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MLB 2021 Season

pachyderm said:
There was also a pretty big push from then owner, circa 1991, of the Nashville Sounds, Larry Schmittou, to buy them and move them to Nashville. I was friends with the family back then and had a little inside scoop. After that deal fell through I'd heard that the Giants might also move to Toronto.

Recently here in Mid TN the rumors have been the Indians and /or the Rays might be headed this way.
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The Giants-to-Toronto deal was mooted in the early-70s, but then Bob Lurie bought the team to prevent that from happening. 20 years later, after being frustrated time and again by his attempts to get a publicly-funded stadium, Lurie looked to sell the team. The initial winners were a group from Tampa Bay and it looked like a done deal to all observers, but the commissioner stepped in to veto the deal and give the investor group led by Peter Magowan time to get a successful package together. For the stadium, there were still numerous false starts through the 1990s until they agreed upon the current, privately financed stadium. That development turned out to be such a cash cow for the ownership group, but the Port of SF and the city in general also benefitted in a huge way. The resultant stadium was well worth the wait: vastly superior to many of the previously proposed designs and locations.

Yes, 1992 was a traumatic time for Giants fans. Just look at the face on this kid in the photo, it says it all.

ScreenShot2012-10-27at11.56.29AM_crop_north.png


PS: the kid in the photo is Giants' shortstop Brandon Crawford. Don't look so glum, lad! You'll grow up to win two rings and a nice collection of Gold Gloves and Silver Sluggers!
 
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Silencio said:
The Giants-to-Toronto deal was mooted in the early-70s, but then Bob Lurie bought the team to prevent that from happening. 20 years later, after being frustrated time and again by his attempts to get a publicly-funded stadium, Lurie looked to sell the team. The initial winners were a group from Tampa Bay and it looked like a done deal to all observers, but the commissioner stepped in to veto the deal and give the investor group led by Peter Magowan time to get a successful package together. For the stadium, there were still numerous false starts through the 1990s until they agreed upon the current, privately financed stadium. That development turned out to be such a cash cow for the ownership group, but the Port of SF and the city in general also benefitted in a huge way. The resultant stadium was well worth the wait: vastly superior to many of the previously proposed designs and locations.

Yes, 1992 was a traumatic time for Giants fans. Just look at the face on this kid in the photo, it says it all.

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PS: the kid in the photo is Giants' shortstop Brandon Crawford. Don't look so glum, lad! You'll grow up to win two rings and a nice collection of Gold Gloves and Silver Sluggers!
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Crawdad is from the Bay Area!?!?

How did I not know that?
 
pachyderm said:
Crawdad is from the Bay Area!?!?

How did I not know that?
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Yep, San Jose kid.

Also coincidentally, yesterday Brandon Crawford tied New York Giant and Hall of Famer Travis Jackson for most games played at shortstop in franchise history. He celebrated by hitting two homers against the Rangers. It's extremely gratifying to see him playing at his peak level again, both at the plate and in the field.
 
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MtLoin2020 said:
if someone watches every Rays baseball game with interest, are they considered a Rays fan?
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The Rays have fans? When the Mets played at The Trop earlier this year it seemed like there were more Mets fans than Rays fans in the park...
 
hallux said:
The Rays have fans? When the Mets played at The Trop earlier this year it seemed like there were more Mets fans than Rays fans in the park...
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yup, or we think we are fans, i had to ask!
and that Mets thing is simply because they do not sell
Rays apparel and memorabilia at stores located in southern Florida.
and our raccoons know better then to scurry in tunnel runways in major baseball stadiums.
 
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Geez - deGrom is just on another level! He's allowed a total of 7 runs this year. Yes, SEVEN, and only FOUR count to his ERA. Five times this year he's struck out 10 or more, making 51 in his career. He's an overmatch for even the Padres...

He's a pitcher? He has 5 RBI and 4 runs scored. Yup, his offense offsets his allowed runs PLUS TWO!
 
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So it seems the MLB is giving teams plenty of warning regarding foreign substances being used for pitchers. I don't get this slow approach and handling these pitchers with kid gloves

Of course there's Gerrit Cole who's down right whining how it is so difficult to hold a baseball and he needs something so he can properly throw the ball.

I have to think its bad optics for pitchers all around, and for the most part its cheating, you're using a foreign substance to get an unfair advantage, in my book I don't see much difference in that vs. a corked bat or even (an extreme example) steroids. And yet it seems MLB took a blind eye.
 
maflynn said:
And yet it seems MLB took a blind eye.
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It's been happening for YEARS. Talk to some pitchers of the past and you hear how they used a combination of the rosin bag and sunscreen to get extra grip on the ball.

maflynn said:
Of course there's Gerrit Cole who's down right whining how it is so difficult to hold a baseball and he needs something so he can properly throw the ball.
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You want to hear whining? Look at Tyler Glasnow from Tampa - he's saying his injury is because he stopped using extra grip "stuff" and had to grip harder, causing him to suffer an injury in his elbow.
 
