.
As a shareholder, I will say that I have been lucky so far for not encountering the problems that people such as yourself or around me have encountered. This includes shoddy MBP keys, MBP malfunctioning mobos, iPhone problems, etc.
I think just like every tech site, the negatives are louder than the positives, and it's not necessarily for the wrong reasons either. I think Apple as a whole due to their focus on thinner/efficiency/margins tends to sacrifice in the QC department. It's difficult to balance those 3 attributes and still maintain the durability that was once expected.
Interestingly, "fashion" and "ecosystem" was left out of the lottery. None of my Apple circles regard "quality" and "reliability" as the top features of an Apple device.
By the same token, it looks like searches on the internet, which are anecdotal in nature won’t sway you from your opinion. So we are at an impasse, and frankly for whatever this is, it just is at this point in time.
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I hear quality and ecosystem. Everbody’s perception and value system are different. My extended family used to have a number of galaxys, those galaxys have been replaced by iPhones. Anecdotal, sure, just like what has been posted.
By the same token, it looks like searches on the internet, which are anecdotal in nature won’t sway you from your opinion. So we are at an impasse, and frankly for whatever this is, it just is at this point in time.
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I hear quality and ecosystem. Everbody’s perception and value system are different. My extended family used to have a number of galaxys, those galaxys have been replaced by iPhones. Anecdotal, sure, just like what has been posted.
Yeah, and that's why I was responding to your original anecdote: "The lottery apple is known for, which is quality and reliability."
Neither do i it seems otherwise I would have stopped buying Apple long ago. It’s great that it is fairly easy to return devices to Apple compared to some high street retailers.
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If you take two things. One positive and one negative about something. The fact that you only see positive does in no way negate the fact that negative things happen.By the same token, it looks like searches on the internet, which are anecdotal in nature won’t sway you from your opinion. So we are at an impasse, and frankly for whatever this is, it just is at this point in time.
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I hear quality and ecosystem. Everbody’s perception and value system are different. My extended family used to have a number of galaxys, those galaxys have been replaced by iPhones. Anecdotal, sure, just like what has been posted.
I make no claims about how widespread the issue are at Apple and you always conflate the two.
It’s not a case if he says she says.
One can make this over generalized statement about any manufactured good. I personally have purchased Apple lottery tickets and came up with quality, reliability. I never said their manufacturing defect rate was 0%.
I understand. The way prices are getting to be today it def does need to be a device that will last for at least a few years. Unfortunately I have not had any luck with any of the android devices i have had in the past. They all become super buggy and the support for them was shortly stopped right after the new devices were unloaded. I do have to say I am a bit of a fanB BUT with the extreme amount of $$$ Apple is wanting these days I have had to look VERY objectively at each purchase. It was kind of ok to get the latest and greatest when the ipads and phones IN TOTAL cost <$1000 now they are ranging from 1000-1800 after cases accessories etc. The pricing is becoming extreme.
I agree the pricing has become extreme, and the exchange rate means that Apple has lost a lot of sales.
I refuse to pay Apples prices even thought I can afford them. I used to be on a two year cycle and haven't upgraded my iPhone from the 6.
Agreed on that, I want to upgrade from my SE, I thought about getting an X but it's far bigger than I want a phone to be (my previous 6 was the limit for what I thought was usable one-handed) and whilst I can afford it with no problem - I can't justify to myself spending £1000 on a base model phone that I don't really want.
I think that is one of the problems that Apple faces, they only want to make a few devices for what ever reason and have to make choices that will annoy a lot of people as a result. Probably why Apple is so polarising.
(Sorry I must add some small print, my views are anecdotal and in no way should this be taken to mean that this is the view of the general Apple establishment
)
I get it, they are a phone and a substitute portable PC for many people who don’t have, or dont use a PC at home and work.
But I still want a powerful but small phone with 5s dimensions. I would pay upto around 1.5-2.5k for such a device, if it had a 5 year life.
I’ve bought a new larger phone, but it’s uncomfortable to hold and awkward to transport compared with my old 5s, consequently I don’t use the new phone.
There is a market for a quality small phone. I don’t think it’s anywhere near as big as the large phone market. But it is there, and it’s still worthwhile tapping into.
But there are no flagship phones of diminutive size available anymore. The last one was the 5s.
I’m hoping that Apple release a small powerful phone next year. But I’m not counting on it. So I may be forced into carrying a Winnebago around with me in future. :-(
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I just want a small phone of 5s type dimensions. A powerful flagship phone, and I’d pay upto 2.5k if it had a useful life of 5 years.
Now that Q1 2019 is out, for your information;
- You were wrong - Apple did not beat it's own guidance of 89b - 93b. It achieved merely 84b.
- You were wrong - Apple didn't achieve more than 3% of y/y growth. In fact, growth rate is in the red y/y.
I would wager that the market for such an expensive phone with perhaps a 5” screen is negligibly small in the US, and smaller still in other markets where the cost would be even greater.
I publicly said I was wrong in the other thread when Tim released his letter to investors. I also said I was disappointed with their execution in China. So you're a little slow on this. I said I was wrong a month ago when we knew revenue would be light.Now that Q1 2019 is out, for your information;
But that's ok, no one is watching this old thread. Let's just keep this between us.
- You were wrong - Apple did not beat it's own guidance of 89b - 93b. It achieved merely 84b.
- You were wrong - Apple didn't achieve more than 3% of y/y growth. In fact, growth rate is in the red y/y.
Since more data has come out, it seems China was a struggle for many companies including Samsung, Intel, Goodyear, Nvidia (20%), Caterpillar, and Tiffany.
I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong.
I will say I am pleased with the quarter they reported overall, despite the China problems. Their businesses were strong to quite strong across the board, with a predictable decline in a tough compare for iPhone. The move to services will not be painless. It helps to have a long term horizon. The market seems to like the report OK, so we'll see where we go from here.