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ESPN is reporting that Cleveland is changing its name from the Indians to the Guardians

I'm not sure I like the name, but I wonder if they felt they needed to move with some speed in case Washington was working on a similar or same name
 
maflynn said:
ESPN is reporting that Cleveland is changing its name from the Indians to the Guardians

I'm not sure I like the name, but I wonder if they felt they needed to move with some speed in case Washington was working on a similar or same name
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I read an article that the are some architectural elements of one or more bridges in the area that are called "guardians" and that's where the name came from. The new logo will incorporate some of those architectural elements...
 
Speaking as a Cleveland native, a few points on the new Guardians name and brand:

1. The Guardians of Traffic are a pair of really cool art deco statues on a really cool old art deco bridge. They've become local icons and particularly popular images in the resurgence of pride in the city as it slowly (and painfully) emerges from its postindustrial low in the 1980s and early 1990s. They can be found on murals, wall art, T shirts, glassware, and whatnot all over the city, and have been for many decades. So it's not something conjured out of thin air. (EDIT: it's also a name and brand that polled well with the community during the selection process.)

2. Without rehashing the whole debate, I grew up with The Indians name and Chief Wahoo. I didn't fully understand the racial caricaturing inherent in the team name and logo as a child and there's no shame in that history from a personal perspective. But we know better now and it is time to move on. I don't want the Indians name anymore. I mention this not to reopen the debate but to point out that there is a very vocal minority who are very angrily resisting this, but it's happing and the overwhelming majority are either in favor or not bothered.

3. It's far from a slam dunk of a logo or name but neither is it bad. I liked the idea of going back to the Spiders myself. But, frankly, I - and all my fellow Clevelanders - have a long history of not caring what people outside the city think about it - it isn't for you anyway. The Yankees logo is ridiculous or at least boring in isolation - but it's iconic due to long familiarity. You can say the same about lots of other famous sports teams. Given time, this will all blow over and the new brand will settle in and become part pf the woodwork.
 
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Lord Blackadder said:
I grew up with The Indians name and Chief Wahoo. I didn't fully understand the racial caricaturing inherent in the team name and logo as a child and there's no shame in that history from a personal perspective. But we know better now and it is time to move on.
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+1

As I mentioned in the "What Book Are You Reading" thread, I'm (now almost done) reading Surviving Genocide by Jeff Ostler. I'm coming around to the position of eliminating references to Indigenous people for all sports teams, including my beloved Fighting Illini. It's an eye-opening book, and I highly recommend it. I can't wait for his second volume, although there is much sadness in recognizing this part of our history, it's a good thing to get a grip on.
 
I like the Guardians name a lot more knowing the story behind it.

The current Cleveland baseball franchise is not related to the old Cleveland Spiders franchise in any way. The old Spiders were a National League team that was merged with the St. Louis franchise that eventually became known as the Cardinals.

Ironically, the Spiders had a star player who was a Native American, Louis Sockalexis, and the Indians franchise nickname was partially inspired by him.
 
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Silencio said:
I like the Guardians name a lot more knowing the story behind it.

The current Cleveland baseball franchise is not related to the old Cleveland Spiders franchise in any way. The old Spiders were a National League team that was merged with the St. Louis franchise that eventually became known as the Cardinals.

Ironically, the Spiders had a star player who was a Native American, Louis Sockalexis, and the Indians franchise nickname was partially inspired by him.
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The Spiders were indeed a different team but it's a legitimate tradition to call on. The Sokalexis story is a fascinating one, though it has also been appropriated in the past by people (unconvincingly) trying to portray it as some kind of justification for Chief Wahoo. "look, we had an Indian play for us, so it's all OK, right?" :rolleyes:

But the nice thing about the Guardians brand is that we are creating a new chapter in the team's history, and one that better aligns with the city as it is today. Traditions matter, but change is constant. I'm happy to move on.
 
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The Sokalexis story is also a tragic one, as his career was drastically curtailed by alcoholism and he died far too young.

Right, tradition and progress are tough to balance sometimes — and especially so in such a tradition-steeped sport as baseball — but progress was an absolute must and long overdue in this case.
 
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Lord Blackadder said:
The Spiders were indeed a different team but it's a legitimate tradition to call on. The Sokalexis story is a fascinating one, though it has also been appropriated in the past by people (unconvincingly) trying to portray it as some kind of justification for Chief Wahoo. "look, we had an Indian play for us, so it's all OK, right?" :rolleyes:

But the nice thing about the Guardians brand is that we are creating a new chapter in the team's history, and one that better aligns with the city as it is today. Traditions matter, but change is constant. I'm happy to move on.
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I'd like to see them be called the Spiders.


Sokalexis reminiscent of Jim Thorpe ...
 
If the season had ended right after their combined no hitter, the Cubs would have made the playoffs. MLB insists on playing the full schedule, for some reason.
 
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